"Aidan" wrote in message
om...
"The signal to noise ratio on UK.D-I-Y is actually pretty good in
comparison to some others."

Signal to noise ratio is probably about 1:5 in the case of this
thread, or about 1:10 in the case of your own contributions to it.
What, are there other idiots ruining other UK newsgroups, in the way
that you, IMM and others are ruining this one? Or, is it the same
idiots?

I don't know if you're the same Aiden on www.periodproperty or not, but if
you are surely you see that here one person doesn't ruin the site whereas
there on a supposedly moderated site one person most definitely has as there
are no blocking tools to cut our her vile opinions.

On Fri, 8 Oct 2004 22:39:57 +0100, "IMM" wrote:


"raden" wrote in message
...
In message , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
True. what do you gave a man who has everything.

A labour government. Then he ends up with nothing.

Heh heh. By all the pledges at the recent Tory party conference, it
would seem there's a new 'spend spend spend' party.

Of course, it's easy to make promises when you know there's no chance
of
having to fulfil them...

That was Labour's problem, wasn't it

Maxie, you are confused again. Blair read to the press not long ago the
point they would do at the last election and 90% plus are done. Maxie!


You're telling me. I feel that I've been done by Bliar every day.


..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

In message , IMM writes

"raden" wrote in message
...
In message , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
True. what do you gave a man who has everything.

A labour government. Then he ends up with nothing.

Heh heh. By all the pledges at the recent Tory party conference, it
would seem there's a new 'spend spend spend' party.

Of course, it's easy to make promises when you know there's no chance
of
having to fulfil them...

That was Labour's problem, wasn't it

Maxie, you are confused again. Blair read to the press not long ago the
point they would do at the last election and 90% plus are done. Maxie!


While what you've written above doesn't make sense ...

Railways - what a disaster
NHS - frigged the figures
Education - don't make me laugh


OK, they forced the foxhunting bill through out of sheer desperation
--
geoff

"Aidan" wrote in message
om...
Andy Hall wrote in message
. ..

"Were you hoping that anybody would be impressed by that?"

No. Just plain facts, believe or disbelieve as you please.
Who cares? People can base their opinions on the content.

"After all, if you walk into a community pub as a newcomer and there
are several conversations going on at the bar, do you instantly elbow
into a conversation and tear into what other people are saying?
You could, but you wouldn't be surprised if they didn't thank you for
it."

On the contrary, if you go into a space/room allocated for a "DIY
Discussion" and persistently disrupt the discussions with irrelevant,
infantile squabbling, then probably only you would be surprised if
someone eventually asked you to shut the hell up.

However, since this is mainly a British discussion group, we usually
don't do that because we don't want to cause a scene. Instead, people
just leave, whilst muttering things under their breath like, "Tut,
tut!", or even, "Really!".

The result is that all those who might have made a valuable
contribution have gone elsewhere and the space is abandoned to the
f***wits. The f***wits eventually dominate the space, indulge in
unchallenged misbehaviour and unquestioned delusions about their own
expertise and even tell those who've come for a discussion to "Fit in
or F*** off". Me, fit in with your conduct?!

"This again demonstrates your lack of understanding of the Usenet
medium and that you have not bothered to look at the history of
threads in this group."

Since when was knowledge of Usenet, computing or the history of your
rantings a prerequisite for reading about DIY stuff? I just want to
read about push-fit plumbing.

"You would have been far better off keeping quiet and following posts
for a while and then introducing yourself into one or two threads with
useful material."

Oh, right. You mean, something like;

Using combi in stored hot water system, posted on 3/10/04

Your omitting to mention a legally-required safety device (your &
IMM's replies of 3/10/04) on an unvented system might have caused
people to wonder about the extent of your knowledge.

"I'm quite sure that if I ever met IMM, I would buy him a beer and
perhaps even dinner."

You slag each other off at every opportunity but, in the event of
your meeting, you expect that you will both behave with courtesy? How
charmingly naïve.

If we met, I would buy you both a drink.
Two cherry cokes, please, in the paper cups, with straws. Now try not
to spill it on yourselves and take it outside to the play area where
you won't annoy the grown-ups.

Finish it.

I thought that was great.

"G&M" wrote in message
...

"Aidan" wrote in message
om...
"The signal to noise ratio on UK.D-I-Y is actually pretty good in
comparison to some others."

Signal to noise ratio is probably about 1:5 in the case of this
thread, or about 1:10 in the case of your own contributions to it.
What, are there other idiots ruining other UK newsgroups, in the way
that you, IMM and others are ruining this one? Or, is it the same
idiots?

I don't know if you're the same Aiden on www.periodproperty or not, but if
you are surely you see that here one person doesn't ruin the site whereas
there on a supposedly moderated site one person most definitely has as
there
are no blocking tools to cut our her vile opinions.

tsk, tsk, tsk.

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 8 Oct 2004 22:39:57 +0100, "IMM" wrote:


"raden" wrote in message
...
In message , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
True. what do you gave a man who has everything.

A labour government. Then he ends up with nothing.

Heh heh. By all the pledges at the recent Tory party conference, it
would seem there's a new 'spend spend spend' party.

Of course, it's easy to make promises when you know there's no
chance
of
having to fulfil them...

That was Labour's problem, wasn't it

Maxie, you are confused again. Blair read to the press not long ago the
point they would do at the last election and 90% plus are done. Maxie!


You're telling me. I feel that I've been done by Bliar every day.

You must have strange feelings every day. Get them sorted on your private
health insurance.

"raden" wrote in message
news
In message , IMM writes

"raden" wrote in message
...
In message , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
True. what do you gave a man who has everything.

A labour government. Then he ends up with nothing.

Heh heh. By all the pledges at the recent Tory party conference, it
would seem there's a new 'spend spend spend' party.

Of course, it's easy to make promises when you know there's no
chance
of
having to fulfil them...

That was Labour's problem, wasn't it

Maxie, you are confused again. Blair read to the press not long ago the
point they would do at the last election and 90% plus are done. Maxie!


While what you've written above doesn't make sense ...

Railways - what a disaster

Putting it right Maxie after the clowns ruined it.

NHS - frigged the figures

Oh you are porkie telling.

Education - don't make me laugh

Highest ever A level results. SA fabulous success.

OK, they forced the foxhunting bill through out of sheer desperation

...and about time too. Bargain hunting should be dealt with next.

On 8 Oct 2004 14:48:16 -0700, (Aidan) wrote:

Andy Hall wrote in message . ..

"Were you hoping that anybody would be impressed by that?"

No. Just plain facts, believe or disbelieve as you please.
Who cares? People can base their opinions on the content.

Of course. They are also at liberty to read the content or not.

You really haven't caught on to the fact that Usenet is predominantly
a writer driven medium, have you?



"After all, if you walk into a community pub as a newcomer and there
are several conversations going on at the bar, do you instantly elbow
into a conversation and tear into what other people are saying?
You could, but you wouldn't be surprised if they didn't thank you for
it."

On the contrary, if you go into a space/room allocated for a "DIY
Discussion" and persistently disrupt the discussions with irrelevant,
infantile squabbling, then probably only you would be surprised if
someone eventually asked you to shut the hell up.

The point was that it is you who is the newcomer into the
room........



However, since this is mainly a British discussion group, we usually
don't do that because we don't want to cause a scene. Instead, people
just leave, whilst muttering things under their breath like, "Tut,
tut!", or even, "Really!".

The result is that all those who might have made a valuable
contribution have gone elsewhere and the space is abandoned to the
f***wits. The f***wits eventually dominate the space, indulge in
unchallenged misbehaviour and unquestioned delusions about their own
expertise and even tell those who've come for a discussion to "Fit in
or F*** off". Me, fit in with your conduct?!

People come and go all the time. As numerous people, who have been
here for a long time have said to you, the signal to noise ratio in
this group is actually quite good in comparison to most.

Usenet is a discussion medium and people contribute in different ways
and with differing views. You can either choose to like that or not.
The whole point of it is that it is, for the most part a medium open
for all with most groups unmoderated.

As I've said to you, if you want to have a discussion group that does
what you want, go and set up a moderated one up on Yahoo - it's free
of charge



"This again demonstrates your lack of understanding of the Usenet
medium and that you have not bothered to look at the history of
threads in this group."

Since when was knowledge of Usenet, computing or the history of your
rantings a prerequisite for reading about DIY stuff? I just want to
read about push-fit plumbing.

Then I would suggest that you go and look at manufacturer's data
sheets.

If you want to use Usenet as a medium, go and read up about the way it
works and the way that it is used. Then make your decision. Like
it and use it the way it is or find somewhere else. It won't change
to suit you.




"You would have been far better off keeping quiet and following posts
for a while and then introducing yourself into one or two threads with
useful material."

Oh, right. You mean, something like;

Using combi in stored hot water system, posted on 3/10/04

Your omitting to mention a legally-required safety device (your &
IMM's replies of 3/10/04) on an unvented system might have caused
people to wonder about the extent of your knowledge.

If you actually read the whole thread and the question asked, you
would realise that the OP (that means original poster, by the way),
was asking only about the principle of using a pressurised cylinder
heated by a combi boiler. He clearly stated that he was going to use
a plumber and not DIY the job. It was therefore completely
unnecessary to get into a discussion about the requirements for the
installation of said pressurised cylinder.

If you took the trouble to look at previous threads, you would
discover that I have regularly said that installation of a pressurised
cylinder is not a DIY job, as have other regular posters here.

I take a great deal of care with what I write on subjects like this,
and if I am in any doubt as to the circumstances of the question, I
cover possible dangers very carefully.

If you are going to try to pick holes in what is written, at least
take the trouble to research it properly first, rather than making a
fool of yourself.




"I'm quite sure that if I ever met IMM, I would buy him a beer and
perhaps even dinner."

You slag each other off at every opportunity but, in the event of
your meeting, you expect that you will both behave with courtesy? How
charmingly naïve.

I think that you are the naive one here by not understanding the
context and intent of what is said.

As I and others have said, you have not taken the trouble to inform
yourself about the Usenet medium and certainly not about what happens
in this news group.

Had you taken the trouble to do so, you would realise that it is
extremely rare that there is any flaming (this is another Usenet term
and you can look it up) or malice in exchanges in this group.


If we met, I would buy you both a drink.
Two cherry cokes, please, in the paper cups, with straws. Now try not
to spill it on yourselves and take it outside to the play area where
you won't annoy the grown-ups.

Finish it.

I really do wish you would.


..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"G&M" wrote in message
...

"Aidan" wrote in message
om...
"The signal to noise ratio on UK.D-I-Y is actually pretty good in
comparison to some others."

Signal to noise ratio is probably about 1:5 in the case of this
thread, or about 1:10 in the case of your own contributions to it.
What, are there other idiots ruining other UK newsgroups, in the way
that you, IMM and others are ruining this one? Or, is it the same
idiots?

I don't know if you're the same Aiden on www.periodproperty or not, but if
you are surely you see that here one person doesn't ruin the site whereas
there on a supposedly moderated site one person most definitely has as
there
are no blocking tools to cut our her vile opinions.

My God! A wrecker of forums eh! I think this is a case for Scotland Yard.

In message , IMM writes

"raden" wrote in message
news
In message , IMM writes

"raden" wrote in message
...
In message , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
True. what do you gave a man who has everything.

A labour government. Then he ends up with nothing.

Heh heh. By all the pledges at the recent Tory party conference, it
would seem there's a new 'spend spend spend' party.

Of course, it's easy to make promises when you know there's no
chance
of
having to fulfil them...

That was Labour's problem, wasn't it

Maxie, you are confused again. Blair read to the press not long ago the
point they would do at the last election and 90% plus are done. Maxie!


While what you've written above doesn't make sense ...

Railways - what a disaster

Putting it right Maxie after the clowns ruined it.

NHS - frigged the figures

Oh you are porkie telling.

Education - don't make me laugh

Highest ever A level results. SA fabulous success.

OK, they forced the foxhunting bill through out of sheer desperation

..and about time too. Bargain hunting should be dealt with next.

You've been sniffing Hawk White, haven't you

--
geoff

In message , Aidan
writes
Andy Hall wrote in message
...

"Were you hoping that anybody would be impressed by that?"

No. Just plain facts, believe or disbelieve as you please.
Who cares? People can base their opinions on the content.

"After all, if you walk into a community pub as a newcomer and there
are several conversations going on at the bar, do you instantly elbow
into a conversation and tear into what other people are saying?
You could, but you wouldn't be surprised if they didn't thank you for
it."

Uk-diy is like an open club

It has people who come and go, it has it's lurkers and it has it's
regulars.

There are only two rules really 1) no top posting and 2) no commercial
advertising

Other than that, it accepts all and sundry and, while it is generally
based around diy subjects, it isn't exclusively so.

Those of us who post regularly here want a bit more than dry factual
threads on occasion, and DIMM baiting falls in that category.

It is a very successful NG, we have our differences, but we all pull
together when duty calls

Some of us have contributed to the FAQs, some have advice to give, some
enjoy a bit of diversion

most of us don't like being told what to do by a newbie who has yet to
contribute anything useful

You have a choice fit in or **** off, it's that simple. We're not going
to change just for you

--
geoff

"raden" wrote in message
...
In message , Aidan
writes
Andy Hall wrote in message
...

"Were you hoping that anybody would be impressed by that?"

No. Just plain facts, believe or disbelieve as you please.
Who cares? People can base their opinions on the content.

"After all, if you walk into a community pub as a newcomer and there
are several conversations going on at the bar, do you instantly elbow
into a conversation and tear into what other people are saying?
You could, but you wouldn't be surprised if they didn't thank you for
it."

Uk-diy is like an open club

It has people who come and go, it has it's lurkers and it has it's
regulars.

There are only two rules really 1) no top posting and 2) no commercial
advertising

Other than that, it accepts all and sundry and, while it is generally
based around diy subjects, it isn't exclusively so.

Those of us who post regularly here want a bit more than dry factual
threads on occasion, and DIMM baiting falls in that category.

Maxie, you are not abusing Dim Lin the luscious far eastern lovely already
are you?

It is a very successful NG, we have our differences, but we all pull
together when duty calls

Some of us have contributed to the FAQs, some have advice to give, some
enjoy a bit of diversion

most of us don't like being told what to do by a newbie who has yet to
contribute anything useful

You have a choice fit in or **** off, it's that simple. We're not going
to change just for you

Well said Maxie!

In article ,
raden wrote:
True. what do you gave a man who has everything.

A labour government. Then he ends up with nothing.

Heh heh. By all the pledges at the recent Tory party conference, it
would seem there's a new 'spend spend spend' party.

Of course, it's easy to make promises when you know there's no chance
of having to fulfil them...

That was Labour's problem, wasn't it

It's the problem with all of them. Talk is cheap.

So saying, this lot seemed to have kept, in general, the economy on a
pretty level plain regardless of world recession etc with none of the
usual boom and burst.

--
*There's no place like www.home.com *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Aidan wrote:
Since when was knowledge of Usenet, computing or the history of your
rantings a prerequisite for reading about DIY stuff? I just want to
read about push-fit plumbing.

Buy a book, then. Or search the internet.

--
*Pride is what we have. Vanity is what others have.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
raden wrote:
Maxie, you are confused again. Blair read to the press not long ago the
point they would do at the last election and 90% plus are done. Maxie!


While what you've written above doesn't make sense ...

Railways - what a disaster

And just who caused the present mess? Some people have very short memories.
Or perhaps you'd have been happy to pay for the whole lot to be sorted
properly?

NHS - frigged the figures

It's certainly in a better state than it was when they took office.

Education - don't make me laugh

And just who has a practical solution to that one?

--
*Gun Control: Use both hands.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"G&M" wrote in message ...
"Aidan" wrote in message
surely you see that here one person doesn't ruin the site whereas
there on a supposedly moderated site one person most definitely has as there
are no blocking tools to cut our her vile opinions.

Who, Evelyn? I'm honestly a bit baffled as to what you're referring
to, although I don't read it all.

She's fairly harmless, I thought, although with strong opinions about
SPAB, lime mortar, uPVC windows, etc.. Still harmless though. Maybe I
had missed something.

In message , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
raden wrote:
Maxie, you are confused again. Blair read to the press not long ago the
point they would do at the last election and 90% plus are done. Maxie!


While what you've written above doesn't make sense ...

Railways - what a disaster

And just who caused the present mess? Some people have very short memories.
Or perhaps you'd have been happy to pay for the whole lot to be sorted
properly?

NHS - frigged the figures

It's certainly in a better state than it was when they took office.

Education - don't make me laugh

And just who has a practical solution to that one?

They inherited a mess, yes

But these were amongst the things which they made election pledges on


--
geoff

Andy Hall wrote in messages

"The point was that it is you who is the newcomer into the
room........"

That is a red herring, i.e., it is irrelevant.
The relevant point is that this is still a DIY discussion room.

I've been reading posts here for about a year and posting occasionally
probably for about 6 months. You lot may have been posting here
longer, but that does not give you squatters' rights of ownership. You
consistently ruin many threads.

"and DIMM baiting falls in that category."
If IMM baiting occupied a small proportion of the posts, then I
wouldn't care. It has completely taken over too many of the posts, to
the detriment of the group/site.

"Then I would suggest that you go and look at manufacturer's data
sheets."

No, I had hoped to read peoples' opinions and experiences. Like the
plastic inserts on Speedfit restricting the pipe bore and imposing a
significant hydraulic resistance. Or the suitability of Speedfit
Pex/Al/Pex on domestic softened water systems. Things like that, the
possible points of weakness in their systems that manufacturers don't
mention.


"If you actually read the whole thread and the question asked………"
"He clearly stated that he was going to use a plumber and not DIY the
job"
"I take a great deal of care with what I write on subjects like this,
and if I am in any doubt as to the circumstances of the question, I
cover possible dangers very carefully."
"If you are going to try to pick holes in what is written, at least
take the trouble to research it properly first, rather than making a
fool of yourself."

Your reply to the OP was;
"Then have the cylinder installed with the coil fed via a diverter
valve or zone valves from the CH circuit. The valve(s) would need
to be fitted before the first radiator and a thermostat for the
cylinder added, but that is broadly it."

That is broadly wrong. Oh, dear.

You could not legally use a diverter valve unless the cylinder also
has a zone valve. Alternatively, you'd need two zone valves (DHWS &
HTG), a simpler arrangement. The primary and secondary resettable
thermostats required should come with the unvented cylinder. You'd
probably also need a new 2-channel programmer. Just see the Honeywell
web-site for a diagram. If I contradicted what you had written, it was
because it was misleading. You should have taken the trouble to
research it properly, rather than have made yourself look foolish. It
was fortunate that a newbie around to correct the OP. But then this
site exists for your mutual admiration, doesn't it, not for DIY
information, so that's OK.

If the OP employed a plumber, it would not follow that the plumber had
passed the recommended training course. Even if he had, it would not
follow that he would do the job correctly. There are just too many
knuckle-draggers in the heating trade. The two-port zone valve usually
comes loose and often ends up in the back of a plumber's van. I've
seen it happen.

"the signal to noise ratio in this group is actually quite good"
And you are generating most of the noise.
Do you read any of the stuff you post here? Choosing a few random
quotes;

"Well said Maxie!"
"IS your name DIMM ? no? Should be OK then"
"Where's DIMM, has he broken his hacksaw blade or what?"
"Probably runs on Windows 3.1 and still booting up for the month."

Does it mean anything? Do you think anyone, anywhere wants to read it?
Why don't you all just e-mail it to each other? Nobody else is
interested in it.

"We're not going to change just for you"

"Finish it. I really do wish you would."
I have. You lot really are boring.


Finish it.
Unfortunately, you won't.

Finish it.

In article ,
Aidan wrote:
Finish it.
Unfortunately, you won't.

Strange the way those who complain about off topic posting always use far
more bandwidth than the posts they're complaining about...

--
*Remember: First you pillage, then you burn.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 9 Oct 2004 17:43:16 -0700, (Aidan) wrote:

Andy Hall wrote in messages

"The point was that it is you who is the newcomer into the
room........"

That is a red herring, i.e., it is irrelevant.
The relevant point is that this is still a DIY discussion room.

....and so it predominantly is.



I've been reading posts here for about a year and posting occasionally
probably for about 6 months. You lot may have been posting here
longer, but that does not give you squatters' rights of ownership. You
consistently ruin many threads.

.... in your view. Nobody is forcing you to read specific threads
or, for that matter, the writings of any particular person.

Certainly there is no notion of squatters rights, but when you join
any community, you don't expect to impose your rules on it on day one
if at all.


"and DIMM baiting falls in that category."
If IMM baiting occupied a small proportion of the posts, then I
wouldn't care. It has completely taken over too many of the posts, to
the detriment of the group/site.

Again in your view.




"Then I would suggest that you go and look at manufacturer's data
sheets."

No, I had hoped to read peoples' opinions and experiences.

They are there and can easily be found. If you used a proper
newsreader, then you would have no difficulty at all.

Like the
plastic inserts on Speedfit restricting the pipe bore and imposing a
significant hydraulic resistance. Or the suitability of Speedfit
Pex/Al/Pex on domestic softened water systems. Things like that, the
possible points of weakness in their systems that manufacturers don't
mention.


Information of this type on various subjects is posted almost daily,
by various people.



"If you actually read the whole thread and the question asked………"
"He clearly stated that he was going to use a plumber and not DIY the
job"
"I take a great deal of care with what I write on subjects like this,
and if I am in any doubt as to the circumstances of the question, I
cover possible dangers very carefully."
"If you are going to try to pick holes in what is written, at least
take the trouble to research it properly first, rather than making a
fool of yourself."

Your reply to the OP was;
"Then have the cylinder installed with the coil fed via a diverter
valve or zone valves from the CH circuit. The valve(s) would need
to be fitted before the first radiator and a thermostat for the
cylinder added, but that is broadly it."

That is broadly wrong. Oh, dear.

No, it's completely correct as far as it goes. I didn't set out to
provide a complete solution because it was not requested or required..


You could not legally use a diverter valve unless the cylinder also
has a zone valve. Alternatively, you'd need two zone valves (DHWS &
HTG), a simpler arrangement. The primary and secondary resettable
thermostats required should come with the unvented cylinder. You'd
probably also need a new 2-channel programmer. Just see the Honeywell
web-site for a diagram. If I contradicted what you had written, it was
because it was misleading.

It was not misleading at all in the context and for the purpose
intended, which was simply to say that the solution enquired about by
the OP is feasible and to give an outline of it. Since it was not
going to be a DIY job, there is absolutely no point in covering
aspects that a plumber or heating engineer would be doing anyway.


You should have taken the trouble to
research it properly, rather than have made yourself look foolish.

There was no need to research it to the detail that you are implying
because it wasn't required to answer the question.

In that sense, it is you who is being foolish for introducing subject
matter that is not relevant to the circumstances of the question being
asked.


It
was fortunate that a newbie around to correct the OP.

There was nothing to correct, because the question was simply about
the feasibility of connecting a pressurised cylinder to a combi
boiler. The answer to that is yes.

But then this
site exists for your mutual admiration, doesn't it, not for DIY
information, so that's OK.

It isn't a site, it is a Usenet group. If you wish to access it via
a web browser, that's up to you, but you lose most of the facilities
of using the technology properly.


If the OP employed a plumber, it would not follow that the plumber had
passed the recommended training course. Even if he had, it would not
follow that he would do the job correctly.

So tell us something that we don't know. The same thing applies to
any trade or profession.

There are just too many
knuckle-draggers in the heating trade.

That has become very apparent.



"We're not going to change just for you"

"Finish it. I really do wish you would."
I have. You lot really are boring.


Then I propose that you go and look for excitement elsewhere.

As I already told you, nobody is forcing you to read any thread or any
post.



..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

Andy Hall wrote in message . ..


No, it's completely correct as far as it goes. I didn't set out to
provide a complete solution because it was not requested or required..


It was not misleading at all in the context and for the purpose
intended, which was simply

Are you a politician?
You were wrong.

"Aidan" wrote in message
om...
Andy Hall wrote in messages

"The point was that it is you who is the newcomer into the
room........"

That is a red herring, i.e., it is irrelevant.

No it is not, or are you one of those people who on entering a room filled
with people demand that they only discuss what you want discussed and in the
way you want it discussed - if you bothered to read those parts of the
threads that you complain about you would see that through the 'banter' some
valuable information does in fact come through.

The relevant point is that this is still a DIY discussion room.

You really have not worked out how Usenet works, in reality what the group
is called is irrelevant, the group is what those posting to it make it.
Always has been and always will be I suspect. Don't like it, move on...


I've been reading posts here for about a year and posting occasionally
probably for about 6 months. You lot may have been posting here
longer, but that does not give you squatters' rights of ownership. You
consistently ruin many threads.

And in all that time you have not even learnt how to reply to messages
correctly, or how to even access the medium in a more suitable way - and
considering that both are free there is really no excuses, all you are doing
is showing up your own (dear I say, mental) deficiencies IMO....

snip

Finish it.

I wish you would !

You might not want to learn what a kill file is or how to use one, but I can
assure you that most people on Usenet do know both and are have no problems
using it, that said, I can see only one person in this thread heading for
inclusion in them and it's not myself, Andy, even IMM or any of the other
'regulars' who have replied to this thread - that leave only you...

As you keep saying, please finish this now, for your own credibility if
nothing else, you won't change how or what Usenet is, no one will (other
than state imposed censorship !).

"Aidan" wrote in message
om...
Andy Hall wrote in message
. ..


No, it's completely correct as far as it goes. I didn't set out to
provide a complete solution because it was not requested or required..


It was not misleading at all in the context and for the purpose
intended, which was simply

Are you a politician?
You were wrong.

And just who are you, by the sounds of it, another IMM,
'I am correct and everyone else is wrong'.

In article , Aidan
writes

Are you a politician?
You were wrong.

*plonk* another dimbulb joins DIMM in the twitlist.

--
..sigmonster on vacation

Andy Hall wrote in message . ..


Information of this type on various subjects is posted almost daily,
by various people.

Information of this type on Push-fit plumbing MIGHT have been posted
in this thread if it hadn't been hi-jacked at an early stage to post
your self-indulgent nonsense. I had more information but was lurking,
waiting to see what other had to say.

They are there and can easily be found. If you used a proper
newsreader, then you would have no difficulty at all.

OK, where is the information of this type on push-fit plumbing?
You have the newsreader, so educate me a little. Where do I find it?
Obviously, it is not in this thread.

On 10 Oct 2004 00:36:14 -0700, (Aidan) wrote:

Andy Hall wrote in message . ..


No, it's completely correct as far as it goes. I didn't set out to
provide a complete solution because it was not requested or required..


It was not misleading at all in the context and for the purpose
intended, which was simply

Are you a politician?
You were wrong.



No. As I told you, to the extent that I covered the topic, I was
correct. I didn't cover the arrangements for delivering water from
relief valves outside the house either, but it wasn't necessary to
answer the question to the extent needed.


..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"Aidan" wrote in message
om...
Andy Hall wrote in message
. ..


Information of this type on various subjects is posted almost daily,
by various people.

Information of this type on Push-fit plumbing MIGHT have been posted
in this thread if it hadn't been hi-jacked at an early stage to post
your self-indulgent nonsense. I had more information but was lurking,
waiting to see what other had to say.

So why didn't you post this most sic valuable information /sic and thus
cancel out some of the 'noise', rather than start making 'noise' of your own
?!..


They are there and can easily be found. If you used a proper
newsreader, then you would have no difficulty at all.

OK, where is the information of this type on push-fit plumbing?
You have the newsreader, so educate me a little. Where do I find it?
Obviously, it is not in this thread.

The point I suspect Andy is making is that in a decent (in fact almost any)
'newsreader' once a thread in the readers opinion has gone off topic it can
be deleted or hidden, unlike trying to use a web page to view the group were
all every message, in every thread is listed in all it's gore.

[1] with a couple of notable exception, were a message was marked for non
archiving and in binary groups, which are not archived AIUI.

On 10 Oct 2004 01:46:25 -0700, (Aidan) wrote:

Andy Hall wrote in message . ..


Information of this type on various subjects is posted almost daily,
by various people.

Information of this type on Push-fit plumbing MIGHT have been posted
in this thread if it hadn't been hi-jacked at an early stage to post
your self-indulgent nonsense.

It wasn't "hijacked at an early stage" or at any other for that matter

I had more information but was lurking,
waiting to see what other had to say.

If you had or have something useful to post then you should have
posted it. You are entirely at liberty to do so.

It's pointless commenting on the posts of others if you don't make a
useful contribution yourself.

So far all that you have done is claimed to be in some way experienced
and qualified but have not demonstrated or proved it - the ways to do
so are obvious.

This is an unmoderated Usenet group which is open to all to both write
and to read. It isn't a vehicle for professional advice.

In fact there are quite a large number of people here who are and are
known to be involved professionally in areas that benefit topics
discussed here. We have heating engineers, plumbers, electricians,
electrical engineers, structural engineers, cabinet makers, building
control officers, to name but a few. Without exception (so far),
those who do have a professional involvement in one of these areas do
not make a big noise about it and post information where appropriate.



They are there and can easily be found. If you used a proper
newsreader, then you would have no difficulty at all.

OK, where is the information of this type on push-fit plumbing?
You have the newsreader, so educate me a little. Where do I find it?
Obviously, it is not in this thread.


The point was about the appropriate method to work with Usenet
newsgroups.

Try typing 'usenet news readers' into your favourite search engine and
you will find plenty of them.


..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

In article ,
Aidan wrote:
Information of this type on Push-fit plumbing MIGHT have been posted
in this thread if it hadn't been hi-jacked at an early stage to post
your self-indulgent nonsense. I had more information but was lurking,
waiting to see what other had to say.

Another who thinks only he has the definitive knowledge on something...

--
*A backward poet writes inverse.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 10:08:28 +0100, ":::Jerry::::"
wrote:


The point I suspect Andy is making is that in a decent (in fact almost any)
'newsreader' once a thread in the readers opinion has gone off topic it can
be deleted or hidden, unlike trying to use a web page to view the group were
all every message, in every thread is listed in all it's gore.


Exactly. Thank you.


..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

Andy Hall wrote in message . ..

No. As I told you, to the extent that I covered the topic, I was
correct. I didn't cover the arrangements for delivering water from
relief valves outside the house either, but it wasn't necessary to
answer the question to the extent needed.


So, you shouldn't have told him the specific type of control valve
that he required? You were wrong to do that, then. You should have
limited your answer to 'Yes'.

You seem to have a problem confronting the fact that you have made a
mistake.

"Aidan" wrote in message
om...

snip

You seem to have a problem confronting the fact that you have made a
mistake.

LOL.. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black !

In article ,
Aidan wrote:
No. As I told you, to the extent that I covered the topic, I was
correct. I didn't cover the arrangements for delivering water from
relief valves outside the house either, but it wasn't necessary to
answer the question to the extent needed.


So, you shouldn't have told him the specific type of control valve
that he required? You were wrong to do that, then. You should have
limited your answer to 'Yes'.

You seem to have a problem confronting the fact that you have made a
mistake.

Seems to me if you have a comment on the advice given - or more advice to
give - you should go ahead and do it, instead of wasting all this space.
The very thing you're complaining about.

--
*The closest I ever got to a 4.0 in school was my blood alcohol content*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 10 Oct 2004 07:14:19 -0700, (Aidan) wrote:

Andy Hall wrote in message . ..

No. As I told you, to the extent that I covered the topic, I was
correct. I didn't cover the arrangements for delivering water from
relief valves outside the house either, but it wasn't necessary to
answer the question to the extent needed.


So, you shouldn't have told him the specific type of control valve
that he required? You were wrong to do that, then. You should have
limited your answer to 'Yes'.

I've already explained to you several times that the issue is
completely irrelevant because it was never going to be a DIY job in
the first place.



You seem to have a problem confronting the fact that you have made a
mistake.

Not really. It seems to me that you are trying to make an issue out
of absolutely nothing, while having nothing of value to contribute.

If you think that the issue of which controls are used is so
important, why don't you use your so-called professional expertise and
provide a detailed and documented solution suitable for a DIYer for
attaching a pressurised cylinder to a combi boiler.

Of course you should include references for the legislation and
relevant British or international standards that specify the types of
controls required and manufacturer part numbers.




..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"Aidan" wrote in message
om...
Andy Hall wrote in message
. ..

You seem to have a problem confronting
the fact that you have made a
mistake.

A mistake is when you know but don't do it properly. When you don't know in
the first place it is ignorance.

"IMM" wrote in message
...

"Aidan" wrote in message
om...
Andy Hall wrote in message
. ..

You seem to have a problem confronting
the fact that you have made a
mistake.

A mistake is when you know but don't do it properly. When you don't know
in
the first place it is ignorance.



So you don't make mistakes then... :~)

"Aidan" wrote in message
om...
Andy Hall wrote in message
. ..


Information of this type on various subjects is posted almost daily,
by various people.

Information of this type on Push-fit plumbing MIGHT have been posted
in this thread if it hadn't been hi-jacked at an early stage to post
your self-indulgent nonsense.

I have to say that generally Andy's posts are the most authoritative sources
of information (provided you can afford to buy the tools he suggests :-) but
if you see an Andy/IMM alternating thread just ignore it.

"Aidan" wrote in message
om...
Andy Hall wrote in message
. ..


Information of this type on various subjects is posted almost daily,
by various people.

Information of this type on Push-fit plumbing
MIGHT have been posted
in this thread

What do you want to know? Ask and I'll tell you.

Try a bit of top posting to get them really upset!!

Aidan wrote:
etc.

If you want sensible answers on push fit plumbing and quite a few other
topics, as you have found, this is frequently not the place to look for
them. I'd have put the signal to noise ratio as at least 1:1000 if
some 5 regular contributors waste space replying. Many of the group
regulars are still trapped in a socialising , pedantic, Canutic past
comfort zone, using 20th century bottom replying news readers and not
bothering to consider that some poor soul might be trying to follow the
rare worthwhile thread up on a Google group search, where the reply gets
cropped. They also suffer from serious repetition problems.

If you accept that usenet is a self expression forum widely used by
many people who have no other purpose in life, then you can reckon that
very few answers to a question will have any useful information after
the first 10 respondents. Additionally realise that critical comments
even when absolutely true will be attacked from all sides!! It has all
the characteristics of a political party, where truth is unacceptable!

IMM at least has a viewpoint which is frequently an original thought
provoking contribution even if perhaps sometimes a little impractical! I
just still can't get to grips with the concept of tangoing up a ladder
in a tutu to fail to install push fit plumbing and two combi's! (LOL)

I've probably been killfiled as a heretic by most of the respondents
concerned, which I can only regard as a blessing. I think you might
consider it the same way. I don't bother to killfile anyone, they
might one day, hopefully, produce something useful.

My only experiences of push fit plumbing are with a shower pump, where
the fittings are all brass and extremely rigid, this has been a short
term success1yr) and a shower cubicle, where the factory fitted plastic
push fit system has leaked like a sieve and I have not yet got around to
sorting out where the problem really lies. I suspect that the problems
with push fit on copper piping, lies with the rigidity of the fittings
and the probability of the tube not being truly circular. There appear
to be too many reports of joints falling apart for me to be prepared to
use these fittings in my own house. As the old adage goes "If the
product is obsolete it's reliable!"

It's always worth asking the question again with a few weeks gap, to
get a perhaps new set of answers from different contributors. I've never
seen a fully sensible set of answers on any newsgroup, so ukdiy conforms
to the norm.

Nice to see a real viewpoint.

Regards
Capitol

"Capitol" wrote in message
...
snip

If you want sensible answers on push fit plumbing and quite a few other
topics, as you have found, this is frequently not the place to look for
them. I'd have put the signal to noise ratio as at least 1:1000 if
some 5 regular contributors waste space replying. Many of the group
regulars are still trapped in a socialising , pedantic, Canutic past
comfort zone, using 20th century bottom replying news readers and not
bothering to consider that some poor soul might be trying to follow the
rare worthwhile thread up on a Google group search, where the reply gets
cropped. They also suffer from serious repetition problems.
snip

Well if you must use inappropriate means of accessing the medium you deserve
all the grief you get !..

You wouldn't plumb a water system using electrical conduit, you shouldn't be
accessing Usenet via the web. Google group search is primarily designed for
accessing archived messages that your NNTP server has deleted or for
research purposes - noting more and nothing less.

BTW, at.troll is that way ==