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Old January 19th 07, 08:13 PM posted to alt.electronics,sci.electronics.equipment
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Default Running an empty microwave oven

Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?

Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?

Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do stuff like that)

--
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A Pakistani arrives in London City all excited. He stops the first person he meets. "Good day, Mr. British, thank you to accept me in Your nice country", but the person interrupts and says: "I am not British, I'm Chinese."
The Pakistani continues on his way and meets another passer-by. "Thank you Mr. British for to let my family and me stay here... " Again, he's interrupted before finishing his sentence. "I no be British, I be Turk!"
He goes a little farther and meets another person and greets him "thank you for letting me come to your beautiful country." ... "I'm not British, I'm Kosavon."
"But," answers the Pakistani distressed, "where are the British??"
The Kosavon looks at his watch and says ..... "Probably at work."

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Old January 19th 07, 08:26 PM posted to alt.electronics,sci.electronics.equipment
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Default Running an empty microwave oven



Peter Hucker wrote:

Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?

Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?

Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating,

That would be a Magnetron tube, and yes, I thenk they all have a
thermostat on
the tube. This is also to prevent a fire if the cooling fan seizes up.
But, in the
case of no food to absorb the microwave energy, the reflected power can
build up
higher than normal voltages in the tube and cause permanent damage
before the
entire anode overheats.

or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do stuff like that)



Parrots? What about kids? I suspect quite a few microwaves get "toasted"
by kids turning them on empty. I know they can survive a few seconds of
this abuse without noticeable damage. You could unplug it or leave the door
open (I'm pretty sure a parrot couldn't close the door.)

Jon

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Old January 20th 07, 10:02 AM posted to alt.electronics,sci.electronics.equipment
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Default Running an empty microwave oven

Peter Hucker wrote in message news[email protected]

I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm

concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)


Parrots. Cool :-)

Leave a cup of water in it. Or something like those heat up aromatherapy
bags, the ones that have lots of little cherry stones in it.


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Old January 20th 07, 04:56 PM posted to alt.electronics,sci.electronics.equipment
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Default Running an empty microwave oven

On Sat, 20 Jan 2007 10:02:05 -0000, Alison "invalid" wrote:

Peter Hucker wrote in message news[email protected]

I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm

concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)


Parrots. Cool :-)


13 of them. Messy. Noisy. But fun.

Leave a cup of water in it. Or something like those heat up aromatherapy
bags, the ones that have lots of little cherry stones in it.


That would only delay the problem. And I'd never remember to put a glass of water in after each time I use it.

I want to know what happens if it is switched on empty. The instructions just say it will damage it. That doesn't bother me too much, it was a very cheap one. As long as it doesn't explode or catch fire when I'm out of the house.

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

What's the difference between spit and swallow?
Forty pounds of pressure on the back of her head.
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Old January 20th 07, 05:02 PM posted to alt.electronics,sci.electronics.equipment
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Default Running an empty microwave oven

On Fri, 19 Jan 2007 20:26:35 -0000, Jon Elson wrote:



Peter Hucker wrote:

Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?

Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?

Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating,

That would be a Magnetron tube, and yes, I thenk they all have a
thermostat on
the tube. This is also to prevent a fire if the cooling fan seizes up.
But, in the
case of no food to absorb the microwave energy, the reflected power can
build up
higher than normal voltages in the tube and cause permanent damage
before the
entire anode overheats.


So it'll just break? That's good to know. I don't want to lose a house or a parrot while out at work.

or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do stuff like that)



Parrots? What about kids? I suspect quite a few microwaves get "toasted"
by kids turning them on empty.


That's a point, it must happen a lot. If they caught fire or exploded, we'd see it on the news.

I know they can survive a few seconds of
this abuse without noticeable damage.


I once went for an interview at a company that makes magnetrons. As far as I know there is a thing that absorbs all returning microwaves. Wouldn't this just have a temperature sensor in it that would shut off the oven?

You could unplug it


The plug is behind the fridge. I used to plug it in above the worktop, but the parrots ate the plug!

or leave the door open (I'm pretty sure a parrot couldn't close the door.)


I bet it could, if it wanted to. But they are more interested in opening or breaking things. Parrots do not tidy or assemble things.

If I leave the door open, one will climb inside and chew up the cover that's over the magnetron output (it looks to be card).

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

"A computer lets you make more mistakes faster than any invention in human history--with the possible exceptions of handguns and tequila."


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Old January 20th 07, 09:03 PM posted to alt.electronics,sci.electronics.equipment
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Default Running an empty microwave oven

On Sat, 20 Jan 2007 16:56:34 -0000, "Peter Hucker"
wrote:

On Sat, 20 Jan 2007 10:02:05 -0000, Alison "invalid" wrote:

Peter Hucker wrote in message news[email protected]

I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm

concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)


Parrots. Cool :-)


13 of them. Messy. Noisy. But fun.

Leave a cup of water in it. Or something like those heat up aromatherapy
bags, the ones that have lots of little cherry stones in it.


That would only delay the problem. And I'd never remember to put a glass of water in after each time I use it.

I want to know what happens if it is switched on empty. The instructions just say it will damage it. That doesn't bother me too much, it was a very cheap one. As long as it doesn't explode or catch fire when I'm out of the house.


Look, the only safe thing is to unplug it. Even a glass of water won't
provide protection if they turn it on for 20 minutes! Use a short,
heavy duty (12 awg) extension cord, or some other similar device.

Either that, or make up a metal shield to cover the controls...

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Old January 20th 07, 10:26 PM posted to alt.electronics,sci.electronics.equipment
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Default Running an empty microwave oven

Peter Hucker wrote:
On Fri, 19 Jan 2007 20:26:35 -0000, Jon Elson wrote:



Peter Hucker wrote:


Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?

Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?

Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating,


That would be a Magnetron tube, and yes, I thenk they all have a
thermostat on
the tube. This is also to prevent a fire if the cooling fan seizes up.
But, in the
case of no food to absorb the microwave energy, the reflected power can
build up
higher than normal voltages in the tube and cause permanent damage
before the
entire anode overheats.



So it'll just break? That's good to know. I don't want to lose a house or a parrot while out at work.

Well, if it has the safety thermostat on the anode, then it will
just shut down, probably forever. I have no idea whether the
safety thermostat is mandated by law or required by testing
agencies like UL, and whether the really cheap ones from China
have them. Without the safety stat, I don't know what would happen.


That's a point, it must happen a lot. If they caught fire or exploded, we'd see it on the news.

Well, I think there have been some fires from them, but probably
not a lot.


I once went for an interview at a company that makes magnetrons. As far as I know there is a thing that absorbs all returning microwaves. Wouldn't this just have a temperature sensor in it that would shut off the oven?

Not in an oven. Maybe in a radar transmitter, they have an
expensive part called a circulator that splits waves going in
different directions, and shunts returning waves to a terminating
resistor. Nothing like that in a microwave oven, believe me.

Jon
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Old January 22nd 07, 02:18 PM posted to alt.electronics,sci.electronics.equipment
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Default Running an empty microwave oven

"Peter Hucker" wrote in message
news[email protected]
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will

break it?

Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?

Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating,

or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm

concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)

When I designed some of the early mcu controllers for them eons ago
we used to give them a heck of a lot of abuse such
as running them empty to try and get the mcu to crash,
(wich with a piggy back eprom mcu was all too easy)
ofc always a microwave leakage meter nearby,
the most spectacular thing was to melt the glass tray,
the turntable mechanism was the first thing to melt usually.

If theres food inside it will eventually catch fire and the flames will come
out of the back,
this was a serious liability worry at the time I assume theyve added some
safty things since I worked on them.

Some have water vapour detectors wich sense the peak and stop cooking, I
assume they will stop if nothing is detected.

Colin =^.^=


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Old January 22nd 07, 07:01 PM posted to alt.electronics,sci.electronics.equipment
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Default Running an empty microwave oven

On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 14:18:49 -0000, colin wrote:

"Peter Hucker" wrote in message
news[email protected]
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will

break it?

Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?

Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating,

or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm

concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)

When I designed some of the early mcu controllers for them eons ago
we used to give them a heck of a lot of abuse such
as running them empty to try and get the mcu to crash,
(wich with a piggy back eprom mcu was all too easy)
ofc always a microwave leakage meter nearby,
the most spectacular thing was to melt the glass tray,
the turntable mechanism was the first thing to melt usually.

If theres food inside it will eventually catch fire and the flames will come
out of the back,
this was a serious liability worry at the time I assume theyve added some
safty things since I worked on them.

Some have water vapour detectors wich sense the peak and stop cooking, I
assume they will stop if nothing is detected.


This is a 27 Tesco Value microwave - probably only has legal safety requirements.

I've already turned it on momentarily with nothing in it, as I'm used to an electronic one. If my food has gone cold due to a phonecall etc, I tend to shove it in and just turn the timer round to get it to go, then open the door after 20 seconds. The electronic ones cancelled the timer when you opened the door, but this one turns back on when you shut the door.

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

"Computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, 1949
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Old January 22nd 07, 07:05 PM posted to alt.electronics,sci.electronics.equipment
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Posts: 415
Default Running an empty microwave oven

On Sat, 20 Jan 2007 21:03:42 -0000, PeterD wrote:

On Sat, 20 Jan 2007 16:56:34 -0000, "Peter Hucker"
wrote:

On Sat, 20 Jan 2007 10:02:05 -0000, Alison "invalid" wrote:

Peter Hucker wrote in message news[email protected]

I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm
concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)


Parrots. Cool :-)


13 of them. Messy. Noisy. But fun.

Leave a cup of water in it. Or something like those heat up aromatherapy
bags, the ones that have lots of little cherry stones in it.


That would only delay the problem. And I'd never remember to put a glass of water in after each time I use it.

I want to know what happens if it is switched on empty. The instructions just say it will damage it. That doesn't bother me too much, it was a very cheap one. As long as it doesn't explode or catch fire when I'm out of the house.


Look, the only safe thing is to unplug it. Even a glass of water won't
provide protection if they turn it on for 20 minutes! Use a short,
heavy duty (12 awg) extension cord, or some other similar device.


Nowhere is safe to plug it in without them chewing the plug. The plug has to be out of sight, which means I can't get to it to turn it off.

Either that, or make up a metal shield to cover the controls...


I bit of a hassle, and I'm useless at that kind of thing. And too lazy to do so unless I'm sure it would explode. Maybe I should buy another one and try it in the garden....

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Condoms aren't completely safe. A friend of mine was wearing one and got hit by a bus.


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