I'm going to assume, from the near-constant stream, of catalogs that I,
a non-customer, get from MLCS that they have some sort of loyal
following ... or else Penn-State has very deep pockets.

As I am considering fleshing out my tiny collection of Ryobi and HF
bits, can anyone comment, from experience, on the relative value of the
MLCS brand?

I'm looking to begin doing small boxes and freehand work and not certain
if I need to step up the quality of my bits or not. The R/HF stuff
cuts wood. Will I really see a noticeable and usable difference in the
cut surfaces in exchange for the higher bit price? Will I gain enough in
wear to overcome the price differential? I'm looking to buy 'quality',
not bragging rights.

Bill
--
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http://nmwoodworks.com


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BillinDetroit wrote:

| As I am considering fleshing out my tiny collection of Ryobi and HF
| bits, can anyone comment, from experience, on the relative value of
| the MLCS brand?

I've been happy with the MLCS bits I bought. My only complaint has
been that the shank on their 1/2" spiral upcut bit was too short.

I don't collect bits. I buy 'em as I need 'em (usually in quantities
of 10). You can put a lot of money on the shelf by buying bit
collections.

MLCS ships promptly and there isn't a (separate) shipping charge. I
like both.

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

I've bought plenty of MLCS bits over the years which have mostlt
served me well. The only exception is on a set of spiral solid carbide
bits. They barely cut at all. But they refunded my money and shipping.
I subsequently bought a spiral solid carbide bit from Infinity and
that sliced right thru the wood. The difference was so astounding that
the next time I buy a bit, I'll try infinity again. I believe that the
bad MLCS was a fluke and I wouldn't hesitate to order from them again
either.

"BillinDetroit" wrote in message
...
I'm going to assume, from the near-constant stream, of catalogs that I, a
non-customer, get from MLCS that they have some sort of loyal following
... or else Penn-State has very deep pockets.

As I am considering fleshing out my tiny collection of Ryobi and HF bits,
can anyone comment, from experience, on the relative value of the MLCS
brand?

I'm looking to begin doing small boxes and freehand work and not certain
if I need to step up the quality of my bits or not. The R/HF stuff cuts
wood. Will I really see a noticeable and usable difference in the cut
surfaces in exchange for the higher bit price? Will I gain enough in wear
to overcome the price differential? I'm looking to buy 'quality', not
bragging rights.

Bill
--

I've bought less than a dozen but none have given me any issues. They seem
to hold an edge well and I never had the carbide separate. The bearings
have held up well but I do lube my bearing after use - spin for a minute and
wipe any excess. Sorry I can't cross compare much with you - the only
other bits I have are Woodcraft and I'd say that they are both equal. YMMV,
naturally.

I'm looking to begin doing small boxes and freehand work and not certain
if I need to step up the quality of my bits or not. The R/HF stuff
cuts wood. Will I really see a noticeable and usable difference in the
cut surfaces in exchange for the higher bit price? Will I gain enough in
wear to overcome the price differential? I'm looking to buy 'quality',
not bragging rights.

In my experience, MLCS bits do cut better than the few no-name Chinese
bits I've used (probably equivalent to HF?). I think they're a good
value, especially if you only need one bit and you'd be paying for
shipping from another company. I have probably 25 of their bits (a 15-
pc set plus several individuals), and have only had a problem with
one: I broke a 1/4" straight bit, while trying to cut too deep (3/8"
in one pass). MLCS promptly replaced it, even though it was arguably
my fault. Overall, I think they're a very good value if you're not
going to be using a single bit very frequently, and I've been very
impressed with their customer service.
However, I think that Infinity, Lee Valley, maybe Freud, (and of
course Whiteside, Amana, CMT, etc.) represent another jump in quality
past MLCS, and some of these can be had for reasonable prices.
(Specifically, keep an eye on Infinity's closeouts). I usually pay
the extra for one of these bits if I know I'm going to be using it a
lot. I think the MLCS cut quality when new is almost equal to the
more expensive bits, but they don't seem to last as long.
(As you can tell, this is merely the opinion of a novice hobbyist
woodworker, so take it for what it's worth...)
Hope the comparisons and experiences are helpful,
Andy

BillinDetroit wrote:
I'm going to assume, from the near-constant stream, of catalogs that I,
a non-customer, get from MLCS that they have some sort of loyal
following ... or else Penn-State has very deep pockets.

As I am considering fleshing out my tiny collection of Ryobi and HF
bits, can anyone comment, from experience, on the relative value of the
MLCS brand?

I'm looking to begin doing small boxes and freehand work and not certain
if I need to step up the quality of my bits or not. The R/HF stuff cuts
wood. Will I really see a noticeable and usable difference in the cut
surfaces in exchange for the higher bit price? Will I gain enough in
wear to overcome the price differential? I'm looking to buy 'quality',
not bragging rights.

Bill

Thanks gang ... I figured you'd come through and you've never let me down.

Yet. ;-)

I bought an 18 piece collection from Ryobi and a panel/rail/stile set
and a slotting set from HF. The 3/8 round-over from Ryobi did a good job
with two Jakes Chairs (with footstools) worth of CWP (cheap white pine)
and the panel set worked well enough on a sample panel ... but I can
foresee a fair amount of router work in my future (yet another
addiction!) and want to make certain that when I move on, I am moving up.

Next on the list, lock miter.

Bill

--
I'm not not at the above address.
http://nmwoodworks.com


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Bill,
Fortunately, {or 'unfortunately', as the case may be} I live about 15
minutes away from them. And seen them grow, over the years. This allows me
to wander through their shop & showroom from time to time. I've gotten a lot
of stuff from them . . . mostly their 'sale' or 'tested' items. And I do
mean a LOT !!

Are they 'perfect' or 'better then' the name-brand stuff ?? I really don't
know. I've gotten some of the 'high quality, pretty color & packaging'
cutters, etc. While they may look 'nicer', and be a little more 'colorful'
and the bodies polished, the cutting edges look pretty much the same. In
most cases they also have the same 'subtext' . . . 'Made in China'.

If my living depended on daily, constant use of the bits, I might research a
bit more, i.e. the 'cost to buy' vs. 'the cost to use'. However, for my
occasional and specialized usage, The least expensive, DECENT, Carbide,
cutters are what I use . . . successfully.

As far as their other stuff, fortunately I'm able to actually look at the
stuff and make judgments based on my observations. So far I've had pretty
good luck. I've gotten any number of plastic items for dust collection
hook-ups, templates, etc. 99 percent of the time 'On Sale', or 'Closeout'.

Regards & Good Luck,
Ron Magen
Backyard Boatshop

"BillinDetroit" wrote in message
SNIP.

As I am considering fleshing out my tiny collection of Ryobi and HF
bits, can anyone comment, from experience, on the relative value of the
MLCS brand?

"Ron Magen" wrote in message
news:yo5oi.15$Nf4.7@trndny08...
Bill,
Fortunately, {or 'unfortunately', as the case may be} I live about 15
minutes away from them. And seen them grow, over the years. This allows me
to wander through their shop & showroom from time to time. I've gotten a
lot
of stuff from them . . . mostly their 'sale' or 'tested' items. And I do
mean a LOT !!

Are they 'perfect' or 'better then' the name-brand stuff ?? I really don't
know. I've gotten some of the 'high quality, pretty color & packaging'
cutters, etc. While they may look 'nicer', and be a little more 'colorful'
and the bodies polished, the cutting edges look pretty much the same. In
most cases they also have the same 'subtext' . . . 'Made in China'.

If my living depended on daily, constant use of the bits, I might research
a
bit more, i.e. the 'cost to buy' vs. 'the cost to use'. However, for my
occasional and specialized usage, The least expensive, DECENT, Carbide,
cutters are what I use . . . successfully.

As far as their other stuff, fortunately I'm able to actually look at the
stuff and make judgments based on my observations. So far I've had pretty
good luck. I've gotten any number of plastic items for dust collection
hook-ups, templates, etc. 99 percent of the time 'On Sale', or 'Closeout'.

Regards & Good Luck,
Ron Magen
Backyard Boatshop

"BillinDetroit" wrote in message
SNIP.

As I am considering fleshing out my tiny collection of Ryobi and HF
bits, can anyone comment, from experience, on the relative value of the
MLCS brand?

I have several of their Katana bits and they are as good as anything out
there. They cost a little more than their other bits.
I think they're made in Taiwan.

Dave wrote:

I have several of their Katana bits and they are as good as anything out
there. They cost a little more than their other bits.
I think they're made in Taiwan.


I was wondering if there was some difference beyond the paint job and
the bottom line.

Taiwan is a LOT closer than mainland ;-)

Bill


--
I'm not not at the above address.
http://nmwoodworks.com


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Not to stir up anything here, but like any other bulk manufacturing
not all of it is the same. I had an interesting talk with one of the
engineers at Jointech (there manufacturing facility is about 5 miles
from me) when I bought some bits from them. Apparently many of them
are made in the same plants, and they are "graded" for appearance,
grind, and assembly. That determines who gets what, and what they
charge. This guy told me their minimum order was 10,000 bits, with
the big breaks coming in after about 25,000 bits.

Jointech really understands the coefficients to determine how much
router bit to buy. I bought a multibit and a small door set (similar
to the Sommerfield) and the work great. Having only used them once to
make a small box lid, they were a great buy. If I had spent 3X for a
set of CMTs, I would have been ****ed off at myself for letting the
dough go on something I very rarely use.

I have bought no name bits at woodworking shows that work great. I
have paid a lot of money for bits that aren't worth a crap. MLCS
seems to strike a nice balance there.
I use the MLCS bits, make sure they stay clean (the very best thing
you can do for a bit) and when they get dull I toss them unless I
think I can touch them up with a diamond file. But they are so
cheap....

I think the key is to buy from a reputable dealer, one that will take
care of you if you have any problems. I have never heard one bad
thing about MLCS service, from me included when I needed them. A
little chip of carbide came off the straight bit I was using for a
dado, and when I sent them a pic via email, they sent me a new bit.

Robert