After prowling this NG for the past few weeks and looking at multiple
web sites, I've just about decided that my first (and probably last)
table saw will be a Delta 36-717. Seems a good split between a $2500+
cabinet saw and a half decent contractors saw.

Anyone have experience with this saw that would either change my mind
or solidify the jello in my brain? Any sugestions on a portable stand
that will allow a 130 pounder to move this beggar around the garage?

Regards.

Tom

On Sun, 03 Apr 2005 15:37:30 -0500, wrote:

Anyone have experience with this saw that would either change my mind
or solidify the jello in my brain? Any sugestions on a portable stand
that will allow a 130 pounder to move this beggar around the garage?


I haven't used the saw but my experiences with Delta's mobile bases
have been good. Check with Delta to see which mobile base fits that
saw. They do make one for the unisaw which may or may not work on
your model.

Mike O.

On Sun, 03 Apr 2005 15:37:30 -0500, wrote:

After prowling this NG for the past few weeks and looking at multiple
web sites, I've just about decided that my first (and probably last)
table saw will be a Delta 36-717. Seems a good split between a $2500+
cabinet saw and a half decent contractors saw.

Anyone have experience with this saw that would either change my mind
or solidify the jello in my brain? Any sugestions on a portable stand
that will allow a 130 pounder to move this beggar around the garage?

Get ahold of Grizzly and request a catalog. They're about the same
price and quality. Most of my tools are Delta, and they're generally
pretty good- but it's always good to compare at least two different
brands before you decide.

Regards.

Tom

Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

Grizzly as good as Delta?...not in my world!
Mike

I have experience with it.

Oh, I'm sorry, I meant I have experience PAYING for it. I have no
experience using it.

I ordered one in late February. It was promised for mid-March, late March,
mid-April, and it was just backed up to mid-June.

I've called Delta, and they always say the same thing: "We have no idea."

I had a great idea, however: I just bought a Grizzly.

You should too. Near as I can tell this saw is what the software industry
calls "vaporware."



wrote in message
...
After prowling this NG for the past few weeks and looking at multiple
web sites, I've just about decided that my first (and probably last)
table saw will be a Delta 36-717. Seems a good split between a $2500+
cabinet saw and a half decent contractors saw.

Anyone have experience with this saw that would either change my mind
or solidify the jello in my brain? Any sugestions on a portable stand
that will allow a 130 pounder to move this beggar around the garage?

Regards.

Tom

On Mon, 4 Apr 2005 21:12:22 -0400, "Mark Cooper"
wrote:


I ordered one in late February. It was promised for mid-March, late March,
mid-April, and it was just backed up to mid-June.

I've called Delta, and they always say the same thing: "We have no idea."



A conversation yesterday with a local Delta distrbutor revealed that:

1. Delta has not yet begun manufacturing the 36-717 model saw.
2. They have not yet tooled up to do so.

Net-net - smoke and mirrors instead of what seemed to be an excellent
TS.

Back to the search - maybe Grizz is the way to go!

Regards.

Tom

wrote:

On Mon, 4 Apr 2005 21:12:22 -0400, "Mark Cooper"
wrote:


I ordered one in late February. It was promised for mid-March, late
March, mid-April, and it was just backed up to mid-June.

I've called Delta, and they always say the same thing: "We have no idea."



A conversation yesterday with a local Delta distrbutor revealed that:

1. Delta has not yet begun manufacturing the 36-717 model saw.
2. They have not yet tooled up to do so.

I'm curious as to how he found out that some factory in Taiwan had not
tooled up.

Net-net - smoke and mirrors instead of what seemed to be an excellent
TS.

Back to the search - maybe Grizz is the way to go!

Regards.

Tom

--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

"J. Clarke" wrote:
....
I'm curious as to how he found out that some factory in Taiwan had not
tooled up.

Suspect Delta distributors have access to a significant amount of
"inside" info not for public consumption...

It's not hard to figure out what Delta's done here. It's a lousy business
practice, and I'll remember it next time I go to buy a power tool.

By "announcing" the saw to the market, they've probably tied up a number of
people's money. People see it, love the specs on it, and possibly put down
orders on it. It's not ready to go yet, and probably won't be for some time
to come. But the guy sitting there thinking about replacing his worn-out
saw and maybe upgrading to some bigger iron sees it and says to himself,
"Man, I'll just sit tight and wait for that one to come out!"

He may even put down some order money on it, just to be first in line when
it comes in. Of course, that makes the distributors happy, because now they
can sit on your money and rake in the interest.

But Delta knows that the actual production won't begin for quite some time.
Doesn't matter...remember, you just "have to have that saw at that great
price!"

Bottom line, don't be the sucker I was. A distributor sat on my $900 for
five weeks before I figured out the game. It's very similar to the "rolling
delay" technique practiced by the airlines. First your flight is just 15
minutes behind schedule...then it's a half-hour...next it's another 15
minutes...don't worry, you won't need to get on that other airline's flight
leaving in a half-hour because yours will leave in just another 15
minutes...

The hell with Delta, go buy a Grizz.

And from what I can tell by looking at Delta's (Black and Decker's) quality
lately, the Grizz is a much better saw.



wrote in message
...
On Mon, 4 Apr 2005 21:12:22 -0400, "Mark Cooper"
wrote:


I ordered one in late February. It was promised for mid-March, late
March,
mid-April, and it was just backed up to mid-June.

I've called Delta, and they always say the same thing: "We have no idea."



A conversation yesterday with a local Delta distrbutor revealed that:

1. Delta has not yet begun manufacturing the 36-717 model saw.
2. They have not yet tooled up to do so.

Net-net - smoke and mirrors instead of what seemed to be an excellent
TS.

Back to the search - maybe Grizz is the way to go!

Regards.

Tom

I mentioned the Black and Decker quality at the end of my above (LONG)
post...here's an example:

Once I gave up the ghost on getting my 36-717, I thought maybe I would get a
Unisaw. A lot of money to be sure, but hey...it's a Unisaw, right?!!

Wrong. It's a Black and Decker POS. While I was in the store, I put a
straight edge down on a Unisaw's extension table.

You could have thrown a cat through the hole between the fence and the
table.

The extension table was so cupped it actually made me laugh out loud. The
salesman wandered back over and asked what I was laughing about. When I
showed him, he said "Why do you think we can't sell Delta's anymore? No one
wants them anymore because they're all that way."

Delta my bright fanny. I recognize a Black and Decker from a mile away
these days...they're all light blue.

"Mark Cooper" wrote in message
news:1112739087.e103e93581c984fb4048dec9729d8418@t eranews...
It's not hard to figure out what Delta's done here. It's a lousy business
practice, and I'll remember it next time I go to buy a power tool.


But Delta knows that the actual production won't begin for quite some
time.

You know that as fact? What are your sources?


Doesn't matter...remember, you just "have to have that saw at that great
price!"

Bottom line, don't be the sucker I was. A distributor sat on my $900 for
five weeks before I figured out the game.

Sorry you had problems, but being in manufacturing for many years, I've seen
things go wrong. The best of plans get screwed up beyond the control of the
company and products get put on hold. Sub-contractors fail to delivery,
parts don't fit as they should, can't get a particular raw material,
breakdown of a machine making a major component. I can tell you hundreds of
stories. We once waited for weeks to get parts the supplier was lat on. He
finally told us the parts were shipped air freight. A plane crashed later
that day and we kidded that the supplier would tell us the parts were on it.
They were! **** happens.

Rant as you please, but I think B&D is financed well enough that they don't
need your deposit money to tide them over. Good luck with whatever you end
up with.
Ed

What part of "A distributor..." sounds to you like Black and Decker?

B & D got none of my money, and I never implied they did.

Check your attitude at the keyboard, young man.

If indeed there was a real problem getting the saw to market, Black and
Decker would be honest with their customer service and field reps. They
would give them actual information. As it is, nobody really seems to know
anything.

Take it from a marketer, B&D is playing to the channel.

And if you don't know what that means...well...maybe you don't work for a
very large manufacturer?




-----My post-----

Bottom line, don't be the sucker I was. A distributor sat on my $900 for
five weeks before I figured out the game.



----Your reply----

Rant as you please, but I think B&D is financed well enough that they
don't need your deposit money to tide them over. Good luck with whatever
you end up with.
Ed

If an outfit the size of B&D cannot come up with a reliable time frame
for delivery, then maybe people should look at grizzly or other mfg. If
they can not come up with the delivery time they how do you expect the
to design a new product. My own feeling is that B&D bought a name. They
will continue to put their old ways and design into the delta line and
say look how good this is. As for a company not needing the up front
money. Come on be real, Name me one large company that would not like to
get $1,000,000 interest free. And that is only what 1100 orders.
Just 25 per state.
Delta had a good name but I think in 10 yrs it will be just like the old
B&D. And you did not buy B&D last year because it was quality and
dependable. You bought it because it was less expensive.

"Mark Cooper" wrote in message
news:1112743750.73f70e4a747778578e147da824398fd1@t eranews...
What part of "A distributor..." sounds to you like Black and Decker?

B & D got none of my money, and I never implied they did.

So you got hoodwinked by the dealer who sat on your money. Maybe he was
going on vacation and needed the extra cash.




Check your attitude at the keyboard, young man.


Thank you. No one has called me a young man for the past ten or twenty
years.



If indeed there was a real problem getting the saw to market, Black and
Decker would be honest with their customer service and field reps. They
would give them actual information. As it is, nobody really seems to know
anything.

Maybe your sources are just not getting the info. Could be no one really
does know for sure and they don't want to knowingly give false information.
Reputable companies do hold back release of new products to be sure they
"get it right" and avoid bad publicity. Some are just ignorant.


Take it from a marketer, B&D is playing to the channel.

And if you don't know what that means...well...maybe you don't work for a
very large manufacturer?

I don't now. Used to. I like small companies much better. Over the years
though, our customer base included General Motors, Ortho, DuPont, Texas
Instruments, IBM, Frigidaire, P & G, and many others that make both consumer
and industrial products. Many of these companies would be pressuring us to
get parts by a certain deadline and when everything was ready, there would
be a last minute delay of days, weeks, months, until a bug got fixed by them
or one of their other suppliers. Last year we started shipping to a company
that came out with a new product. Then we were put on hold. It was a year
before they started shipping again as they had to recall and rework
everything they made.

You have an opinion. You may or may not be right, but to state it as fact
and not give facts to back it up does not make by sympathetic to your cause.
It will not affect my decision making if I was to consider buying from them
in the future. again, good luck with what you buy instead.
--
Ed
http://pages.cthome.net/edhome/

In article 1112739087.e103e93581c984fb4048dec9729d8418@teran ews, Mark
Cooper wrote:

Of course, that makes the distributors happy, because now they
can sit on your money and rake in the interest.

That's not as common or as lucrative as the "manufacturer's rebate"
scam, however. Think of the sheer volume of items in retail, especially
in the high-end electronics, cameras, and computer areas, that use this
ploy to get your money for six or eight weeks of interest-free use.
Instead of an item costing $80, you get the great bargain of parting
with $130 and waiting a lo-o-o-o-o-ng time for your $50 rebate /with/
/no/ /interest/. Now, extend that free cash to manufacturers with all
the rebate slips that get lost or never sent. What a crafty, LEGAL scam
that has become!

Gerry rant mode off