I have four cabinet doors to make with ash.
I would like to make them with Diamond Points patterns.
I do not know how to make these Diamond points and I am looking for advises.
TIA

wrote in message
...
I have four cabinet doors to make with ash.
I would like to make them with Diamond Points patterns.
I do not know how to make these Diamond points and I am looking for
advises.
TIA


MDJ:

Good to see you. Do you want the pattern to cover the entire door except for
a
frame? Do you want the pattern to be continuous within its field? And,
lastly, do you want the pattern to be cut/routed into the existing doors or
would you be interested in various
kinds of overlays in haute relief? If you have various skills and tools,
much of this
can be done yourself. If not, this is work that can often be done at a
reasonable cost.

Regards,

Edward Hennessey

"Edward Hennessey" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
I have four cabinet doors to make with ash.
I would like to make them with Diamond Points patterns.
I do not know how to make these Diamond points and I am looking for
advises.
TIA


MDJ:

Good to see you. Do you want the pattern to cover the entire door except
for a
frame? Do you want the pattern to be continuous within its field? And,
lastly, do you want the pattern to be cut/routed into the existing doors
or would you be interested in various
kinds of overlays in haute relief? If you have various skills and tools,
much of this
can be done yourself. If not, this is work that can often be done at a
reasonable cost.

Regards,

Edward Hennessey

Thanks for your reply.
Yes, over the years I have acquired all kind of woodworking tools.
About 75% of all the furniture in my house were made by me. Not to mention
my children and grand children.
Thirty five years ago I made an entrainment center with ash to accommodate
the electronics of that time.

Now with the advent of the LCD television and others. I am thinking
re-configuring the old design to suit the new gears. As the old cabinets
were made with solid ash I intend to use every bit of it.

It would be nice if the pattern could but.routed into the existing 3/4"
thick doors.
I am also interested in the overlay technique in haute relief or is this
what is also known as the appliqué technique?
Any feedback will be appreciated

Denis

wrote in message
...

"Edward Hennessey" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
I have four cabinet doors to make with ash.
I would like to make them with Diamond Points patterns.
I do not know how to make these Diamond points and I am looking for
advises.
TIA


MDJ:

Good to see you. Do you want the pattern to cover the entire door except
for a
frame? Do you want the pattern to be continuous within its field? And,
lastly, do you want the pattern to be cut/routed into the existing doors
or would you be interested in various
kinds of overlays in haute relief? If you have various skills and tools,
much of this
can be done yourself. If not, this is work that can often be done at a
reasonable cost.

Regards,

Edward Hennessey


D:

Thanks for your reply.

You're welcome.

Yes, over the years I have acquired all kind of woodworking tools.
About 75% of all the furniture in my house were made by me. Not to
mention my children and grand children.
Thirty five years ago I made an entrainment center with ash to accommodate
the electronics of that time.

Now with the advent of the LCD television and others. I am thinking
re-configuring the old design to suit the new gears. As the old cabinets
were made with solid ash I intend to use every bit of it.

It would be nice if the pattern could but.routed into the existing 3/4"
thick doors.

Doable. Routing would offer you the choice of different bits for different
groove profiles. A hand router with a guiding jig would work. If you can
indicate
that you have a router of specified horsepower and whether you are familiar
with simple jig building and routing, it would be possible for myself and
others undoubtedly
more intimate with the process to comment.

I am also interested in the overlay technique in haute relief or is this
what is also known as the appliqué technique?

It is a noticeably different effect than incising the wood, so you would
have to
look for examples to see if that is the appearance you want. One plus comes
from
the fact that you should have a wide variety of styles, sizes and woods
in such diamond elements to choose from over a number of suppliers. And if
you fancy something intricate, you could use the first technique in
combination
with this one.

You would need to
have a truly flat panel for best results with this method, along with some
experience on positioning such pieces and cleanly gluing them in place,
which would entail a way
of applying compression while the glue sets. Weights or various kind of
clamping
jigs are options. There are other attachment approaches utilizing doweling,
mechanical
fasteners with cover-up dowels, etcetera.

In the long run, this second approach would seem more complicated.

You might want to balance your human investment in this possible task
against
a commercial quote. There is a shop near me of the kind that one could
probably find
in most places by asking glass people since they trade in wooden windows
and doors.
This shop is used by those vendors and both their results are professional
and their prices are attractive when I don't have the time or interest in
pursuing a job myself.

Anyway, with your reply, this should focus the issue enough that discussion
can
get started.

Regards,

Edward Hennessey

wrote in message
...

"Edward Hennessey" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
I have four cabinet doors to make with ash.
I would like to make them with Diamond Points patterns.
I do not know how to make these Diamond points and I am looking for
advises.
TIA


MDJ:

Good to see you. Do you want the pattern to cover the entire door except
for a
frame? Do you want the pattern to be continuous within its field? And,
lastly, do you want the pattern to be cut/routed into the existing doors
or would you be interested in various
kinds of overlays in haute relief? If you have various skills and tools,
much of this
can be done yourself. If not, this is work that can often be done at a
reasonable cost.

Regards,

Edward Hennessey

Thanks for your reply.
Yes, over the years I have acquired all kind of woodworking tools.
About 75% of all the furniture in my house were made by me. Not to
mention my children and grand children.
Thirty five years ago I made an entrainment center with ash to accommodate
the electronics of that time.

Now with the advent of the LCD television and others. I am thinking
re-configuring the old design to suit the new gears. As the old cabinets
were made with solid ash I intend to use every bit of it.

It would be nice if the pattern could but.routed into the existing 3/4"
thick doors.
I am also interested in the overlay technique in haute relief or is this
what is also known as the appliqué technique?
Any feedback will be appreciated

Denis

D:

Well, since no one else has chimed in, here's a bit more on one approach
with the
router. Since you have four doors, you might want to make a frame larger
than any of
them--so you can make an unobstructed pass all the way--and fit pieces in
a diagonal pattern such two or more pieces will evenly support the base
plate of your router to keep it horizontal and one piece will act as a guide
for the pilot bearing your on your bit as you make the cut.
The nice thing about this is you can just turn the door around to make your
second
run of cuts to complete the diamond pattern going the other way. Of course,
you must
have some way to hold the door in place while cutting it and be careful to
only make as
deep a cut as the hp on your router will support. You can always deepen your
cut in
successive passes. If you haven't had much experience with a router, it's a
good idea to
try this on some scrap to get the feel of things like feed rate before you
deal
with your doors. The sharpest bits you can find will really help. Tungsten
carbide are
nice.
I hope that either is of some help or there are evident errors within which
will attracts
correction or better ideas.

Regards,

Edward Hennessey

The diamond points I've seen look similar to this;
http://www.canadianhomeworkshop.com/..._cabinet.shtml

3/4" is not thick enough to give adequate routing depth for the shadow
effect. I would create the diamonds (saw and router) and glue onto
another face panel. 1 1/2" (two 3/4" glued) would give adequate depth
for the effect and is closer to the thickness in diamond points that I've
seen. (3/4" door + 1 1/8" applique is what is described on the parts list
from the above link)


Another possible idea is grain matching. Although it is quite a bit more
work and has the potential to "ruin" your material if it isn't
successful. Grain matching is usually done with veneers or bandsawn
slices, but I've seen beautiful work in solid wood. Ash can have
prominent and consistent grain. If your stock does have prominent grain,
you could also do a diamond or reverse diamond pattern like one of these;
http://www.stwood.net/stwood/applications.htm
http://www.eidosdesignstudio.com/cus...ure_veneer.htm
http://www.adamsveneer.com/specialty.html

The best way to do this is to make paper stencils and tape them to the
surface of the wood panel. Take digital pictures of each stenciled area.
Measure the distance between the camera and the wood and keep it
consistent for each picture. Shoot directly perpendicular to the center
of each stenciled area. Crop the stenciled area in a paint program. Now
you can arrange the cropped sections in any patterns to roughly view the
end result. The entire stencil process can also be done in the paint
program using one picture of the entire panel.

The build process involves a lot of panel glue-up work that will be
displayed in plain view. You need good flat stock and some experience in
this to achieve best results. I'd recommend making one glue-up panel out
of scrap stock before you cut your real stock if you haven't done the
chosen glue-up pattern before. Clamping can be slightly trickier that
standard straight glue-ups.


This is how I do burls or exotics for smaller grain matching projects.
You can slide the stencils around on the wood to find the best sections
for patterns. I usually use a similar technique with an opaque projector
for marquetry projects to locate interesting grain patterns within
defined cut shapes. Easy to zoom in and out for re-sizing patterns,
change angle slightly for warping pattern, etc. and switch out different
pattern outlines quickly. Once and interesting grain pattern is found
just quick trace over area and continue with another outline until the
board is fully utilized. Then cut all patterns at once with the bandsaw,
scrollsaw, fretsaw, router, etc..

Usually I don't fully utilized the board so a final step before cutting
is to take a picture of the board with outline traces, place in paint
program and use custom paint program brushes to maximize use of the board
or pattern nesting software to fully utilize.
An example of pattern nesting software, many are available;
http://www.nirvanatec.com/panel_optimization_wood.html

Brushes in your paint program (paintshop pro, photoshop, gimp, etc.) can
be any shape. Usually the brushes are circles, dots or lines, but the
brushes can be outlines of any shape or entire pictures. Brushes can be
re-sized. Make custom brushes of standard geometric shapes and any common
custom shapes used. (birds, flower petals, leaves, etc.)

Joe wrote:
The diamond points I've seen look similar to this;
http://www.canadianhomeworkshop.com/..._cabinet.shtml

3/4" is not thick enough to give adequate routing depth for the shadow
effect. I would create the diamonds (saw and router) and glue onto
another face panel. 1 1/2" (two 3/4" glued) would give adequate depth
for the effect and is closer to the thickness in diamond points that
I've seen. (3/4" door + 1 1/8" applique is what is described on the
parts list from the above link)


Good post, Joe.

Like you said, there are a lot of different ways to approach the question
and differeing
effects to be attained by each.

Another notion for Denis is to find some open-work lattice in a diamond or
near-diamond pattern. I've seen this used in dividers and other furniture
application. If you like the ide of negative diamond forms, this would save
you a ton of cutting, positioning and gluing problems versus the discrete
element approach. You might find some of these lattice panels
in hardwood but I'm more familiar with them in various colorable
manufactured forms.
For that matter, if you find a piece, you could use it as a routing guide if
bas relief
that's not tres bas is appealing. And if you wanted to go diamond on a
smaller scale, there
are expanded metal sheets which would make amusing guides too. It is just a
matter of searching out availability to ascertain whether this is an
interesting path for you.

See you later Denis.

Regards,

Edward Hennessey

a