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Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems. |
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#41
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.home.repair,sci.electronics.repair
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Hoist brake solenoid buzzes/fluckers instead of steadily pulling
On 11/13/2011 9:21 AM, Ignoramus22978 wrote:
Here's a picture. http://boss-proxy.chudov.com/tmp/tmp-0432.jpg.html That amount of surface rust and corrosion INSIDE a cover indicates it's been wet, or in a wet location. That's a disc brake and should dis-engage when the hoist is in operation. Do you have the wiring diagram for this hoist? I know that label reads, "Caution dual voltage" as an indication it "might be wired for a different voltage than what you're using. Despite all the random guessing, I'm assuming that is a very simple straight forward coil that pulls the release on the disc brake. If that coil is set up for 480 volts and you're putting 240 across it, it IS going to buzz and chatter. It will do that without any missing diodes, open coils, hidden switches or two sets pull & hold windings. If that coil is set up for "dual voltage" it should have more that two wires connecting to it. Or there should be a control transformer somewhere else in the housing to supply the correct voltage to a single voltage coil. Or a dropping resistor (not likely) to allow a 240 coil to be used on 480. And the instructions, as such, should have the connection for both voltages and everything you have to reconnect listed. Jeff -- "Everything from Crackers to Coffins" |
#42
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.home.repair,sci.electronics.repair
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Hoist brake solenoid buzzes/fluckers instead of steadily pulling
On Mon, 14 Nov 2011 09:59:40 -0600, Jeffrey Angus
wrote: On 11/13/2011 9:21 AM, Ignoramus22978 wrote: Here's a picture. http://boss-proxy.chudov.com/tmp/tmp-0432.jpg.html That amount of surface rust and corrosion INSIDE a cover indicates it's been wet, or in a wet location. That's a disc brake and should dis-engage when the hoist is in operation. Do you have the wiring diagram for this hoist? I know that label reads, "Caution dual voltage" as an indication it "might be wired for a different voltage than what you're using. Despite all the random guessing, I'm assuming that is a very simple straight forward coil that pulls the release on the disc brake. If that coil is set up for 480 volts and you're putting 240 across it, it IS going to buzz and chatter. It will do that without any missing diodes, open coils, hidden switches or two sets pull & hold windings. If that coil is set up for "dual voltage" it should have more that two wires connecting to it. Or there should be a control transformer somewhere else in the housing to supply the correct voltage to a single voltage coil. Or a dropping resistor (not likely) to allow a 240 coil to be used on 480. And the instructions, as such, should have the connection for both voltages and everything you have to reconnect listed. Jeff The several I own (CMS) have internal transformers that allow voltage changes. to the workings. Though he does say that he has 240 on the coils..which is troublesome Gunner One could not be a successful Leftwinger without realizing that, in contrast to the popular conception supported by newspapers and mothers of Leftwingers, a goodly number of Leftwingers are not only narrow-minded and dull, but also just stupid. Gunner Asch |
#43
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.home.repair,sci.electronics.repair
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Hoist brake solenoid buzzes/fluckers instead of steadily pulling
Ignoramus22978 wrote:
On 2011-11-13, Gunner Asch wrote: On Sun, 13 Nov 2011 08:00:33 -0600, Ignoramus22978 wrote: I have a 3 phase Yale 1/2 ton hoist. It has an electric brake with a solenoid, whose job is to pull away the brake lever when 230VAC is supplied to it. The problem is that it does not do it. Instead of steadily pulling away, it constantly jerks the lever, but never far enough to the end point where it is supposed to be pulled away. So, the brake is not disengaged as the hoist operates. I am glad that I noticed that. I tried pulling on the lever by hand when the solenoid was engaged. I noticed that if I help the solenoid and pull away the lever to the end, jerking stops completely, but if I slowly let go of the lever and it returns to the brake position, jerking resumes. I am thinking that perhaps this solenoid has two separate coils, pulling and holding one, and the holding one is not working or not engaging? Any idea? thanks Check to see if its not wired up for 440/480 Most of those hoists are dual voltage and while they will run on 220 if wired for 440..the solenoids most often will not The hoist can be entirely rewired for 240/480. It actually WAS wired for 480 and I had to rewire. So, you are saying that to complete this transition to 240, I would have to replace the solenoid? If that being the case, I then would assume that maybe the solenoid was getting its voltage from one of the star windings on the motor? A connection from wire 4 to wire 5 should provide ~ 230V Ac when the motor is wired for 480 which is a standard way of doing it, how ever, I wonder if you considered this when you did your change over? Of course, I don't know anything about anything so don't listen to me. Jamie |
#44
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.home.repair,sci.electronics.repair
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Hoist brake solenoid buzzes/fluckers instead of steadily pulling
Ignoramus22978 wrote:
On 2011-11-14, Jeffrey Angus wrote: On 11/13/2011 8:52 PM, Ignoramus22978 wrote: The hoist can be entirely rewired for 240/480. It actually WAS wired for 480 and I had to rewire. So, you are saying that to complete this transition to 240, I would have to replace the solenoid? i Ok, let's back up a bit. WHEN was the last time the hoist worked like it should? When it was installed and operating on 480 v? Or was it working at some point when re-wired for 240 v and THEN started to act up with the brake solenoid? I bought it at auction. I have never seen this hoist run. At my place, I have 240v 3ph only. (well, I have a transformer that I could wire to get 460v, but it is sitting in the corner right now). i Ok, so what is the original coil voltage suppose to be? 230 or 480? You do know that many of those types of devices that allow you to rewire uses the same coil for both voltages? Normally the coil is spec'd out for 230V AC.. which will work in either case, it's just where you connect the wires to. Jamie |
#45
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.home.repair,sci.electronics.repair
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Hoist brake solenoid buzzes/fluckers instead of steadily pulling
On Nov 14, 7:35*pm, Jamie
t wrote: Ignoramus22978 wrote: On 2011-11-14, Jeffrey Angus wrote: On 11/13/2011 8:52 PM, Ignoramus22978 wrote: The hoist can be entirely rewired for 240/480. It actually WAS wired for 480 and I had to rewire. So, you are saying that to complete this transition to 240, I would have to replace the solenoid? i Ok, let's back up a bit. WHEN was the last time the hoist worked like it should? When it was installed and operating on 480 v? Or was it working at some point when re-wired for 240 v and THEN started to act up with the brake solenoid? I bought it at auction. I have never seen this hoist run. At my place, I have 240v 3ph only. (well, I have a transformer that I could wire to get 460v, but it is sitting in the corner right now). i Ok, so what is the original coil voltage suppose to be? 230 or 480? * You do know that many of those types of devices that allow you to rewire uses the same coil for both voltages? Normally the coil is spec'd out for 230V AC.. which will work in either case, it's just where you connect the wires to. * Jamie- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Has the OP ever said if there are two or three or how many wires going to the solenoid???? |
#46
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.home.repair,sci.electronics.repair
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Hoist brake solenoid buzzes/fluckers instead of steadily pulling
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#47
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.home.repair,sci.electronics.repair
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Hoist brake solenoid buzzes/fluckers instead of steadily pulling
In sci.electronics.repair Michael A. Terrell wrote:
Jeffrey Angus wrote: On 11/13/2011 9:54 AM, GeorgeD wrote: That solenoid requires that the pole pieces be in contact. Then it will hold (strongly). If it can not close completely, it will vibrate. Not much of a puller, but a big holder. Looks like your typical washing machine part. And yes, lots of hold power when the pole pieces touch. Check to make sure it can pull in fully and that the poles are not cruded up. It looks like it only needs some cleaning and TLC. Serious case of corrosion there. No telling how much surface crud on the sliding parts. There is only one coil. Of course, but we still have to listen to Maynard's view of multi- windings and embedded diodes. What else do you expect from 'Skippy - V2.0'? He also thinks Electret microphones are crystal microphones, and that you can easily change the bandgap in LEDs to adjust the color. He's a real, no class Not sure about the flamewar going on here, but it's actually not hard to get a LED to change colors. Get some liquid nitrogen and try it out. |
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