I am re-finishing a walnut table. The top coat was originally lacquer
and had been badly damaged.

It was stripped and then I wiped it with mineral spirits. It looked
great - no lacquer residue. The surface was obviously dyed with
something like golden oak and the filled with a grain filler. I did a
light sanding and sprayed a light coat of satin varnish on it. The
table appears very dull with very muted color.

I am hesitant to put on more varnish to find out if the color will
come back up. One thought is to first apply a walnut gel stain to
enhance the color and follow that with a coat of dewaxed shellac.
After that, go back to a couple of coats of varnish again.

Can I apply the gel stain over the varnish?
Is it advisable or will added coats of the varnish alone bring up the
color?
Any other thoughts on the subject??

Thanks,
Len

On Apr 18, 2:18*pm, " wrote:
I am re-finishing a walnut table. *The top coat was originally lacquer
and had been badly damaged.

It was stripped and then I *wiped it with mineral spirits. *It looked
great - no lacquer residue. *The surface was obviously dyed with
something like golden oak and the filled with a grain filler. *I did a
light sanding and sprayed a light coat of satin varnish on it. *The
table appears very dull with very muted color.

I am hesitant to put on more varnish to find out if the color will
come back up. *One thought is to first apply a walnut gel stain to
enhance the color and follow that with a coat of dewaxed shellac.
After that, go back to a couple of coats of varnish again.

Can I apply the gel stain over the varnish?
Is it advisable or will added coats of the *varnish alone bring up the
color?
Any other thoughts on the subject??

Thanks,
Len

Wetting the surface does not change the color at all.

Len

On Apr 18, 3:18*pm, " wrote:
I am re-finishing a walnut table. *The top coat was originally lacquer
and had been badly damaged.

It was stripped and then I *wiped it with mineral spirits. *It looked
great - no lacquer residue. *The surface was obviously dyed with
something like golden oak and the filled with a grain filler. *I did a
light sanding and sprayed a light coat of satin varnish on it. *The
table appears very dull with very muted color.

I am hesitant to put on more varnish to find out if the color will
come back up. *One thought is to first apply a walnut gel stain to
enhance the color and follow that with a coat of dewaxed shellac.
After that, go back to a couple of coats of varnish again.

Can I apply the gel stain over the varnish?
Is it advisable or will added coats of the *varnish alone bring up the
color?
Any other thoughts on the subject??

Thanks,
Len

What brand varnish? Poly?

On Apr 18, 7:30*pm, Father Haskell wrote:
On Apr 18, 3:18*pm, " wrote:



I am re-finishing a walnut table. *The top coat was originally lacquer
and had been badly damaged.

It was stripped and then I *wiped it with mineral spirits. *It looked
great - no lacquer residue. *The surface was obviously dyed with
something like golden oak and the filled with a grain filler. *I did a
light sanding and sprayed a light coat of satin varnish on it. *The
table appears very dull with very muted color.

I am hesitant to put on more varnish to find out if the color will
come back up. *One thought is to first apply a walnut gel stain to
enhance the color and follow that with a coat of dewaxed shellac.
After that, go back to a couple of coats of varnish again.

Can I apply the gel stain over the varnish?
Is it advisable or will added coats of the *varnish alone bring up the
color?
Any other thoughts on the subject??

Thanks,
Len

What brand varnish? *Poly?

General Finishes satin water based top coat (acrylic resin). The only
oil based varnish that I can find contains toluene. I won't spray
that due to its carcinogenic capabilities.

Len

On Apr 18, 2:18*pm, " wrote:

I am re-finishing a walnut table. *The top coat was originally lacquer
and had been badly damaged.

It was stripped and then I *wiped it with mineral spirits. *It looked
great - no lacquer residue. *

Mineral spirits is the wrong cleaner to use as your final step when
removing a lacquer finish. Lacquer thinner is your choice. You most
likely left lacquer (a thin coat of residue) on top of your project.


The surface was obviously dyed with
something like golden oak and the filled with a grain filler. *

Someone died walnut? Were they trying to brown it out with that awful
color?

If you stripped and didn't brush/scrub the finish to get out the pore
filler, you will need to start over. The filler will be wedged into
the pores of the wood, and secured in place by finish. Careful putty
knife work won't do it. Nor will good sanding unless you want to take
off about 3 mil. Restrip and scrub off the finish.

Additionally, the pore filler would almost certainly explain the poor
finish. Remaining artifacts of the finish in the pores that won't come
out with rags will leach into your finish and contaminate it.

I did a
light sanding and sprayed a light coat of satin varnish on it. *The
table appears very dull with very muted color.

I am hesitant to put on more varnish to find out if the color will
come back up. *

Adding another coat of finish will not enhance your color nor will it
clarify your finish. You can adjust the sheen to a more even
appearance, but the color and clarity are set with the first coat.
More finish simply obscures the actual wood and coloring.

One thought is to first apply a walnut gel stain to
enhance the color and follow that with a coat of dewaxed shellac.
After that, go back to a couple of coats of varnish again.

Learning refinishing can be painful. To correct a finish, you don't
keep piling on more "cures". All it does is make things worse. I am
still scratching my head over the fact that someone stained walnut
with golden oak. Now you are saying that you might want to put on
another coat of walnut (what was wrong with the unstained walnut that
made you stain it?) then another primer to cover all that up, then two
more coats of another finish.

Can I apply the gel stain over the varnish?
Is it advisable or will added coats of the *varnish alone bring up the
color?
Any other thoughts on the subject??

None of that will work.

In these situations (which I have put myself in before) it is best to
bite down hard, and strip and start over again, doing all the steps
correctly.

YMMV.

Robert

On 4/19/2010 2:28 PM, dadiOH wrote:
wrote:

The table had been DYED with a golden
colored dye and then filled with walnut
colored pore filler. To my knowledge, that is the usual
manner of treating a dark walnut table.

I'm not in the biz but I've made numerous things of walnut. Never dyed or
stained except sap wood if I wanted it dark. In my 76 years I don't recall
ever seing *anything* of walnut that had been. Are you sure the "golden
dye" isn't just sap wood? Are you sure it is walnut and not "white walnut"
(butternut)?

I haven't done all that much work in walnut and I've never stained any of it
(nor do I think I'd be so inclined...) but it's my understanding that it's not
all that uncommon for walnut to be stained because it tends to look rather gray
and drab with simple clear finishes (particularly the water-based varieties,
which tend to be _crystal_ clear). What's always worked well for me is a few
good healthy coats of garnet shellac; that really gives walnut a deep rich color.

--
See Nad. See Nad go. Go Nad!
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

Same subject, different project.

The current NYW rerun has Norm building a walnut drop leaf table.

When it comes time to finish, Norm brings in a refinishing expect
from Georgia who offers the following schedule:

Wipe on BLO cut with mineral spirits.

Allow to absorb then wipe off excess.

Allow to cure for a couple of days.

Apply a couple of seal coats of orange shellac allowing at least
24 hours between coats.

Apply 10-12 additional coats of full strength orange shellac,
again allowing at least 24 hours between coats.

Rub out with 0000 steel wool, then apply wax and buff out.

Seems simple enough and finished table sure looked pretty.

Notice that any imperfections that might happen during shellac
application were basically ignored until it was 0000 time.

Lew