How to get 4 cables into this CU?

Metal CU has clearances of:
top 4"
bottom 4"
right: 0
left: plenty, but the tails run up there.

A christmas-tree cone bit is at least 2" long, leaving little space for a drill for top or bottom.
Right is possible by drilling through what it's up against, but the result would look lousy.
Left there's enough space in theory, but a lot of hand held drilling with a large bit very close to tails? Not loving that idea.
Looked at cutting into the front edge rather than using round entry glands, but not seeing fireproof grommet strip anywhere.

Suggestions welcome!

On 29/04/2020 09:54, wrote:
How to get 4 cables into this CU?

Metal CU has clearances of:
top 4"
bottom 4"
right: 0
left: plenty, but the tails run up there.

A christmas-tree cone bit is at least 2" long, leaving little space for a drill for top or bottom.
Right is possible by drilling through what it's up against, but the result would look lousy.
Left there's enough space in theory, but a lot of hand held drilling with a large bit very close to tails? Not loving that idea.
Looked at cutting into the front edge rather than using round entry glands, but not seeing fireproof grommet strip anywhere.

Suggestions welcome!


Q max punch?

Example
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Q-Max-SHE...MAAOSwPaNdB4Is

or

https://tinyurl.com/y8xv4wtl

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On 29/04/2020 10:01, alan_m wrote:


Q max punch?

Smaller hole still required to fit punch but could that be done by
drilling from inside of the box?


--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On Wednesday, 29 April 2020 10:02:00 UTC+1, alan_m wrote:
On 29/04/2020 09:54, tabbypurr wrote:
How to get 4 cables into this CU?

Metal CU has clearances of:
top 4"
bottom 4"
right: 0
left: plenty, but the tails run up there.

A christmas-tree cone bit is at least 2" long, leaving little space for a drill for top or bottom.
Right is possible by drilling through what it's up against, but the result would look lousy.
Left there's enough space in theory, but a lot of hand held drilling with a large bit very close to tails? Not loving that idea.
Looked at cutting into the front edge rather than using round entry glands, but not seeing fireproof grommet strip anywhere.

Suggestions welcome!


Q max punch?

Example
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Q-Max-SHE...MAAOSwPaNdB4Is

or

https://tinyurl.com/y8xv4wtl

Interesting. Last time I used those, long ago, they severely distorted the sheet they were punching. Is there some way to avoid that?


NT

On 29/04/2020 10:14, wrote:

Interesting. Last time I used those, long ago, they severely distorted the sheet they were punching. Is there some way to avoid that?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxQE6mtRWCk

I've used them in the past without problems but are you sure that it was
the punch causing the distortion or you applying a sideways force to the
whole punch assembly and twisting the metal.

You can get a Q-MAX Thrust Race to make winding in the punch much easier
and possibly help with with any unwanted forces you apply to the
structure you are working on

Google "Q-MAX Thrust Race"


--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk
rather than

On Wednesday, 29 April 2020 11:29:12 UTC+1, alan_m wrote:
On 29/04/2020 10:14, tabbypurr wrote:

Interesting. Last time I used those, long ago, they severely distorted the sheet they were punching. Is there some way to avoid that?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxQE6mtRWCk

I've used them in the past without problems but are you sure that it was
the punch causing the distortion or you applying a sideways force to the
whole punch assembly and twisting the metal.

the metal was in free air, and the punch tightened with spanners. The problem is that the punch cutting edge is not flat, so as it pushes 2 parts of the potential hole, the whole sheet wanted to follow it & get very bent. I know punches sometimes work, but IMLE with them you need a lot of surrounding metal to resist that urge to bend horribly.


You can get a Q-MAX Thrust Race to make winding in the punch much easier
and possibly help with with any unwanted forces you apply to the
structure you are working on

sure, not sure it's worth it for 1 or 2 holes.


NT

On Wed, 29 Apr 2020 11:14:53 -0700, tabbypurr wrote:

On Wednesday, 29 April 2020 11:29:12 UTC+1, alan_m wrote:
On 29/04/2020 10:14, tabbypurr wrote:

Interesting. Last time I used those, long ago, they severely
distorted the sheet they were punching. Is there some way to avoid
that?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxQE6mtRWCk

I've used them in the past without problems but are you sure that it
was the punch causing the distortion or you applying a sideways force
to the whole punch assembly and twisting the metal.

the metal was in free air, and the punch tightened with spanners. The
problem is that the punch cutting edge is not flat, so as it pushes 2
parts of the potential hole, the whole sheet wanted to follow it & get
very bent. I know punches sometimes work, but IMLE with them you need a
lot of surrounding metal to resist that urge to bend horribly.


You can get a Q-MAX Thrust Race to make winding in the punch much
easier and possibly help with with any unwanted forces you apply to the
structure you are working on

sure, not sure it's worth it for 1 or 2 holes.


NT

Cor! I used to cut holes in folded brass chassis for B7G and B9A valve
bases with Q-Max cutters sixty years ago......didn't know you could still
get them.

In article ,
wrote:
Interesting. Last time I used those, long ago, they severely distorted
the sheet they were punching. Is there some way to avoid that?

Get some decent quality ones? If the tolerances are poor, it won't shear
accurately.

--
*I believe five out of four people have trouble with fractions. *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

It might be easier to simply pull the CU off the wall, this of course means pulling the DNOs service fuse but will also give you the opportunity to fit a separate isolator switch. I would not worry about anybody Complaining about it, I did it and when the guy came to fit the smart meter he said nothing and resealed the fuse afterwards as well as the isolator switch.

Richard

On Thursday, 30 April 2020 11:46:56 UTC+1, Tricky Dicky wrote:

It might be easier to simply pull the CU off the wall, this of course means pulling the DNOs service fuse but will also give you the opportunity to fit a separate isolator switch. I would not worry about anybody Complaining about it, I did it and when the guy came to fit the smart meter he said nothing and resealed the fuse afterwards as well as the isolator switch.

Richard

At the moment the most interesting options look like removing the mounting screws or cutting a temporary wooden guard panel & drilling the left.


Cheers everyone.

On 30/04/2020 11:46, Tricky Dicky wrote:
It might be easier to simply pull the CU off the wall, this of course means pulling the DNOs service fuse but will also give you the opportunity to fit a separate isolator switch. I would not worry about anybody Complaining about it, I did it and when the guy came to fit the smart meter he said nothing and resealed the fuse afterwards as well as the isolator switch.




Or simpler still just remove the tails and drill some holes?

--
Adam

On Thursday, 30 April 2020 11:37:57 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
tabbypurr wrote:

Interesting. Last time I used those, long ago, they severely distorted
the sheet they were punching. Is there some way to avoid that?

Get some decent quality ones? If the tolerances are poor, it won't shear
accurately.

The ones I was using were the Qmax you recommended.

In article ,
wrote:
On Thursday, 30 April 2020 11:37:57 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
tabbypurr wrote:

Interesting. Last time I used those, long ago, they severely
distorted the sheet they were punching. Is there some way to avoid
that?

Get some decent quality ones? If the tolerances are poor, it won't
shear accurately.

The ones I was using were the Qmax you recommended.

What were you cutting? I've made loads and loads of holes with them in
various materials and not had a problem with distortion. Assuming you took
care using them, as it would obviously be possible to bend sheet steel by
the action of turning them with a spanner, etc. In thin sheet, where it
matters, I tend to use a T handle driver.

--
*No husband has ever been shot while doing the dishes *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Have you ever spent longer getting the bit you punched out of the cutting
tool than cutting the hole in the first place? Grin.
Brian

--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"alan_m" wrote in message
...
On 29/04/2020 09:54, wrote:
How to get 4 cables into this CU?

Metal CU has clearances of:
top 4"
bottom 4"
right: 0
left: plenty, but the tails run up there.

A christmas-tree cone bit is at least 2" long, leaving little space for a
drill for top or bottom.
Right is possible by drilling through what it's up against, but the
result would look lousy.
Left there's enough space in theory, but a lot of hand held drilling with
a large bit very close to tails? Not loving that idea.
Looked at cutting into the front edge rather than using round entry
glands, but not seeing fireproof grommet strip anywhere.

Suggestions welcome!


Q max punch?

Example
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Q-Max-SHE...MAAOSwPaNdB4Is

or

https://tinyurl.com/y8xv4wtl

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On 29/04/2020 11:06, Brian Gaff (Sofa 2) wrote:
Have you ever spent longer getting the bit you punched out of the cutting
tool than cutting the hole in the first place? Grin.
Brian



I usually have that problem with hole saws into wood

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On Wednesday, 29 April 2020 09:54:31 UTC+1, wrote:
How to get 4 cables into this CU?

Photo please :-)

Can you unfix it from the wall and pull it forward?

Owain

wrote:

How to get 4 cables into this CU?

armeg holesaw, doesn't need separate arbor so shorter (use with right
angle drill if possible)

https://screwfix.com/p/armeg-acceler8/1009r

On 29/04/2020 10:19, Andy Burns wrote:
wrote:

How to get 4 cables into this CU?

armeg holesaw, doesn't need separate arbor so shorter (use with right
angle drill if possible)

https://screwfix.com/p/armeg-acceler8/1009r

The absolute best.

Did I show you them at ELEX or did you already know about them? I cannot
remember.

Also they do not fly through the hole you have just cut as they have a
wider diameter base than the hole you have cut.

Both CK and Starrett now have similar (first links I could find)

https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/FXSSH20.html?

https://www.buildingsuppliesdirect.c...w-20mm-bf1320?

Its worth noting that they fit impact drivers (the Armeg one does) which
are usually smaller than a cordless drill if space is tight.

Usually when cutting into a DB or trunking full of cables I use the
floorboard lifter as protection against against the hole cutter causing
any damage.

--
Adam

ARW wrote:

Did I show you them at ELEX

Yes, you did ...

Both CK and Starrett now have similar

cheaper too.

On 29/04/2020 09:54, wrote:
How to get 4 cables into this CU?

Metal CU has clearances of:
top 4"
bottom 4"
right: 0
left: plenty, but the tails run up there.

A christmas-tree cone bit is at least 2" long, leaving little space for a drill for top or bottom.
Right is possible by drilling through what it's up against, but the result would look lousy.
Left there's enough space in theory, but a lot of hand held drilling with a large bit very close to tails? Not loving that idea.
Looked at cutting into the front edge rather than using round entry glands, but not seeing fireproof grommet strip anywhere.

Suggestions welcome!

Aren't there any knock-outs to, errr, knock-out?
If not, you could get a nibbler into a 4" gap and then improvise grommet
strip from anything suitable (saw blade protector, slit sleeving, T&E
outer ...) and then use high-temp silicone to form a seal.
I have a hand nibbler and also one that goes onto a drill, for this job
I'd use the latter. Mine is one of these:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Falcon-Ni...-/250816902636
but bought 10-15 years ago and much used for sheet metal work.

On Wednesday, 29 April 2020 11:32:00 UTC+1, wrote:
On 29/04/2020 09:54, tabbypurr wrote:

How to get 4 cables into this CU?

Metal CU has clearances of:
top 4"
bottom 4"
right: 0
left: plenty, but the tails run up there.

A christmas-tree cone bit is at least 2" long, leaving little space for a drill for top or bottom.
Right is possible by drilling through what it's up against, but the result would look lousy.
Left there's enough space in theory, but a lot of hand held drilling with a large bit very close to tails? Not loving that idea.
Looked at cutting into the front edge rather than using round entry glands, but not seeing fireproof grommet strip anywhere.

Suggestions welcome!

Aren't there any knock-outs to, errr, knock-out?

It looks like there are, but I can only conclude they weren't pressed deep enough, as the whole box starts to bend under great force before those bits show any interest in moving.


If not, you could get a nibbler into a 4" gap and then improvise grommet
strip from anything suitable (saw blade protector, slit sleeving, T&E
outer ...) and then use high-temp silicone to form a seal.
I have a hand nibbler and also one that goes onto a drill, for this job
I'd use the latter. Mine is one of these:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Falcon-Ni...-/250816902636
but bought 10-15 years ago and much used for sheet metal work.

Interesting.


NT

On 29/04/2020 19:18, wrote:

It looks like there are, but I can only conclude they weren't pressed deep enough, as the whole box starts to bend under great force before those bits show any interest in moving.

Is it similar with metal back boxes for sockets or switches where the
trick seems to be to knock out the blanking plug by giving it a quick
shock? Place the blade of a suitably sized screwdriver on the blanking
plug and hit the handle of the screwdriver with a hammer.


--
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In article ,
alan_m wrote:
On 29/04/2020 19:18, wrote:

It looks like there are, but I can only conclude they weren't pressed
deep enough, as the whole box starts to bend under great force before
those bits show any interest in moving.

Is it similar with metal back boxes for sockets or switches where the
trick seems to be to knock out the blanking plug by giving it a quick
shock? Place the blade of a suitably sized screwdriver on the blanking
plug and hit the handle of the screwdriver with a hammer.

I tend to bash it with the end of the cutters. ;-)

--
*Indian Driver - Smoke signals only*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 04/05/2020 13:27, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
alan_m wrote:
On 29/04/2020 19:18, wrote:

It looks like there are, but I can only conclude they weren't pressed
deep enough, as the whole box starts to bend under great force before
those bits show any interest in moving.

Is it similar with metal back boxes for sockets or switches where the
trick seems to be to knock out the blanking plug by giving it a quick
shock? Place the blade of a suitably sized screwdriver on the blanking
plug and hit the handle of the screwdriver with a hammer.

I tend to bash it with the end of the cutters. ;-)


That will not work on the old Eaton kit.

--
Adam

On Wednesday, 29 April 2020 11:32:00 UTC+1, wrote:

Aren't there any knock-outs to, errr, knock-out?
If not, you could get a nibbler into a 4" gap and then improvise grommet
strip from anything suitable (saw blade protector, slit sleeving, T&E
outer ...) and then use high-temp silicone to form a seal.

Is that 18th edition passable?

On 29/04/2020 19:20, wrote:
On Wednesday, 29 April 2020 11:32:00 UTC+1, wrote:

Aren't there any knock-outs to, errr, knock-out?
If not, you could get a nibbler into a 4" gap and then improvise grommet
strip from anything suitable (saw blade protector, slit sleeving, T&E
outer ...) and then use high-temp silicone to form a seal.

Is that 18th edition passable?

I can't give a categorical "yes", but also can't see why not. The cable
is protected from the metal edge by the improvised grommet strip and the
hole is sealed and fireproof.
Hmm, I typed "high-temp silicone", but I meant "fire-retardant silicone"
- like this
https://www.screwfix.com/p/no-nonsen...te-310ml/4019x

In article ,
wrote:
How to get 4 cables into this CU?

Metal CU has clearances of:
top 4"
bottom 4"
right: 0
left: plenty, but the tails run up there.

A christmas-tree cone bit is at least 2" long, leaving little space for a drill for top or bottom.
Right is possible by drilling through what it's up against, but the result would look lousy.
Left there's enough space in theory, but a lot of hand held drilling with a large bit very close to tails? Not loving that idea.
Looked at cutting into the front edge rather than using round entry glands, but not seeing fireproof grommet strip anywhere.

Suggestions welcome!

A Q-Max cutter. Needs very little clearance once you have the pilot hole.
And gives a perfect hole.

--
*Do paediatricians play miniature golf on Wednesdays?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.