I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person
had been sick. However, I don't know if it still emits the germ killing
UVC spectrum. What's a quick way I could tell for sure? Thanks.

On 2020/01/18 1:11 p.m., KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person
had been sick.Â* However, I don't know if it still emits the germ killing
UVC spectrum.Â* What's a quick way I could tell for sure?Â* Thanks.

Inverse square law makes your idea not so practical, aside from the
inherent dangers of exposure to raw UV light!

Better to wash the room down with a disinfectant, or simply air it out
for a while...

If the person was very contagious then look up the procedures for
dealing with that rather than making up your own potentially dangerous
ones.

John :-#(#

On 1/18/20 5:08 PM, John Robertson wrote:
On 2020/01/18 1:11 p.m., KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person
had been sick.Â* However, I don't know if it still emits the germ
killing UVC spectrum.Â* What's a quick way I could tell for sure?Â* Thanks.

Inverse square law makes your idea not so practical, aside from the
inherent dangers of exposure to raw UV light!

I'm well aware of this after having used such lamps in the past.


Better to wash the room down with a disinfectant, or simply air it out
for a while...

The problem is that there are dogs and cats present and the room I want
to sterilize is in a relative's house. They own the pets, but I haven't
had a pet in over 40 years. If I were disinfecting my own room, I might
use 70% iso rubbing alcohol in sprayer format or even a weak bleach
solution, but animals pretty much rule out either chemical. At least
with the lamp, there are no residuals other than perhaps weak ozone that
can be aired out quickly.


If the person was very contagious then look up the procedures for
dealing with that rather than making up your own potentially dangerous
ones.

Trying not to make this complicated. All I wanted to do was see if the
lamp was in fact still producing the necessary UVC spectrum. Surely,
there should be something on the market that perhaps fluoresces only
when UVC illuminates it. Or something similar and relatively simple.

John :-#(#

a) Neither cats nor dogs are threatened by a low concentration of either bleach or isopropyl alcohol.
b) Anything over 10% alcohol or 0.5% sodium hypochlorite is an effective germicide & viricide.
c) Common 80-proof Vodka cut 4:1 is also very effective, and leaves no residue.

With that in mind, and the exposure requirements for UV to be effective, you would be far better served to use an alcohol solution. Which has the additional virtue of being able to get behind and into cracks and corners where light will not.

Do also research the viability of the infections involved over time, tolerance of temperature extremes, tolerance of humidity extremes and so forth. And, just for giggles, look up Hospital patient room discharge requirements.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA

In article , says...

Trying not to make this complicated. All I wanted to do was see if the
lamp was in fact still producing the necessary UVC spectrum. Surely,
there should be something on the market that perhaps fluoresces only
when UVC illuminates it. Or something similar and relatively simple.




Lots of cloth material made out of polyester that is white will have a
chemical in it that glows under the UV light.

Try taking several pieces of white clothing and even the white thread
that some buttons are sewen on with will work.

Where I worked making polyester sandoze was added to the material to
make the whites even whiter. That glows under UV light.

On Sun, 19 Jan 2020 10:08:04 -0500, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article , says...

Trying not to make this complicated. All I wanted to do was see if the
lamp was in fact still producing the necessary UVC spectrum. Surely,
there should be something on the market that perhaps fluoresces only
when UVC illuminates it. Or something similar and relatively simple.

Lots of cloth material made out of polyester that is white will have a
chemical in it that glows under the UV light.

Try taking several pieces of white clothing and even the white thread
that some buttons are sewen on with will work.

Where I worked making polyester sandoze was added to the material to
make the whites even whiter. That glows under UV light.

Cat ****. Cat **** shows up quite bright under UV light.

Glad to help,
Jonesy
--
Marvin L Jones | Marvin | W3DHJ.net | linux
38.238N 104.547W | @ jonz.net | Jonesy | FreeBSD
* Killfiling google & XXXXbanter.com: jonz.net/ng.htm

On 1/18/2020 3:11 PM, KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person
had been sick.Â* However, I don't know if it still emits the germ killing
UVC spectrum.Â* What's a quick way I could tell for sure?Â* Thanks.

I see UVC covers 200nm to 280nm. I don't know anything about UVC bulbs
so I need to ask is does yours have a specific wavelength output? Like
270nm? My limited search finds bulbs of 254nm to 270 nm.
I did a little searching and didn't find anything in the way of UVC
sensors. But maybe a way to back into it?
Adafruit has a UV sensor that works from 240nm to 370nm for $6.50.
Maybe buy a filter for UVA and UVB, to cover that sensor and see if it
senses any UVC. OR buy a UVC sensor and flip flop covering and
uncovering the sensor and see if you get a square wave output.

Mikek

On 1/19/2020 8:59 AM, amdx wrote:
On 1/18/2020 3:11 PM, KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person
had been sick.Â* However, I don't know if it still emits the germ
killing UVC spectrum.Â* What's a quick way I could tell for sure?Â* Thanks.

I see UVC covers 200nm to 280nm. I don't know anything about UVC bulbs
so I need to ask is does yours have a specific wavelength output? Like
270nm? My limited search finds bulbs of 254nm to 270 nm.
Â*I did a little searching and didn't find anything in the way of UVC
sensors. But maybe a way to back into it?
Â*Adafruit has a UV sensor that works from 240nm to 370nm for $6.50.
Maybe buy a filter for UVA and UVB, to cover that sensor and see if it
senses any UVC. OR buy a UVC sensor and flip flop covering and
uncovering the sensor and see if you get a square wave output.

Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Mikek

I should have posted the sensor.
https://cdn-shop.adafruit.com/datasheets/1918guva.pdf

and the adafruit pcb.

https://www.adafruit.com/product/191...An90EALw_ wcB

On 1/19/2020 9:01 AM, amdx wrote:
On 1/19/2020 8:59 AM, amdx wrote:
On 1/18/2020 3:11 PM, KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person
had been sick.Â* However, I don't know if it still emits the germ
killing UVC spectrum.Â* What's a quick way I could tell for sure?
Thanks.

I see UVC covers 200nm to 280nm. I don't know anything about UVC bulbs
so I need to ask is does yours have a specific wavelength output? Like
270nm? My limited search finds bulbs of 254nm to 270 nm.
Â*Â*I did a little searching and didn't find anything in the way of UVC
sensors. But maybe a way to back into it?
Â*Â*Adafruit has a UV sensor that works from 240nm to 370nm for $6.50.
Maybe buy a filter for UVA and UVB, to cover that sensor and see if it
senses any UVC. OR buy a UVC sensor and flip flop covering and
uncovering the sensor and see if you get a square wave output.

Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Mikek

Â*I should have posted the sensor.
https://cdn-shop.adafruit.com/datasheets/1918guva.pdf

Â*and the adafruit pcb.

https://www.adafruit.com/product/191...An90EALw_ wcB




No one has responded to my post. Is there anything fundamentally wrong
other than the cost of filters is high and the sensor has it weakest
response in the UVC wavelength.
I don't mind the idea getting shot down, I'd learn something.

Mikek

On 2020/01/20 6:23 p.m., amdx wrote:
On 1/19/2020 9:01 AM, amdx wrote:
On 1/19/2020 8:59 AM, amdx wrote:
On 1/18/2020 3:11 PM, KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a
person had been sick.Â* However, I don't know if it still emits the
germ killing UVC spectrum.Â* What's a quick way I could tell for
sure? Thanks.

I see UVC covers 200nm to 280nm. I don't know anything about UVC
bulbs so I need to ask is does yours have a specific wavelength
output? Like 270nm? My limited search finds bulbs of 254nm to 270 nm.
Â*Â*I did a little searching and didn't find anything in the way of UVC
sensors. But maybe a way to back into it?
Â*Â*Adafruit has a UV sensor that works from 240nm to 370nm for $6.50.
Maybe buy a filter for UVA and UVB, to cover that sensor and see if
it senses any UVC. OR buy a UVC sensor and flip flop covering and
uncovering the sensor and see if you get a square wave output.

Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Mikek

Â*Â*I should have posted the sensor.
https://cdn-shop.adafruit.com/datasheets/1918guva.pdf

Â*Â*and the adafruit pcb.

https://www.adafruit.com/product/191...An90EALw_ wcB




Â*No one has responded to my post. Is there anything fundamentally wrong
other than the cost of filters is high and the sensor has it weakest
response in the UVC wavelength.
Â*I don't mind the idea getting shot down, I'd learn something.

Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Mikek

Hi Mikek,

While your information may be valid, it is of little use to the OP to
try to use a UV bulb to sterilize the room. It would be dangerous to his
eyes and or skin, and it would be ineffective as the UV only would
effect microbes that are on a surface the UV light would strike, plus
the UV light has to be near (under 1 foot typically) to have a high
enough concentration and it needs to light up the organisms for up to
five minutes to be sure of killing them. Thus you have to hold the UV
lamp for five minutes over every square inch of the room and you won't
get any of the crevasses at all!

So totally impractical.

On the other hand if you made a separate posting under the topic of
tools to measure UV bandwidth (or similar) you might get more bites!

John :-#)#

On Monday, January 20, 2020 at 10:29:31 PM UTC-5, John Robertson wrote:
On 2020/01/20 6:23 p.m., amdx wrote:
On 1/19/2020 9:01 AM, amdx wrote:
On 1/19/2020 8:59 AM, amdx wrote:
On 1/18/2020 3:11 PM, KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a
person had been sick.Â* However, I don't know if it still emits the
germ killing UVC spectrum.Â* What's a quick way I could tell for
sure? Thanks.

I see UVC covers 200nm to 280nm. I don't know anything about UVC
bulbs so I need to ask is does yours have a specific wavelength
output? Like 270nm? My limited search finds bulbs of 254nm to 270 nm.
Â*Â*I did a little searching and didn't find anything in the way of UVC
sensors. But maybe a way to back into it?
Â*Â*Adafruit has a UV sensor that works from 240nm to 370nm for $6.50.
Maybe buy a filter for UVA and UVB, to cover that sensor and see if
it senses any UVC. OR buy a UVC sensor and flip flop covering and
uncovering the sensor and see if you get a square wave output.

Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Mikek

Â*Â*I should have posted the sensor.
https://cdn-shop.adafruit.com/datasheets/1918guva.pdf

Â*Â*and the adafruit pcb.

https://www.adafruit.com/product/191...An90EALw_ wcB




Â*No one has responded to my post. Is there anything fundamentally wrong
other than the cost of filters is high and the sensor has it weakest
response in the UVC wavelength.
Â*I don't mind the idea getting shot down, I'd learn something.

Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Mikek

Hi Mikek,

While your information may be valid, it is of little use to the OP to
try to use a UV bulb to sterilize the room. It would be dangerous to his
eyes and or skin, and it would be ineffective as the UV only would
effect microbes that are on a surface the UV light would strike, plus
the UV light has to be near (under 1 foot typically) to have a high
enough concentration and it needs to light up the organisms for up to
five minutes to be sure of killing them. Thus you have to hold the UV
lamp for five minutes over every square inch of the room and you won't
get any of the crevasses at all!

So totally impractical.

On the other hand if you made a separate posting under the topic of
tools to measure UV bandwidth (or similar) you might get more bites!

On some work sites, you see the plumbers or steamfitters welding (tig) black iron pipe, creating light that could hurt the cornea of un-protected eyes.. How would germs stand up to that spectrum? You have to wonder.

On 1/20/2020 9:29 PM, John Robertson wrote:
On 2020/01/20 6:23 p.m., amdx wrote:
On 1/19/2020 9:01 AM, amdx wrote:
On 1/19/2020 8:59 AM, amdx wrote:
On 1/18/2020 3:11 PM, KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a
person had been sick.Â* However, I don't know if it still emits the
germ killing UVC spectrum.Â* What's a quick way I could tell for
sure? Thanks.

I see UVC covers 200nm to 280nm. I don't know anything about UVC
bulbs so I need to ask is does yours have a specific wavelength
output? Like 270nm? My limited search finds bulbs of 254nm to 270 nm.
Â*Â*I did a little searching and didn't find anything in the way of
UVC sensors. But maybe a way to back into it?
Â*Â*Adafruit has a UV sensor that works from 240nm to 370nm for $6.50.
Maybe buy a filter for UVA and UVB, to cover that sensor and see if
it senses any UVC. OR buy a UVC sensor and flip flop covering and
uncovering the sensor and see if you get a square wave output.

Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Mikek

Â*Â*I should have posted the sensor.
https://cdn-shop.adafruit.com/datasheets/1918guva.pdf

Â*Â*and the adafruit pcb.

https://www.adafruit.com/product/191...An90EALw_ wcB




Â*Â*No one has responded to my post. Is there anything fundamentally
wrong other than the cost of filters is high and the sensor has it
weakest response in the UVC wavelength.
Â*Â*I don't mind the idea getting shot down, I'd learn something.

Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Mikek

Hi Mikek,

While your information may be valid, it is of little use to the OP to
try to use a UV bulb to sterilize the room. It would be dangerous to his
eyes and or skin, and it would be ineffective as the UV only would
effect microbes that are on a surface the UV light would strike, plus
the UV light has to be near (under 1 foot typically) to have a high
enough concentration and it needs to light up the organisms for up to
five minutes to be sure of killing them. Thus you have to hold the UV
lamp for five minutes over every square inch of the room and you won't
get any of the crevasses at all!

So totally impractical.

On the other hand if you made a separate posting under the topic of
tools to measure UV bandwidth (or similar) you might get more bites!

John :-#)#


Ok, I just want to say one word to you, just one word, Copper!

http://theconversation.com/copper-is...s-use-it-73103

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antimi...ties_of_copper

OK, OK same problem, getting it over the entire room.
But it would be interesting to see what harmful effects having
lots of copper fittings all over a hospital would cause.
Most of us have spent years drinking water that spent the night in a
copper pipe, so maybe no problem.
Mikek

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 16:11:01 -0500, KC JONES
wrote:

I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person
had been sick. However, I don't know if it still emits the germ killing
UVC spectrum. What's a quick way I could tell for sure? Thanks.

Ummm... perhaps a UV-C light meter? Something like this:
https://www.solarmeter.com/uvc-meters.html
https://youtu.be/6Jaic8OwzaU
Response is 246-262 nm with a UV-C pass filter.

More of the same:
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=uvc+light+meter
Typically $350 to $1,100. You might want to look into borrowing or
renting such a meter.



--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

In article ,
says...

More of the same:
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=uvc+light+meter
Typically $350 to $1,100. You might want to look into borrowing or
renting such a meter.





You would think that China would have some for way under $50 . While
they may not work the best, China seems to have almost every thing else
very inexpensive.

Bad to pay $ 300 + to check out a $ 20 or so light.

On Sun, 19 Jan 2020 19:01:47 -0500, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

More of the same:
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=uvc+light+meter
Typically $350 to $1,100. You might want to look into borrowing or
renting such a meter.

You would think that China would have some for way under $50 . While
they may not work the best, China seems to have almost every thing else
very inexpensive.

Bad to pay $ 300 + to check out a $ 20 or so light.

I couldn't find anything from China that is substantially cheaper:
https://www.aliexpress.com/wholesale?trafficChannel=main&d=y&SearchText=uvc+m eter&ltype=wholesale&SortType=price_asc&groupsort= 1&CatId=0&page=1

The bulk of the cost seems to be in the sensor and the UV-C filter.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32998762871.html
https://www.edmundoptics.com/c/optical-filters/610/#27587=27587_d%3A%5B200.00%20TO%20280.00%5D&Produc tFamilies_ii=ProductFamilies_ii%3AMTQ5NjM1

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Sunday, January 19, 2020 at 2:18:04 PM UTC-8, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 16:11:01 -0500, KC JONES
wrote:

I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage...However, I don't know if it still emits the germ killing
UVC spectrum. What's a quick way I could tell for sure? Thanks.

Ummm... perhaps a UV-C light meter?
Typically $350 to $1,100. You might want to look into borrowing or
renting such a meter.

It'll embrittle plastic quick if it's really UV-C; a disposable bag turning to
dust would convince me it was shining. Or, you could imagine something with
a slit, telescope mirror, thermopile, and grating, if intensity measurement was
important.

I'd think of something quick-and-dirty before shelling out bucks.

Not so long ago, someone here stated that this group exists to teach gullible individuals how to do things the hard way (as opposed to the correct way, or the effective way. Emphatically not the 'easy way').

This thread is a very nearly perfect example of that process.

a) Whereas light on the correct UV spectrum *will* kill many (not all) microbes and such, it is not designed against the stated purpose. As an Ozonator in a water sterilization device, fine. Or in a fume-hood.

NOTE FROM SECONDARY SOURCE: Germicidal lamps emit radiation in the UV-C portion of the ultraviolet (UV) spectrum, which includes wavelengths between 100 and 280 nanometers (nm). The lamps are used in a variety of applications where disinfection is the primary concern, including air and water purification, food and beverage protection, and sterilization of sensitive tools such as medical instruments. Germicidal light destroys the ability of bacteria, viruses, and other pathogens to multiply by deactivating their reproductive capabilities. The average bacteria may be killed in 10 seconds at a distance of 6 inches from the lamp.

b) That form of UVR that is effective in killing pathogens will also damage humans.

NOTE FROM SECONDARY SOURCE: UVR is not felt immediately; in fact, the user may not realize the danger until after the exposure has caused damage. Symptoms typically occur 4 to 24 hours after exposure. The effects on skin are of two types: acute and chronic. Acute effects appear within a few hours of exposure, while chronic effects are long-lasting and cumulative and may not appear for years. An acute effect of UVR is redness of the skin called erythema (similar to sunburn). Chronic effects include accelerated skin aging and skin cancer. UVR is absorbed in the outer layers of the eye €“ the cornea and conjunctiva. Acute overexposure leads to a painful temporary inflammation, mainly of the cornea, known as photokeratitis. Subsequent overexposure to the UV is unlikely because of the pain involved. Chronic exposure leads to an increased risk of certain types of ocular cataracts.
Working unprotected for even a few minutes can cause injury. It is possible to calculate the threshold for acute effects and to set exposure limits. It is not possible, however, to calculate threshold for chronic effects; therefore, because no exposure level is safe, exposure should be
reduced as much as possible.

c) If one takes the 30 seconds or so to research how UV light is used in laboratory settings to sterilize equipment, surfaces and instruments, one will see that, again, it is not indicated for the purpose stated hear.

Bottom line: UV light is not indicated. UV light is dangerous. UV light is not 'quick' either. To do what is required per the OP is good old 'asses and elbows' work, not the waving of a magic wand or, pun intended, light saber.

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 16:11:01 -0500, KC JONES
wrote:

I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person
had been sick. However, I don't know if it still emits the germ killing
UVC spectrum. What's a quick way I could tell for sure? Thanks.

All the UVC lights I have ever used have some part of the visible
spectrum. See if white items "glow".

Steve

--
http://www.npsnn.com

On Saturday, January 18, 2020 at 4:11:06 PM UTC-5, KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person
had been sick. However, I don't know if it still emits the germ killing
UVC spectrum. What's a quick way I could tell for sure? Thanks.

It's a good question (if not a good use.) Amazon is full of air purifiers that include UV light inside the enclosure. That light must degrade over time, if it even works at all.

A quick google says change the bulb every 12 months. I bet it isn't cheap, either.

So, A your lamp probably kills germs for about 6 inches, and B it's probably worn out by now anyway.

On Tuesday, January 21, 2020 at 2:43:01 PM UTC-5, Tim R wrote:
On Saturday, January 18, 2020 at 4:11:06 PM UTC-5, KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person
had been sick. However, I don't know if it still emits the germ killing
UVC spectrum. What's a quick way I could tell for sure? Thanks.

It's a good question (if not a good use.) Amazon is full of air purifiers that include UV light inside the enclosure. That light must degrade over time, if it even works at all.

A quick google says change the bulb every 12 months. I bet it isn't cheap, either.

So, A your lamp probably kills germs for about 6 inches, and B it's probably worn out by now anyway.

Snip from a UV website:
********
What distance and how long would I have to expose an article to germicidal ultraviolet to sanitize it?
The exposure necessary to inactivate microorganisms is a product of time and ultraviolet intensity. High intensities for a short period of time, or low intensities for a long period of time are fundamentally equal in lethal action on infectious microorganisms. As a rule of thumb, at two inches away from the STER-L-RAY ® germicidal ultraviolet lamp, most common bacteria and virus are inactivated within five seconds of exposure. For specific recommendations, please call our staff with the details of your application (including area available for the fixture, how far the fixture will be from the article, etc.) The more information you can provide, the better.

[snip]

The second best way [a] to clear out microbial nasties
is via hydrgen perxide misting. The equipment is
still quite expensive and rare, but gaining traction
in hospitals and other high risk areas.

Here's a technical/medical professional article
about it:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2546749/

And a markting quasi advert:

http://www.europeancleaningjournal.c...cleaning-firms

You might, emphasize might, be able to find a local
source of this type of equipment for rent.

(Probably not at any reasonable price).

[a] the first is via high intensity radiation.
I doubt you'd find that a plausable option.


--
__________________________________________________ ___
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key

[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]

Let's cut to the chase. If the goal is to sanitize a former sickroom of potentially dangerous and/or persistent bacteria and viruses, using effective means-and-methods as economically as practical, do so with established materials following established procedures and protocols.

https://www.mnhospitals.org/Portals/...uidebo ok.pdf

http://dhss.alaska.gov/dph/Epi/id/Si...eaning-Kit.pdf

Otherwise, it is just speculation and baseless opining.

NOTE: I work in, but not for a major medical school and in their major research and teaching facility. Animals, BSL-3 labs, and all that. Cleaning is a serious concern as on any given day, there is about $30,000,000 in research happening within the building. This building also happens to be attached to a major hospital that closed in November. Where, again, cleaning was a serious business.

Guys and gals, UV is in use - but only in very specialized applications. Otherwise, it is too slow and far too dangerous. Around the animals, it is mostly alcohol and dilute bleach. In the patient rooms it was a mix of alcohol-based wipes and solutions together with various sanitary wipes using complex molecule germicides. BUT, for any sort of spill of patient fluids, blood or similar, it was bleach. Good old bleach. Kills everything, and is easily removed when done.

Ah, well. I guess it MUST be the hard way.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA

On 1/21/20 3:19 PM, wrote:
Let's cut to the chase. If the goal is to sanitize a former sickroom of potentially dangerous and/or persistent bacteria and viruses, using effective means-and-methods as economically as practical, do so with established materials following established procedures and protocols.

https://www.mnhospitals.org/Portals/...uidebo ok.pdf

http://dhss.alaska.gov/dph/Epi/id/Si...eaning-Kit.pdf

Otherwise, it is just speculation and baseless opining.

NOTE: I work in, but not for a major medical school and in their major research and teaching facility. Animals, BSL-3 labs, and all that. Cleaning is a serious concern as on any given day, there is about $30,000,000 in research happening within the building. This building also happens to be attached to a major hospital that closed in November. Where, again, cleaning was a serious business.

Guys and gals, UV is in use - but only in very specialized applications. Otherwise, it is too slow and far too dangerous. Around the animals, it is mostly alcohol and dilute bleach. In the patient rooms it was a mix of alcohol-based wipes and solutions together with various sanitary wipes using complex molecule germicides. BUT, for any sort of spill of patient fluids, blood or similar, it was bleach. Good old bleach. Kills everything, and is easily removed when done.

Ah, well. I guess it MUST be the hard way.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA

Well, just as a follow up, while I did expose the light sealed room to
the 200 W lamp for 30 minutes, I also followed up with 70% iso alcohol
solution. The smell of the room did change after the lamp had been used
with the characteristic strong smell of ozone.

Until the alcohol dried, I kept any animals away and also aired out the
room to negate the ozone. I have now been occupying the room nearly 16
hours per day since "decontamination" and have not gotten sick like the
former occupants. Still taking care to wash hands frequently above all
else.

Just to share, my first experience in the realization of UVC light was
when I was in shop class way back when. When we were finished with our
projects, the teacher would have us place all of out goggles into a
cabinet, then the cabinet was closed and the light was activated to 15
minutes. I doubt that bulb had ever been changed, plus the light was at
the top corner of the cabinet. Not all the goggles would have had
exposure on every side. Makes me wonder about the effectiveness.

KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of years,
but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person had been
sick. However, I don't know if it still emits the germ killing UVC
spectrum. What's a quick way I could tell for sure? Thanks.

My mom had a dryer with UV lamp, think it was for the ozone fresh smell. I
noticed in the hospital they had random UV lights facing up in hallways. I
would think some device using filter to determine band exists. I recall
hearing of a UV device wheeled into rooms for sterilization.

Greg

On 1/18/20 4:11 PM, KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person
had been sick.Â* However, I don't know if it still emits the germ killing
UVC spectrum.Â* What's a quick way I could tell for sure?Â* Thanks.

Once upon a time, I was part of a test study on mercury vapor lamps with
the outer envelopes broken so only the inner, strong UVC element
illuminated. Both 175 and 400 watt bulbs were tested. Can't speak much
for UVC detection without instrumentation, but a quick test might be
illuminating small insects, like crickets or flies. If they die
quickly, there's 99% certainty that you have UVC.

[snip]

Once upon a time, I was part of a test study on mercury vapor lamps with =

the outer envelopes broken so only the inner, strong UVC element=20
illuminated.

*whew*, thanks.

I was 99 percent sure I remembered those days of mercury arc
lamps needing that extra, outer, envelope 'cuz worries
about the UV intensity, and even that Duro Test had marketed
a "safety lamp" ("bulb") that, if the outer glass broke, would
shut itself down.

(this would have been the 1970's)

But none of the yung'uns around me believe that was ever teh case.

Any idea how they cleared up that problem? I replaced a bunch
of legacy mercury lamps about two decades ago and there weren't
any warnings on the packages.

Thanks.

--
__________________________________________________ ___
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key

[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]

On 1/23/20 3:27 PM, danny burstein wrote:
[snip]

Once upon a time, I was part of a test study on mercury vapor lamps with =

the outer envelopes broken so only the inner, strong UVC element=20
illuminated.

*whew*, thanks.

I was 99 percent sure I remembered those days of mercury arc
lamps needing that extra, outer, envelope 'cuz worries
about the UV intensity, and even that Duro Test had marketed
a "safety lamp" ("bulb") that, if the outer glass broke, would
shut itself down.

(this would have been the 1970's)

But none of the yung'uns around me believe that was ever teh case.

Any idea how they cleared up that problem? I replaced a bunch
of legacy mercury lamps about two decades ago and there weren't
any warnings on the packages.

Thanks.


Odd. I still have an outdoor mercury lamp on my property, a 250 W
lamp. I just replaced it last year and the UV warnings were still
present concerning breaking the outer envelope. So they would
definitely still emit UVC if the envelope was broken.

Ways of getting around the UVC hazard included shutdown mechanisms so
that the lamp extinguished when the envelope was broken, providing a
lamp housing that has a glass cover (like street lights have), or
switching out to something different altogether where the UVC hazard
doesn't exist such as LED. There's been an ongoing effort to outlaw the
mv lamps.

In James Reaper writes:


Odd. I still have an outdoor mercury lamp on my property, a 250 W
lamp. I just replaced it last year and the UV warnings were still
present concerning breaking the outer envelope. So they would
definitely still emit UVC if the envelope was broken.

Amusingly the ones I purchased didn't have thos waarning.

I think... they were 185 watt replacements I picked
up at Home Depot. (No one else had them).

Ways of getting around the UVC hazard included shutdown mechanisms so
that the lamp extinguished when the envelope was broken, providing a
lamp housing that has a glass cover (like street lights have), or
switching out to something different altogether where the UVC hazard
doesn't exist such as LED. There's been an ongoing effort to outlaw the
mv lamps.

New fixtures/ballasts have been a no no for a decade or
so by now, and replacement lamps have been attriting down.

About ten years ago I found a drop-in flourescent replacement
for the aforementioned 185 watter. The power factors/wave forms/
how it worked... made my head hurt, but somehow it did.

(We've since swapped the whole fixture for an LED unit).

Oh, here we go:

[Duromex, the successor to Duro Test, website]

"1975: Securilux (Safe-T-Vapor)

"This was the first mercury lamp with a safety mechanism that
extinguished the arc tube in case of an exterior light bulb smash. "

http://duromex.com/about

--
__________________________________________________ ___
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key

[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]

On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 12:27:08 PM UTC-8, danny burstein wrote:

I was 99 percent sure I remembered those days of mercury arc
lamps needing that extra, outer, envelope 'cuz worries
about the UV intensity, and even that Duro Test had marketed
a "safety lamp" ("bulb") that, if the outer glass broke, would
shut itself down.

(this would have been the 1970's)

But none of the yung'uns around me believe that was ever teh case.

Any idea how they cleared up that problem?

Some mercury lamps have quartz envelopes, that take the high temperature, but
those ALSO pass UV. Most low-intensity lamps don't need quartz. and glass
that is opaque to UV is easily formulated. Welder's helmets always have such a
glass filter (in addition to the visible-light-attenuating dark ones).

Heck, some halogen incandescents need a safety glass pane, as well.

On 1/18/20 4:11 PM, KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person
had been sick.Â* However, I don't know if it still emits the germ killing
UVC spectrum.Â* What's a quick way I could tell for sure?Â* Thanks.

Something I've always wondered about were Tesla coils. When I was a
kid, I built one and let it run arcing from HV to ground for nearly an
hour. When my parents arrived home from work, the house was so full of
ozone that we all had to leave for a couple of hours with the windows
wide opened to air out the house. Would that much ozone have killed
surface bacteria as a germicidal lamp would have?

On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 3:07:39 PM UTC-5, James Reaper wrote:

Something I've always wondered about were Tesla coils. When I was a
kid, I built one and let it run arcing from HV to ground for nearly an
hour. When my parents arrived home from work, the house was so full of
ozone that we all had to leave for a couple of hours with the windows
wide opened to air out the house. Would that much ozone have killed
surface bacteria as a germicidal lamp would have?


http://www.ozoneapplications.com/inf...ld_viruses.htm

It takes a LOT. Once that level is reached, however, the killing does not take a huge amount of time. And ozone concentrations will vary by the amount diffused and the amount generated as it is very short-lived.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA

On Thu, 23 Jan 2020 15:07:35 -0500, James Reaper
wrote:

On 1/18/20 4:11 PM, KC JONES wrote:
I've had a germicidal lamp more or less in storage for a number of
years, but recently brought it out to sterilize a room where a person
had been sick.* However, I don't know if it still emits the germ killing
UVC spectrum.* What's a quick way I could tell for sure?* Thanks.

Something I've always wondered about were Tesla coils. When I was a
kid, I built one and let it run arcing from HV to ground for nearly an
hour. When my parents arrived home from work, the house was so full of
ozone that we all had to leave for a couple of hours with the windows
wide opened to air out the house. Would that much ozone have killed
surface bacteria as a germicidal lamp would have?

I did the same thing. When my mother got home she said the house
smelled like the seaside. My Tesla coil was used a few times just to
make the seaside smell. I don't know if it killed all the bacteria.

Steve

--
http://www.npsnn.com

On Friday, January 24, 2020 at 8:25:14 AM UTC-5, Stephen Wolstenholme wrote:

I did the same thing. When my mother got home she said the house
smelled like the seaside. My Tesla coil was used a few times just to
make the seaside smell. I don't know if it killed all the bacteria.

Steve

--
http://www.npsnn.com

There are people who use an ozone generator to get rid of mold and mildew smells, especially in warehouses. There are others who claim it it works by numbing your nose rather than killing the actual mold.

On Fri, 24 Jan 2020 06:46:08 -0800 (PST), Tim R
wrote:

On Friday, January 24, 2020 at 8:25:14 AM UTC-5, Stephen Wolstenholme wrote:

I did the same thing. When my mother got home she said the house
smelled like the seaside. My Tesla coil was used a few times just to
make the seaside smell. I don't know if it killed all the bacteria.

Steve

--
http://www.npsnn.com

There are people who use an ozone generator to get rid of mold and mildew smells, especially in warehouses. There are others who claim it it works by numbing your nose rather than killing the actual mold.
A secretary where I worked had to get rid of cat urine smell at an
apartment she rented out. Even after a thorough cleaning of the
apartment involving washing the walls where the cat ****ed there was a
lingering odor. She used an ozone generator that was left in place
running for a few days. It worked very well. But some rubber items she
had left on a counter near the generator turned into some sort of goo.
Eric