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#1
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
Waterborne poly seems to have some advantages which are not generally
mentioned. In fact, I think it is sort of strange stuff. I don't particularly care for its water resistance or polishability, but what I have been doing is to put three coats or so on natural wood, sanding between coats, and then top it off with one or two coats of oilbase poly .. This gives me something I can rub out, and has extra water resistance and better luster, and I like the results. The waterbase stuff dries fast, sands easily, and it doesn't seem to make any difference if you even wipe off sanding dust, though I usually do. It seems to redissolve particles of the sanded film. Since I am not worried about using it for a finish coat, even the occasional sag doesn't matter, it just sands away cleanly. AND, I have discovered that it will dissolve (actually sort of wash away if you rub a bit) yellow glue that didn't quite get sanded off. The solvents in waterbase must be fierce. They eat away at plastic wood, for instance, and this must also explain the yellow glue feature. I think that this material is a truly lazy-friendly product. Have others noticed these things? It could be brand-specific, I have really only used Parks "Pro Finisher". |
#2
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
The last I saw my waterborne was as the can floated across my flooded
basement floor. On Fri, 02 Jun 2006 15:06:55 -0400, donald girod wrote: Waterborne poly seems to have some advantages which are not generally mentioned. In fact, I think it is sort of strange stuff. I don't particularly care for its water resistance or polishability, but what I have been doing is to put three coats or so on natural wood, sanding between coats, and then top it off with one or two coats of oilbase poly . This gives me something I can rub out, and has extra water resistance and better luster, and I like the results. The waterbase stuff dries fast, sands easily, and it doesn't seem to make any difference if you even wipe off sanding dust, though I usually do. It seems to redissolve particles of the sanded film. Since I am not worried about using it for a finish coat, even the occasional sag doesn't matter, it just sands away cleanly. AND, I have discovered that it will dissolve (actually sort of wash away if you rub a bit) yellow glue that didn't quite get sanded off. The solvents in waterbase must be fierce. They eat away at plastic wood, for instance, and this must also explain the yellow glue feature. I think that this material is a truly lazy-friendly product. Have others noticed these things? It could be brand-specific, I have really only used Parks "Pro Finisher". |
#3
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
On Fri, 02 Jun 2006 15:06:55 -0400, donald girod
wrote: I think that this material is a truly lazy-friendly product. Have others noticed these things? It could be brand-specific, I have really only used Parks "Pro Finisher". Yeah, it is. I think it gets a bad rap- I like the millwork aspect a whole lot more than the finishing in woodworking, and waterbourne poly gets used a fair amount in my home shop. No complaints from anyone so far- in fact, the Wreck is the only place I've ever heard of it being so reviled. Most customers expect it on their finished piece these days, and will make odd faces if you give them something that has been finsihed with shellac or similar. |
#4
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
donald girod wrote:
Waterborne poly seems to have some advantages which are not generally mentioned. In fact, I think it is sort of strange stuff. I don't particularly care for its water resistance or polishability, but what I have been doing is to put three coats or so on natural wood, sanding between coats, and then top it off with one or two coats of oilbase poly . This gives me something I can rub out, and has extra water resistance and better luster, and I like the results. The waterbase stuff dries fast, sands easily, and it doesn't seem to make any difference if you even wipe off sanding dust, though I usually do. It seems to redissolve particles of the sanded film. Since I am not worried about using it for a finish coat, even the occasional sag doesn't matter, it just sands away cleanly. AND, I have discovered that it will dissolve (actually sort of wash away if you rub a bit) yellow glue that didn't quite get sanded off. The solvents in waterbase must be fierce. They eat away at plastic wood, for instance, and this must also explain the yellow glue feature. I think that this material is a truly lazy-friendly product. Have others noticed these things? It could be brand-specific, I have really only used Parks "Pro Finisher". G'day Donald, I have noticed that the water based poly does remove PVA and tend to soften plastic putty. Perhaps they all have a similar solvent thus allowing a re-activation of the former. I have just finished sanding and polishing the Jarrah floors in the lounge, dining room and kitchen. I used a 2 part water based poly and having used Oil base poly on other projects I'd have to reckon a bloke would be mad to use oil based. Although the "Hydrathane" was almost twice the price of standard poly, the 2 hour drying time between coats, ease of clean-up, lack of smell all make it a winner in my book. I have used the same stuff many years ago on another floor and used left overs on furniture. It does a great job and the gloss is controlled by the number of coats. Just my 2 bob's worth. regards John |
#5
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
Prometheus wrote: Yeah, it is. I think it gets a bad rap- I like the millwork aspect a whole lot more than the finishing in woodworking, and waterbourne poly gets used a fair amount in my home shop. No complaints from anyone so far- in fact, the Wreck is the only place I've ever heard of it being so reviled. Couldn't agree more. If they are thinking of some of the older, nastier finishes out there from even a few years ago, then it deserves all the bashing it gets. Likewise, if the bashers are looking at the big box products, then they probably have a legitimate beef. Chromatic reflections, blue tints, no abrasion and little water resistance, etc. all plagued the early finishes of 10 - 15 years ago. Now with people like ML Cambell, Target, and Oxford in the mix, that has all changed. According to a couple of factory reps I talked to here in the last couple of months there are many finishes that have the same water resistance or better than the solvent based stuff, and better abrasion resistance. There are a couple that even advertise that second and third coats will achieve 100% burn in if applied as directed. I don't know how it could be done, but then I don't understand the water bases shellac that Jewitt sells and stand behind on his website, either. Nor do I understand a qualtiy water based polyurethane. I like the water based stuff and in the next year or so I will probably be switching to some brand or another after I test a few of them out. Low fumes, less toxicity, easier to clean, distilled water for thinner (not cabinet grade lacquer thinner) along with happier homewowners make it look pretty attractive to me. Plus, I like the idea that the finish will always stay clear and never amber or yellow. So if I color match a door or finish and do a good job, it will always look the same over a period of years. Robert |
#6
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
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#7
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
John B wrote:
donald girod wrote: Waterborne poly seems to have some advantages which are not generally mentioned. In fact, I think it is sort of strange stuff. I don't particularly care for its water resistance or polishability, but what I have been doing is to put three coats or so on natural wood, sanding between coats, and then top it off with one or two coats of oilbase poly . This gives me something I can rub out, and has extra water resistance and better luster, and I like the results. The waterbase stuff dries fast, sands easily, and it doesn't seem to make any difference if you even wipe off sanding dust, though I usually do. It seems to redissolve particles of the sanded film. Since I am not worried about using it for a finish coat, even the occasional sag doesn't matter, it just sands away cleanly. AND, I have discovered that it will dissolve (actually sort of wash away if you rub a bit) yellow glue that didn't quite get sanded off. The solvents in waterbase must be fierce. They eat away at plastic wood, for instance, and this must also explain the yellow glue feature. I think that this material is a truly lazy-friendly product. Have others noticed these things? It could be brand-specific, I have really only used Parks "Pro Finisher". G'day Donald, I have noticed that the water based poly does remove PVA and tend to soften plastic putty. Perhaps they all have a similar solvent thus allowing a re-activation of the former. Yeah, they do...water. -- dadiOH ____________________________ dadiOH's dandies v3.06... ....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that. Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico |
#8
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
dadiOH wrote:
John B wrote: donald girod wrote: Waterborne poly seems to have some advantages which are not generally mentioned. In fact, I think it is sort of strange stuff. I don't particularly care for its water resistance or polishability, but what I have been doing is to put three coats or so on natural wood, sanding between coats, and then top it off with one or two coats of oilbase poly . This gives me something I can rub out, and has extra water resistance and better luster, and I like the results. The waterbase stuff dries fast, sands easily, and it doesn't seem to make any difference if you even wipe off sanding dust, though I usually do. It seems to redissolve particles of the sanded film. Since I am not worried about using it for a finish coat, even the occasional sag doesn't matter, it just sands away cleanly. AND, I have discovered that it will dissolve (actually sort of wash away if you rub a bit) yellow glue that didn't quite get sanded off. The solvents in waterbase must be fierce. They eat away at plastic wood, for instance, and this must also explain the yellow glue feature. I think that this material is a truly lazy-friendly product. Have others noticed these things? It could be brand-specific, I have really only used Parks "Pro Finisher". G'day Donald, I have noticed that the water based poly does remove PVA and tend to soften plastic putty. Perhaps they all have a similar solvent thus allowing a re-activation of the former. Yeah, they do...water. Actually, I think it's the polyglycol ethers in the stuff, whatever the hell they are. It sure isn't the water, because water does not wash away yellow glue stains, and we hope that water doesn't dissolve the dry poly film. But the stuff I use (Pro Finisher) definitely bites into undercoats of itself. |
#9
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
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#10
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
"vic" wrote in news:1149337424.786499.137880
@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com: What are there better water based poly products other than the standard Minwax products sold at HD and Lowes? Thanks I' ve used General Finishes High Performance Water-based Poly. I chose it because of low odor (it was winter and I had to use it indoors). At first I was disappointed because of poor coverage. This was because I did not wait long enough between the tung oil coating and the top coat of poly. Once I figured this out, I have been very happy. If you;re in a hurry, oil-based polys do not seem to have this problem. |
#11
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
donald girod wrote: Waterborne poly seems to have some advantages which are not generally mentioned. I used Waterbased poly for awhile, but I went back to oil, because I really like the amber tone that oil based gives you. Now I saw an article where the author puts down one coat of oil poly and then two coats of water and he claimed to get the same "warmth" that oil alone gives. I may try it someday, but IMO, it's the same amount of work to put 3 coats of oil poly as it is 1. Although, I admit that water based poly is great for small projects. It's nice to be able to get all your coats of poly on in one day. Even large projects, the quick drying time is a nice advantage. |
#12
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
vic wrote: What are there better water based poly products other than the standard Minwax products sold at HD and Lowes? Thanks Try www.homesteadfinishing.com and take a look at his products. On a good day, you can talk to Jeff. I have talked to some that are switching to the Target water borne products that are widely available on the net, and may even be available there. I don't know, but I don't think Jeff Jewitt would sell anything that would ruin or cast a shadow on his finishing empire, nor do I think he would sell something he didn't try. A lot of the kitchen cabinet REfinishers are going to the ML Cambell (Ultrastar Euro series I think) and with the compatible primers are having a great amount of success. You can get the Cambell products at any independent paint store, and some of the chains. Robert |
#13
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
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#14
Posted to rec.woodworking
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waterborne polyurethane
TransTint dyes work in waterbased and many other finishes and some use
a dye to "warm up" the waterbased finishes. On 3 Jun 2006 10:12:48 -0700, "bf" wrote: donald girod wrote: Waterborne poly seems to have some advantages which are not generally mentioned. I used Waterbased poly for awhile, but I went back to oil, because I really like the amber tone that oil based gives you. Now I saw an article where the author puts down one coat of oil poly and then two coats of water and he claimed to get the same "warmth" that oil alone gives. I may try it someday, but IMO, it's the same amount of work to put 3 coats of oil poly as it is 1. Although, I admit that water based poly is great for small projects. It's nice to be able to get all your coats of poly on in one day. Even large projects, the quick drying time is a nice advantage. |
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