Hello:

Would appreciate any information on the following:

Will be replacing a very old gas, forced hot air furnace with a new
"high-efficiency" type.

Have just read in the Audel's HVAC manuals that for a "high-efficiency" type
of hot air
furnace, you do not vent thru the chimney (or via a metal vent pipe that
goes thru roof like we now have),
but rather you vent via a PVC pipe thru the side of the house. It wasn't
worded such that you might think that this is an an option, but rather that
this is the (only) way to do it.

Has to do with the fact that the gas is not very hot from these types of
furnaces, and the condensate would flow back and ruin the furnace, etc.

Is it the "only" way ?

Is there a "mid-efficiency" forced gas hot air furnace that would enable
venting in the manner we now are doing it (thru the roof) ?

Sure don't want the expense of trying to configure a new vent thru the back
side of the house !

If so, how would these "mid-efficiency" furnaces be designated: by SEER
Number, or... ?

Any thoughts on this would be most appreciated.

Thanks,
Bob

You would not want anything less efficient then one that uses PVC. PVC is
cheap and zero clearance. The guy who comes out to look at your old
installation should have a way to do it. He is also going to have to route
the condensate out of the house sometimes using a small pump and vinyl
hose..... again no big deal.


"Robert11" wrote in message
...
Hello:

Would appreciate any information on the following:

Will be replacing a very old gas, forced hot air furnace with a new
"high-efficiency" type.

Have just read in the Audel's HVAC manuals that for a "high-efficiency"
type of hot air
furnace, you do not vent thru the chimney (or via a metal vent pipe that
goes thru roof like we now have),
but rather you vent via a PVC pipe thru the side of the house. It wasn't
worded such that you might think that this is an an option, but rather
that this is the (only) way to do it.

Has to do with the fact that the gas is not very hot from these types of
furnaces, and the condensate would flow back and ruin the furnace, etc.

Is it the "only" way ?

Is there a "mid-efficiency" forced gas hot air furnace that would enable
venting in the manner we now are doing it (thru the roof) ?

Sure don't want the expense of trying to configure a new vent thru the
back side of the house !

If so, how would these "mid-efficiency" furnaces be designated: by SEER
Number, or... ?

Any thoughts on this would be most appreciated.

Thanks,
Bob

If you live in an area that has high heat bills and want to really save
then a condensing furnace is the way to go. You pretty much add 10 - 15%
efficiency over non condensing. Non condensing are around 80-83% and
condensing easily up to 94.5% on several makes. Vents can be run a
specified distance to help in location of vent-exhaust. Everything has
its drawbacks.

"Robert11" wrote in message
...
Hello:

Would appreciate any information on the following:

Will be replacing a very old gas, forced hot air furnace with a new
"high-efficiency" type.

Go 94% or higher...go with the highest AFUE you can possibly afford.



Have just read in the Audel's HVAC manuals that for a "high-efficiency"
type
of hot air
furnace, you do not vent thru the chimney (or via a metal vent pipe that
goes thru roof like we now have),
but rather you vent via a PVC pipe thru the side of the house. It wasn't
worded such that you might think that this is an an option, but rather
that
this is the (only) way to do it.


Its the only way to do it correctly, as all your new 90%+ units are set up
that way.



Has to do with the fact that the gas is not very hot from these types of
furnaces, and the condensate would flow back and ruin the furnace, etc.

Is it the "only" way ?

Pretty much....I mean...you can do whatever you want, but running the intake
and exhaust on the new units takes about an hour in most cases, and its not
real difficult. Your installers know what and how to do this.


Is there a "mid-efficiency" forced gas hot air furnace that would enable
venting in the manner we now are doing it (thru the roof) ?

Nope...not unless you call 80% mid....we call mid 90% units, and all of them
vent via PVC pipe.


Sure don't want the expense of trying to configure a new vent thru the
back
side of the house !

If so, how would these "mid-efficiency" furnaces be designated: by SEER
Number, or... ?


AFUE.
SEER is ONLY for AC
HSPF is for the heat mode on a heat pump.
In all cases, higher numbers mean less expense to run.

Any thoughts on this would be most appreciated.


We use a concentric vent on all our new installs where the old unit is
vented via B pipe like you have now.
All it takes is a 4 inch hole in the side of the home, and the intake and
exhaust are in the same opening, but you only see a round "cap" that is on
the outside of the home. The center of the vent is the exhaust and the
backside is the intake...under the home the pipe splits and the intake and
the exhaust are in different pipes leading back to the unit. The vents are
not overly expensive, and they are quick and easy for your installer to set
up. Once they are in place, you just support the PVC every 5 feet or to your
local code and its done.
If you want to see pics of one, in action, let me know as we have several
that we can either put on the website, or mail to you.



Thanks,
Bob

"Robert11" wrote in message
...
Hello:

Would appreciate any information on the following:

Will be replacing a very old gas, forced hot air furnace with a new
"high-efficiency" type.

Have just read in the Audel's HVAC manuals that for a "high-efficiency"
type
of hot air
furnace, you do not vent thru the chimney (or via a metal vent pipe that
goes thru roof like we now have),
but rather you vent via a PVC pipe thru the side of the house. It wasn't
worded such that you might think that this is an an option, but rather
that
this is the (only) way to do it.

Has to do with the fact that the gas is not very hot from these types of
furnaces, and the condensate would flow back and ruin the furnace, etc.

Is it the "only" way ?

Is there a "mid-efficiency" forced gas hot air furnace that would enable
venting in the manner we now are doing it (thru the roof) ?

Sure don't want the expense of trying to configure a new vent thru the
back
side of the house !

If so, how would these "mid-efficiency" furnaces be designated: by SEER
Number, or... ?

Any thoughts on this would be most appreciated.

Thanks,
Bob

You can go through the chimney with an 80% eff. non-condensing furnace. With
the high eff. you not only need to go through the side of the house but
you'll also need a condensate pump and a means to get the condensate to an
area where it can be drained----I use my washing machine drain. If you go
through the side of the house and live in an area where you get a lot of
snow be sure that the vents are high enough off the ground so that there is
no chance of snow blockage. In the long run, there is a measurable cost
saving going with the higher eff. furnace.
MLD

"Art" wrote in message
k.net...
You would not want anything less efficient then one that uses PVC. PVC is
cheap and zero clearance. The guy who comes out to look at your old
installation should have a way to do it. He is also going to have to
route
the condensate out of the house sometimes using a small pump and vinyl
hose..... again no big deal.


According to http://hem.dis.anl.gov/eehem/94/941108.html the condensation is
supposed to run back to the furnace. :-/

I'm learning myself, and I don't quite understand why it wouldn't be better
to keep the condensation out of the furnace.

The only thing I can come up with so far is that it's supposed to run back
in to be heated enough to evaporate and be expelled as a gas instead of
pooling in the exhaust pipe somewhere and restricting the airflow. But
wouldn't a condensate drain work, and be a better idea, like you suggest
above?

We have a pulse furnace at one of the homes where I work. I have no idea why
anyone would want a pulse-jet honking away like that in their basement. It
is quite annoying... the first time I kicked the furnace on I shut it back
off because I thought it was malfunctioning.

"Olaf" wrote in message
...

"Art" wrote in message
k.net...
You would not want anything less efficient then one that uses PVC. PVC
is
cheap and zero clearance. The guy who comes out to look at your old
installation should have a way to do it. He is also going to have to
route
the condensate out of the house sometimes using a small pump and vinyl
hose..... again no big deal.


According to http://hem.dis.anl.gov/eehem/94/941108.html the condensation
is
supposed to run back to the furnace. :-/

I'm learning myself, and I don't quite understand why it wouldn't be
better
to keep the condensation out of the furnace.



OK, I should have kept reading... it does say the condensate needs to be
drained. sheesh! I was wondering why one would want water boiling off in the
heat exchanger... what a waste of energy!

"Olaf" wrote in message
...

"Olaf" wrote in message
...

"Art" wrote in message
k.net...
You would not want anything less efficient then one that uses PVC.
PVC
is
cheap and zero clearance. The guy who comes out to look at your old
installation should have a way to do it. He is also going to have to
route
the condensate out of the house sometimes using a small pump and vinyl
hose..... again no big deal.


According to http://hem.dis.anl.gov/eehem/94/941108.html the
condensation
is
supposed to run back to the furnace. :-/

I'm learning myself, and I don't quite understand why it wouldn't be
better
to keep the condensation out of the furnace.



OK, I should have kept reading... it does say the condensate needs to be
drained. sheesh! I was wondering why one would want water boiling off in
the
heat exchanger... what a waste of energy!


Well, it condenses out in the 2nd exchanger, and there are at least 3 places
on most units to remove this.
You would be amazed at how many installers dont hook the lines up right and
how much trouble such a little thing causes.