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#1
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LP Air in the shop
Looking for ideas on how to distribute LP air in my shop.
My shop is 18' X 22' and I have a stair case in the back corner, under which my compressor sits. Right now, I have a rubber hose running through the ceiling with just one outlet at a hose reel in the front of the shop. I would like to have the hose reel and a fixed outlet at the front of the shop, a hose drop in the ceiling in the middle and a outlet at the back. Maybe to elaborate for a small shop but things that make my work easier are a bonus. I have looked at the Rapid Air System, seems a bit pricey at $139.99 for 100ft of hose, a compressor manifold and 2 outlets. I was also looking at building my own black pipe system that would give me the 3 outlets and the hose reel for less money and more labor. Any ideas? Neil Larson Crystal Lake, IL |
#2
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LP Air in the shop
Any ideas?
What type of air do you need to transport? Low volume where a small tube is okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed? If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release fittings all over. Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don't need a tube too so you could make everything quick release. Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 01.908.542.0244 Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com V8013-R |
#3
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LP Air in the shop
On Fri, 6 Mar 2009 14:51:05 -0500, "Joe AutoDrill"
wrote: Any ideas? What type of air do you need to transport? Low volume where a small tube is okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed? If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release fittings all over. Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don't need a tube too so you could make everything quick release. Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 01.908.542.0244 Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com V8013-R Half inch heavy-wall copper water pipe.(type K) run with 1 inch drop in 12 feet, with a "T" pointing down where-ever you want an air outlet. On each drop install another "T" to bring the line out, with a "stub" on the bottom. Put a drain valve on the "stub" to drain out any condensation that gets trapped there. I'm using a braided steel flex hose to connect from the compressor to the wall-mounted line, but you could use a short chunk of air hose. |
#4
Posted to rec.woodworking
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LP Air in the shop
wrote in message
... On Fri, 6 Mar 2009 14:51:05 -0500, "Joe AutoDrill" wrote: Any ideas? What type of air do you need to transport? Low volume where a small tube is okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed? If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release fittings all over. Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don't need a tube too so you could make everything quick release. Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 01.908.542.0244 Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com V8013-R Half inch heavy-wall copper water pipe.(type K) run with 1 inch drop in 12 feet, with a "T" pointing down where-ever you want an air outlet. On each drop install another "T" to bring the line out, with a "stub" on the bottom. Put a drain valve on the "stub" to drain out any condensation that gets trapped there. I'm using a braided steel flex hose to connect from the compressor to the wall-mounted line, but you could use a short chunk of air hose. "M" Copper is fine, unless you are running some ridiculous pressure. http://www.copper.org/Applications/p...h_table3c.html Greg |
#5
Posted to rec.woodworking
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LP Air in the shop
"Joe AutoDrill" wrote in message ... Any ideas? What type of air do you need to transport? Low volume where a small tube is okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed? If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release fittings all over. Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don't need a tube too so you could make everything quick release. Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 01.908.542.0244 Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com V8013-R If this is ordinary compressed air like 80-100 psi. NEVER use plasitc pipe. Proper compressed air rated plastic tubing may be OK but plastic water pipe style can explode without warning. John G. |
#6
Posted to rec.woodworking
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LP Air in the shop
Not that it really matters right now, it seems however I read the
table that M is OK for my 110# system, but I can't really understand the table. I don't get the column headings S=4900 psi 200F means what? On Mar 6, 3:19*pm, "Greg O" wrote: wrote in message ... On Fri, 6 Mar 2009 14:51:05 -0500, "Joe AutoDrill" wrote: Any ideas? What type of air do you need to transport? *Low volume where a small tube is okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed? If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release fittings all over. *Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don't need a tube too so you could make everything quick release. Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 01.908.542.0244 Automatic / Pneumatic Drills:http://www.AutoDrill.com Multiple Spindle Drills:http://www.Multi-Drill.com Flagship Site:http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com V8013-R Half inch heavy-wall copper water pipe.(type K) run with 1 inch drop in 12 feet, with a "T" pointing down where-ever you want an air outlet. On each drop install another "T" to bring the line out, with a "stub" on the bottom. Put a drain valve on the "stub" to drain out any condensation that gets trapped there. I'm using a braided steel flex hose to connect from the compressor to the wall-mounted line, but you could use a short chunk of air hose. "M" Copper is fine, unless you are running some ridiculous pressure.http://www.copper.org/Applications/p.../tables/cth_ta... Greg- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - |
#7
Posted to rec.woodworking
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LP Air in the shop
"John G." wrote in message ... "Joe AutoDrill" wrote in message ... Any ideas? What type of air do you need to transport? Low volume where a small tube is okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed? If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release fittings all over. Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don't need a tube too so you could make everything quick release. Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 01.908.542.0244 Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com V8013-R If this is ordinary compressed air like 80-100 psi. NEVER use plastic pipe. Proper compressed air rated plastic tubing may be OK but plastic water pipe style can explode without warning. John G. John I have 1/2 inch HOT water plastic pipe running from garage to basement125 PSI at compressor. Been in service for more than 6 years. Have 3 outlets. One at each end of shop and one outside. no problems so far. WW |
#8
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LP Air in the shop
"WW" wrote in message John I have 1/2 inch HOT water plastic pipe running from garage to basement125 PSI at compressor. Been in service for more than 6 years. Have 3 outlets. One at each end of shop and one outside. no problems so far. WW But that does not mean it won't blow. OSHA does not allow it and the tubing makers don't recommend it. May last another 6 or 16 years, may produce shrapnel next time you pressurize it. |
#9
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LP Air in the shop
On Mar 6, 7:12 pm, "SonomaProducts.com" wrote:
Not that it really matters right now, it seems however I read the table that M is OK for my 110# system, but I can't really understand the table. I don't get the column headings S=4900 psi 200F means what? It's giving the rating vs temperature. -Kevin |
#10
Posted to rec.woodworking
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LP Air in the shop
In article ,
"Ed Pawlowski" wrote: "WW" wrote in message John I have 1/2 inch HOT water plastic pipe running from garage to basement125 PSI at compressor. Been in service for more than 6 years. Have 3 outlets. One at each end of shop and one outside. no problems so far. WW But that does not mean it won't blow. OSHA does not allow it and the tubing makers don't recommend it. May last another 6 or 16 years, may produce shrapnel next time you pressurize it. Agreed; the problem isn't so much that it can't withstand the pressure in general (it can), but that the failure mode when it fails is dangerous. Copper pipe tends to rend itself and split open to release the pressure; plastic (at least PVC) pipe tends to shatter into many shards. For water and such incompressible liquids, these shards don't get any great velocity because the pressure instantly decreases once released; but for compressed air, they are projected quite forcibly and become dangerous shrapnel. Other kinds of plastic piping/tubing may be suitable for compressed air use, such as the kinds they sometimes make air hoses out of. -- Andrew Erickson "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." -- Jim Elliot |
#11
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LP Air in the shop
WW wrote:
.... John I have 1/2 inch HOT water plastic pipe running from garage to basement125 PSI at compressor. Been in service for more than 6 years. ... ... no problems so far. WW The last two words are the key phrase here. For 1/2" the volume isn't large enough to be a huge threat but as others have said, not recommended application. The bigger threat normally isn't just a spontaneous failure but that any impact may produce an explosive fracture instead of just a break. -- |
#12
Posted to rec.woodworking
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LP Air in the shop
On Fri, 6 Mar 2009 17:19:07 -0600, "Greg O"
wrote: wrote in message .. . On Fri, 6 Mar 2009 14:51:05 -0500, "Joe AutoDrill" wrote: Any ideas? What type of air do you need to transport? Low volume where a small tube is okay or higher volume where a 3/8" ID or larger tube is needed? If low volume, I'd simply put some plastic tubing with quick release fittings all over. Plugs are avaialble for the places where you don't need a tube too so you could make everything quick release. Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 01.908.542.0244 Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com V8013-R Half inch heavy-wall copper water pipe.(type K) run with 1 inch drop in 12 feet, with a "T" pointing down where-ever you want an air outlet. On each drop install another "T" to bring the line out, with a "stub" on the bottom. Put a drain valve on the "stub" to drain out any condensation that gets trapped there. I'm using a braided steel flex hose to connect from the compressor to the wall-mounted line, but you could use a short chunk of air hose. "M" Copper is fine, unless you are running some ridiculous pressure. http://www.copper.org/Applications/p...h_table3c.html Greg "M" is borderline for 130PSI shop air. For the small difference in price for 30 feet, I went for the "good stuff". |
#13
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LP Air in the shop
I'm doing the same project in my shop. Apologies for a minor thread
highjack. I managed to score some black iron pipe at an auction for a plumbing shop that was moving out of state. About 60 feet of 1 inch, 20 feet of 3/4 inch and 20 feet of 1/2 inch. Way more than I need, but I got it for $30 (golly, is that my first gloat here?). The problem is that a couple of the chunks are used. I guess for natural gas, but I'm not sure. There is some black corrosion/residue/something that flakes on the inside of them. Any suggestions on how to clean it out? -- Frank Stutzman |
#14
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LP Air in the shop
On Fri, 6 Mar 2009 23:01:30 -0500, "Ed Pawlowski"
wrote: "WW" wrote in message John I have 1/2 inch HOT water plastic pipe running from garage to basement125 PSI at compressor. Been in service for more than 6 years. Have 3 outlets. One at each end of shop and one outside. no problems so far. WW But that does not mean it won't blow. OSHA does not allow it and the tubing makers don't recommend it. May last another 6 or 16 years, may produce shrapnel next time you pressurize it. Just don't strike it when it's cold and pressurized. |
#15
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LP Air in the shop
Frank Stutzman wrote:
.... I managed to score some black iron pipe ... ...a couple of the chunks are used. ... ... There is some black corrosion/residue/something that flakes on the inside of them. Any suggestions on how to clean it out? Once you cut to length, might try a stiff (#10, say) wire thru pulling a brush first. After that, I'd just hook it up and use the air pressure to flush it. If add a screen/filter should be no time before all that's going to come loose is out. -- |
#16
Posted to rec.woodworking
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LP Air in the shop
wrote in message
... Half inch heavy-wall copper water pipe.(type K) run with 1 inch drop in 12 feet, with a "T" pointing down where-ever you want an air outlet. On each drop install another "T" to bring the line out, with a "stub" on the bottom. Put a drain valve on the "stub" to drain out any condensation that gets trapped there. I'm using a braided steel flex hose to connect from the compressor to the wall-mounted line, but you could use a short chunk of air hose. "M" Copper is fine, unless you are running some ridiculous pressure. http://www.copper.org/Applications/p...h_table3c.html Greg "M" is borderline for 130PSI shop air. For the small difference in price for 30 feet, I went for the "good stuff". It depends on the size. I see above 1" was mentioned. M would still be fine. Smaller diameters even better yet. Really 3/4" is more plenty for any home shop. 3/4" will flow well over 20 CFM at reasonable lengths. 1" is way over kill for 99% of us! Greg |
#17
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LP Air in the shop
"Greg O" wrote: Really 3/4" is more plenty for any home shop. 3/4" will flow well over 20 CFM at reasonable lengths. 1" is way over kill for 99% of us! Added storage caqpacity out weighs flow rate for most DIY installations. 2' Black iron with 3/4 side taps bushed as required is hard to beat. BTDT Lew |
#18
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LP Air in the shop
I fit gas pipe for a living. Buy a tank, it is easier and cheaper!
"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message ... "Greg O" wrote: Really 3/4" is more plenty for any home shop. 3/4" will flow well over 20 CFM at reasonable lengths. 1" is way over kill for 99% of us! Added storage caqpacity out weighs flow rate for most DIY installations. 2' Black iron with 3/4 side taps bushed as required is hard to beat. BTDT Lew Threading and assembling 2" black pipe is a pain, nothing I would recommend to any one without experience and a couple high quality 24" pipe wrenches! For the little extra you would gain in capacity you can pick up a tank and add in the system if you feel the need for more capacity. Unless you get the pipe for free I would not consider it, and even then I probably still would go with 3/4"!! Figure the price of fittings in the mix and I think most will agree. 2" black pipe will contain about 375 cubic inches per ten feet or 1.6 gallons. I worked in a CNC machine shop, 20 HP recip compressor, later a 50 HP screw. We had 1-1/4" mains that served us very well. I will post a chart on binaries. It shows pressure drop of various pipe sizes at 100 feet. 1/2" at 100 PSI will flow about 16 CFM. 3/4" at 100 PSI will flow about 32 CFM. Greg |
#19
Posted to rec.woodworking
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LP Air in the shop
On Sat, 7 Mar 2009 14:36:46 -0600, "Greg O"
wrote: wrote in message .. . Half inch heavy-wall copper water pipe.(type K) run with 1 inch drop in 12 feet, with a "T" pointing down where-ever you want an air outlet. On each drop install another "T" to bring the line out, with a "stub" on the bottom. Put a drain valve on the "stub" to drain out any condensation that gets trapped there. I'm using a braided steel flex hose to connect from the compressor to the wall-mounted line, but you could use a short chunk of air hose. "M" Copper is fine, unless you are running some ridiculous pressure. http://www.copper.org/Applications/p...h_table3c.html Greg "M" is borderline for 130PSI shop air. For the small difference in price for 30 feet, I went for the "good stuff". It depends on the size. I see above 1" was mentioned. M would still be fine. Smaller diameters even better yet. Really 3/4" is more plenty for any home shop. 3/4" will flow well over 20 CFM at reasonable lengths. 1" is way over kill for 99% of us! Greg 1/2" is adequate for most - 5/8" for the rest of us. |
#20
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LP Air in the shop
On Mar 6, 1:23*pm, "Neil Larson" wrote:
Looking for ideas on how to distribute LP air in my shop. My shop is 18' X 22' and I have a stair case in the back corner, under which my compressor sits. Right now, I have a rubber hose running through the ceiling with just one outlet at a hose reel in the front of the shop. I would like to have the hose reel and a fixed outlet at the front of the shop, a hose drop in the ceiling in the middle and a outlet at the back. Maybe to elaborate for a small shop but things that make my work easier are a bonus. I have looked at the Rapid Air System, seems a bit pricey at *$139.99 for 100ft of hose, a compressor manifold and 2 outlets. I was also looking at building my own black pipe system that would give me the 3 outlets and the hose reel for less money and more labor. Any ideas? Neil Larson Crystal Lake, IL Not withstanding all the cautionary tales this suggestion might generate herein, we used schedule 40 3/4" PVC to "pipe" the air throughout our shop for years w/o a problem. We had a very large dual- stage compressor inherited from an auto body shop down the road. we ran drops down from the ceiling, tapping them at working height and incorporating drains below each drop after about 6-8 inches of pipe with the petcock at the bottom. We ran air tools and Binks Spray guns. Worked like a charm and much cheaper than iron (read expensive/ rusting) pipe. |
#21
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LP Air in the shop
On Sun, 8 Mar 2009 20:06:29 -0700 (PDT), Hoosierpopi
wrote: Not withstanding all the cautionary tales this suggestion might generate herein, we used schedule 40 3/4" PVC to "pipe" the air throughout our shop for years w/o a problem. ... Not a thing wrong with that as long as you're not subject to OSHA inspection/fines and don't mind assuming a small risk of PVC shrapnel. Tom Veatch Wichita, KS USA |
#22
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LP Air in the shop
If this is ordinary compressed air like 80-100 psi. NEVER use plasitc
pipe. Proper compressed air rated plastic tubing may be OK but plastic water pipe style can explode without warning. Agreed. It better be pneumatic tube and not your cousin's fish tank plastic tube or some PVC drain pipe stuff. -- Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 01.908.542.0244 Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com V8013-R |
#23
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LP Air in the shop
"Hoosierpopi" wrote in message
... Not withstanding all the cautionary tales this suggestion might generate herein, we used schedule 40 3/4" PVC to "pipe" the air throughout our shop for years w/o a problem. We had a very large dual- stage compressor inherited from an auto body shop down the road. we ran drops down from the ceiling, tapping them at working height and incorporating drains below each drop after about 6-8 inches of pipe with the petcock at the bottom. We ran air tools and Binks Spray guns. Worked like a charm and much cheaper than iron (read expensive/ rusting) pipe. Screw the cautionary tales! I think anyone that uses PVC pipe for air lines is crazy! I used it myself in a couple differant shops, but when I saw the result of a failure I ripped it all out! The stuff explodes like a hand grenade when it fails. Run rubber hose, solder copper pipe, thread black pipe, but just say no to PVC!! Greg |
#24
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LP Air in the shop
"Greg O" wrote: Screw the cautionary tales! I think anyone that uses PVC pipe for air lines is crazy! Agreed. Run rubber hose, solder copper pipe, thread black pipe, but just say no to PVC!! Around here, black iron nipples threaded both ends are available up to 6 ft long. No need to thread an air distribution systen, just a little teflon paste and a couple of pipe wrenches.. Pitch the pipe 1/4"/ft with a petcock at the low point and rut is not a problem Lew |
#25
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LP Air in the shop-Correction
"Lew Hodgett" wrote:
Around here, black iron nipples threaded both ends are available up to 6 ft long. Correction: That should read 5 ft long, not 6 ft. Lew |
#26
Posted to rec.woodworking
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LP Air in the shop
Lew Hodgett wrote:
"Greg O" wrote: Screw the cautionary tales! I think anyone that uses PVC pipe for air lines is crazy! Agreed. Run rubber hose, solder copper pipe, thread black pipe, but just say no to PVC!! Around here, black iron nipples threaded both ends are available up to 6 ft long. No need to thread an air distribution systen, just a little teflon paste and a couple of pipe wrenches.. Pitch the pipe 1/4"/ft with a petcock at the low point and rut is not a problem Lew Made me think of my deceased uncle. His saying about hogs was "when they ain't rootin' they're a ruttin". I used black iron iron in my shop, with two outside drops. Learned to use a plastic slip cover on them to keep the little mud wasps from clogging the connectors up. -- Gerald Ross Cochran, GA My favorite mythical creature? The honest politician. |
#27
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LP Air in the shop
"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message ... "Greg O" wrote: Screw the cautionary tales! I think anyone that uses PVC pipe for air lines is crazy! Agreed. Run rubber hose, solder copper pipe, thread black pipe, but just say no to PVC!! Around here, black iron nipples threaded both ends are available up to 6 ft long. No need to thread an air distribution systen, just a little teflon paste and a couple of pipe wrenches.. Pitch the pipe 1/4"/ft with a petcock at the low point and rut is not a problem Lew The local Lowe's carries 10' sections. (Threaded) Max (El Paso) |
#28
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LP Air in the shop
"Max" wrote in
: The local Lowe's carries 10' sections. (Threaded) Max (El Paso) Lowe's is kinda funny, at least around here. If you need sections that add to 10', it's much cheaper to have them cut and thread the 10' pipe rather than buying parts. Puckdropper -- On Usenet, no one can hear you laugh. That's a good thing, though, as some writers are incorrigible. To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm |
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