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Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems. |
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#1
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christmas lights - sealing connections
Hi everyone,
Every Christmas when I hang my lights I seal all male/female connections between cords with electrical tape so that water should not penetrate and short out the circuit. I was wondering if anyone objects to doing this. Also I was wondering if I should just not bother sealing the connections. Thanks, Carl |
#2
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christmas lights - sealing connections
wrote in message oups.com... Hi everyone, Every Christmas when I hang my lights I seal all male/female connections between cords with electrical tape so that water should not penetrate and short out the circuit. I was wondering if anyone objects to doing this. Also I was wondering if I should just not bother sealing the connections. Can't hurt and the electrical tape manufacturer's love you! Merry XMAS. |
#3
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christmas lights - sealing connections
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#4
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LED Xmas lights
Every Christmas when I hang my lights I seal all male/female
connections between cords with electrical tape so that water should not penetrate and short out the circuit. I was wondering if anyone objects to doing this. I object. Please don't do that anymore. **kidding** I do it too. On a related note can someone recommend a brand of LED xmas lights that are as bright as typical miniature incandescents? I bought some last year but they are noticably dimmer. I always put white lights on the roofline of the house (using clips so each is positioned just so) and it looks nice. But I'm one of those people for whom incandescent light looks yellowish so white LED's look great--really really white--plus they look different than anyone else's lights. I want them brighter though. |
#5
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LED Xmas lights
Plus, they blink! I don't understand
why they don't put in full wave rectifiers. Yes I do, it's all $$$$, but I'd gladly pay an extra $1 for the rectifier. Most of them that I have seen are on for 120th of a second and off for the same. Steve Kraus wrote: Every Christmas when I hang my lights I seal all male/female connections between cords with electrical tape so that water should not penetrate and short out the circuit. I was wondering if anyone objects to doing this. I object. Please don't do that anymore. **kidding** I do it too. On a related note can someone recommend a brand of LED xmas lights that are as bright as typical miniature incandescents? I bought some last year but they are noticably dimmer. I always put white lights on the roofline of the house (using clips so each is positioned just so) and it looks nice. But I'm one of those people for whom incandescent light looks yellowish so white LED's look great--really really white--plus they look different than anyone else's lights. I want them brighter though. |
#7
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LED Xmas lights
Art Todesco wrote:
Plus, they blink! I don't understand why they don't put in full wave rectifiers. Yes I do, it's all $$$$, but I'd gladly pay an extra $1 for the rectifier. Most of them that I have seen are on for 120th of a second and off for the same. You are really fast with that stop watch. :-) -- Joseph Meehan Dia duit |
#8
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LED Xmas lights
Steve Kraus wrote: Every Christmas when I hang my lights I seal all male/female connections between cords with electrical tape so that water should not penetrate and short out the circuit. I was wondering if anyone objects to doing this. I object. Please don't do that anymore. **kidding** I do it too. I don't object but then I don't see the point in doing it either. I haven't done it ever (over 30 years), put out lots of lights in the past, have had them up for a month, never had a short. Looks like wasted time/effort and make a mess pulling them down. Harry K |
#9
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LED Xmas lights
I don't object but then I don't see the point in doing it either. I haven't done it ever (over 30 years), put out lots of lights in the past, have had them up for a month, never had a short. Looks like wasted time/effort and make a mess pulling them down. Harry K My neighbors must be getting lazy because they have permanent outdoor Christmas lights. Actually it's a good concept. Why not have them built in? 30 years ago we lived in a neighborhood where the homeowners were shuned if they didn't get the lights down by say Feb 1. Beachcomber |
#10
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LED Xmas lights
The town where I live has a March or
April 1st ordinance for Christmas decorations/lights removal, although I have seen lights up all year on some houses. BTW, some colored lights will loose their color much faster if left out all year. Beachcomber wrote: I don't object but then I don't see the point in doing it either. I haven't done it ever (over 30 years), put out lots of lights in the past, have had them up for a month, never had a short. Looks like wasted time/effort and make a mess pulling them down. Harry K My neighbors must be getting lazy because they have permanent outdoor Christmas lights. Actually it's a good concept. Why not have them built in? 30 years ago we lived in a neighborhood where the homeowners were shuned if they didn't get the lights down by say Feb 1. Beachcomber |
#11
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LED Xmas lights
Joseph Meehan wrote:
Art Todesco wrote: Plus, they blink! I don't understand why they don't put in full wave rectifiers. Yes I do, it's all $$$$, but I'd gladly pay an extra $1 for the rectifier. Most of them that I have seen are on for 120th of a second and off for the same. You are really fast with that stop watch. :-) No, but, if you move your head, you can definitely see it. And, it is irritating to some. |
#12
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LED Xmas lights
"Joseph Meehan" writes:
Art Todesco wrote: Plus, they blink! I don't understand why they don't put in full wave rectifiers. Yes I do, it's all $$$$, but I'd gladly pay an extra $1 for the rectifier. Most of them that I have seen are on for 120th of a second and off for the same. You are really fast with that stop watch. :-) Once you've seen a few pulsing LEDs, it's easy to tell. There are only two common possitiblities - full wave or halfwave and they are trivial to tell apart. There's no microcomputer in there to produce other rep rates! --- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/ Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/ +Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/lasersam.htm | Mirror Sites: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_mirror.html Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header above is ignored unless my full name is included in the subject line. Or, you can contact me via the Feedback Form in the FAQs. |
#13
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LED Xmas lights
Andrew Rossmann wrote:
[This followup was posted to sci.electronics.repair and a copy was sent to the cited author.] In article , says... On a related note can someone recommend a brand of LED xmas lights that are as bright as typical miniature incandescents? I bought some last year but they are noticably dimmer. I always put white lights on the roofline of the house (using clips so each is positioned just so) and it looks nice. But I'm one of those people for whom incandescent light looks yellowish so white LED's look great--really really white--plus they look different than anyone else's lights. I want them brighter though. I have some ForverBright sets. The 35-light sets are a single circuit. I put a bridge rectifier in a small outlet box with a combo switch/outlet. The rectifier came from my junk box, and is a giant 1.5" or so square with a bolt hole through middle, way overkill. You could obviously use something much smaller. Just don't forget a fuse rated at or below the rectifier's rating. Running off of unfiltered 120V DC, it is noticeably brighter, and no obvious flicker. You could string several sets together. The newer sets also have a nicer green. One set is older, and the green is dim and sort of that puke lime-green color. Be careful of longer sets. I have a 70-light set, and it is basically two 35-light sets connected with opposite polarity. Running on DC, it's one half or the other lit. I haven't looked close at it yet to see if it's possible to reverse one circuit so it would be DC friendly. Some sets run off of a transformer. They probably work similar to the above. You'd just need a DC supply at the right voltage and current. Using the full wave rectifier without any other current limiting could, depending on the wiring, put too much current through the string and shorten the LED life. But, that said, it's probably not that significant. And, as you pointed out, they are somewhat brighter. I have a set of 70 "L.E.D. Lights" that is actually 2 sets of 35, not alternated, but 35 in a row, followed by 35 more. One diode string is in one direction and the other is opposite. A full wave bridge on this set will cause 35 light not to light unless you modify the wiring. I tried wiring all 70 lights in one series circuit (with the diodes in the same direction) and it was much too dim even through the rectifier bridge. Wiring the 2 groups of 35 in parallel with the diodes in the same direction, works but the string has a much higher through current. A series resistor of about 700 ohms corrects this. The resistor should be 1/2 or 1 watt (preferrable). Of course, you are wasting this power, about 1/2 watt. Boy, do I have too much time on my hands or what? |
#14
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LED Xmas lights
"Art Todesco" wrote in message ... Plus, they blink! I don't understand why they don't put in full wave rectifiers. Yes I do, it's all $$$$, but I'd gladly pay an extra $1 for the rectifier. Most of them that I have seen are on for 120th of a second and off for the same. SNIP Mounting a hefty rectifier bridge in a box with an outlet is something that you could do yourself for a few dollars. I'd also install a DPDT switch so you could change the polarity of the output. TKM |
#15
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LED Xmas lights
"Art Todesco" wrote in message . .. The town where I live has a March or April 1st ordinance for Christmas decorations/lights removal, although I have seen lights up all year on some houses. BTW, some colored lights will loose their color much faster if left out all year. Beachcomber wrote: I don't object but then I don't see the point in doing it either. I haven't done it ever (over 30 years), put out lots of lights in the past, have had them up for a month, never had a short. Looks like wasted time/effort and make a mess pulling them down. Harry K My neighbors must be getting lazy because they have permanent outdoor Christmas lights. Actually it's a good concept. Why not have them built in? 30 years ago we lived in a neighborhood where the homeowners were shuned if they didn't get the lights down by say Feb 1. Beachcomber The National Electrical Code now says (Article 590.3) that temporary holiday decorative lighting can only stay up for 90 days. Don't know how many NEC lighting police are around to check, but the stuff does deterioriate especially from moisture and UV in sunlight. TKM |
#16
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LED Xmas lights
Art Todesco wrote:
Joseph Meehan wrote: Art Todesco wrote: Plus, they blink! I don't understand why they don't put in full wave rectifiers. Yes I do, it's all $$$$, but I'd gladly pay an extra $1 for the rectifier. Most of them that I have seen are on for 120th of a second and off for the same. You are really fast with that stop watch. :-) No, but, if you move your head, you can definitely see it. And, it is irritating to some. Yes it really is very noticeable, it was my main objection to LED lights, but I picked up a pack of Philips LED's this year since they were on sale and they're fairly bright so I'm gonna solder a bridge rectifier into them just after the plug and seal it in heatshrink tubing. |
#17
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LED Xmas lights
I can see the 30hz flicker from those LED strings. (60hz rectified
with one diode chops half the sine wave in half). Love the low power but not the flickers. Drives me nuts and hard on my eye. Cheers, Wizard |
#18
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LED Xmas lights
Beachcomber wrote:
I don't object but then I don't see the point in doing it either. I haven't done it ever (over 30 years), put out lots of lights in the past, have had them up for a month, never had a short. Looks like wasted time/effort and make a mess pulling them down. Harry K My neighbors must be getting lazy because they have permanent outdoor Christmas lights. Actually it's a good concept. Why not have them built in? .... Beachcomber My neighbor had a small unrelated fire in the middle of the summer. The fire department had the fire out in a few minutes with minimal damage to their home. However they say the Christmas lights on it and put up an unfit for occupancy sign and told them the sign would come down after they had removed all the Christmas lights. It seems they have had problems with them from people who have left them up all year. They got the lights down the same day and they were back in their home the same day, with just a little smoke and some repair work to the third floor. -- Joseph Meehan Dia duit |
#19
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LED Xmas lights
Are you the Art Todesco from Bell Labs??
H. R.(Bob) Hofmann |
#20
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LED Xmas lights
Are you the Art Todesco from Bell Labs??
H. R.(Bob) Hofmann |
#21
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LED Xmas lights
(Jason D.) writes:
I can see the 30hz flicker from those LED strings. (60hz rectified with one diode chops half the sine wave in half). Love the low power but not the flickers. Drives me nuts and hard on my eye. Still 60 Hz. --- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/ Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/ +Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/lasersam.htm | Mirror Sites: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_mirror.html Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header above is ignored unless my full name is included in the subject line. Or, you can contact me via the Feedback Form in the FAQs. |
#22
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LED Xmas lights
Jason D. wrote:
I can see the 30hz flicker from those LED strings. (60hz rectified with one diode chops half the sine wave in half). Love the low power but not the flickers. Drives me nuts and hard on my eye. If the 60 Hz (as others have corrected you) flicker bothers you how do you watch TV (59.97 Hz vertical) or go to the movies (48 Hz ficker rate)? |
#23
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LED Xmas lights
On Mon, 21 Nov 2005 05:16:48 GMT, Steve Kraus
wrote: Jason D. wrote: I can see the 30hz flicker from those LED strings. (60hz rectified with one diode chops half the sine wave in half). Love the low power but not the flickers. Drives me nuts and hard on my eye. If the 60 Hz (as others have corrected you) flicker bothers you how do you watch TV (59.97 Hz vertical) or go to the movies (48 Hz ficker rate)? Thanks for the correction. 60hz is what I can still see on monitors at 60hz and LEDs on AC especially LED xmas strings. Bugs me. TVs CRT has phorphors that is too slow to make it barely objectable. When time permits I'm taking down two old fluorescents down was magnetic ballast & old housings and put up new one with electronic ballasts and proper housings that reflects lights towards floor. These items are already bought and waiting to put up. Cheers, Wizard |
#24
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LED Xmas lights
If the 60 Hz (as others have corrected you) flicker bothers you how do you watch TV (59.97 Hz vertical) or go to the movies (48 Hz ficker rate)? Have you actually seen LED xmas lights with this in person? They have a 50% duty cycle and zero phosphor persistance, the flicker is not subtle, particularly if you move your eyes and catch the lights in your peripheral vision. A TV does flicker, but the phosphor persistance makes it far less apparent. A computer monitor with low persistance phosphors running at 60Hz is unbearable though, instant headache. |
#25
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LED Xmas lights
"Joseph Meehan" wrote in
m: Beachcomber wrote: I don't object but then I don't see the point in doing it either. I haven't done it ever (over 30 years), put out lots of lights in the past, have had them up for a month, never had a short. Looks like wasted time/effort and make a mess pulling them down. Harry K My neighbors must be getting lazy because they have permanent outdoor Christmas lights. Actually it's a good concept. Why not have them built in? ... Beachcomber My neighbor had a small unrelated fire in the middle of the summer. The fire department had the fire out in a few minutes with minimal damage to their home. However they say the Christmas lights on it and put up an unfit for occupancy sign and told them the sign would come down after they had removed all the Christmas lights. It seems they have had problems with them from people who have left them up all year. They got the lights down the same day and they were back in their home the same day, with just a little smoke and some repair work to the third floor. The X-mas lights wire insulation probably gets degraded by UV exposure,or damaged by weathering. Maybe dirt and moisture gets into sockets,corrosion creates resistance and new,undesirable current paths. -- Jim Yanik jyanik at kua.net |
#26
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christmas lights - sealing connections
It's a dangerous practice. If any moisture gets in, it will stay
there and do more damage than if the connection were left exposed. wrote: Hi everyone, Every Christmas when I hang my lights I seal all male/female connections between cords with electrical tape so that water should not penetrate and short out the circuit. I was wondering if anyone objects to doing this. Also I was wondering if I should just not bother sealing the connections. Thanks, Carl |
#27
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LED Xmas lights
James Sweet wrote:
If the 60 Hz (as others have corrected you) flicker bothers you how do you watch TV (59.97 Hz vertical) or go to the movies (48 Hz ficker rate)? Have you actually seen LED xmas lights with this in person? They have a 50% duty cycle and zero phosphor persistance, the flicker is not subtle, particularly if you move your eyes and catch the lights in your peripheral vision. A TV does flicker, but the phosphor persistance makes it far less apparent. A computer monitor with low persistance phosphors running at 60Hz is unbearable though, instant headache. It prolly wouldn't take a very big electrolytic capacitor to level those current pulses out, huh? Easy to do fer your own strings I guess, but that doesn't help for all the others you have to look at. Fortunately that 60 Hz flicker rate is above what triggers photosensitive epilepsy in most persons sensitive to that. http://www.epilepsy.org.uk/info/photo.html Jeff -- Jeffry Wisnia (W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE) "Truth exists; only falsehood has to be invented." |
#28
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LED Xmas lights
It prolly wouldn't take a very big electrolytic capacitor to level those current pulses out, huh? Easy to do fer your own strings I guess, but that doesn't help for all the others you have to look at. Fortunately that 60 Hz flicker rate is above what triggers photosensitive epilepsy in most persons sensitive to that. http://www.epilepsy.org.uk/info/photo.html Jeff Don't even need a capacitor, a simple bridge rectifier changes it to 120Hz flicker, pretty much not noticeable unless you scan your eyes past it quickly. |
#29
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LED Xmas lights
James Sweet wrote:
It prolly wouldn't take a very big electrolytic capacitor to level those current pulses out, huh? Easy to do fer your own strings I guess, but that doesn't help for all the others you have to look at. Fortunately that 60 Hz flicker rate is above what triggers photosensitive epilepsy in most persons sensitive to that. http://www.epilepsy.org.uk/info/photo.html Jeff Don't even need a capacitor, a simple bridge rectifier changes it to 120Hz flicker, pretty much not noticeable unless you scan your eyes past it quickly. My thinking wuz that by using just a cap, you wouldn't change the total energy delivered to the string of LEDs significantly, but with full wave rectification you'd double it and possibly blow an LED if the original design had them powered pretty close to their safe limit. Capice? Jeff -- Jeffry Wisnia (W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE) "Truth exists; only falsehood has to be invented." |
#30
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LED Xmas lights
For an example of overdone xmas decorations, see:
http://media.putfile.com/WizardsofWinter-SM (broadband connection suggested) -- Rich Greenberg Marietta, GA, USA richgr atsign panix.com + 1 770 321 6507 Eastern time. N6LRT I speak for myself & my dogs only. VM'er since CP-67 Canines:Val, Red & Shasta (RIP),Red, husky Owner:Chinook-L Atlanta Siberian Husky Rescue. www.panix.com/~richgr/ Asst Owner:Sibernet-L |
#31
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LED Xmas lights
Jeff Wisnia wrote:
James Sweet wrote: It prolly wouldn't take a very big electrolytic capacitor to level those current pulses out, huh? Easy to do fer your own strings I guess, but that doesn't help for all the others you have to look at. Fortunately that 60 Hz flicker rate is above what triggers photosensitive epilepsy in most persons sensitive to that. http://www.epilepsy.org.uk/info/photo.html Jeff Don't even need a capacitor, a simple bridge rectifier changes it to 120Hz flicker, pretty much not noticeable unless you scan your eyes past it quickly. My thinking wuz that by using just a cap, you wouldn't change the total energy delivered to the string of LEDs significantly, but with full wave rectification you'd double it and possibly blow an LED if the original design had them powered pretty close to their safe limit. Capice? Jeff Good thought! But you have to put a diode somewhere to protect the electrolytic capacitor from seeing AC. I guess you could "sacrifice" the 1st LED and put the capacitor after it. But, there are parallel and/or series resistors in the sockets, so you have to be carefull. A separate diode would probably be best. |
#32
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LED Xmas lights
Art Todesco wrote:
Jeff Wisnia wrote: James Sweet wrote: It prolly wouldn't take a very big electrolytic capacitor to level those current pulses out, huh? Easy to do fer your own strings I guess, but that doesn't help for all the others you have to look at. Fortunately that 60 Hz flicker rate is above what triggers photosensitive epilepsy in most persons sensitive to that. http://www.epilepsy.org.uk/info/photo.html Jeff Don't even need a capacitor, a simple bridge rectifier changes it to 120Hz flicker, pretty much not noticeable unless you scan your eyes past it quickly. My thinking wuz that by using just a cap, you wouldn't change the total energy delivered to the string of LEDs significantly, but with full wave rectification you'd double it and possibly blow an LED if the original design had them powered pretty close to their safe limit. Capice? Jeff Good thought! But you have to put a diode somewhere to protect the electrolytic capacitor from seeing AC. I guess you could "sacrifice" the 1st LED and put the capacitor after it. But, there are parallel and/or series resistors in the sockets, so you have to be carefull. A separate diode would probably be best. That shows another this Jew doesn't know about Xmas, I've never examined a string of LED lights to determine just how they work. G I'd assumed there was a half wave rectifier and maybe a series resistor there already there, to avoid exceeding the LED's PIV ratings. But maybe they avoid that with a parallel diode across each LED and a single series resistor for the whole string, that's similar to what I found inside one of our white LED nightlights when it started acting funny because the LED was having a nervous breakdown. (It stayed dark even though plugged in, but flickered on when I switched an inductive load on the same circuit - a bathroom vent fan.) Soldering in a new LED fixed that sucker. Anyway, you got my point, full wave rectification would most likely double the power dissipated in the LEDs if everything else in the circuit stayed the same. Jeff -- Jeffry Wisnia (W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE) "Truth exists; only falsehood has to be invented." |
#33
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LED Xmas lights
Jeff Wisnia wrote:
Art Todesco wrote: Jeff Wisnia wrote: James Sweet wrote: It prolly wouldn't take a very big electrolytic capacitor to level those current pulses out, huh? Easy to do fer your own strings I guess, but that doesn't help for all the others you have to look at. Fortunately that 60 Hz flicker rate is above what triggers photosensitive epilepsy in most persons sensitive to that. http://www.epilepsy.org.uk/info/photo.html Jeff Don't even need a capacitor, a simple bridge rectifier changes it to 120Hz flicker, pretty much not noticeable unless you scan your eyes past it quickly. My thinking wuz that by using just a cap, you wouldn't change the total energy delivered to the string of LEDs significantly, but with full wave rectification you'd double it and possibly blow an LED if the original design had them powered pretty close to their safe limit. Capice? Jeff Good thought! But you have to put a diode somewhere to protect the electrolytic capacitor from seeing AC. I guess you could "sacrifice" the 1st LED and put the capacitor after it. But, there are parallel and/or series resistors in the sockets, so you have to be carefull. A separate diode would probably be best. That shows another this Jew doesn't know about Xmas, I've never examined a string of LED lights to determine just how they work. G I'd assumed there was a half wave rectifier and maybe a series resistor there already there, to avoid exceeding the LED's PIV ratings. But maybe they avoid that with a parallel diode across each LED and a single series resistor for the whole string, that's similar to what I found inside one of our white LED nightlights when it started acting funny because the LED was having a nervous breakdown. (It stayed dark even though plugged in, but flickered on when I switched an inductive load on the same circuit - a bathroom vent fan.) Soldering in a new LED fixed that sucker. Anyway, you got my point, full wave rectification would most likely double the power dissipated in the LEDs if everything else in the circuit stayed the same. Jeff Adding a single diode and capacitor will also increase the current because the capacitor will bring the DC voltage up to the peak value of the AC line, usually considered to be 177 volts. As I had a string of 70 (2 series circuits in the same direction) on the bench, I tried a single diode and capactor. With a capacitor as small as 2.3uf, the string current still went up significantly and the LEDs got much brighter. BTW, in the stores they have a display string (5 or 6 LEDs) with a momentary button to show how they look. No blinking here as this display is run on a battery burried in the cardboard display. |
#34
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LED Xmas lights
Art Todesco wrote:
Jeff Wisnia wrote: Art Todesco wrote: Jeff Wisnia wrote: James Sweet wrote: It prolly wouldn't take a very big electrolytic capacitor to level those current pulses out, huh? Easy to do fer your own strings I guess, but that doesn't help for all the others you have to look at. Fortunately that 60 Hz flicker rate is above what triggers photosensitive epilepsy in most persons sensitive to that. http://www.epilepsy.org.uk/info/photo.html Jeff Don't even need a capacitor, a simple bridge rectifier changes it to 120Hz flicker, pretty much not noticeable unless you scan your eyes past it quickly. My thinking wuz that by using just a cap, you wouldn't change the total energy delivered to the string of LEDs significantly, but with full wave rectification you'd double it and possibly blow an LED if the original design had them powered pretty close to their safe limit. Capice? Jeff Good thought! But you have to put a diode somewhere to protect the electrolytic capacitor from seeing AC. I guess you could "sacrifice" the 1st LED and put the capacitor after it. But, there are parallel and/or series resistors in the sockets, so you have to be carefull. A separate diode would probably be best. That shows another this Jew doesn't know about Xmas, I've never examined a string of LED lights to determine just how they work. G I'd assumed there was a half wave rectifier and maybe a series resistor there already there, to avoid exceeding the LED's PIV ratings. But maybe they avoid that with a parallel diode across each LED and a single series resistor for the whole string, that's similar to what I found inside one of our white LED nightlights when it started acting funny because the LED was having a nervous breakdown. (It stayed dark even though plugged in, but flickered on when I switched an inductive load on the same circuit - a bathroom vent fan.) Soldering in a new LED fixed that sucker. Anyway, you got my point, full wave rectification would most likely double the power dissipated in the LEDs if everything else in the circuit stayed the same. Jeff Adding a single diode and capacitor will also increase the current because the capacitor will bring the DC voltage up to the peak value of the AC line, usually considered to be 177 volts. As I had a string of 70 (2 series circuits in the same direction) on the bench, I tried a single diode and capactor. With a capacitor as small as 2.3uf, the string current still went up significantly and the LEDs got much brighter. BTW, in the stores they have a display string (5 or 6 LEDs) with a momentary button to show how they look. No blinking here as this display is run on a battery burried in the cardboard display. All sounds reasonable, maybe some more LEDs in the string and a cap large enough to remain charged close to peak voltage would be an economical way to avoid *any* flicker. G I think we've about "saucered and blowed"* this one by now, but I am curious about how those series strings handle the reverse voltage across the LEDs. Do they have diodes or resistors across each one or do they just depend upon the summed inverse breakdown voltages keeping the reverse current from ever getting large enough to blow an LED? I'm guessing maybe that's it, do ya happen to know the answer? Jeff * An old "down Maine" expression referring to method of cooling a too hot cup of coffee by pouring some into the saucer and blowing across it, returning it to the cup when it's ready to drink. -- Jeffry Wisnia (W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE) "Truth exists; only falsehood has to be invented." |
#35
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LED Xmas lights
I think we've about "saucered and blowed"* this one by now, but I am curious about how those series strings handle the reverse voltage across the LEDs. Do they have diodes or resistors across each one or do they just depend upon the summed inverse breakdown voltages keeping the reverse current from ever getting large enough to blow an LED? I'm guessing maybe that's it, do ya happen to know the answer? They depend on the latter, don't think for an instant that these things are over-engineered, or even well engineered. Really though, in practice I've found LED's to be far more tolerant of reverse voltage than the specs would indicate. |
#36
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LED Xmas lights
In article , Steve Kraus
wrote: Every Christmas when I hang my lights I seal all male/female connections between cords with electrical tape so that water should not penetrate and short out the circuit. I was wondering if anyone objects to doing this. I object. Please don't do that anymore. **kidding** I do it too. On a related note can someone recommend a brand of LED xmas lights that are as bright as typical miniature incandescents? I bought some last year but they are noticably dimmer. I always put white lights on the roofline of the house (using clips so each is positioned just so) and it looks nice. But I'm one of those people for whom incandescent light looks yellowish so white LED's look great--really really white--plus they look different than anyone else's lights. I want them brighter though. Check out the Philips brand ones at Target. They resemble the Forever Bright ones of the past 2-3 years. The manufacturer mentioned on the package sounds familiart to me. However, LEDs get improved gradually over the years, and I suspect they also had to get brighter to get Philips to put their name on them. At Target, they show some in operation - see if they're bright enough for you. I saw some with bare LEDs - those had somewhat narrow beams and were weak outside their beams, while ones with "bulbs" over the LEDs shone more equally in all directions. - Don Klipstein ) |
#37
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LED Xmas lights
In article 2z3gf.3613$kw2.1313@trnddc05, James Sweet wrote:
Art Todesco wrote: Joseph Meehan wrote: Art Todesco wrote: Plus, they blink! I don't understand why they don't put in full wave rectifiers. Yes I do, it's all $$$$, but I'd gladly pay an extra $1 for the rectifier. Most of them that I have seen are on for 120th of a second and off for the same. You are really fast with that stop watch. :-) No, but, if you move your head, you can definitely see it. And, it is irritating to some. Yes it really is very noticeable, it was my main objection to LED lights, but I picked up a pack of Philips LED's this year since they were on sale and they're fairly bright so I'm gonna solder a bridge rectifier into them just after the plug and seal it in heatshrink tubing. Make sure the LEDs don't overheat from getting twice as much average current! But if nothing goes wrong, they will not only not flicker but they will also be brighter. Keep in mind that if they are going to overheat, they may not do so quickly. One thing that can happen is "thermal runaway" - where higher temperature makes the LEDs more conductive, and this situation reinforces itself. This may wait until a moment when the line voltage or the ambient temperature is higher. Keep in mind that such a modification voids UL certification and increases your liability should a fire start - even if a flaw in the product was a contributing factor to the fire. - Don Klipstein ) |
#38
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LED Xmas lights
In article . net, Steve
Kraus wrote: Jason D. wrote: I can see the 30hz flicker from those LED strings. (60hz rectified with one diode chops half the sine wave in half). Love the low power but not the flickers. Drives me nuts and hard on my eye. If the 60 Hz (as others have corrected you) flicker bothers you how do you watch TV (59.97 Hz vertical) or go to the movies (48 Hz ficker rate)? I sometimes see flicker in TVs and monitors set to 60 Hz. I usually see flicker in monitors set to 56 Hz. I also only sometimes see LED lights flickering when they have 60 Hz flicker. I suspect that the flicker gets more visible when the light source is more intense - possibly explaining why LEDs are more likely to visibly flicker at 60 Hz than TVs and monitors are. Movies have a high duty cycle and a much shorter offtime than halfwave rectified LEDs. - Don Klipstein ) |
#39
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LED Xmas lights
I really wanted to buy some LED last year, they were real cheap at an
after Xmas sale at a Nursery. The white ones, (the only ones I was interested in) were too "cool" for my taste. I love the yellowy glow of regular incandescent "white" lights, seems homey, warm & inviting. The LED's looked harsh & "office-light" like for my tastes so I took a pass. FWIW... they must be popular, as from what I could see Target or mass marketers, from what I could see, sold out before Christmas I hope they soon come out with a warmer version, for I can't wait to be done with cheap incandescent xmas lights buring out and driving me absolutely crazy. . |
#40
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LED Xmas lights
Don Klipstein wrote:
I sometimes see flicker in TVs and monitors set to 60 Hz. I usually see flicker in monitors set to 56 Hz. I also only sometimes see LED lights flickering when they have 60 Hz flicker. I suspect that the flicker gets more visible when the light source is more intense - possibly explaining why LEDs are more likely to visibly flicker at 60 Hz than TVs and monitors are. I'm going to say one word, and you decide if you still like your theory. Persistence. -- If John McCain gets the 2008 Republican Presidential nomination, my vote for President will be a write-in for Jiang Zemin. |
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