Brought home a new laptop today with Windows 8 installed. First impression: they let a few nutjobs take over the design of this OS when the A-team was out to lunch. Nothing is intuitive. Simple things, like moving a file from one folder to another, require one to use Explorer. Even "my computer" no longer resides on the desktop. There are two interfaces -- the tiles version and one that kinda mimics the familiar XP version. The former is loaded with a lot of junk.

It's going to take me hours to get this machine set up -- hours that I could spend more enjoyably in the shop.

BTW, this is being written on my old machine, which needs to be returned to my employer come retirement date (May 3).

Larry

On Fri, 08 Mar 2013 19:10:54 -0800, Gramp's shop wrote:

Brought home a new laptop today with Windows 8 installed. First
impression: they let a few nutjobs take over the design of this OS when
the A-team was out to lunch. Nothing is intuitive. Simple things, like
moving a file from one folder to another, require one to use Explorer.
Even "my computer" no longer resides on the desktop. There are two
interfaces -- the tiles version and one that kinda mimics the familiar
XP version. The former is loaded with a lot of junk.

It's going to take me hours to get this machine set up -- hours that I
could spend more enjoyably in the shop.

BTW, this is being written on my old machine, which needs to be returned
to my employer come retirement date (May 3).

Larry


This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.

Paul

On 3/8/2013 9:51 PM, PHT wrote:
On Fri, 08 Mar 2013 19:10:54 -0800, Gramp's shop wrote:

Brought home a new laptop today with Windows 8 installed. First
impression: they let a few nutjobs take over the design of this OS when
the A-team was out to lunch. Nothing is intuitive. Simple things, like
moving a file from one folder to another, require one to use Explorer.
Even "my computer" no longer resides on the desktop. There are two
interfaces -- the tiles version and one that kinda mimics the familiar
XP version. The former is loaded with a lot of junk.

It's going to take me hours to get this machine set up -- hours that I
could spend more enjoyably in the shop.

BTW, this is being written on my old machine, which needs to be returned
to my employer come retirement date (May 3).

Larry


This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.

Paul

Which is unfortunately far behind as a consumer product...

On 03/08/2013 09:27 PM, Richard wrote:
On 3/8/2013 9:51 PM, PHT wrote:
On Fri, 08 Mar 2013 19:10:54 -0800, Gramp's shop wrote:

Brought home a new laptop today with Windows 8 installed. First
impression: they let a few nutjobs take over the design of this OS when
the A-team was out to lunch. Nothing is intuitive. Simple things, like
moving a file from one folder to another, require one to use Explorer.
Even "my computer" no longer resides on the desktop. There are two
interfaces -- the tiles version and one that kinda mimics the familiar
XP version. The former is loaded with a lot of junk.

It's going to take me hours to get this machine set up -- hours that I
could spend more enjoyably in the shop.

BTW, this is being written on my old machine, which needs to be returned
to my employer come retirement date (May 3).

Larry


This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.

Paul

Which is unfortunately far behind as a consumer product...

What is your latest experience and with linux and what distribution are
you basing this on?

As a "user" rather than a "consumer", I have had a very good experience
with linux for the last 18 years.


--
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure,the creed of ignorance, and the
gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery"
-Winston Churchill

Doug Winterburn wrote:
On 03/08/2013 09:27 PM, Richard wrote:
On 3/8/2013 9:51 PM, PHT wrote:
On Fri, 08 Mar 2013 19:10:54 -0800, Gramp's shop wrote:

Brought home a new laptop today with Windows 8 installed. First
impression: they let a few nutjobs take over the design of this OS
when
the A-team was out to lunch. Nothing is intuitive. Simple things,
like
moving a file from one folder to another, require one to use Explorer.
Even "my computer" no longer resides on the desktop. There are two
interfaces -- the tiles version and one that kinda mimics the familiar
XP version. The former is loaded with a lot of junk.

It's going to take me hours to get this machine set up -- hours that I
could spend more enjoyably in the shop.

BTW, this is being written on my old machine, which needs to be
returned
to my employer come retirement date (May 3).

Larry


This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.

Paul

Which is unfortunately far behind as a consumer product...

What is your latest experience and with linux and what distribution
are you basing this on?

As a "user" rather than a "consumer", I have had a very good
experience with linux for the last 18 years.

Can you run SketchUp on it?

Bill wrote:

Can you run SketchUp on it?

Yes.

As chance would have it I installed Sketchup 8 (free version) just
yesterday on my 64 bit laptop running Ubuntu 12.10. I can't say
that I put it through all its paces as of yet but I've yet to find
anything that is broken with it.

You do have to run it under Wine (a windows compatibility layer), so
performance probably takes a hit, but its OK for my simple needs.

A tiny bit of Linux knowledge is needed (how to do things in a terminal
window, for example) to install it.

For what it's worth, I was also successful in getting emachineshop to run
as well as Google Earth.



--
Frank Stutzman

On 03/08/2013 10:19 PM, Bill wrote:
Doug Winterburn wrote:
On 03/08/2013 09:27 PM, Richard wrote:
On 3/8/2013 9:51 PM, PHT wrote:



This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.

Paul

Which is unfortunately far behind as a consumer product...

What is your latest experience and with linux and what distribution
are you basing this on?

As a "user" rather than a "consumer", I have had a very good
experience with linux for the last 18 years.

Can you run SketchUp on it?


One way to have the best of both Windows and Linux is to install vmware
player on windows and install linux as a virtual machine. This works
well with the large amounts of RAM and drive space on newer machines and
linux as a vm will perform almost as well as running natively. You can
do the same in reverse by running linux natively with windows as a a vm.



--
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure,the creed of ignorance, and the
gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery"
-Winston Churchill

This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.

Paul

Which is unfortunately far behind as a consumer product...

What is your latest experience and with linux and what distribution are
you basing this on?

As a "user" rather than a "consumer", I have had a very good experience
with linux for the last 18 years.


I use Opensuse. I have been using Suse for something like 20 years. I have
have never had problems that I have seen about Windows. Linux does
have a program that will run Windows programs.

Paul

"PHT" wrote in message ...

On Fri, 08 Mar 2013 19:10:54 -0800, Gramp's shop wrote:

Brought home a new laptop today with Windows 8 installed. First
impression: they let a few nutjobs take over the design of this OS when
the A-team was out to lunch. Nothing is intuitive. Simple things, like
moving a file from one folder to another, require one to use Explorer.
Even "my computer" no longer resides on the desktop. There are two
interfaces -- the tiles version and one that kinda mimics the familiar
XP version. The former is loaded with a lot of junk.

It's going to take me hours to get this machine set up -- hours that I
could spend more enjoyably in the shop.

BTW, this is being written on my old machine, which needs to be returned
to my employer come retirement date (May 3).

Larry


This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.
================================================== =================
Here that all the time. Go Linux. Go Mac. Compatibility is a problem. Stick
with Windows if you need to communicate with most of the world.

On 3/9/2013 12:05 AM, CW wrote:


"PHT" wrote in message ...

On Fri, 08 Mar 2013 19:10:54 -0800, Gramp's shop wrote:

Brought home a new laptop today with Windows 8 installed. First
impression: they let a few nutjobs take over the design of this OS when
the A-team was out to lunch. Nothing is intuitive. Simple things, like
moving a file from one folder to another, require one to use Explorer.
Even "my computer" no longer resides on the desktop. There are two
interfaces -- the tiles version and one that kinda mimics the familiar
XP version. The former is loaded with a lot of junk.

It's going to take me hours to get this machine set up -- hours that I
could spend more enjoyably in the shop.

BTW, this is being written on my old machine, which needs to be returned
to my employer come retirement date (May 3).

Larry


This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.
================================================== =================
Here that all the time. Go Linux. Go Mac. Compatibility is a problem.
Stick with Windows if you need to communicate with most of the world.


The good, the bad, and some ugly...
http://www.winehq.org/docs/wineusr-g...nfig-wine-main

I think it has come a long way, but still required considerable
knowledge and patience to install and run.

Maybe some day?

On Fri, 08 Mar 2013 22:05:23 -0800, CW wrote:

Compatibility is a problem. Stick
with Windows if you need to communicate with most of the world.

And on what do you base that? I have no problem with email, news groups,
Web sites, Office documents, spreadsheets, databases, or presentations.

I could see your problem if you're mainly a CAD user. While several free
CAD programs are available for Linux, none of them, IMNSHO, are as good
as TurboCad. I drop into Windows XP for that. But if I wasn't so lazy,
I'd install WINE (Windows emulator) and run TurboCad in Linux

--
When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and
carrying a cross.

PHT wrote:

This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.

Not for everyone .... AAMOF, no longer even for one of the most famous
famous Linux users, proponents, and programmers alive, Miguel de Icaza.

LMAO when I read this last week:

http://tirania.org/blog/archive/2013/Mar-05.html


--
www.ewoodshop.com (Mobile)

On 3/9/2013 7:29 AM, Swingman wrote:
wrote:

This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.

Not for everyone .... AAMOF, no longer even for one of the most famous
famous Linux users, proponents, and programmers alive, Miguel de Icaza.

LMAO when I read this last week:

http://tirania.org/blog/archive/2013/Mar-05.html


Oh man! But yes, that's exactly how I feel about it too.

In article ,
PHT wrote:
On Fri, 08 Mar 2013 19:10:54 -0800, Gramp's shop wrote:

Brought home a new laptop today with Windows 8 installed. First
impression: they let a few nutjobs take over the design of this OS when
the A-team was out to lunch. Nothing is intuitive. Simple things, like
moving a file from one folder to another, require one to use Explorer.
Even "my computer" no longer resides on the desktop. There are two
interfaces -- the tiles version and one that kinda mimics the familiar
XP version. The former is loaded with a lot of junk.

It's going to take me hours to get this machine set up -- hours that I
could spend more enjoyably in the shop.

BTW, this is being written on my old machine, which needs to be returned
to my employer come retirement date (May 3).

Larry


This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.

Paul


Phooey on the new Gnome shell, Unity, and the other alleged "improvements"
to linux desktops, too.
--
When the game is over, the pawn and the king are returned to the same box.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar.org

On 03/09/2013 11:02 AM, Larry W wrote:
In article ,
PHT wrote:
On Fri, 08 Mar 2013 19:10:54 -0800, Gramp's shop wrote:

Brought home a new laptop today with Windows 8 installed. First
impression: they let a few nutjobs take over the design of this OS when
the A-team was out to lunch. Nothing is intuitive. Simple things, like
moving a file from one folder to another, require one to use Explorer.
Even "my computer" no longer resides on the desktop. There are two
interfaces -- the tiles version and one that kinda mimics the familiar
XP version. The former is loaded with a lot of junk.

It's going to take me hours to get this machine set up -- hours that I
could spend more enjoyably in the shop.

BTW, this is being written on my old machine, which needs to be returned
to my employer come retirement date (May 3).

Larry


This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.

Paul


Phooey on the new Gnome shell, Unity, and the other alleged "improvements"
to linux desktops, too.


If you don't like those desktops, take a look through this:

http://www.nixtutor.com/ubuntu/20-ubuntu-derivatives-you-should-know-about/


--
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure,the creed of ignorance, and the
gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery"
-Winston Churchill

In article om,
Doug Winterburn wrote:
On 03/09/2013, some people rote:

This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.

Paul


Phooey on the new Gnome shell, Unity, and the other alleged "improvements"
to linux desktops, too.


If you don't like those desktops, take a look through this:

http://www.nixtutor.com/ubuntu/20-ubuntu-derivatives-you-should-know-about/


Thanks, I've used XFCE in the past and I'm inclined to switch to Mint
when support for lucid ends this year.



--
Often wrong, never in doubt.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org

On Sat, 09 Mar 2013 03:51:21 +0000, PHT wrote:

This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.

Windows 8 is aimed at the hand-held market, not the desktop. MS has
apparently decided that's a dying market. Ubuntu, the most popular Linux
distribution, has decided to go the same way. That may also include Mint
and Kubuntu, which are Ubuntu derivatives, but I don't have that info.

I'm still running Ubuntu 10.04 LTS (April 2010 Long Term Support) and
will for a while. But I've already started looking for an alternative.
I may even skip Linux entirely and go with BSD (Berkeley Unix) - or maybe
back to Slackware which is what I started Linux with long ago.

It's also possible to run Ubuntu (or any other release) with one of many
window managers, each of which has a different look and feel. But that
may be more than a newbie is willing to handle.

--
When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and
carrying a cross.

PHT wrote:
On Fri, 08 Mar 2013 19:10:54 -0800, Gramp's shop wrote:

Brought home a new laptop today with Windows 8 installed. First
impression: they let a few nutjobs take over the design of this OS
when the A-team was out to lunch. Nothing is intuitive. Simple
things, like moving a file from one folder to another, require one
to use Explorer. Even "my computer" no longer resides on the
desktop. There are two interfaces -- the tiles version and one that
kinda mimics the familiar XP version. The former is loaded with a
lot of junk.

It's going to take me hours to get this machine set up -- hours that
I could spend more enjoyably in the shop.

BTW, this is being written on my old machine, which needs to be
returned to my employer come retirement date (May 3).

Larry


This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.


Right. Get a knock-off of a 40-year old operating system designed by a
money-losing division of your local telephone company.

Linux commands less than TWO PERCENT (1.2%) of the desktop operating
systems. The remainder of desktop users have chosen to vote with their
wallet by choosing some version of Windows, Apple, or "Other."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_s...rating_systems

On 03/10/2013 03:53 AM, HeyBub wrote:
PHT wrote:
On Fri, 08 Mar 2013 19:10:54 -0800, Gramp's shop wrote:

Brought home a new laptop today with Windows 8 installed. First
impression: they let a few nutjobs take over the design of this OS
when the A-team was out to lunch. Nothing is intuitive. Simple
things, like moving a file from one folder to another, require one
to use Explorer. Even "my computer" no longer resides on the
desktop. There are two interfaces -- the tiles version and one that
kinda mimics the familiar XP version. The former is loaded with a
lot of junk.

It's going to take me hours to get this machine set up -- hours that
I could spend more enjoyably in the shop.

BTW, this is being written on my old machine, which needs to be
returned to my employer come retirement date (May 3).

Larry


This sounds like a very good time to dump the windows OS and install
Linux. A far better OS.


Right. Get a knock-off of a 40-year old operating system designed by a
money-losing division of your local telephone company.

Right. That's why I don't fly in these knock-offs of a 110 year old
design by two guys who worked in a bicycle shop.


Linux commands less than TWO PERCENT (1.2%) of the desktop operating
systems. The remainder of desktop users have chosen to vote with their
wallet by choosing some version of Windows, Apple, or "Other."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_s...rating_systems




--
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure,the creed of ignorance, and the
gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery"
-Winston Churchill

On 3/10/2013 8:26 AM, Doug Winterburn wrote:

Right. That's why I don't fly in these knock-offs of a 110 year old
design by two guys who worked in a bicycle shop.

Well said ...

The ONLY smart way to decide upon an OS is to chose the software that
does the job you need done, then chose the OS that runs it best.

Denigrating other folks choice in an operating system is the
unmistakable sign of an ignorant fool.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://plus.google.com/114902129577517371552/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On Sun, 10 Mar 2013 05:53:30 -0500, "HeyBub"
wrote:




Right. Get a knock-off of a 40-year old operating system designed by a
money-losing division of your local telephone company.

Linux commands less than TWO PERCENT (1.2%) of the desktop operating
systems. The remainder of desktop users have chosen to vote with their
wallet by choosing some version of Windows, Apple, or "Other."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_s...rating_systems


Linux users remind me of a religious cult.

On 03/10/2013 06:41 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On Sun, 10 Mar 2013 05:53:30 -0500, "HeyBub"
wrote:




Right. Get a knock-off of a 40-year old operating system designed by a
money-losing division of your local telephone company.

Linux commands less than TWO PERCENT (1.2%) of the desktop operating
systems. The remainder of desktop users have chosen to vote with their
wallet by choosing some version of Windows, Apple, or "Other."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_s...rating_systems


Linux users remind me of a religious cult.


Windows users remind me of Democrats.


--
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure,the creed of ignorance, and the
gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery"
-Winston Churchill

On 3/10/2013 8:55 AM, Doug Winterburn wrote:
Windows users remind me of Democrats.

Damn, what a low blow, Bubba!!



--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://plus.google.com/114902129577517371552/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On Sun, 10 Mar 2013 06:55:14 -0700, Doug Winterburn
Windows users remind me of Democrats.

Oh ouch, that hurts. You're just plain *mean*!

On 3/10/2013 8:55 AM, Doug Winterburn wrote:
On 03/10/2013 06:41 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On Sun, 10 Mar 2013 05:53:30 -0500, "HeyBub"
wrote:




Right. Get a knock-off of a 40-year old operating system designed by a
money-losing division of your local telephone company.

Linux commands less than TWO PERCENT (1.2%) of the desktop operating
systems. The remainder of desktop users have chosen to vote with their
wallet by choosing some version of Windows, Apple, or "Other."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_s...rating_systems


Linux users remind me of a religious cult.


Windows users remind me of Democrats.




As I said a while back, we all use the slurs we misunderstand best...

On Sun, 10 Mar 2013 05:53:30 -0500, HeyBub wrote:

Linux commands less than TWO PERCENT (1.2%) of the desktop operating
systems. The remainder of desktop users have chosen to vote with their
wallet by choosing some version of Windows, Apple, or "Other."

I wonder what "other" is?

Linux will always have a small share. It doesn't force hardware sellers
into exclusive agreements, it doesn't advertise except by word of mouth,
and it requires a user to have a bit more computer savvy than MS or Apple
systems.

And, to be fair, it is lacking in some areas, like CAD and high end games.

--
When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and
carrying a cross.

Gramp's shop wrote:
Brought home a new laptop today with Windows 8 installed. First impression: they let a few nutjobs take over the design of this OS when the A-team was out to lunch. Nothing is intuitive. Simple things, like moving a file from one folder to another, require one to use Explorer. Even "my computer" no longer resides on the desktop. There are two interfaces -- the tiles version and one that kinda mimics the familiar XP version. The former is loaded with a lot of junk.

It's going to take me hours to get this machine set up -- hours that I could spend more enjoyably in the shop.

BTW, this is being written on my old machine, which needs to be returned to my employer come retirement date (May 3).

Larry

I appreciate your sharing your experience as I have been looking at
laptops. Windows7 is superior to the new one, huh? Does yours have a
touch screen?

Bill

I have a friend that is the head IT engineer for a school system
here. We get together and test out bourbons and smoke cigars and
talk things over in general.

He assured me at our last outing that I needed to buy myself a copy of
Windows 7 and put it aside for later use. He snarled and bristled for
a half hour about all the things that were wrong with Win 8, and
assured me it was as bad as the change to Vista from XP, and probably
even worse.

According to his opinion, 8 was designed to be compatible with the
Windows Phone and its upcoming OS, not for desktops or laptops.

Yet another misfire from the good folks at Microsoft.

Robert

" wrote:
I have a friend that is the head IT engineer for a school system
here. We get together and test out bourbons and smoke cigars and
talk things over in general.

He assured me at our last outing that I needed to buy myself a copy of
Windows 7 and put it aside for later use. He snarled and bristled for
a half hour about all the things that were wrong with Win 8, and
assured me it was as bad as the change to Vista from XP, and probably
even worse.

According to his opinion, 8 was designed to be compatible with the
Windows Phone and its upcoming OS, not for desktops or laptops.

Yet another misfire from the good folks at Microsoft.

Gotta disagree on this one ... IT folks are the most change resistant bunch
on the planet, bar none, and have to be dragged kicking and screaming to
anything new that upsets their current technical infrastructure.

I'm willing to bet with anyone that the next decade sees more "Win8 type"
UI in Enterprise computing than most can currently imagine. Might not be a
MSFT OS, but it will certainly be a similar iteration GUI, and it will not
be readily accepted by IT, just as tablets and iPhones were not welcomed by
IT just three years ago.

But, and it's a big but ... We gotta go through the FUD cycle first, just
as was done with Vista's UAC component, which caused most of the teeth
gnashing.

--
www.ewoodshop.com (Mobile)

On Fri, 8 Mar 2013 21:34:51 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

I have a friend that is the head IT engineer for a school system
here. We get together and test out bourbons and smoke cigars and
talk things over in general.

He assured me at our last outing that I needed to buy myself a copy of
Windows 7 and put it aside for later use. He snarled and bristled for
a half hour about all the things that were wrong with Win 8, and
assured me it was as bad as the change to Vista from XP, and probably
even worse.

According to his opinion, 8 was designed to be compatible with the
Windows Phone and its upcoming OS, not for desktops or laptops.

Yet another misfire from the good folks at Microsoft.

Robert

Wonder what SP1 of 8 will address, or will they continue make a IBM
like decisions when the PC emerged?

Bill ...

I bought a Lenovo with 4gb ram and a 500gb HD. $350 from Best Buy. No touch screen. Like the computer but (H)8 Windows 8.

Lrry

Gramp's shop wrote:
Bill ...

I bought a Lenovo with 4gb ram and a 500gb HD. $350 from Best Buy. No touch screen. Like the computer but (H)8 Windows 8.

Lrry
It sounds like you did real well! I was mainly looking for something to
attach to a big screen tv, so I have been looking at those with HD,
1080P (1920x1080)--matching the TV. Most (all?) of the candidates seem
to have "4000HD" (integrated) graphics. Has anyone tried streaming video
from web pages this way with success in the way of video quality? I
have a hunch it will be hit and miss. I doubt Roy Underhill's show is
recorded (at PBS) in HD, for instance, but I'm assuming a laptop as
described would give the best possible configuration. I'll be sure to
try to avoid Windows8until I hear kinder words said about it! I was
mildly enthusiastic aboutthe touchscreen concept, but now I think I'll
sit on thesideline and hear more what those on the front line have to
report.

Bill

On Sat, 09 Mar 2013 01:26:22 -0500, Bill
It sounds like you did real well! I was mainly looking for something to
attach to a big screen tv, so I have been looking at those with HD,
1080P (1920x1080)--matching the TV.

http://www.amazon.com/High-Quality-B...ds=hdmi+to+usb

Dave wrote:
On Sat, 09 Mar 2013 01:26:22 -0500, Bill
It sounds like you did real well! I was mainly looking for something to
attach to a big screen tv, so I have been looking at those with HD,
1080P (1920x1080)--matching the TV.
http://www.amazon.com/High-Quality-B...ds=hdmi+to+usb

Thank you. I have this one on my Amazon "wish list":
http://www.amazon.com/AmazonBasics-H...I289UCEVO10GOX

Bill wrote:
Gramp's shop wrote:
Bill ...

I bought a Lenovo with 4gb ram and a 500gb HD. $350 from Best Buy. No
touch screen. Like the computer but (H)8 Windows 8.

Lrry
It sounds like you did real well! I was mainly looking for something to
attach to a big screen tv, so I have been looking at those with HD, 1080P
(1920x1080)--matching the TV. Most (all?) of the candidates seem to have
"4000HD" (integrated) graphics. Has anyone tried streaming video from web
pages this way with success in the way of video quality? I have a hunch
it will be hit and miss. I doubt Roy Underhill's show is recorded (at
PBS) in HD, for instance, but I'm assuming a laptop as described would
give the best possible configuration. I'll be sure to try to avoid
Windows8until I hear kinder words said about it! I was mildly
enthusiastic aboutthe touchscreen concept, but now I think I'll sit on
thesideline and hear more what those on the front line have to report.

Bill

Don't believe all the naysayers about the underlying OS itself, as
technically it is one of MSFT's best operating systems yet, very resource
efficient, fast and relatively more secure than any MSFT consumer OS to
date (notice the word "relatively", no such thing as a totally secure OS,
just one that hasn't been targeted).

It is the GUI that throws everyone, and that can be infuriating because it
is such a drastic sea change and humans simply don't like change. I'm not a
big fan of the Win8 GUI myself, but having run it on a seven year old
laptop since it came out I find myself getting used to it, and appreciating
most parts of it.

Short story - because you are human you will NOT like it at first because
of the GUI, but you will like the benefits of the underlying technical
aspects, so try it for an extended period and see if the angst doesn't
become more tempered than not ... and do keep in mind it is a first
iteration, and you do have the option to use the classic desktop.

And yes, it does run Sketchup, handily.

As far as your media center:

Get a Raspberry Pi for $40 and load up xbmc:

http://lifehacker.com/5929913/build-...5-raspberry-pi

--
www.ewoodshop.com (Mobile)

On 3/9/2013 8:29 AM, Swingman wrote:
Bill wrote:
Gramp's shop wrote:
Bill ...

I bought a Lenovo with 4gb ram and a 500gb HD. $350 from Best Buy. No
touch screen. Like the computer but (H)8 Windows 8.

Lrry
It sounds like you did real well! I was mainly looking for something to
attach to a big screen tv, so I have been looking at those with HD, 1080P
(1920x1080)--matching the TV. Most (all?) of the candidates seem to have
"4000HD" (integrated) graphics. Has anyone tried streaming video from web
pages this way with success in the way of video quality? I have a hunch
it will be hit and miss. I doubt Roy Underhill's show is recorded (at
PBS) in HD, for instance, but I'm assuming a laptop as described would
give the best possible configuration. I'll be sure to try to avoid
Windows8until I hear kinder words said about it! I was mildly
enthusiastic aboutthe touchscreen concept, but now I think I'll sit on
thesideline and hear more what those on the front line have to report.

Bill

Don't believe all the naysayers about the underlying OS itself, as
technically it is one of MSFT's best operating systems yet, very resource
efficient, fast and relatively more secure than any MSFT consumer OS to
date (notice the word "relatively", no such thing as a totally secure OS,
just one that hasn't been targeted).

It is the GUI that throws everyone, and that can be infuriating because it
is such a drastic sea change and humans simply don't like change. I'm not a
big fan of the Win8 GUI myself, but having run it on a seven year old
laptop since it came out I find myself getting used to it, and appreciating
most parts of it.

Short story - because you are human you will NOT like it at first because
of the GUI, but you will like the benefits of the underlying technical
aspects, so try it for an extended period and see if the angst doesn't
become more tempered than not ... and do keep in mind it is a first
iteration, and you do have the option to use the classic desktop.

And yes, it does run Sketchup, handily.

As far as your media center:

Get a Raspberry Pi for $40 and load up xbmc:

http://lifehacker.com/5929913/build-...5-raspberry-pi



My objection is to the touch interface. On anything of any size, the
motion of the hands and fingers on the touch screen will create a whole
new set of syndroms. The act of hold your arms outward for any lenght
of time is going to create stress in the upper arm shoulder areas. To
move the to the exteme for the point imaging use 70" screen with a touch
screen.

"Any size" is any thing that one would use for spreadsheets, accounting,
word processing, or presentation programs. Serious user will not be
running these programs on a 4X6 screen.

For those people alread with movement problems, the extra arm movement
will be impossible.

Personnally my screen has not icons. All of my programs are accessed
from the tool bar at the bottom of the screen.

The screen is for my photographs that I use as wall paper. I don't like
the idea of having the screen covered with large icons that prevent
seeing the background.

On 3/9/2013 1:26 AM, Bill wrote:
Gramp's shop wrote:
Bill ...

I bought a Lenovo with 4gb ram and a 500gb HD. $350 from Best Buy. No
touch screen. Like the computer but (H)8 Windows 8.

Lrry
It sounds like you did real well! I was mainly looking for something to
attach to a big screen tv, so I have been looking at those with HD,
1080P (1920x1080)--matching the TV. Most (all?) of the candidates seem
to have "4000HD" (integrated) graphics. Has anyone tried streaming video
from web pages this way with success in the way of video quality? I
have a hunch it will be hit and miss. I doubt Roy Underhill's show is
recorded (at PBS) in HD, for instance, but I'm assuming a laptop as
described would give the best possible configuration. I'll be sure to
try to avoid Windows8until I hear kinder words said about it! I was
mildly enthusiastic aboutthe touchscreen concept, but now I think I'll
sit on thesideline and hear more what those on the front line have to
report.

Bill
There aren't that many touch screens around Bill, not for laptops or
desktops. They are mostly tablets... so win8 is a miss.

As far as what Swingy said, really when you work at a screen all day and
need to do what I do, you need a keyboard. Touching a screen to type is
just ridiculous. putting your fingers where you need to view too.

I'm not against the tablet for many worker types. But they are not for
every type of worker.

--
Jeff

On 3/9/2013 4:51 PM, woodchucker wrote:
On 3/9/2013 1:26 AM, Bill wrote:
Gramp's shop wrote:
Bill ...

I bought a Lenovo with 4gb ram and a 500gb HD. $350 from Best Buy. No
touch screen. Like the computer but (H)8 Windows 8.

Lrry
It sounds like you did real well! I was mainly looking for something to
attach to a big screen tv, so I have been looking at those with HD,
1080P (1920x1080)--matching the TV. Most (all?) of the candidates seem
to have "4000HD" (integrated) graphics. Has anyone tried streaming video
from web pages this way with success in the way of video quality? I
have a hunch it will be hit and miss. I doubt Roy Underhill's show is
recorded (at PBS) in HD, for instance, but I'm assuming a laptop as
described would give the best possible configuration. I'll be sure to
try to avoid Windows8until I hear kinder words said about it! I was
mildly enthusiastic aboutthe touchscreen concept, but now I think I'll
sit on thesideline and hear more what those on the front line have to
report.

Bill
There aren't that many touch screens around Bill, not for laptops or
desktops. They are mostly tablets... so win8 is a miss.

As far as what Swingy said, really when you work at a screen all day and
need to do what I do, you need a keyboard. Touching a screen to type is
just ridiculous. putting your fingers where you need to view too.

I'm not against the tablet for many worker types. But they are not for
every type of worker.



My question has always been - why just one product for all markets?
Microsoft is big enough to support more than one, IMHO.

Why foist a touch screen GUI off on desktops?

On Fri, 08 Mar 2013 23:21:04 -0500, Bill
wrote:



I appreciate your sharing your experience as I have been looking at
laptops. Windows7 is superior to the new one, huh? Does yours have a
touch screen?

Bill

The only reason to buy W8 is if you have a touch screen. Right now
your best bet is to find a unit sitting on the shelf with W7. I got
an email from Acer yesterday and they still have a couple to sell in
their clearance page.

On 3/8/2013 10:10 PM, Gramp's shop wrote:
Brought home a new laptop today with Windows 8 installed. First impression: they let a few nutjobs take over the design of this OS when the A-team was out to lunch. Nothing is intuitive. Simple things, like moving a file from one folder to another, require one to use Explorer. Even "my computer" no longer resides on the desktop. There are two interfaces -- the tiles version and one that kinda mimics the familiar XP version. The former is loaded with a lot of junk.

It's going to take me hours to get this machine set up -- hours that I could spend more enjoyably in the shop.

BTW, this is being written on my old machine, which needs to be returned to my employer come retirement date (May 3).

Download and install this, bring back the start menu and more, many ways
to tweak it to your liking.

--
Froz...


The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.