I've been asked to help a friend replace some old rotting railroad ties
lining a garden area. This time they want to join the ties together in
some way and since I'm not very knowledgeable about woodworking I thought
you guys could give me some ideas. The ties will be just one layer high.
There are four 90 degree angles since the garden is rectangular. The
straight areas will need several ties joined together and I'm not sure
what type of cuts/splices/dowels to use to fasten these things together.
They are fairly large pieces of wood. Any ideas and/or photos are greatly
appreciated.

Stan

I usually use through dovetails; half blind just isn't strong enough with
big wood like that.

How about using half lap joints secured with these?
http://www.mcfeelys.com/subcat.asp?subcat=20.1.12.10

Art




"Stan Mulder" wrote in message
newsan.2005.05.21.19.13.18.803688@intrepidsoftwa re.com...
I've been asked to help a friend replace some old rotting railroad ties
lining a garden area. This time they want to join the ties together in
some way and since I'm not very knowledgeable about woodworking I thought
you guys could give me some ideas. The ties will be just one layer high.
There are four 90 degree angles since the garden is rectangular. The
straight areas will need several ties joined together and I'm not sure
what type of cuts/splices/dowels to use to fasten these things together.
They are fairly large pieces of wood. Any ideas and/or photos are greatly
appreciated.

Stan

Why join them together? Once placed, they won't move if on relatively flat
ground. Also back fill about 1" all the way around the tie. One could
drill thru them in two or three places and drive rebar into the ground.
1/2 inch will do. But if you gotta join them, a half lap works good, still
need the rebar tho. A reciprocating saw or a chain saw. RR ties are 8x6"

For what it's worth, we had a "professional" landscaper do a retaining wall
for us about
15 years ago using railroad ties. His concept of setting the vertical posts
first and then leveling
them with a chain saw sounded just fine.

To his dismay, the vertical 'posts' had all sorts of sand, etc. in then
which ate up the chains of
his saw at a very rapid rate.

Summed up, they don't cut/machine very easily???

Good luck!
"Stan Mulder" wrote in message
newsan.2005.05.21.19.13.18.803688@intrepidsoftwa re.com...
I've been asked to help a friend replace some old rotting railroad ties
lining a garden area. This time they want to join the ties together in
some way and since I'm not very knowledgeable about woodworking I thought
you guys could give me some ideas. The ties will be just one layer high.
There are four 90 degree angles since the garden is rectangular. The
straight areas will need several ties joined together and I'm not sure
what type of cuts/splices/dowels to use to fasten these things together.
They are fairly large pieces of wood. Any ideas and/or photos are greatly
appreciated.

Stan

Stan Mulder wrote:
I've been asked to help a friend replace some old rotting railroad ties
lining a garden area. This time they want to join the ties together in
some way and since I'm not very knowledgeable about woodworking I thought
you guys could give me some ideas. The ties will be just one layer high.
There are four 90 degree angles since the garden is rectangular. The
straight areas will need several ties joined together and I'm not sure
what type of cuts/splices/dowels to use to fasten these things together.
They are fairly large pieces of wood. Any ideas and/or photos are greatly
appreciated.

I don't know where you are located, but I'll relate what I did in
Northern Ohio, more than 30 years ago.

As far as I know, it is still in service.

As I remember, was able to get a couple of ties that were about 16 ft
long and still full of sticky black creosote in some places.

Cut one of the timbers with a cross cut pruning saw into an 8 ft and two
4 ft pieces.

This allowed a 4 x 24 garden using an existing concrete porch slab as
the 4th side.

Dug out the dirt for a quasi footer under the tie area and replaced with
slag to provide some drainage in hard clay soil.

Set the ties on the slag, then back filled with dirt so the ties were
about 1/2 above grade.

Filled the space with a bunch of pea gravel left over from another
landscaping job after first laying black plastic punched full of holes
to keep the weeds from growing in the area.

Laid a bunch of 8x16 colored concrete patio stones around the outside so
the grass wouldn't grow against the ties so I wouldn't have to trim.

The ties didn't move in the 20+ years I lived there.

It worked for me.

YMMV

Lew

Don't laugh but my Dad just replaced some old railroad tie garden walls with
PT 6x6, and just for ****s and grins he dovetailed the one visible corner.

SteveP.

"toller" wrote in message
...
I usually use through dovetails; half blind just isn't strong enough with
big wood like that.

Wood Butcher wrote:
How about using half lap joints secured with these?
http://www.mcfeelys.com/subcat.asp?subcat=20.1.12.10

Art


I agree on the half lap joints but the fasteners you suggest won't be
long enough. Railroad ties are something like 12 X 12. I'd suggest
concrete re bars cut to appropriate length with an angle grinder.

FoggyTown

Wood Butcher wrote:
How about using half lap joints secured with these?
http://www.mcfeelys.com/subcat.asp?subcat=20.1.12.10

Art


I agree on the half lap joints but the fasteners you suggest won't be
long enough. Railroad ties are something like 12 X 12. I'd suggest
concrete re bars cut to appropriate length with an angle grinder.

FoggyTown

"Wood Butcher" wrote in message
...
How about using half lap joints secured with these?
http://www.mcfeelys.com/subcat.asp?subcat=20.1.12.10

Art



Why not just use heavy galvanized tie plates & corner braces with those
screws? 1/4" thick x 1 or 1 1/4" wide, predrilled. They may rust after a
while, but with that amount of metal you won't have to worry about it in
this lifetime.

--
Nahmie
The greatest headaches are those we cause ourselves.

On Sat, 21 May 2005 15:13:19 -0400, Stan Mulder
wrote:

I've been asked to help a friend replace some old rotting railroad ties
lining a garden area. This time they want to join the ties together in
some way and since I'm not very knowledgeable about woodworking I thought
you guys could give me some ideas. The ties will be just one layer high.
There are four 90 degree angles since the garden is rectangular. The
straight areas will need several ties joined together and I'm not sure
what type of cuts/splices/dowels to use to fasten these things together.
They are fairly large pieces of wood. Any ideas and/or photos are greatly
appreciated.

Stan

Suggestion. Use 2-1/2" deck screws and some aluminum angle stock (may
be purchased at Home Depot). The angle will cut easily with a hack
saw, then file/sand the sharp edges. Drill 2 or three holes in each
side to accept the deck screws. You can secure the ties to the ground
to keep them shifting by pounding pieces of 2-foot rebar into
locations (pre-drilled holes with a spade bit) near where the butt
joints are located.

On Sat, 21 May 2005 15:13:19 -0400, the inscrutable Stan Mulder
spake:

I've been asked to help a friend replace some old rotting railroad ties
lining a garden area. This time they want to join the ties together in
some way and since I'm not very knowledgeable about woodworking I thought
you guys could give me some ideas. The ties will be just one layer high.
There are four 90 degree angles since the garden is rectangular. The
straight areas will need several ties joined together and I'm not sure
what type of cuts/splices/dowels to use to fasten these things together.
They are fairly large pieces of wood. Any ideas and/or photos are greatly
appreciated.

I picked up a pallet of ties a couple months ago. they have ripple
irons in the ends. I'll be drilling them and pounding 3' sections of
rebar into the holes/ground to hold them in place.

Butt them together and drive pins in. At 100-200 pounds each, they
won't go anywhere.

-
The only reason I would take up exercising is || http://diversify.com
so that I could hear heavy breathing again. || Programmed Websites

Most of the railroad ties I'm familiar with usually have an 'S' piece of
metal hammered into the end to reduce checking. The rest of the tie is
checked enough that you can find gravel in them. They're about 8" square,
although they can vary. I've never seen a new one, just used, though. Not
exactly material for fancy joinery.

Half laps are really good to do, but be on the look out for the 'S' & other
debris. I've used galvanized spikes to put them together, but if I just
want them to sit still in the ground, I drill a 7/16" hole through them &
pound a 2' length of 3/8" rebar through them into the ground. They tend to
stay put pretty well. I agree with digging them an inch or so into the
ground, too. A mower can clip them & move them otherwise.

Jim

"Stan Mulder" wrote in message
newsan.2005.05.21.19.13.18.803688@intrepidsoftwa re.com...
I've been asked to help a friend replace some old rotting railroad ties
lining a garden area. This time they want to join the ties together in
some way and since I'm not very knowledgeable about woodworking I thought
you guys could give me some ideas. The ties will be just one layer high.
There are four 90 degree angles since the garden is rectangular. The
straight areas will need several ties joined together and I'm not sure
what type of cuts/splices/dowels to use to fasten these things together.
They are fairly large pieces of wood. Any ideas and/or photos are greatly
appreciated.

Stan

Half laps and drill and pin with lengths of rebar driven thru the
ties and a couple feet into the ground

John

On Sat, 21 May 2005 15:13:19 -0400, Stan Mulder
wrote:

I've been asked to help a friend replace some old rotting railroad ties
lining a garden area. This time they want to join the ties together in
some way and since I'm not very knowledgeable about woodworking I thought
you guys could give me some ideas. The ties will be just one layer high.
There are four 90 degree angles since the garden is rectangular. The
straight areas will need several ties joined together and I'm not sure
what type of cuts/splices/dowels to use to fasten these things together.
They are fairly large pieces of wood. Any ideas and/or photos are greatly
appreciated.

Stan

On Sat, 21 May 2005 15:13:19 -0400, Stan Mulder
wrote:

I've been asked to help a friend replace some old rotting railroad ties
lining a garden area. This time they want to join the ties together in
some way and since I'm not very knowledgeable about woodworking I thought
you guys could give me some ideas. The ties will be just one layer high.
There are four 90 degree angles since the garden is rectangular. The
straight areas will need several ties joined together and I'm not sure
what type of cuts/splices/dowels to use to fasten these things together.
They are fairly large pieces of wood. Any ideas and/or photos are greatly
appreciated.

Those things are likely to eat up any saw you use on them, and they're
full of nasty chemicals to boot- so I wouldn't get too awfully fancy
with it. Have you considered just using the cactus plates that are
often used when making trusses on the bottom and perhaps the inside
corners of the joints? They are not going to have a deep enough spike
penetration to make a free standing stucture out of the suckers, but
the things are just sitting on the ground, and the plates would keep
them from sliding apart pretty well.

Also, if you don't want to dig to set the ties, if you fill the garden
area with topsoil so that it's level with the top of the ties, that
sucker isn't going to go anywhere- especially once the garden gets
going and you've got all those roots holding the topsoil in place.
Then you don't have to till it, either.

Half laps and drill and pin with lengths of rebar driven thru the
ties and a couple feet into the ground

John

Exactly what I did.

Homier sells a set of long drill bits really cheap



On Sat, 21 May 2005 15:13:19 -0400, Stan Mulder
wrote:

I've been asked to help a friend replace some old rotting railroad ties
lining a garden area. This time they want to join the ties together in
some way and since I'm not very knowledgeable about woodworking I thought
you guys could give me some ideas. The ties will be just one layer high.
There are four 90 degree angles since the garden is rectangular. The
straight areas will need several ties joined together and I'm not sure
what type of cuts/splices/dowels to use to fasten these things together.
They are fairly large pieces of wood. Any ideas and/or photos are greatly
appreciated.

Stan

You really ought to run the ties through your jointer before doing any
other work on them.