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#1
Posted to rec.autos.tech,alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
I have a 2005 Toyota Solara SLE, 133,000 miles, with P0171 and P0174
codes, lean mixture in both banks, and a check engine light that returns soon after being cleared. I've cleaned and then replaced the MAF sensor, replaced the PCV valve, and listened all over for hissing. I have a constant noise in one ear, like the sound of water running in a pipe, but I still think I'd be able to hear hissing with the other ear, and even the bad one. I've also used an unlit propane torch with a hose on the end to direct propane to every place I thought there could be a vacuum leak and there are no engine-sound changes. I think cleaning the MAF sensor actually made it run worse. The hesistation at 1mph, which was occasional, became frequent. Changing the MAF sensor didn't have any effect. These are the sensors readings, at idle, then at 2000, 3000, and 4000rpm as best as I could hold the throttle at those places: Below are the sensor 2 readings, I've included the Sensor 1 readings below them, but they seem less interesting. Below that are a few sets of trim readings, 2 or 3 at each rpm. I have the complete set of readings if that will help, but I thought it would make this post too long, and that intervals were easier to compare without the extra lines. The MPH is always 0 but I could do it again with the car moving, with someone helping if need be. Sensor 2 Live Data Engine RPM(rpm) 720 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)15.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.01 Absolute Throttle Position(%)16.5 OBD requirements to which vehicle is designedOBDII === Despite the line above, what follows are actual readings, right? Not just design requirements? Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.640 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.660 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 710 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)14.5 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.01 Absolute Throttle Position(%)16.5 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.700 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.640 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.279 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 707 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)15.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.01 Absolute Throttle Position(%)16.5 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.115 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.660 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.28 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 700 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)14.5 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.01 Absolute Throttle Position(%)16.5 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.605 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.660 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 1550 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)38.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.01 Absolute Throttle Position(%)18.4 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.195 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.095 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 1813 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)40.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)19.2 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.780 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.760 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 1896 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)40.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)18.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.095 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.760 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Numbers of DTCs 2 Engine RPM(rpm) 1895 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)40.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)18.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.680 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.740 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 1890 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)40.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)18.8- Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.780 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.780 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 1897 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)40.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)18.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.605 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.780 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 1992 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)40.5 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)19.2 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.760 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.760 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 2676 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)45.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.03 Absolute Throttle Position(%)20.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.410 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.270 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3073 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.03 Absolute Throttle Position(%)20.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.290 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.760 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3078 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.03 Absolute Throttle Position(%)20.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.175 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.055 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3109 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.03 Absolute Throttle Position(%)20.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.485 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.055 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3127 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.03 Absolute Throttle Position(%)20.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.760 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.720 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3169 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.03 Absolute Throttle Position(%)20.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.330 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.740 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3837 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)43.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 At almost 4000 rpm and above, the air temp has only gone down 2 degrees! Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.05 Absolute Throttle Position(%)22.4 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.525 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.015 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 4180 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.04 Absolute Throttle Position(%)22.4 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.075 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.095 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 4180 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.04 Absolute Throttle Position(%)22.4 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.290 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.135 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 4199 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.5 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.05 Absolute Throttle Position(%)22.4 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.095 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.135 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3716 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)45.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)17.6 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.835 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.820 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 866 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)21.5 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.01 Absolute Throttle Position(%)16.5 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.835 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.820 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Numbers of DTCs 2 Fuel system 1 statusCL Fuel System 2 statusCL Calculated Load Value(%)11.8 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)168 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)-2.3 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)-0.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)35.2 Engine RPM(rpm) 683 What's really noticeable to me is that Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%) is always N/A. Even though Bank 2 Sensor 2 gives values at every interval. Does that indicate maybe that the Bank 1 sensor 2 has failed???? Could that cause the codes, even for bank 2? I talked to the original owner, who had owned the car since it was new, and she first got the CEL in March. She took it in, they could find nothing wrong, so they turned off the light and she said the light never went on again. She has no reason to lie to me, because I'd already bought the car, and not from her. (She traded in the car to a new car dealer who auctioned it and I bought if from the guy who bought it at the auction.) The car hesitates from 1mph. Probably not from 0 or 3mph or higher. I'll really appreciate any help you can give. Sensor 1 readings. From the same test, so the engine speeds are the same as above. I omitted as much as possible to make it easier to compare. Live Data Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.003 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.287 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.004 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.263 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.994 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.260 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.006 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.279 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.999 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.246 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.002 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.268 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.065 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.573 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.137 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.760 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.014 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.304 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.949 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.980 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.982 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.160 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.953 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.028 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.993 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.299 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.010 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.307 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.992 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.300 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.094 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.553 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.057 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.465 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.015 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.300 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.012 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.405 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.036 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.396 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.104 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.594 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.065 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.357 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.981 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.269 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.096 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.557 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.983 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.266 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.049 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.388 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.947 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.039 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.002 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.348 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.943 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.015 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.000 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.363 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.996 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.122 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.948 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.910 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.983 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.244 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.004 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.253 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.909 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)2.917 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.040 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.385 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.191 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.825 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.927 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.688 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.980 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.071 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.906 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.775 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.088 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.407 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.912 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.749 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.016 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.344 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.026 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.390 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.004 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.305 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.013 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.338 ---------------------- Numbers of DTCs 2 Fuel system 1 statusCL Fuel System 2 statusCL Calculated Load Value(%)11.8 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)168 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)-2.3 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)-0.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)35.2 Engine RPM(rpm) 683 Trim readings Fuel system 1 statusCL Fuel System 2 statusCL Calculated Load Value(%)12.2 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)150 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)7.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)7.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)35.2 Calculated Load Value(%)11.8 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)149 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)9.4 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)8.6 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)35.2 Calculated Load Value(%)11.8 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)149 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)7.0 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)9.4 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)35.2 ..... Calculated Load Value(%)11.8 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)150 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)14.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)18.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 1813 Calculated Load Value(%)12.2 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)150 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)10.2 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)5.5 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 1896 .... Calculated Load Value(%)14.9 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)158 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)-12.5 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)-4.7 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 3073 Calculated Load Value(%)14.1 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)158 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)-5.5 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)-7.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 3078 Calculated Load Value(%)14.5 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)159 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)-13.3 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)21.1 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)-10.9 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 3109 ...... Calculated Load Value(%)16.1 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)167 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)5.5 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)18.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)4.7 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 3837 Fuel system 1 statusCL Fuel System 2 statusCL Calculated Load Value(%)14.5 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)167 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)-7.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)18.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 4180 Calculated Load Value(%)13.7 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)168 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)0.0 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)18.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)10.9 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 4180 |
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#2
Posted to alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Saturday, October 28, 2017 at 12:43:28 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:
Every lean condition I've had was due to a leak in the intake system. Have you tried any forums for the particular car/engine? Many times there are particular problem parts that are known to fail and cause a leak. For example on the BMW X5 here, it's a 4" diameter rubber elbow that connects the intake ducting to the throttle body. It cracks and leaks. You can't hear it, I've never found a vacuum leak by sound. I've read stories of people buying fog/smoke making widgets that were designed for special effects, using them to blow smoke into the intake so you can see where it comes out. Might find one of those on Ebay to adapt. I think there are pro version tools that do similar, but I've never had to go that route to find the problem. |
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#3
Posted to alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 10:20:42 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote: On Saturday, October 28, 2017 at 12:43:28 PM UTC-4, micky wrote: Every lean condition I've had was due to a leak in the intake system. Have you tried any forums for the particular car/engine? Many times Yeah, I have. Maybe it's the age of the car or maybe it's the make, or maybe it's the people, but I don't get much in the way of answers for any of my questions including this one. Sometimes 80 people will look at it an no one will answer, and these are just people who have what ever gen Solara I have and whatever gen Camry goes with it. Questions about making the car look hot do better. I'll try again rephrasing it. So I thought to come at it from the other direction, data interpretation. Maybe I can find newer cars that used the same engine, 3MZ-FE. there are particular problem parts that are known to fail and cause a leak. For example on the BMW X5 here, it's a 4" diameter rubber elbow that connects the intake ducting to the throttle body. It cracks and leaks. You can't hear it, I've never found a vacuum leak by sound. I've read stories of people buying fog/smoke making widgets that were designed for special effects, using them to blow smoke into the intake so you can see where it comes out. Might find one of those on Ebay to adapt. I think there are pro version tools that do similar, but I've never had to go that route to find the problem. That's an idea. I can imagine that even though the engine is not running, not much would come out, considering the atmosophere is not sucking like the engine is, but it still must work some of the time. |
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#4
Posted to alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
In article , NONONOmisc07
@bigfoot.com says... In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 10:20:42 -0700 (PDT), trader_4 wrote: On Saturday, October 28, 2017 at 12:43:28 PM UTC-4, micky wrote: Every lean condition I've had was due to a leak in the intake system. Have you tried any forums for the particular car/engine? Many times Yeah, I have. Maybe it's the age of the car or maybe it's the make, or maybe it's the people, but I don't get much in the way of answers for any of my questions including this one. Sometimes 80 people will look at it an no one will answer, and these are just people who have what ever gen Solara I have and whatever gen Camry goes with it. Questions about making the car look hot do better. I'll try again rephrasing it. So I thought to come at it from the other direction, data interpretation. Maybe I can find newer cars that used the same engine, 3MZ-FE. there are particular problem parts that are known to fail and cause a leak. For example on the BMW X5 here, it's a 4" diameter rubber elbow that connects the intake ducting to the throttle body. It cracks and leaks. You can't hear it, I've never found a vacuum leak by sound. I've read stories of people buying fog/smoke making widgets that were designed for special effects, using them to blow smoke into the intake so you can see where it comes out. Might find one of those on Ebay to adapt. I think there are pro version tools that do similar, but I've never had to go that route to find the problem. That's an idea. I can imagine that even though the engine is not running, not much would come out, considering the atmosophere is not sucking like the engine is, but it still must work some of the time. Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. -- RonNNN |
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#5
Posted to rec.autos.tech,alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 12:43:20 -0400, micky
wrote: I have a 2005 Toyota Solara SLE, 133,000 miles, with P0171 and P0174 codes, lean mixture in both banks, and a check engine light that returns soon after being cleared. On that car, with that combination of codes, 99.9% you have an intake leak. 0.1% remaining, it's a bad primary O2 sensor. Just saying - Pull the manifold and replace all of the seals. Common problem I've cleaned and then replaced the MAF sensor, replaced the PCV valve, and listened all over for hissing. I have a constant noise in one ear, like the sound of water running in a pipe, but I still think I'd be able to hear hissing with the other ear, and even the bad one. I've also used an unlit propane torch with a hose on the end to direct propane to every place I thought there could be a vacuum leak and there are no engine-sound changes. I think cleaning the MAF sensor actually made it run worse. The hesistation at 1mph, which was occasional, became frequent. Changing the MAF sensor didn't have any effect. These are the sensors readings, at idle, then at 2000, 3000, and 4000rpm as best as I could hold the throttle at those places: Below are the sensor 2 readings, I've included the Sensor 1 readings below them, but they seem less interesting. Below that are a few sets of trim readings, 2 or 3 at each rpm. I have the complete set of readings if that will help, but I thought it would make this post too long, and that intervals were easier to compare without the extra lines. The MPH is always 0 but I could do it again with the car moving, with someone helping if need be. Sensor 2 Live Data Engine RPM(rpm) 720 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)15.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.01 Absolute Throttle Position(%)16.5 OBD requirements to which vehicle is designedOBDII === Despite the line above, what follows are actual readings, right? Not just design requirements? Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.640 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.660 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 710 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)14.5 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.01 Absolute Throttle Position(%)16.5 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.700 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.640 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.279 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 707 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)15.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.01 Absolute Throttle Position(%)16.5 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.115 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.660 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.28 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 700 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)14.5 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.01 Absolute Throttle Position(%)16.5 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.605 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.660 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 1550 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)38.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.01 Absolute Throttle Position(%)18.4 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.195 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.095 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 1813 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)40.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)19.2 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.780 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.760 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 1896 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)40.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)18.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.095 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.760 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Numbers of DTCs 2 Engine RPM(rpm) 1895 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)40.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)18.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.680 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.740 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 1890 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)40.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)18.8- Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.780 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.780 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 1897 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)40.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)18.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.605 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.780 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 1992 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)40.5 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)19.2 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.760 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.760 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 2676 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)45.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.03 Absolute Throttle Position(%)20.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.410 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.270 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3073 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.03 Absolute Throttle Position(%)20.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.290 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.760 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3078 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.03 Absolute Throttle Position(%)20.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.175 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.055 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3109 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.03 Absolute Throttle Position(%)20.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.485 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.055 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3127 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.03 Absolute Throttle Position(%)20.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.760 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.720 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3169 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.03 Absolute Throttle Position(%)20.8 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.330 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.740 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3837 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)43.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 At almost 4000 rpm and above, the air temp has only gone down 2 degrees! Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.05 Absolute Throttle Position(%)22.4 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.525 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.015 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 4180 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)111 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.04 Absolute Throttle Position(%)22.4 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.075 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.095 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 4180 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.04 Absolute Throttle Position(%)22.4 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.290 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.135 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 4199 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)44.5 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.05 Absolute Throttle Position(%)22.4 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.095 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.135 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 3716 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)45.0 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.02 Absolute Throttle Position(%)17.6 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.835 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.820 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Engine RPM(rpm) 866 Ignition Timing Advanece for #1 Cylinder(¡£)21.5 Intake Air Temperature(¡£F)113 Air Flow Rate from Mass Air Flow Sensor(lb/s)0.01 Absolute Throttle Position(%)16.5 Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 1-Sensor 2(V)0.835 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%)N/A Oxygen Sensor Output Voltage Bank 2-Sensor 2(V)0.820 Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 2-Sensor 2(%)99.2 ---------------------- Numbers of DTCs 2 Fuel system 1 statusCL Fuel System 2 statusCL Calculated Load Value(%)11.8 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)168 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)-2.3 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)-0.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)35.2 Engine RPM(rpm) 683 What's really noticeable to me is that Short Term Fuel Trim Bank 1-Sensor 2(%) is always N/A. Even though Bank 2 Sensor 2 gives values at every interval. Does that indicate maybe that the Bank 1 sensor 2 has failed???? Could that cause the codes, even for bank 2? I talked to the original owner, who had owned the car since it was new, and she first got the CEL in March. She took it in, they could find nothing wrong, so they turned off the light and she said the light never went on again. She has no reason to lie to me, because I'd already bought the car, and not from her. (She traded in the car to a new car dealer who auctioned it and I bought if from the guy who bought it at the auction.) The car hesitates from 1mph. Probably not from 0 or 3mph or higher. I'll really appreciate any help you can give. Sensor 1 readings. From the same test, so the engine speeds are the same as above. I omitted as much as possible to make it easier to compare. Live Data Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.003 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.287 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.004 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.263 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.994 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.260 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.006 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.279 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.999 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.246 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.002 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.268 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.065 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.573 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.137 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.760 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.014 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.304 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.949 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.980 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.982 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.160 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.953 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.028 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.993 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.299 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.010 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.307 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.992 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.300 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.094 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.553 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.057 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.465 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.015 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.300 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.012 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.405 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.036 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.396 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.104 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.594 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.065 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.357 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.981 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.269 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.096 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.557 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.983 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.266 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.049 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.388 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.947 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.039 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.002 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.348 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.943 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.015 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.000 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.363 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.996 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.122 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.948 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.910 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.983 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.244 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.004 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.253 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.909 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)2.917 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.040 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.385 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.191 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.825 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.927 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.688 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.980 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.071 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.906 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.775 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.088 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.407 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.912 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.749 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.016 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.344 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.026 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.390 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.004 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.305 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.013 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.338 ---------------------- Numbers of DTCs 2 Fuel system 1 statusCL Fuel System 2 statusCL Calculated Load Value(%)11.8 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)168 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)-2.3 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)-0.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)35.2 Engine RPM(rpm) 683 Trim readings Fuel system 1 statusCL Fuel System 2 statusCL Calculated Load Value(%)12.2 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)150 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)7.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)7.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)35.2 Calculated Load Value(%)11.8 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)149 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)9.4 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)8.6 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)35.2 Calculated Load Value(%)11.8 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)149 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)7.0 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)9.4 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)35.2 .... Calculated Load Value(%)11.8 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)150 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)14.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)18.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 1813 Calculated Load Value(%)12.2 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)150 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)10.2 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)5.5 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 1896 ... Calculated Load Value(%)14.9 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)158 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)-12.5 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)-4.7 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 3073 Calculated Load Value(%)14.1 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)158 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)-5.5 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)-7.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 3078 Calculated Load Value(%)14.5 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)159 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)-13.3 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)21.1 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)-10.9 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 3109 ..... Calculated Load Value(%)16.1 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)167 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)5.5 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)18.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)4.7 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 3837 Fuel system 1 statusCL Fuel System 2 statusCL Calculated Load Value(%)14.5 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)167 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)-7.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)32.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)18.8 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 4180 Calculated Load Value(%)13.7 Engine Coolant Temperature(¡£F)168 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 1(%)0.0 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 1(%)18.0 Short Term Fuel Trim -Bank 2(%)10.9 Long Term Fuel Trim - Bank 2(%)32.8 Engine RPM(rpm) 4180 |
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#6
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote:
Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. I seen or read about also using a propane gas from a small tank. Just open the gas valve an point to the suspect line. RPM gets eradicate. |
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#7
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Saturday, October 28, 2017 at 3:09:23 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:
Place I'd give prime attention to is the intake plumbing between the MAF and the throttle body. Anything there that's not rigid, like that 90 deg elbow made out of rubber with bellows like creases in it on my BMW is suspect. Make sure a connection hasn't come loose at a clamp. Sometimes car repair manuals have a diagram that shows all the vac hoses which is great, because you know where they go, what they do, and you can then isolate, test, etc. Also any history of any work that was done recently where something could have been disturbed or not reconnected? |
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#8
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:13:26 -0700, Oren
wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote: Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. I seen or read about also using a propane gas from a small tank. Just open the gas valve an point to the suspect line. RPM gets eradicate. Yeah, that's what I did. I even put a hose on it so I could tell where the propane was going, and I put it everywhere in the intake area two pieces met, rubber, metal, whatever, but nothing changed the RPM. I didn't want to use carb cleaner because the engine is almost spotless now and I figured it left residue. Is carb cleaner going to work better than propane? |
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#9
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:24:51 -0400, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:13:26 -0700, Oren wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote: Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. I seen or read about also using a propane gas from a small tank. Just open the gas valve an point to the suspect line. RPM gets eradicate. Yeah, that's what I did. I even put a hose on it so I could tell where the propane was going, and I put it everywhere in the intake area two pieces met, rubber, metal, whatever, but nothing changed the RPM. I didn't want to use carb cleaner because the engine is almost spotless now and I figured it left residue. Is carb cleaner going to work better than propane? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eMJ9bBlaE8 This guy used carb cleaner. No luck. But he found the leak with his hand. |
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#10
Posted to rec.autos.tech,alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
micky wrote:
I have a 2005 Toyota Solara SLE, 133,000 miles, with P0171 and P0174 codes, lean mixture in both banks, and a check engine light that returns soon after being cleared. What are the O2 sensor(s) readings? Can your scanner read or map the O2 voltages? If not then use your dvm on the leads. Check when HOT! 2k-3k rpm. |
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
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#12
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote:
In article , NONONOmisc07 says... In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 10:20:42 -0700 (PDT), trader_4 wrote: On Saturday, October 28, 2017 at 12:43:28 PM UTC-4, micky wrote: Every lean condition I've had was due to a leak in the intake system. Have you tried any forums for the particular car/engine? Many times Yeah, I have. Maybe it's the age of the car or maybe it's the make, or maybe it's the people, but I don't get much in the way of answers for any of my questions including this one. Sometimes 80 people will look at it an no one will answer, and these are just people who have what ever gen Solara I have and whatever gen Camry goes with it. Questions about making the car look hot do better. I'll try again rephrasing it. So I thought to come at it from the other direction, data interpretation. Maybe I can find newer cars that used the same engine, 3MZ-FE. there are particular problem parts that are known to fail and cause a leak. For example on the BMW X5 here, it's a 4" diameter rubber elbow that connects the intake ducting to the throttle body. It cracks and leaks. You can't hear it, I've never found a vacuum leak by sound. I've read stories of people buying fog/smoke making widgets that were designed for special effects, using them to blow smoke into the intake so you can see where it comes out. Might find one of those on Ebay to adapt. I think there are pro version tools that do similar, but I've never had to go that route to find the problem. That's an idea. I can imagine that even though the engine is not running, not much would come out, considering the atmosophere is not sucking like the engine is, but it still must work some of the time. Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. There is a TSB about this very issue from Toyota. A copy can be found at https://www.discountconverter.com/te...rter-&News=240 |
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#13
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:13:26 -0700, Oren wrote:
On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote: Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. I seen or read about also using a propane gas from a small tank. Just open the gas valve an point to the suspect line. RPM gets eradicate. Erratic? |
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#14
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
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#15
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:14:13 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:24:51 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:13:26 -0700, Oren wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote: Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. I seen or read about also using a propane gas from a small tank. Just open the gas valve an point to the suspect line. RPM gets eradicate. Yeah, that's what I did. I even put a hose on it so I could tell where the propane was going, and I put it everywhere in the intake area two pieces met, rubber, metal, whatever, but nothing changed the RPM. I didn't want to use carb cleaner because the engine is almost spotless now and I figured it left residue. Is carb cleaner going to work better than propane? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eMJ9bBlaE8 This guy used carb cleaner. No luck. But he found the leak with his hand. Well if it was good enough for him, I tried it a couple hours ago with the engine idling, after I cleared the codes I put my hand everywhere and couldn't feel any breezes. I also tried squeezing all the hoses. None of them felt mushy or seemed to be cracking, or seemed loose, or affected engine speed, and most look like new. (Especially the large pleated? corrugated? hose between the air cleaner and the plenum.) Then I got in the car and drove. In the past it took no more than 10 miles to set the codes and for a while it would do it in 1 or 2 minutes of idling. I forgot to look at pending codes until 6 miles out, and I had not only the 0171 and 0174, but I also had 2198!!! But after 4 more miles, there were no pending codes anymore, and no actual codes. And after 10 more miles to get home, still no codes. Plus, the engine doesn't seem to hesitate anymore, though maybe I learned how to accelerate to avoid that, and it's hard to go back to a style that was causing trouble. (If that's it, I"m sure over time, I'll revert to my old style.) There are a lot of hoses, but if this starts up again, I'll go through them more slowly and more deliberately Oh, I found out what p2198 means: "Stop squeezing my hoses." |
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#16
Posted to alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 15:31:24 -0400, micky
wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:14:13 -0500, Vic Smith wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:24:51 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:13:26 -0700, Oren wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote: Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. I seen or read about also using a propane gas from a small tank. Just open the gas valve an point to the suspect line. RPM gets eradicate. Yeah, that's what I did. I even put a hose on it so I could tell where the propane was going, and I put it everywhere in the intake area two pieces met, rubber, metal, whatever, but nothing changed the RPM. I didn't want to use carb cleaner because the engine is almost spotless now and I figured it left residue. Is carb cleaner going to work better than propane? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eMJ9bBlaE8 This guy used carb cleaner. No luck. But he found the leak with his hand. Well if it was good enough for him, I tried it a couple hours ago with the engine idling, after I cleared the codes I put my hand everywhere and couldn't feel any breezes. I also tried squeezing all the hoses. None of them felt mushy or seemed to be cracking, or seemed loose, or affected engine speed, and most look like new. (Especially the large pleated? corrugated? hose between the air cleaner and the plenum.) Then I got in the car and drove. In the past it took no more than 10 miles to set the codes and for a while it would do it in 1 or 2 minutes of idling. I forgot to look at pending codes until 6 miles out, and I had not only the 0171 and 0174, but I also had 2198!!! But after 4 more miles, there were no pending codes anymore, and no actual codes. And after 10 more miles to get home, still no codes. Plus, the engine doesn't seem to hesitate anymore, though maybe I learned how to accelerate to avoid that, and it's hard to go back to a style that was causing trouble. (If that's it, I"m sure over time, I'll revert to my old style.) There are a lot of hoses, but if this starts up again, I'll go through them more slowly and more deliberately Oh, I found out what p2198 means: "Stop squeezing my hoses." Code p2198 means" Stop squeezing my hoses or I will sue you for hosual harassment" Actually it means "O2 Sensor Signal Stuck Rich Bank 2 Sensor 1" https://www.yourmechanic.com/article...y-andrew-quinn and this reminds me that last night I sprayed the base of the B2S1 sensor with PB Blaster, since changing the sensor woudl be easier and changing the manifold gasket. I only sprayed where it screws in. I saw what got wet and the top didn't. How could spraying the base affect *any*thing? Especially since it was 20 hours earlier. If the codes come back after the stuff evaporates, I'll spray it again! |
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#17
Posted to alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:13:58 -0400, micky
wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 15:31:24 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:14:13 -0500, Vic Smith wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:24:51 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:13:26 -0700, Oren wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote: Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. I seen or read about also using a propane gas from a small tank. Just open the gas valve an point to the suspect line. RPM gets eradicate. Yeah, that's what I did. I even put a hose on it so I could tell where the propane was going, and I put it everywhere in the intake area two pieces met, rubber, metal, whatever, but nothing changed the RPM. I didn't want to use carb cleaner because the engine is almost spotless now and I figured it left residue. Is carb cleaner going to work better than propane? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eMJ9bBlaE8 This guy used carb cleaner. No luck. But he found the leak with his hand. Well if it was good enough for him, I tried it a couple hours ago with the engine idling, after I cleared the codes I put my hand everywhere and couldn't feel any breezes. I also tried squeezing all the hoses. None of them felt mushy or seemed to be cracking, or seemed loose, or affected engine speed, and most look like new. (Especially the large pleated? corrugated? hose between the air cleaner and the plenum.) Then I got in the car and drove. In the past it took no more than 10 miles to set the codes and for a while it would do it in 1 or 2 minutes of idling. I forgot to look at pending codes until 6 miles out, and I had not only the 0171 and 0174, but I also had 2198!!! But after 4 more miles, there were no pending codes anymore, and no actual codes. And after 10 more miles to get home, still no codes. Plus, the engine doesn't seem to hesitate anymore, though maybe I learned how to accelerate to avoid that, and it's hard to go back to a style that was causing trouble. (If that's it, I"m sure over time, I'll revert to my old style.) There are a lot of hoses, but if this starts up again, I'll go through them more slowly and more deliberately Oh, I found out what p2198 means: "Stop squeezing my hoses." Code p2198 means" Stop squeezing my hoses or I will sue you for hosual harassment" Actually it means "O2 Sensor Signal Stuck Rich Bank 2 Sensor 1" https://www.yourmechanic.com/article...y-andrew-quinn and this reminds me that last night I sprayed the base of the B2S1 sensor with PB Blaster, since changing the sensor woudl be easier and changing the manifold gasket. I only sprayed where it screws in. I saw what got wet and the top didn't. How could spraying the base affect *any*thing? Especially since it was 20 hours earlier. If the codes come back after the stuff evaporates, I'll spray it again! Also should mention that I used the tank with Techron fuel injector cleaner in it, and yesterday I filled the tank and put a can of Sea Foam fuel injector cleaner in it. But the car has always been able to do 70mph without stumbling, so doesn't that imply the fuel pump was good and the injectors were clean enough? I havent' tried to accelerate up a hill to that speed because I haven't seen any hills. |
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#18
Posted to alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Mon, 30 Oct 2017 15:31:24 -0400, micky
wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:14:13 -0500, Vic Smith wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:24:51 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:13:26 -0700, Oren wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote: Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. I seen or read about also using a propane gas from a small tank. Just open the gas valve an point to the suspect line. RPM gets eradicate. Yeah, that's what I did. I even put a hose on it so I could tell where the propane was going, and I put it everywhere in the intake area two pieces met, rubber, metal, whatever, but nothing changed the RPM. I didn't want to use carb cleaner because the engine is almost spotless now and I figured it left residue. Is carb cleaner going to work better than propane? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eMJ9bBlaE8 This guy used carb cleaner. No luck. But he found the leak with his hand. Well if it was good enough for him, I tried it a couple hours ago with the engine idling, after I cleared the codes I put my hand everywhere and couldn't feel any breezes. I also tried squeezing all the hoses. None of them felt mushy or seemed to be cracking, or seemed loose, or affected engine speed, and most look like new. (Especially the large pleated? corrugated? hose between the air cleaner and the plenum.) Then I got in the car and drove. In the past it took no more than 10 miles to set the codes and for a while it would do it in 1 or 2 minutes of idling. I forgot to look at pending codes until 6 miles out, and I had not only the 0171 and 0174, but I also had 2198!!! But after 4 more miles, there were no pending codes anymore, and no actual codes. And after 10 more miles to get home, still no codes. Plus, the engine doesn't seem to hesitate anymore, though maybe I learned how to accelerate to avoid that, and it's hard to go back to a style that was causing trouble. (If that's it, I"m sure over time, I'll revert to my old style.) There are a lot of hoses, but if this starts up again, I'll go through them more slowly and more deliberately Oh, I found out what p2198 means: "Stop squeezing my hoses." Means bank 2 stuck rich. What fuel are you running in it? Try a top tier fuel - preferably SHELL - (just my experience) for a few tanks and see what happens. You COULD have injector troubles. If you had semi-blocked injectors it would run lean. If one cleared and momentarily was jammed open, you could get a 2198 - and it could have cleared everything - stranger things have happened. |
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#19
Posted to alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:13:58 -0400, micky
wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 15:31:24 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:14:13 -0500, Vic Smith wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:24:51 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:13:26 -0700, Oren wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote: Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. I seen or read about also using a propane gas from a small tank. Just open the gas valve an point to the suspect line. RPM gets eradicate. Yeah, that's what I did. I even put a hose on it so I could tell where the propane was going, and I put it everywhere in the intake area two pieces met, rubber, metal, whatever, but nothing changed the RPM. I didn't want to use carb cleaner because the engine is almost spotless now and I figured it left residue. Is carb cleaner going to work better than propane? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eMJ9bBlaE8 This guy used carb cleaner. No luck. But he found the leak with his hand. Well if it was good enough for him, I tried it a couple hours ago with the engine idling, after I cleared the codes I put my hand everywhere and couldn't feel any breezes. I also tried squeezing all the hoses. None of them felt mushy or seemed to be cracking, or seemed loose, or affected engine speed, and most look like new. (Especially the large pleated? corrugated? hose between the air cleaner and the plenum.) Then I got in the car and drove. In the past it took no more than 10 miles to set the codes and for a while it would do it in 1 or 2 minutes of idling. I forgot to look at pending codes until 6 miles out, and I had not only the 0171 and 0174, but I also had 2198!!! But after 4 more miles, there were no pending codes anymore, and no actual codes. And after 10 more miles to get home, still no codes. Plus, the engine doesn't seem to hesitate anymore, though maybe I learned how to accelerate to avoid that, and it's hard to go back to a style that was causing trouble. (If that's it, I"m sure over time, I'll revert to my old style.) There are a lot of hoses, but if this starts up again, I'll go through them more slowly and more deliberately Oh, I found out what p2198 means: "Stop squeezing my hoses." Code p2198 means" Stop squeezing my hoses or I will sue you for hosual harassment" Actually it means "O2 Sensor Signal Stuck Rich Bank 2 Sensor 1" https://www.yourmechanic.com/article...y-andrew-quinn and this reminds me that last night I sprayed the base of the B2S1 sensor with PB Blaster, since changing the sensor woudl be easier and changing the manifold gasket. I only sprayed where it screws in. I saw what got wet and the top didn't. How could spraying the base affect *any*thing? Especially since it was 20 hours earlier. If the codes come back after the stuff evaporates, I'll spray it again! Mabee the PB Blaster softened and swelled a gasket or seal?? |
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#20
Posted to alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:19:54 -0400, micky
wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:13:58 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 15:31:24 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:14:13 -0500, Vic Smith wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:24:51 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:13:26 -0700, Oren wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote: Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. I seen or read about also using a propane gas from a small tank. Just open the gas valve an point to the suspect line. RPM gets eradicate. Yeah, that's what I did. I even put a hose on it so I could tell where the propane was going, and I put it everywhere in the intake area two pieces met, rubber, metal, whatever, but nothing changed the RPM. I didn't want to use carb cleaner because the engine is almost spotless now and I figured it left residue. Is carb cleaner going to work better than propane? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eMJ9bBlaE8 This guy used carb cleaner. No luck. But he found the leak with his hand. Well if it was good enough for him, I tried it a couple hours ago with the engine idling, after I cleared the codes I put my hand everywhere and couldn't feel any breezes. I also tried squeezing all the hoses. None of them felt mushy or seemed to be cracking, or seemed loose, or affected engine speed, and most look like new. (Especially the large pleated? corrugated? hose between the air cleaner and the plenum.) Then I got in the car and drove. In the past it took no more than 10 miles to set the codes and for a while it would do it in 1 or 2 minutes of idling. I forgot to look at pending codes until 6 miles out, and I had not only the 0171 and 0174, but I also had 2198!!! But after 4 more miles, there were no pending codes anymore, and no actual codes. And after 10 more miles to get home, still no codes. Plus, the engine doesn't seem to hesitate anymore, though maybe I learned how to accelerate to avoid that, and it's hard to go back to a style that was causing trouble. (If that's it, I"m sure over time, I'll revert to my old style.) There are a lot of hoses, but if this starts up again, I'll go through them more slowly and more deliberately Oh, I found out what p2198 means: "Stop squeezing my hoses." Code p2198 means" Stop squeezing my hoses or I will sue you for hosual harassment" Actually it means "O2 Sensor Signal Stuck Rich Bank 2 Sensor 1" https://www.yourmechanic.com/article...y-andrew-quinn and this reminds me that last night I sprayed the base of the B2S1 sensor with PB Blaster, since changing the sensor woudl be easier and changing the manifold gasket. I only sprayed where it screws in. I saw what got wet and the top didn't. How could spraying the base affect *any*thing? Especially since it was 20 hours earlier. If the codes come back after the stuff evaporates, I'll spray it again! Also should mention that I used the tank with Techron fuel injector cleaner in it, and yesterday I filled the tank and put a can of Sea Foam fuel injector cleaner in it. But the car has always been able to do 70mph without stumbling, so doesn't that imply the fuel pump was good and the injectors were clean enough? I havent' tried to accelerate up a hill to that speed because I haven't seen any hills. The Techron may have cleaned the injectors enough that they are no longer running lean - and it may have happened suddenly enough that it temporatily ran rich throwing the 2198. Might have been a problem with the FP regulator too - fixed by the Techron. |
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#22
Posted to alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:58:07 -0400,
wrote: On Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:13:58 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 15:31:24 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:14:13 -0500, Vic Smith wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:24:51 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:13:26 -0700, Oren wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote: Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. I seen or read about also using a propane gas from a small tank. Just open the gas valve an point to the suspect line. RPM gets eradicate. Yeah, that's what I did. I even put a hose on it so I could tell where the propane was going, and I put it everywhere in the intake area two pieces met, rubber, metal, whatever, but nothing changed the RPM. I didn't want to use carb cleaner because the engine is almost spotless now and I figured it left residue. Is carb cleaner going to work better than propane? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eMJ9bBlaE8 This guy used carb cleaner. No luck. But he found the leak with his hand. Well if it was good enough for him, I tried it a couple hours ago with the engine idling, after I cleared the codes I put my hand everywhere and couldn't feel any breezes. I also tried squeezing all the hoses. None of them felt mushy or seemed to be cracking, or seemed loose, or affected engine speed, and most look like new. (Especially the large pleated? corrugated? hose between the air cleaner and the plenum.) Then I got in the car and drove. In the past it took no more than 10 miles to set the codes and for a while it would do it in 1 or 2 minutes of idling. I forgot to look at pending codes until 6 miles out, and I had not only the 0171 and 0174, but I also had 2198!!! But after 4 more miles, there were no pending codes anymore, and no actual codes. And after 10 more miles to get home, still no codes. Plus, the engine doesn't seem to hesitate anymore, though maybe I learned how to accelerate to avoid that, and it's hard to go back to a style that was causing trouble. (If that's it, I"m sure over time, I'll revert to my old style.) There are a lot of hoses, but if this starts up again, I'll go through them more slowly and more deliberately Oh, I found out what p2198 means: "Stop squeezing my hoses." Code p2198 means" Stop squeezing my hoses or I will sue you for hosual harassment" Actually it means "O2 Sensor Signal Stuck Rich Bank 2 Sensor 1" https://www.yourmechanic.com/article...y-andrew-quinn and this reminds me that last night I sprayed the base of the B2S1 sensor with PB Blaster, since changing the sensor woudl be easier and changing the manifold gasket. I only sprayed where it screws in. I saw what got wet and the top didn't. How could spraying the base affect *any*thing? Especially since it was 20 hours earlier. If the codes come back after the stuff evaporates, I'll spray it again! Mabee the PB Blaster softened and swelled a gasket or seal?? I called it a spray but it was more like a stream**. I don't think I hit anything else. **Maybe that's why they call it blaster. Calling a spray "blaster" is like calling a lamb "tiger". |
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#23
Posted to alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 18:02:00 -0400,
wrote: On Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:19:54 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:13:58 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 15:31:24 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:14:13 -0500, Vic Smith wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:24:51 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:13:26 -0700, Oren wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote: Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. I seen or read about also using a propane gas from a small tank. Just open the gas valve an point to the suspect line. RPM gets eradicate. Yeah, that's what I did. I even put a hose on it so I could tell where the propane was going, and I put it everywhere in the intake area two pieces met, rubber, metal, whatever, but nothing changed the RPM. I didn't want to use carb cleaner because the engine is almost spotless now and I figured it left residue. Is carb cleaner going to work better than propane? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eMJ9bBlaE8 This guy used carb cleaner. No luck. But he found the leak with his hand. Well if it was good enough for him, I tried it a couple hours ago with the engine idling, after I cleared the codes I put my hand everywhere and couldn't feel any breezes. I also tried squeezing all the hoses. None of them felt mushy or seemed to be cracking, or seemed loose, or affected engine speed, and most look like new. (Especially the large pleated? corrugated? hose between the air cleaner and the plenum.) Then I got in the car and drove. In the past it took no more than 10 miles to set the codes and for a while it would do it in 1 or 2 minutes of idling. I forgot to look at pending codes until 6 miles out, and I had not only the 0171 and 0174, but I also had 2198!!! But after 4 more miles, there were no pending codes anymore, and no actual codes. And after 10 more miles to get home, still no codes. Plus, the engine doesn't seem to hesitate anymore, though maybe I learned how to accelerate to avoid that, and it's hard to go back to a style that was causing trouble. (If that's it, I"m sure over time, I'll revert to my old style.) There are a lot of hoses, but if this starts up again, I'll go through them more slowly and more deliberately Oh, I found out what p2198 means: "Stop squeezing my hoses." Code p2198 means" Stop squeezing my hoses or I will sue you for hosual harassment" Actually it means "O2 Sensor Signal Stuck Rich Bank 2 Sensor 1" https://www.yourmechanic.com/article...y-andrew-quinn and this reminds me that last night I sprayed the base of the B2S1 sensor with PB Blaster, since changing the sensor woudl be easier and changing the manifold gasket. I only sprayed where it screws in. I saw what got wet and the top didn't. How could spraying the base affect *any*thing? Especially since it was 20 hours earlier. If the codes come back after the stuff evaporates, I'll spray it again! Also should mention that I used the tank with Techron fuel injector cleaner in it, and yesterday I filled the tank and put a can of Sea Foam fuel injector cleaner in it. But the car has always been able to do 70mph without stumbling, so doesn't that imply the fuel pump was good and the injectors were clean enough? I havent' tried to accelerate up a hill to that speed because I haven't seen any hills. The Techron may have cleaned the injectors enough that they are no longer running lean That would be great. It's sometimes hard to believe the things you add to the gas tank can do that much, but even when I thought that, it was worth $20 or 30 for various injector cleaners compared to the alternatives. (I still have a bottle of the Autozone brand. It was by far the cheapest, $3 or 4.) - and it may have happened suddenly enough that it temporatily ran rich throwing the 2198. Huh! I wouldn't have thought of that. Might have been a problem with the FP regulator too - fixed by the Techron. Or that. Thanks. Barring the return of the codes, I think I'm a big believer in Techron now. |
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#24
Posted to rec.autos.tech,alt.home.repair
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:47:15 -0500, Paul in Houston
TX wrote: micky wrote: I have a 2005 Toyota Solara SLE, 133,000 miles, with P0171 and P0174 codes, lean mixture in both banks, and a check engine light that returns soon after being cleared. What are the O2 sensor(s) readings? Can your scanner read or map the O2 voltages? If not then use your dvm on the leads. Check when HOT! 2k-3k rpm. I think this is what you mean: Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.065 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.573 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.137 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.760 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.014 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.304 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.949 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.980 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.982 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.160 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.953 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.028 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.993 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.299 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.010 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.307 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.992 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.300 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.094 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.553 ---------------------- So what they call voltages are more than zero and less than 12, and go up and down around 3.1 to 3.6. So does that imply they are good? I was going to take the connector apart and measure the resistance, but it looked like I had to take off the air intake "funnel" first, and then, it seems, the car started working right! |
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#25
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:47:15 -0500, Paul in Houston TX wrote: micky wrote: I have a 2005 Toyota Solara SLE, 133,000 miles, with P0171 and P0174 codes, lean mixture in both banks, and a check engine light that returns soon after being cleared. What are the O2 sensor(s) readings? Can your scanner read or map the O2 voltages? If not then use your dvm on the leads. Check when HOT! 2k-3k rpm. I think this is what you mean: Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.065 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.573 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.137 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.760 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.014 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.304 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.949 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.980 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.982 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.160 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.953 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.028 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.993 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.299 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.010 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.307 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.992 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.300 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.094 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.553 ---------------------- So what they call voltages are more than zero and less than 12, and go up and down around 3.1 to 3.6. So does that imply they are good? I was going to take the connector apart and measure the resistance, but it looked like I had to take off the air intake "funnel" first, and then, it seems, the car started working right! I went back and reread your original post. All the numbers were there. I was my mistake for overlooking them. The numbers look just fine. A bit on the rich side but that is probably due to the low engine temp ~150F. Don't really see anything wrong. |
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#26
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Mon, 30 Oct 2017 18:30:24 -0400, micky
wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 18:02:00 -0400, wrote: On Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:19:54 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:13:58 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 15:31:24 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:14:13 -0500, Vic Smith wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:24:51 -0400, micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:13:26 -0700, Oren wrote: On Sat, 28 Oct 2017 14:23:37 -0500, RonNNN wrote: Try using some spray Berrymans carb cleaner and spray around the intake and pcv hose and other vacuum hoses (etc.), if the engine RPM increases you've found a vacuum leak. I seen or read about also using a propane gas from a small tank. Just open the gas valve an point to the suspect line. RPM gets eradicate. Yeah, that's what I did. I even put a hose on it so I could tell where the propane was going, and I put it everywhere in the intake area two pieces met, rubber, metal, whatever, but nothing changed the RPM. I didn't want to use carb cleaner because the engine is almost spotless now and I figured it left residue. Is carb cleaner going to work better than propane? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eMJ9bBlaE8 This guy used carb cleaner. No luck. But he found the leak with his hand. Well if it was good enough for him, I tried it a couple hours ago with the engine idling, after I cleared the codes I put my hand everywhere and couldn't feel any breezes. I also tried squeezing all the hoses. None of them felt mushy or seemed to be cracking, or seemed loose, or affected engine speed, and most look like new. (Especially the large pleated? corrugated? hose between the air cleaner and the plenum.) Then I got in the car and drove. In the past it took no more than 10 miles to set the codes and for a while it would do it in 1 or 2 minutes of idling. I forgot to look at pending codes until 6 miles out, and I had not only the 0171 and 0174, but I also had 2198!!! But after 4 more miles, there were no pending codes anymore, and no actual codes. And after 10 more miles to get home, still no codes. Plus, the engine doesn't seem to hesitate anymore, though maybe I learned how to accelerate to avoid that, and it's hard to go back to a style that was causing trouble. (If that's it, I"m sure over time, I'll revert to my old style.) There are a lot of hoses, but if this starts up again, I'll go through them more slowly and more deliberately Oh, I found out what p2198 means: "Stop squeezing my hoses." Code p2198 means" Stop squeezing my hoses or I will sue you for hosual harassment" Actually it means "O2 Sensor Signal Stuck Rich Bank 2 Sensor 1" https://www.yourmechanic.com/article...y-andrew-quinn and this reminds me that last night I sprayed the base of the B2S1 sensor with PB Blaster, since changing the sensor woudl be easier and changing the manifold gasket. I only sprayed where it screws in. I saw what got wet and the top didn't. How could spraying the base affect *any*thing? Especially since it was 20 hours earlier. If the codes come back after the stuff evaporates, I'll spray it again! Also should mention that I used the tank with Techron fuel injector cleaner in it, and yesterday I filled the tank and put a can of Sea Foam fuel injector cleaner in it. But the car has always been able to do 70mph without stumbling, so doesn't that imply the fuel pump was good and the injectors were clean enough? I havent' tried to accelerate up a hill to that speed because I haven't seen any hills. The Techron may have cleaned the injectors enough that they are no longer running lean That would be great. It's sometimes hard to believe the things you add to the gas tank can do that much, but even when I thought that, it was worth $20 or 30 for various injector cleaners compared to the alternatives. (I still have a bottle of the Autozone brand. It was by far the cheapest, $3 or 4.) - and it may have happened suddenly enough that it temporatily ran rich throwing the 2198. Huh! I wouldn't have thought of that. Might have been a problem with the FP regulator too - fixed by the Techron. Or that. Thanks. Barring the return of the codes, I think I'm a big believer in Techron now. Techron is one of the better ones generally available - along with sea foam and BG 144K and it's little brother, BG TuneUp) |
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#27
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Mon, 30 Oct 2017 18:36:04 -0400, micky
wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:47:15 -0500, Paul in Houston TX wrote: micky wrote: I have a 2005 Toyota Solara SLE, 133,000 miles, with P0171 and P0174 codes, lean mixture in both banks, and a check engine light that returns soon after being cleared. What are the O2 sensor(s) readings? Can your scanner read or map the O2 voltages? If not then use your dvm on the leads. Check when HOT! 2k-3k rpm. I think this is what you mean: Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.065 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.573 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.137 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.760 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.014 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.304 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.949 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.980 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.982 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.160 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.953 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.028 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.993 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.299 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.010 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.307 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.992 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.300 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.094 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.553 ---------------------- So what they call voltages are more than zero and less than 12, and go up and down around 3.1 to 3.6. So does that imply they are good? I was going to take the connector apart and measure the resistance, but it looked like I had to take off the air intake "funnel" first, and then, it seems, the car started working right! Technically they oscillate between 0 and 5. The wider the swing the better. |
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#28
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Mon, 30 Oct 2017 18:36:04 -0400, micky
wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:47:15 -0500, Paul in Houston TX wrote: micky wrote: I have a 2005 Toyota Solara SLE, 133,000 miles, with P0171 and P0174 codes, lean mixture in both banks, and a check engine light that returns soon after being cleared. What are the O2 sensor(s) readings? Can your scanner read or map the O2 voltages? If not then use your dvm on the leads. Check when HOT! 2k-3k rpm. I think this is what you mean: Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.065 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.573 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.137 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.760 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)1.014 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.304 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.949 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)2.980 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.982 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.160 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)0.953 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.028 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.993 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.299 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.010 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.307 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.992 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.300 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.094 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.553 ---------------------- So what they call voltages are more than zero and less than 12, and go up and down around 3.1 to 3.6. So does that imply they are good? I was going to take the connector apart and measure the resistance, but it looked like I had to take off the air intake "funnel" first, and then, it seems, the car started working right! OOPS!!! normal O2 sensor between 1 and zero, late model Toyotas (with wide band O2 sensor) 0 to 3.3 |
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#29
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 20:00:12 -0500, Paul in Houston
TX wrote: micky wrote: In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 28 Oct 2017 19:47:15 -0500, Paul in Houston TX wrote: micky wrote: I have a 2005 Toyota Solara SLE, 133,000 miles, with P0171 and P0174 codes, lean mixture in both banks, and a check engine light that returns soon after being cleared. What are the O2 sensor(s) readings? Can your scanner read or map the O2 voltages? If not then use your dvm on the leads. Check when HOT! 2k-3k rpm. I think this is what you mean:.... ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.993 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.299 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.010 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.307 ---------------------- Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 1-Sensor 1)0.992 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 1-Sensor 1)(V)3.300 Equivalence Ration (lambda)(Bank 2-Sensor 1)1.094 Oxygen Sensor Voltage (Bank 2-Sensor 1)(V)3.553 ---------------------- So what they call voltages are more than zero and less than 12, and go up and down around 3.1 to 3.6. So does that imply they are good? I was going to take the connector apart and measure the resistance, but it looked like I had to take off the air intake "funnel" first, and then, it seems, the car started working right! I went back and reread your original post. All the numbers were there. I was my mistake for overlooking them. The numbers look just fine. A bit on the rich side but that is probably due to the low engine temp ~150F. Don't really see anything wrong. That's good. There must have been some vacuum leak, and I suppose it will reappear**. What I should do is use the scan tool to get the same sort of readings when it's working right, and maybe I can find one or more values that are different from when it was working wrong, and maybe if/when it starts working wrong again, someone can sit in the car watching just that/those values, and when I fiddle with the right hose, or blast the right 02/fuel sensor, he's see the change and tell me. **After all, it showed up in March when the previous owner had it, then in October. The mechanic who looked at in March might have touched the same hose or whatever I touched. Actually, the CEL and the VSC and Trac*** lights were all on and they all went off a day or two after I bought the car. Then when I was playing with the transmission, putting it in first gear to go down a steep but short hill, the light went on and it's been on almost all of the time since then. ***The owners manual says that the Trac (Off) light will come on when the VSC light is on. But still, maybe I should have mentioned the other two lights. I apologize, although I was only hurting myself. I think this was a very good thread. Even if what I learned didn't directly fix the car, I still learned a lot. |
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#30
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 30 Oct 2017 22:40:11 -0400, micky
wrote: That's good. There must have been some vacuum leak, and I suppose it will reappear. Unless it was partly clogged injectors and the Techron cured it, at least for 2 or 3000 miles. What I should do is use the scan tool to get the same sort of readings when it's working right, and maybe I can find one or more values that are different from when it was working wrong, and maybe if/when it starts working wrong again, someone can sit in the car watching just that/those values, and when I fiddle with the right hose, or blast the right 02/fuel sensor, he's see the change and tell me. |
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#31
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
micky wrote:
That's good. There must have been some vacuum leak, and I suppose it will reappear**. Right. And as someone else here pointed out, it's likely on the intake gaskets because they are a known problem on those engines. What I should do is use the scan tool to get the same sort of readings when it's working right, and maybe I can find one or more values that are different from when it was working wrong, and maybe if/when it starts working wrong again, someone can sit in the car watching just that/those values, and when I fiddle with the right hose, or blast the right 02/fuel sensor, he's see the change and tell me. Well, just watching the readings should be sufficient. If you manage to block the leak or get propane into the leak instead of air or the like, the numbers will change immediately and obviously and then return back once you remove your hand or the propane torch from the leak. But you also know that the intake gaskets are bad, and if they aren't causing this problem, they are likely going to cause another. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
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#32
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
On Tuesday, October 31, 2017 at 10:09:19 AM UTC-4, Scott Dorsey wrote:
micky wrote: That's good. There must have been some vacuum leak, and I suppose it will reappear**. Right. And as someone else here pointed out, it's likely on the intake gaskets because they are a known problem on those engines. I assume you read that Toyota tech bulletin that Clare provided? It applied to a very specific leak, at the shaft on the throttle body or air volume control, whatever you choose to call it. Did you check there? What I should do is use the scan tool to get the same sort of readings when it's working right, and maybe I can find one or more values that are different from when it was working wrong, and maybe if/when it starts working wrong again, someone can sit in the car watching just that/those values, and when I fiddle with the right hose, or blast the right 02/fuel sensor, he's see the change and tell me. That tech bulletin said to watch short term fuel trim while doing the spray test. |
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#33
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
In alt.home.repair, on Tue, 31 Oct 2017 07:36:56 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote: On Tuesday, October 31, 2017 at 10:09:19 AM UTC-4, Scott Dorsey wrote: micky wrote: That's good. There must have been some vacuum leak, and I suppose it will reappear**. Right. And as someone else here pointed out, it's likely on the intake gaskets because they are a known problem on those engines. I assume you read that Toyota tech bulletin that Clare provided? It applied to a very specific leak, at the shaft on the throttle body or air volume control, whatever you choose to call it. Did you check there? I checked everywhere. And I did read the TSB, and it is exactly my codes and my model car, but it also provided a list of VINs, of Production Change Effective VIN, a term I don't understand. But still I think mine isn't in the list. The 4th character and everything except the last 3 after that was different, so I figure it doesn't apply to me. It listed Camry 4T1BA3#K*4u502118 Solara 4T1CA3#K*4u017744 And I'm Solara 4T1FA38P55U044744 However I did spray carb cleaner where they said to, and nothing happened. I'd already tried propane all around there. What I should do is use the scan tool to get the same sort of readings when it's working right, and maybe I can find one or more values that are different from when it was working wrong, and maybe if/when it starts working wrong again, someone can sit in the car watching just that/those values, and when I fiddle with the right hose, or blast the right 02/fuel sensor, he's see the change and tell me. That tech bulletin said to watch short term fuel trim while doing the spray test. I gather that if the codes are cleared, when the code is set again, many scan tools including mine will take a freeze frame. But that's not the same as spraying and having the fuel trim change. How does a person notice that when he's alone? Put the scanner on the dash facing out? Anyhow, I'm going for a longer drive now with the scan tool attached. |
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#34
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P0171, P0174 and scan tool readings
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