Some time ago I saw a message here about soaking cracked bowls in a
mixture of glue & water. Of the 60+ bowls I roughed out in Jan & Feb,
5 developed cracks of varying degrees. As an experiment I mixed 1/3
white glue to 2/3 water and soaked them for 3 to 4 days. Three large
sweetgum bowls showed no improvement, but I had no covered container
large enough to completely submerge them so used plastic bags and it
is iffy that they were wet all over the whole time.

Two sassafras bowls about 10 inches were soaked in a covered plastic
container with a piece of brick to hold them under the surface. One
showed no improvement and the last one was completely healed. I cannot
even find where the crack was, and it extended from the rim down to
the dovetail on the base. The cracks on both were open about 1/8 inch
at the rim.

So with a good test on two bowls I got 50% healing of the cracks.
Anyone else trying this method?
--
Gerald Ross
Cochran, GA

In article , Gerald Ross
wrote:

Some time ago I saw a message here about soaking cracked bowls in a
mixture of glue & water. Of the 60+ bowls I roughed out in Jan & Feb,
5 developed cracks of varying degrees. As an experiment I mixed 1/3
white glue to 2/3 water and soaked them for 3 to 4 days. Three large
sweetgum bowls showed no improvement, but I had no covered container
large enough to completely submerge them so used plastic bags and it
is iffy that they were wet all over the whole time.

Two sassafras bowls about 10 inches were soaked in a covered plastic
container with a piece of brick to hold them under the surface. One
showed no improvement and the last one was completely healed. I cannot
even find where the crack was, and it extended from the rim down to
the dovetail on the base. The cracks on both were open about 1/8 inch
at the rim.

So with a good test on two bowls I got 50% healing of the cracks.
Anyone else trying this method?

My results are about the same as yours. It works sometimes. Sort of a
stay of execution before it hits the fire wood pile. Kinda hard to keep
slimy microbes from growing in it, ain't it?

-j

Hi Gerald, Thanks for sharing your info about the healing powers of
watery glue. I remember that several good turners have recommended it,
but recently it seems the enthusiasm has waned. I assume that 'healing'
by soaking means that the crack walls are drawn or pressed together by
the diluted glue, not 'repaired' by being glued together? Haven't tried
it myself. I'm too old to wait for glue to dry.

I'm no statistician, but even if it doesn't rise to the level of being
"evidenced based" which I see by the paper is the 'in-word' used by
politicians involved in
health care (they could use some glue on themselves) your results gives
us Crackers with cracked bowls some hope.


At least, 50% is a coin flip and a much better chance than my cracked
NIP bowls have for healing themselves. Some actually do. Whew 60+ bowls
with only 5 cracked. With that record I'd forget the glue and sell the
five as art. If you weren't a good net friend, I'd accuse you of either
bragging or fudging. Anyway you've been too busy to get into any real
trouble.

BTW, I've plagiarized many of your great philosophical 'sign offs' Keep
em coming.


Turn to Safety, Arch
Fortiter


http://community.webtv.net/almcc/MacsMusings

Arch wrote:
I'm too old to wait for glue to dry.

....and I've been told I'm impatient!! LOL!

On Mar 9, 5:21*am, Gerald Ross wrote:
Some time ago I saw a message here about soaking cracked bowls in a
mixture of glue & water. Of the 60+ bowls I roughed out in Jan & Feb,
5 developed cracks of varying degrees. As an experiment I mixed 1/3
white glue to 2/3 water and soaked them for 3 to 4 days. Three large
sweetgum bowls showed no improvement, but I had no covered container
large enough to completely submerge them so used plastic bags and it
is iffy that they were wet all over the whole time.

Two sassafras bowls about 10 inches were soaked in a covered plastic
container with a piece of brick to hold them under the surface. One
showed no improvement and the last one was completely healed. I cannot
even find where the crack was, and it extended from the rim down to
the dovetail on the base. The cracks on both were open about 1/8 inch
at the rim.

So with a good test on two bowls I got 50% healing of the cracks.
Anyone else trying this method?
--
Gerald Ross
Cochran, GA

Wally Dickerman was the person to first provide this cure for cracked
bowls. He recommended 50-50 white glue and water. I had my doubts
about the cure, but Wally has been turning three or four times as long
as I have, do I tried it on a 15 inch rough turned salad bowl that I
had planned it as a gift for a friend who had purchased a new home. I
had to purchase two gallons of white glue and put it with two gallons
of water. I soaked the bowl for a couple of days and took it out. The
crack was still open. I said to myself, Wally it didn't work. I threw
the bowl onto a pile of wood in the yard, where it was rained on for a
couple of or more. About a week later, I walked past the bowl and
noticed that the crack (which had been about 3/8" at the rim) had
completely closed up. I put it in the shed to dry before final
turning. The crack never opened up again. The friend is still using
the salad bowl (been about four years now) and it only has a fine line
where the crack had been. Just my experience.

Barring you spent a lot of money on the blank, cracked bowl = Firewood,
move on. If you spent a lot of money on the blank, you can call it art,
or fill the crack with turquoise and call it art, or toss it in the
firewood pile and ask yourself why you spent a lot on a bowl blank.

....MHO.

--
Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by

Ecnerwal wrote:
Barring you spent a lot of money on the blank, cracked bowl = Firewood,
move on. If you spent a lot of money on the blank, you can call it art,
or fill the crack with turquoise and call it art, or toss it in the
firewood pile and ask yourself why you spent a lot on a bowl blank.

...MHO.

1- this is science. I wanted to see if there was anything to this
story about fixing a crack, and reported accordingly.

2. No money at all in the blank, but a little time. The jug of glue
was already there and not being used. The water was free. The one that
worked was a freebie since it was destined for the dump. I don't use
firewood.

3. If I ever DO have an expensive bowl that cracks, I now know that
there is some possibility of fixing it.

4. I'm moving, I'm moving on.

--
Gerald Ross
Cochran, GA

My favorite mythical creature? The
honest politician.

In message , Gerald Ross
writes
1- this is science. I wanted to see if there was anything to this story
about fixing a crack, and reported accordingly.


One thing that springs to mind, is like most things , failure occurs at
the weakest point.

So as the wood dehydrates, we get shrinkage.

If we then have a weak point, and the forces involved in the shrinkage
are strong enough, we will get a crack, starting at the weak point.

Now if we re-hydrate the wood, the wood will likely return to the shape
it had before, dehydration, hence closing the gap. The adhesive, in the
solution causing the surfaces either side of the crack to bond.

In addition to this the adhesive provides reinforcement for the wood
around the crack, so that as the wood again dehydrates, it is less
likely to crack again, in this location, though it could be that the
forces are strong enough to find a new weakness.
--
John

On Tue, 10 Mar 2009 09:18:58 -0700 (PDT), wrote:



Wally Dickerman was the person to first provide this cure for cracked
bowls. He recommended 50-50 white glue and water. I had my doubts
about the cure, but Wally has been turning three or four times as long
as I have, do I tried it on a 15 inch rough turned salad bowl that I
had planned it as a gift for a friend who had purchased a new home. I
had to purchase two gallons of white glue and put it with two gallons
of water. I soaked the bowl for a couple of days and took it out. The
crack was still open. I said to myself, Wally it didn't work. I threw
the bowl onto a pile of wood in the yard, where it was rained on for a
couple of or more. About a week later, I walked past the bowl and
noticed that the crack (which had been about 3/8" at the rim) had
completely closed up. I put it in the shed to dry before final
turning. The crack never opened up again. The friend is still using
the salad bowl (been about four years now) and it only has a fine line
where the crack had been. Just my experience.

Fred... When you dried and turned the bowl, was the wood normal, or glue
impregnated?

Just thinking back to some of my LDD experiments and trying to turn soft,
colored bowls that never went back to natural color of texture..


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

On Mar 10, 3:54*pm, mac davis wrote:
On Tue, 10 Mar 2009 09:18:58 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

Wally Dickerman was the person to first provide this cure for cracked
bowls. He recommended 50-50 white glue and water. I had my doubts
about the cure, but Wally has been turning three or four times as long
as I have, do I tried it on a 15 inch rough turned salad bowl that I
had planned it as a gift for a friend who had purchased a new home. I
had to purchase two gallons of white glue and put it with two gallons
of water. I soaked the bowl for a couple of days and took it out. The
crack was still open. I said to myself, Wally it didn't work. I threw
the bowl onto a pile of wood in the yard, where it was rained on for a
couple of or more. About a week later, I walked past the bowl and
noticed that the crack (which had been about 3/8" at the rim) had
completely closed up. I put it in the shed to dry before final
turning. The crack never opened up again. The friend is still using
the salad bowl (been about four years now) and it only has a fine line
where the crack had been. Just my experience.

Fred... When you dried and turned the bowl, was the wood normal, or glue
impregnated?

Just thinking back to some of my LDD experiments and trying to turn soft,
colored bowls that never went back to natural color of texture..

mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

Hello Mac,

I don't recall any discoloring of the wood. It was a nice maple bowl.
It final turned easily with no sign if the glue.

Fred Holder
http://www.morewoodturning.net

On Mar 10, 9:48*pm, wrote:
On Mar 10, 3:54*pm, mac davis wrote:





On Tue, 10 Mar 2009 09:18:58 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

Wally Dickerman was the person to first provide this cure for cracked
bowls. He recommended 50-50 white glue and water. I had my doubts
about the cure, but Wally has been turning three or four times as long
as I have, do I tried it on a 15 inch rough turned salad bowl that I
had planned it as a gift for a friend who had purchased a new home. I
had to purchase two gallons of white glue and put it with two gallons
of water. I soaked the bowl for a couple of days and took it out. The
crack was still open. I said to myself, Wally it didn't work. I threw
the bowl onto a pile of wood in the yard, where it was rained on for a
couple of or more. About a week later, I walked past the bowl and
noticed that the crack (which had been about 3/8" at the rim) had
completely closed up. I put it in the shed to dry before final
turning. The crack never opened up again. The friend is still using
the salad bowl (been about four years now) and it only has a fine line
where the crack had been. Just my experience.

Fred... When you dried and turned the bowl, was the wood normal, or glue
impregnated?

Just thinking back to some of my LDD experiments and trying to turn soft,
colored bowls that never went back to natural color of texture..

mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

Hello Mac,

I don't recall any discoloring of the wood. It was a nice maple bowl.
It final turned easily with no sign if the glue.

Fred Holder
http://www.morewoodturning.net

I wrote about this a few years ago on this forum, and as it happens I
had to fix 2 bowls in this past week with my "wood soup", one just
because I was in a hurry even though I know better, where I got a
couple of checks in the lower part of a square natural edge bowl,
wrapped a water/glue soaked rag around the outside and placed another
soaked rag into the inside of the bowl, placed a plastic bag around it
and let it sit overnight, that was enough to close the checks back up
and the bowl is dry now and finished, and the wood stayed close, there
are two very narrow lines were the splits have been, but I don't think
anyone would notice with the other lines that are in the sapwood that
look much alike, anyway I saved my time spent and a piece of nice
black walnut.
The other one is a trial piece with a double wing and as it happened
there was a small twig showing close to the edge of one wing, I should
have placed a staple in the edge to make sure it wasn't going to
split, anyway the next day when I pulled it out of the paper bag to do
some more work to it had a split about 1½ long and 1/16 wide, again, I
placed a water and glue soaked rag on the outside of the wing and set
it in a plastic bag to soak for the night, the next day the split was
closed, removed it from the plastic bag and wiped it clean and it is
now drying in a brown paper bag, the split I can't find even though I
know where it was.
Again I have saved my time I did spend on this trial bowl, and a piece
of wood.
I don't do this glue thing very often as I don't usually have
splitting turnings very often, but I never let a bowl sit without
checking them especially the first couple of days, so wood isn't dry
and has sat with wide splits in them for a while.
I have always had good luck fixing the small splits when the wood is
still wet and the splits/checks are still small, works for me ;-))
Have fun and take care
Leo Van Der Loo

John wrote:

One thing that springs to mind, is like most things , failure occurs at
the weakest point.

So as the wood dehydrates, we get shrinkage.

If we then have a weak point, and the forces involved in the shrinkage
are strong enough, we will get a crack, starting at the weak point.

Now if we re-hydrate the wood, the wood will likely return to the shape
it had before, dehydration, hence closing the gap. The adhesive, in the
solution causing the surfaces either side of the crack to bond.

In addition to this the adhesive provides reinforcement for the wood
around the crack, so that as the wood again dehydrates, it is less
likely to crack again, in this location, though it could be that the
forces are strong enough to find a new weakness.

I never tried this trick, but it sounds like the glue/water mixture
soaks into the wood, swelling the crack closed, When the wood again
dehydrates, just the water evaporates leaving the glue to keep the crack
"swelled" shut. I reckon if just the holding power of the glue forced
the crack to stay closed, you would stand a better than even chance the
crack would re-appear there or somewhere else. The glue that remains in
the wood keeps it in a swelled/stable state forever.

In other words, I'm thinking the bonding part is minor compared to the
left over swelling? Just my guess though, not sure.
--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com