Hello...

I need a fence, probably about 6 feet tall to hold back a couple of
dogs. It won't be that large of an area at first (about 40' by 20 feet
or so), but we intend on expanding the fenced in area in the future.
I'm not a very 'handy' person, I've never installed a fence before,
but i think I have an idea how it goes. We're probably looking at some
of the wooden privacy type (called dogear iirc). I see that you can
buy all the materials and assemble it yourself, or you can buy
pre-built sections from Borg.

Is it ever a better idea to install the fence yourself, or is this one
of those things that you can do yourself, but usually turns out being
more trouble than it's worth unless you've already done it 100 times?
I might just have it professionally done.

(sorry for the open-ended question).


Any direction is appreciated.

phaeton wrote:
Hello...

I need a fence, probably about 6 feet tall to hold back a couple of
dogs. It won't be that large of an area at first (about 40' by 20 feet
or so), but we intend on expanding the fenced in area in the future.
I'm not a very 'handy' person, I've never installed a fence before,
but i think I have an idea how it goes. We're probably looking at some
of the wooden privacy type (called dogear iirc). I see that you can
buy all the materials and assemble it yourself, or you can buy
pre-built sections from Borg.

Is it ever a better idea to install the fence yourself, or is this one
of those things that you can do yourself, but usually turns out being
more trouble than it's worth unless you've already done it 100 times?
I might just have it professionally done.


If yu are ot handy then this is too big a project for you. A fence
increases the value of your property and has a lot of eye appeal. It
is important that you do a nice job.

"phaeton" wrote in message oups.com...
| Hello...
|
| I need a fence, probably about 6 feet tall to hold back a couple of
| dogs. It won't be that large of an area at first (about 40' by 20 feet
| or so), but we intend on expanding the fenced in area in the future.
| I'm not a very 'handy' person, I've never installed a fence before,
| but i think I have an idea how it goes. We're probably looking at some
| of the wooden privacy type (called dogear iirc). I see that you can
| buy all the materials and assemble it yourself, or you can buy
| pre-built sections from Borg.
|
| Is it ever a better idea to install the fence yourself, or is this one
| of those things that you can do yourself, but usually turns out being
| more trouble than it's worth unless you've already done it 100 times?
| I might just have it professionally done.
|
| (sorry for the open-ended question).
|
|
| Any direction is appreciated.
|

If you have small dogs 6' will work.
My vet says a Husky can clear 6'.
Seems 7' can keep the big dogs out or in but, I know for a fact, it cannot keep clawless cats in.

That said, DIY isn't all that tough a job if you have a "pro" set the posts. They have the equipment and can supply all the requisite sweat.

I bought the 4X4, 2X4, and 1X6 green from the local lumberyard at as good a price as I could have gotten from the BORG.

Had I bought pre-assembled from the BORG, the 42 post holes would have had to be spot-on. Because I bought individually, the holes could be set to about 7'6" thereby allowing for the occasional rock or other impediment to digging without affecting the look of the fence.

I installed the top, middle and bottom rails plus all the boards myself. I only had to true 3 posts and then only because the greenwood had warped.

Because I had previously listened to the experts and used "specially coated" deck screws on my deck and found them to be wanting, I opted for stainless steel for the fence. I am glad I spent the extra for these as there are now no signs of weeping around the screw heads.

From the quotes I received, I calculate that I saved some $3000 by DIY. Looks better in my pocket than some contractor's.

As for equipment:
1 sliding compound miter saw
1 3 foot level
1 try square
1 pencil
1 skill saw
1 3/8" drill - for screwing
1 tape measure
50 feet of 1/4" rope to bring posts in line and plumb as required.

Before doing anything have all the locates done and marked and verify with the locaters exactly what was found and where.

I had mine done twice because I could not believe what I was told:
they failed to find a hydro line that I knew was there and
they mislabeled a TV cable line as hydro.

As for the posts:
6 had to be hand dug
2 shifted due to tree roots


--
PDQ

--

Thanks Lawrence.... I was thinking the same thing- this might be too
much for me to bite and chew off, even if it is a small fence. True
this is something you want done *right*.


"If you have small dogs 6' will work.
My vet says a Husky can clear 6'.
Seems 7' can keep the big dogs out or in but, I know for a fact, it
cannot keep clawless cats in. "

The two dogs are going to be border collie and (probably) lab mix. I
guess I'll have to find something 6' tall to put them in and see if
they can clear it I kind of doubt it though.

Stuff running underground behind the house will be an issue too. I
believe there's tons of it- cable, fiber, water, sewer, etc. With all
do respect, *i* don't want to be the one that hits that buried high
voltage line As a side note, the cable guys ran new cable from the
cable pedestal to our house, and now we have this bright orange run of
coax across the back yard. I know I should probably bury it or do
*something* with it.

The other issue is that there is a tree that needs to come down that is
about 2 or 3 feet from where the fence will run. I wonder if we ought
to take that down *first*... it has all kinds of houses to fall on too,
but if it wipes out the fence it might be insult to injury as well.

Once a fence goes up, are they usually untreated wood? I see a lot of
grey wood fences, and IMHO it looks more 'ramshackle' than 'rustic' to
me. Should it be painted right away (brush, sprayer, roller) to match
the house? Stained and then clear lacquered? Just clear lacquered?

thanks.

phaeton wrote:
Thanks Lawrence.... I was thinking the same thing- this might be too
much for me to bite and chew off, even if it is a small fence. True
this is something you want done *right*.

As a side note, the cable guys ran new cable from the
cable pedestal to our house, and now we have this bright orange run of
coax across the back yard. I know I should probably bury it or do
*something* with it.

Depending on how long the run is you can either just make a slit with a
shovel or possible rent a trencher on a longer run.

The other issue is that there is a tree that needs to come down that is
about 2 or 3 feet from where the fence will run. I wonder if we ought
to take that down *first*... it has all kinds of houses to fall on too,
but if it wipes out the fence it might be insult to injury as well.

I think a tree that close to the fence probably has to be removed,
first obviously. If there are houses it could fall on then that is a
big deal which has to be taken seriously. There are people who do this
for a living who have the necessary insurance. I removed a large oak
that was near my house but there are no other houses so the only risk
was my own.

Once a fence goes up, are they usually untreated wood? I see a lot of
grey wood fences, and IMHO it looks more 'ramshackle' than 'rustic' to
me. Should it be painted right away (brush, sprayer, roller) to match
the house? Stained and then clear lacquered? Just clear lacquered?

Most wood fence are built of treated wood. Cedar is also used and
makes a more attractive fence that is possibly more environmentally
friendly. It is maybe 3 to 4 times the expense however. Most folk
don't bother to paint or stain but it is a good idea. Most use a
penetrating stain on decks and fences. It will look better and
possibly last longer if you do. You could rent an airless spayer to do
a job like that.

The cable run is about 15 feet, not a whole lot About how deep should
I go? a few inches?

The tree in question is actually between our house and the neighbour's
house. There is about 15 feet between the two houses. I believe the
tree's base is actually right on the property line, and the dead part
leans somewhat towards our house. It'll be tricky for no matter who
takes it down. I assume they climb up it and start cutting from the
top, so they can control where the chunks of tree fall each time,
right?

I know local markets vary, but is this the sort of thing that's
hundreds of dollars or thousands of dollars?

As far as the fence, I think I'll want to paint it to match the house.
Even treated wood turns grey eventually, and though Cedar is pretty, it
might be out of the budget.

thx again

phaeton wrote:

I know local markets vary, but is this the sort of thing that's
hundreds of dollars or thousands of dollars?


About 1-1/2 years ago, had a 35 to 40 foot eucalyptus
taken down, cost something like $325. I'm in the Phoenix
area.

They wanted like $80 more to grind the stump down below
ground level. Took a pass on that.

Jerry

Yeah, this is some kind of oak- i can't tell what sort because it has
no leaves, but the bark is oakish. I would pass on the stump grinding
too. I just don't want it to come through my upstairs livingroom, or
the neighbour's house either.

I haven't talked to the neighbor at all, but maybe he and I can work
out a deal since it's on both our properties and it could flop either
way.

That's about what I thought it'd be- between $200 and $400

I loved the desert when I lived there, fwiw.

In article .com,
"phaeton" wrote:

Is it ever a better idea to install the fence yourself, or is this one
of those things that you can do yourself, but usually turns out being
more trouble than it's worth unless you've already done it 100 times?
I might just have it professionally done.

A friend and I installed my chainlink fence at our old house. I got what I
paid for: Cheap, now-rusted, 11-1/2-gauge fencing. I drove by the place a
while back. The ~23-year-old fence is still there and appears to be doing its
job.

After we moved into this place in 1991, I had a much higher-quality chainlink
fence installed professionally. It was WORTH IT!

The previous fence job was a LOT of work, but certainly not beyond my common,
handyman skills.

Being familiar with more backyards than ANYONE except a meter reader, I
wouldn't install a wooden fence UNLESS it was mounted on STEEL line posts set
in concrete. I'm not sure I would want to tackle such a fence myself.

*IF* you hire a good, reputable contractor, you get what you pay for. Fence
installation is not high tech but it IS a lot of work.

Good luck!
--

JR

In article ,
"PDQ" wrote:

Before doing anything have all the locates done

Bravo! Get that man a cigar!
--

JR

"phaeton" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hello...

I need a fence, probably about 6 feet tall to hold back a couple of
dogs. It won't be that large of an area at first (about 40' by 20 feet
or so), but we intend on expanding the fenced in area in the future.
I'm not a very 'handy' person, I've never installed a fence before,
but i think I have an idea how it goes. We're probably looking at some
of the wooden privacy type (called dogear iirc). I see that you can
buy all the materials and assemble it yourself, or you can buy
pre-built sections from Borg.

Is it ever a better idea to install the fence yourself, or is this one
of those things that you can do yourself, but usually turns out being
more trouble than it's worth unless you've already done it 100 times?
I might just have it professionally done.

(sorry for the open-ended question).


Any direction is appreciated.

Also, after you have 'digsafe' mark all the burieds be sure you know exactly
where your property lines are so you building on your land. A general rule
of thumb is 2-3 feet in on your side from the property line if you are
bordering your property to allow for painting and repairs in case you get a
difficult neighbor next door in the future, or have one now!

Jay

In article . com,
"phaeton" wrote:

this is something you want done *right*.

You got that right.

"If you have small dogs 6' will work.

In most modern neighborhoods and cities, 6-ft is the MAXIMUM height allowed
for a residential fence.

My vet says a Husky can clear 6'.

I'm sure my lab, when she was younger, could have cleared 6-ft. She could
have EASILY jumped over the 48-inch high chainlink fence that is STILL keeping
her contained. She just never LEARNED that she could jump over it.

It wasn't until we got a second Labrador Retriever that we had a problem with
escape. This dog didn't JUMP over the fence, she CLIMBED it.

My solution was VERY low-tech: I went to the local farm store and purchased
an electric fencer. I installed everything myself and it worked like a charm.
She never climbed the fence again. (PETA can kiss my @$$.)

The two dogs are going to be border collie and (probably) lab mix. I
guess I'll have to find something 6' tall to put them in and see if
they can clear it I kind of doubt it though.

Don't install a 6-ft fence for any other reason that you LIKE how it looks -
not merely for dog containment. Keeping a dog inside a fence, even a
48-inch-high fence, can be accomplished in much less expensive and obtrusive
ways.

Stuff running underground behind the house will be an issue too. I
believe there's tons of it- cable, fiber, water, sewer, etc.

Dealing with buried utilities is another advantage to having the job done
professionally. They work around such stuff every day. They (usually) know
what they're doing. Also, if any damage is done, they should "eat" the repair
costs and stay within their bid. Be sure to verify that they are bonded and
insured since, if they are injured on your property, you can bet that they'll
make every attempt to collect from YOUR homeowner's insurance coverage.

With all do respect, *i* don't want to be the one that
hits that buried high voltage line

I'll give you credit for being "ahead of the curve" in this regard. Most
folks don't even THINK about buried utilities. That's why there is SO much
damage done every year, including severe injuries and fatalities.

If you have never dug around buried utilities, you may wish EVEN MORE to hire
the job done. There is a "hand dig zone" around all buried utilities, usually
18-inches on EITHER side of the locate mark.

As a side note, the cable guys ran new cable from the
cable pedestal to our house

Uh, they laid a TEMPORARY wire across your yard.

and now we have this bright orange run of coax across the back yard.
I know I should probably bury it or do *something* with it.

That's THEIR job. You are already paying for it in the form of your monthly
bill. They should bury the line (eventually) at NO extra cost to you.
Particularly with your typical, scab CATV outfit, you may have to be a
"squeaky wheel" by calling them several times before they do it. They are
probably hoping that you'll tire of the hassle and bury it yourself.

However, considering that CATV's idea of a buried drop is to simply kick dirt
over it, burying it yourself MIGHT not be a bad idea. You just don't HAVE to
do it - they should.

The other issue is that there is a tree that needs to come down that is
about 2 or 3 feet from where the fence will run. I wonder if we ought
to take that down *first*... it has all kinds of houses to fall on too,
but if it wipes out the fence it might be insult to injury as well.

It sounds like the tree is large enough to require a BIG effort by a
PROFESSIONAL tree company. In that case, you are right: It SHOULD come down
first. If you'll allow a truck to go back there (no fence), the cost could be
significantly less.

Once a fence goes up, are they usually untreated wood?

CCA, no. Cedar, yes.

I see a lot of grey wood fences, and IMHO it looks more
'ramshackle' than 'rustic' to me.

Me, too. A wooden fence, particularly a cedar fence, is no different than a
deck constructed of the same material: To avoid the "gray" look, it needs to
be stained every (very) few years. Because most wooden fences of ANY material
are left to turn gray is one of the reasons I chose chain link. To me, a good
chainlink fence is no more obtrusive-looking than a tall, GRAY wooden fence.
Besides, I had NO desire to "sign up" for XX years of fence maintenance. I
LOVE my chainlink fence. I NEVER heard a complaint from a neighbor about it
before, during and after it was built.

Should it be painted right away (brush, sprayer, roller) to match
the house? Stained and then clear lacquered? Just clear lacquered?

Neither. Put up a 48-inch, 9-gauge, galvanized-AFTER-weaved chainlink fence
and FORGET it. Deal afterwards with a high-jumping dog IF that happens.

Good luck!
--

JR

In article . com,
"phaeton" wrote:

The cable run is about 15 feet, not a whole lot About how deep should
I go? a few inches?

That's probably deeper than the CATV droids would place it. sigh

The tree in question is actually between our house and the neighbour's
house. There is about 15 feet between the two houses. I believe the
tree's base is actually right on the property line, and the dead part
leans somewhat towards our house. It'll be tricky for no matter who
takes it down. I assume they climb up it and start cutting from the
top, so they can control where the chunks of tree fall each time,
right?

Right. They'll take it to pieces from the top down. It's an amazing aerial
"ballet" - quite interesting to watch.

I know local markets vary, but is this the sort of thing that's
hundreds of dollars or thousands of dollars?

If there is 15-feet between the houses and the tree in question is a "house
crusher", it could easily cost a couple grand.

I watched a *HUGE* tree be removed in our small town. It was easily
100-years-old and DIRECTLY between two, equally aged houses. The BIG tree
removal company didn't have high-reach equipment capable of doing the job.
They hired a CRANE company to help.

The crane was set up in the (closed) street out front. It literally reached
over the house where tree climbers secured a sling to huge branches. They cut
the branch and the crane lifted it over the house and set it down in the
street. There the branch was diced-up and carted off.

The crane, with operator, was $195/hour. The job was over $6k. Big trees
between houses are *VERY* expensive to remove. It's cheap, however, when
compared to the price of rebuilding a SMASHED house, hospitalization and
funerals.

Remember, trees are like hard drives and light bulbs: It's not IF they'll
come down, it's WHEN.
--

JR

In article .com,
wrote:

About 1-1/2 years ago, had a 35 to 40 foot eucalyptus
taken down, cost something like $325. I'm in the Phoenix
area.

After I built a large concrete addition to my driveway to accommodate my RV, I
paid to have a *LARGE* branch (not the whole tree) removed from my neighbor's
tree that hung over the new drive and camper. It was over $400 about four
years ago. (Omaha, Nebraska area)

They wanted like $80 more to grind the stump down below
ground level. Took a pass on that.

From experience, I have decided that grinding-out a stump is a mixed blessing.

When my house was built in 1991 on a lot that had been vacant since the
neighborhood was first platted in 1960, I had a HUGE Chinese Elm tree removed
and the stump ground out.

The ground over that area has been settling ever since and is a real ankle
buster if I'm not careful when mowing. I assume that LEAVING the stump only
DELAYS the process. I would still grind out a stump, though. I think the
place looks nicer than with an old stump in various stages of decay.
--

JR

With the help of 2 handy buddies, I installed 450' of dog ear fence in a
weekend. Dug the holes, set the poles, added 2 horizontal boards, and nailed
up the dog ears.

As stated elsewhere, the big problem is setting the poles. We spent most of
day 1 doing that and we had a tractor with an auger to dig the holes.

Day 2 was spent running nailguns...

We were very impressed with ourselves when the fence (with 3 gates) was
finished at the end of day 2.

KB


"phaeton" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hello...

I need a fence, probably about 6 feet tall to hold back a couple of
dogs. It won't be that large of an area at first (about 40' by 20 feet
or so), but we intend on expanding the fenced in area in the future.
I'm not a very 'handy' person, I've never installed a fence before,
but i think I have an idea how it goes. We're probably looking at some
of the wooden privacy type (called dogear iirc). I see that you can
buy all the materials and assemble it yourself, or you can buy
pre-built sections from Borg.

Is it ever a better idea to install the fence yourself, or is this one
of those things that you can do yourself, but usually turns out being
more trouble than it's worth unless you've already done it 100 times?
I might just have it professionally done.

(sorry for the open-ended question).


Any direction is appreciated.

My two cents...I think PDQ hit the nail on the head...the hardest part
is the fence posts.
A fence was one of my first DIY projects and turned out to be fairly
easy. I dug the holes and was extra careful about the placement of the
posts. I started in a corner to set the first post. I set it in
concrete so that held it pretty well and used a post level (about 5
bucks at a hardware store) to tell when the post was plumb in both
directions. I ran mason line the length of the run to make sure the
posts were not twisted and were even with each other. I used a tape
measure to set the posts the same distance apart (about 8 feet)
measured center to center. All in all it took a day to dig the holes,
and a day to set the posts. I had one post that was about 6 inches
higher than the rest of them..no problem...5 minutes with a circular
saw and problem solved. From there i bought the prefabbed fence
sections from Home Depot. If you set your posts right it only takes a
couple of hours to put the fence sections up. I used a line level to
set the height and then hit it with screws. Everything but putting the
panels up is a one person job. The panels are heavy enough that i held
them while someone else screwed them.
Also, when i dug my post holes I did it using a post hole digger. Not
the way to go...you can rent a power auger and knock them out in a few
hours. You can concrete the posts in, but if you are afraid of making
a mistake, you can just set them in gravel.
You can used treated wood, but it will turn grey as it weathers. You
can clean it with a power washer once in a while and that will help.
If you use cedar, the cost goes up but the finished product looks nice.

Good luck. IMHO this is a DIY project, even if you are not that
handy. Take your time and set the posts right and the rest will go
smooth. Or, like PDQ said..hire a pro to set the posts.

On 27 Mar 2006 10:20:17 -0800, "Lawrence"


If yu are ot handy then this is too big a project for you. A fence
increases the value of your property and has a lot of eye appeal. It
is important that you do a nice job.

Not going to argue with you...

BUT to be honest I have NEVER seen 6 foot high wooden fence that has
"eye" appeal ..at least to my eyes..

And 90 opercent of the fences I have seen have NOT added value to the
property..usually the opposite...

Not saying it can not be done.. because .I have seen some pretty darn
nice fences...

Bob G.

"Bob G." wrote in message
...
On 27 Mar 2006 10:20:17 -0800, "Lawrence"


If yu are ot handy then this is too big a project for you. A fence
increases the value of your property and has a lot of eye appeal. It
is important that you do a nice job.

Not going to argue with you...

BUT to be honest I have NEVER seen 6 foot high wooden fence that has
"eye" appeal ..at least to my eyes..

And 90 opercent of the fences I have seen have NOT added value to the
property..usually the opposite...

Not saying it can not be done.. because .I have seen some pretty darn
nice fences...

Bob G.

Bob:

I agree with you a 6' fence, by itself, looks like a prison. IMHO one needs
to analyze the reason the fence in being built, contain large animals, small
animals, screen, define property lines, visually break up a big field,
whatever, and then build the right type of fence(s) for that/those
application(s).

For this stated application (hold back a couple of big dogs) I would build
as simple a wood fence as possible, or have a chain link fence
professionally installed, and then try to 'soften' it with climbing vines,
grapes, roses, or any other green living, low maintenance, things one could
think of. The end result, hopefully, would be to contain the animals and
not have it look like what it is, a containment area.

Jay

Bob G. wrote:

BUT to be honest I have NEVER seen 6 foot high wooden fence that has
"eye" appeal ..at least to my eyes..

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. Whether or not it is attractive is not
the point I was trying to make. Any fence attracts the "eye". That
is, it is among the first things noticed when you look at a property
whether positive or negative. This cannot be denied.

And 90 opercent of the fences I have seen have NOT added value to the
property..usually the opposite...

A poorly designed and installed fence does not add value. A nice fence
may add value for some if it makes the property more useful and is well
constructed. That is my reasoning for doing a nice job or hiring
someone who will. Perhaps this makes my meaning more clear.

Lawrence

Speaking of which, i'm currently on the fence (pun semi-intended) about
whether to go with wood (sounds like maintenance) or chainlink (less
attractive, but can be covered up with vines and foliage as stated).

Hell if we had time to do this i'd just plant a thick hedge all the way
around the yard and let it get tall, but unfortunately we do not have
the time for that.

We really liked the black pvc-coated steel fences we've seen advertised
(they resemble wrought iron in appearance). They would go very well
with the motif of the house and are IMHO the nicest looking.
Unfortunately we can't seem to find anyone that will put them in, or
put in one taller than 3 feet. There are also the annodized box-steel
type (with the crimped tops) that i see around a lot of cemetaries that
I think would be gorgeous, but I don't know if those are really
classified as "wrought iron" or just "steel fence".

Saturday the Borg comes over to measure up and give us estimates.
Maybe we'll find out which is cheaper (chainlink or wood) and i don't
have my heart set on having them do it, this is just an estimate.

thx

"phaeton" wrote in message oups.com...
SNIP
| We really liked the black pvc-coated steel fences we've seen advertised
| (they resemble wrought iron in appearance). They would go very well
| with the motif of the house and are IMHO the nicest looking.
| Unfortunately we can't seem to find anyone that will put them in, or
| put in one taller than 3 feet. There are also the annodized box-steel
| type (with the crimped tops) that i see around a lot of cemetaries that
| I think would be gorgeous, but I don't know if those are really
| classified as "wrought iron" or just "steel fence".
|

If you really want "wrought iron", look he

http://www.moultriemanufacturing.com/fences/index.shtml

They got some really good stuff here.

--
PDQ

--

Those are nice... thanks.

probably beyond my price range, especially since I'd have to have
someone install it.

My two cents:

If you're counting on the fence to hold dogs in, you should consider
that some dogs love to dig and will go under the fence, rather than
over it.

If it were my fence, I'd make it is one of the vinyl ones that don't
need painting and aren't subjet to rot.

In addition to checking local ordinances on where fences can go, how
high, etc, also make absolutely sure you know where your property line
is before you put the fence up

"Jim Redelfs" wrote in message
...
Being familiar with more backyards than ANYONE except a meter reader, I
wouldn't install a wooden fence UNLESS it was mounted on STEEL line posts
set
in concrete. I'm not sure I would want to tackle such a fence myself.

Unfortunately, some communities have rules about what type of fence you can
put on your property... It sucks... Every house looks alike, no
originality...

"Jim Redelfs" wrote in message
...
My solution was VERY low-tech: I went to the local farm store and
purchased
an electric fencer. I installed everything myself and it worked like a
charm.
She never climbed the fence again. (PETA can kiss my @$$.)

I did a similar thing... I hammered some 3/4" square steel tubing in the
ground as posts and then put some insulators on them... The posts are only
about 30" high and I run two wires -- one low enough that he can't crawl
under it, the other one about 8-9" above that, pretty much at nose level...
I'm able to keep him in certain area of the yard so that he doesn't lay
landmines all over everywhere in addition to keeping him away from the cable
internet line so it doesn't get chewed up... He's pretty lazy (half German
Shepherd and half Saint Bernard) so he's either too lazy to jump over it or
too stupid...

Don't install a 6-ft fence for any other reason that you LIKE how it
looks -
not merely for dog containment. Keeping a dog inside a fence, even a
48-inch-high fence, can be accomplished in much less expensive and
obtrusive
ways.

Previous dogs I had would chew through the wooden fences... They would dig
down a bit until they hit the clay and couldn't dig any further and then
start eating a hole through the fence... They would go out, but come back...
My current dog is so stupid he can't find his way back home... He's also so
friendly that is kind of like, "Smile at me, I'm your's"...

However, considering that CATV's idea of a buried drop is to simply kick
dirt
over it, burying it yourself MIGHT not be a bad idea. You just don't HAVE
to
do it - they should.

I prefer to run the CATV and phone lines through Schedule-40 PVC pipe so
that if I'm eventually digging around in that area, I might notice it before
actually cutting the line... Schedule-20, doesn't work... With one swipe of
my post hole digger, I went through 3 pieces of Schedule-20 that was used
for my sprinkler system that all crossed exactly where I was wanting to put
a fence post...

wrote in message
oups.com...
If you're counting on the fence to hold dogs in, you should consider
that some dogs love to dig and will go under the fence, rather than
over it.

Running a concrete strip along the bottom of the fence will stop many of the
dogs... It also helps prevent dirt getting in contact with the bottom of the
wooden fence and keeps the bottoms from rotting out as quickly... Some
people just bury some chicken wire along the edge of the fence...

If it were my fence, I'd make it is one of the vinyl ones that don't
need painting and aren't subjet to rot.

Assuming your dog doesn't like to chew on the plastic... My dog *loves* PVC
pipe... If you are even a mediocre welder, it's not that difficult to weld
up your own metal fence... When you buy the metal at the steel supply stores
in the 20 ft lengths, the 1/2" solid bar stock is not that much more than
the 1/2" square tubing that is around 16-gauge... The horizonal pieces of
the fence will be at least 3/4"... Anything larger than 3/4" will definitely
be square tubing, not bar stock... Posts will be 1.5 or 2 inches and also
square tubing...