When it comes to mains sockets with integrated USB power supplies do they only get powered up when a USB plug is inserted ala shaver sockets? I am considering putting one in a kitchen island which would be used very infrequently and hence would rather it not be sitting there wasting power (presumably very little) and not representing a fire risk (perhaps more a concern given how often USB power supplies have been found to be the cause of domestic fires).

The rest of our sockets are Volex and so that'd be my starting point for one, but would switch to another if this feature wasn't standard.

In article ,
Mathew Newton wrote:
When it comes to mains sockets with integrated USB power supplies do
they only get powered up when a USB plug is inserted ala shaver sockets?
I am considering putting one in a kitchen island which would be used
very infrequently and hence would rather it not be sitting there wasting
power (presumably very little) and not representing a fire risk (perhaps
more a concern given how often USB power supplies have been found to be
the cause of domestic fires).

The rest of our sockets are Volex and so that'd be my starting point for
one, but would switch to another if this feature wasn't standard.

All sockets should be mounted in a fire proof box. Conforming to regs.

I'm sure they do take a tiny current at all times. But then so will lots
of things in your house. Like the clock in your oven, etc. TV if left
plugged in and switched on at the socket.

--
*WOULD A FLY WITHOUT WINGS BE CALLED A WALK?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sunday, 27 October 2019 10:28:35 UTC, Mathew Newton wrote:
When it comes to mains sockets with integrated USB power supplies do they only get powered up when a USB plug is inserted ala shaver sockets? I am considering putting one in a kitchen island which would be used very infrequently and hence would rather it not be sitting there wasting power (presumably very little) and not representing a fire risk (perhaps more a concern given how often USB power supplies have been found to be the cause of domestic fires).

The rest of our sockets are Volex and so that'd be my starting point for one, but would switch to another if this feature wasn't standard.

they normally run 24/7


NT

Mathew Newton wrote:
When it comes to mains sockets with integrated USB power supplies do they
only get powered up when a USB plug is inserted ala shaver sockets? I am
considering putting one in a kitchen island which would be used very
infrequently and hence would rather it not be sitting there wasting power
(presumably very little) and not representing a fire risk (perhaps more a
concern given how often USB power supplies have been found to be the
cause of domestic fires).

The rest of our sockets are Volex and so that'd be my starting point for
one, but would switch to another if this feature wasn't standard.


All the ones Ive seen lack any kind of switch.

They use a switch mode PSU and tend to be very efficient so, unless you are
charging something, the standby power is really naff all.

As for fire risk, while nothing is ever 100% risk free in this respect, if
you by a decent make etc and install it in correctly ( they should be in a
fire proof back box) they are almost certainly safer than leaving USB
charger plugged in, even when in use.

Personally, I think the batteries pose a greater risk while on charge- the
real horror stories generally involve batteries rather than just chargers
if you look at the details.

On 27/10/2019 10:28, Mathew Newton wrote:
When it comes to mains sockets with integrated USB power supplies do they only get powered up when a USB plug is inserted ala shaver sockets? I am considering putting one in a kitchen island which would be used very infrequently and hence would rather it not be sitting there wasting power (presumably very little) and not representing a fire risk (perhaps more a concern given how often USB power supplies have been found to be the cause of domestic fires).

The rest of our sockets are Volex and so that'd be my starting point for one, but would switch to another if this feature wasn't standard.


MK make shuttered USB charger modules. When nothing is inserted the
shutter closes and completely disconnects the charging circuitry.

(Not that cheap, and don't include 13A 3-pin sockets)

--
Reentrant

Mathew Newton wrote

When it comes to mains sockets with integrated USB power supplies do
they only get powered up when a USB plug is inserted ala shaver sockets?

Hardly ever.

I am considering putting one in a kitchen island which would be
used very infrequently and hence would rather it not be sitting
there wasting power (presumably very little) and not representing
a fire risk (perhaps more a concern given how often USB power
supplies have been found to be the cause of domestic fires).

Then it would be better not to have one.

The rest of our sockets are Volex and so that'd be my starting point
for one, but would switch to another if this feature wasn't standard.

On Mon, 28 Oct 2019 04:32:35 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


Then it would be better not to have one.

It would be better for you to just shut your stupid senile gob, "Chang", you
nym-shifting senile Ozzie pest! BG

--
addressing nym-shifting senile Rodent:
"You on the other hand are a heavyweight bull****ter who demonstrates
your particular prowess at it every day."
MID:

It is always on, at least all the ones I've seen are basically mini wall
warts of the switch mode which interfere with almost everything just wired
across the mains with a thermal cut out.

What is wrong with just using a normal wall wart and unplugging it?
Brian

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"Mathew Newton" wrote in message
...
When it comes to mains sockets with integrated USB power supplies do they
only get powered up when a USB plug is inserted ala shaver sockets? I am
considering putting one in a kitchen island which would be used very
infrequently and hence would rather it not be sitting there wasting power
(presumably very little) and not representing a fire risk (perhaps more a
concern given how often USB power supplies have been found to be the cause
of domestic fires).

The rest of our sockets are Volex and so that'd be my starting point for
one, but would switch to another if this feature wasn't standard.

On Sunday, 27 October 2019 11:46:32 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

All sockets should be mounted in a fire proof box. Conforming to regs.

That's an interesting point; are plastic plasterboard back boxes considered fireproof? Indeed are metal ones even given they gave holes in them?

Incidentally, this socket would be going in the side of a kitchen island and so would arguably be even more warranting of protection given the flammable surrounding materials.

I'm also not sure about some shaver sockets. One which a friend ripped out
of a bathroom a while back had an isolating transformer in it for whatever
reason, now obviously its not going touse much, but it must have been using
something.
Brian

--
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This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
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Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
wrote in message
...
On Sunday, 27 October 2019 10:28:35 UTC, Mathew Newton wrote:
When it comes to mains sockets with integrated USB power supplies do they
only get powered up when a USB plug is inserted ala shaver sockets? I am
considering putting one in a kitchen island which would be used very
infrequently and hence would rather it not be sitting there wasting power
(presumably very little) and not representing a fire risk (perhaps more a
concern given how often USB power supplies have been found to be the cause
of domestic fires).

The rest of our sockets are Volex and so that'd be my starting point for
one, but would switch to another if this feature wasn't standard.

they normally run 24/7


NT

On Sunday, 27 October 2019 20:01:36 UTC, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
I'm also not sure about some shaver sockets. One which a friend ripped out
of a bathroom a while back had an isolating transformer in it for whatever
reason, now obviously its not going touse much, but it must have been using
something.
Brian

--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
wrote in message
...
On Sunday, 27 October 2019 10:28:35 UTC, Mathew Newton wrote:
When it comes to mains sockets with integrated USB power supplies do they
only get powered up when a USB plug is inserted ala shaver sockets? I am
considering putting one in a kitchen island which would be used very
infrequently and hence would rather it not be sitting there wasting power
(presumably very little) and not representing a fire risk (perhaps more a
concern given how often USB power supplies have been found to be the cause
of domestic fires).

The rest of our sockets are Volex and so that'd be my starting point for
one, but would switch to another if this feature wasn't standard.

they normally run 24/7


NT

Our shaver sockets switch off when nothing is plugged in. I thoight that was pretty common, if not universal.

On Sunday, 27 October 2019 19:58:34 UTC, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
It is always on, at least all the ones I've seen are basically mini wall
warts of the switch mode which interfere with almost everything just wired
across the mains with a thermal cut out.

What is wrong with just using a normal wall wart and unplugging it?
Brian

A USB double-socket allows two mains devices AND two (or more) USB devices to be plugged in at the same time. Using wall warts means that the mains sockets are occupied.

polygonum_on_google wrote:

A USB double-socket allows two mains devices AND two (or more) USB devices to be plugged in at the same time. Using wall warts means that the mains sockets are occupied.

You can get a dual USB charger with 13A passthrough
https://www.amazon.co.uk/SRGAUSBPB22/dp/B00N63FTMC

"Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)" wrote:
I'm also not sure about some shaver sockets. One which a friend ripped out
of a bathroom a while back had an isolating transformer in it for whatever
reason, now obviously its not going touse much, but it must have been using
something.

Er, that's the whole point of a shaver socket, it has an isolating
transformer in it so that 'mains' voltage is (relatively) safe in the
bathroom.

--
Chris Green
·

In article , Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)
wrote:
I'm also not sure about some shaver sockets. One which a friend ripped
out of a bathroom a while back had an isolating transformer in it for
whatever reason,

The reason is so that you don't have a live socket beside a wash basin
which might well contain water.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On Sunday, 27 October 2019 20:49:15 UTC, charles wrote:
In article , Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)
wrote:

I'm also not sure about some shaver sockets. One which a friend ripped
out of a bathroom a while back had an isolating transformer in it for
whatever reason,

The reason is so that you don't have a live socket beside a wash basin
which might well contain water.

you still have that. But it becomes independantly floating IT rather than earthed neutral. There is some useful safety benefit, but it doesn't remove all shock risk.


NT

In article ,
Reentrant wrote:
MK make shuttered USB charger modules. When nothing is inserted the
shutter closes and completely disconnects the charging circuitry.

Wonder about the service life of such switches?

--
*Nostalgia isn't what is used to be.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
says...

polygonum_on_google wrote:

A USB double-socket allows two mains devices AND two (or more) USB devices to be plugged in at the same time. Using wall warts means that the mains sockets are occupied.

You can get a dual USB charger with 13A passthrough
https://www.amazon.co.uk/SRGAUSBPB22/dp/B00N63FTMC

Poundland do one in white for £2 and I've got a similar one,
also £2, which I think came from Wilko.

--

Terry

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

On 27/10/2019 20:00, Mathew Newton wrote:
On Sunday, 27 October 2019 11:46:32 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

All sockets should be mounted in a fire proof box. Conforming to regs.

That's an interesting point; are plastic plasterboard back boxes considered fireproof? Indeed are metal ones even given they gave holes in them?

Incidentally, this socket would be going in the side of a kitchen island and so would arguably be even more warranting of protection given the flammable surrounding materials.


You can buy intumescent dry liners.

--
Adam

On Sunday, 27 October 2019 20:10:04 UTC, Andy Burns wrote:
polygonum_on_google wrote:

A USB double-socket allows two mains devices AND two (or more) USB devices to be plugged in at the same time. Using wall warts means that the mains sockets are occupied.

You can get a dual USB charger with 13A passthrough
https://www.amazon.co.uk/SRGAUSBPB22/dp/B00N63FTMC

True - but it is still something extra. And it is plugly. And it is quite expensive for what it is.

polygonum_on_google wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/SRGAUSBPB22/dp/B00N63FTMC

quite expensive for what it is.

Normal sockets would stay in place for decades, USB has a habit of
changing connectors, voltages or currents every couple of years, how
much more often will sockets with USB need replacing?

I guess they won't run that cool, being enclosed.

Andy Burns wrote:
polygonum_on_google wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/SRGAUSBPB22/dp/B00N63FTMC

quite expensive for what it is.

Normal sockets would stay in place for decades, USB has a habit of
changing connectors, voltages or currents every couple of years, how
much more often will sockets with USB need replacing?

I guess they won't run that cool, being enclosed.

How cool they run would depend on their efficiency, and/or their power
consumption when not providing power to a load.

--
Chris Green
·

In article ,
Andy Burns wrote:
Normal sockets would stay in place for decades, USB has a habit of
changing connectors, voltages or currents every couple of years, how
much more often will sockets with USB need replacing?

The USB outlets on my sockets are identical to the very first USB one I
ever saw. Voltage still 5v.

The USB inputs (as regards charging etc) do have several varieties. But
you'd have the correct lead for that.

I'm sure you can buy a device that uses apparently USB, but needs a
dedicated charger. If you are silly enough to do so.

--
*Don't byte off more than you can view *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

The USB outlets on my sockets are identical to the very first USB one I
ever saw. Voltage still 5v.


currents vary from original 500mA, 1A, 2A, several variants of
QC/QC2/QC3, some devices will start to insist on USB-C to get up to 20V
at up to 5A.


several laptops now run/charge over USB, rather than a coaxial power plug.

In article ,
Andy Burns wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

The USB outlets on my sockets are identical to the very first USB one I
ever saw. Voltage still 5v.


currents vary from original 500mA, 1A, 2A, several variants of
QC/QC2/QC3, some devices will start to insist on USB-C to get up to 20V
at up to 5A.

True. But I've not found any USB charging device I've got complain about
having a 2 amp supply. rather than 500mA.


several laptops now run/charge over USB, rather than a coaxial power plug.

It comes as no surprise that a maker doesn't want to follow a standard.

--
*TEAMWORK...means never having to take all the blame yourself *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article , Dave Plowman (News)
wrote:
In article , Andy Burns
wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

The USB outlets on my sockets are identical to the very first USB one
I ever saw. Voltage still 5v.


currents vary from original 500mA, 1A, 2A, several variants of
QC/QC2/QC3, some devices will start to insist on USB-C to get up to 20V
at up to 5A.

True. But I've not found any USB charging device I've got complain about
having a 2 amp supply. rather than 500mA.


several laptops now run/charge over USB, rather than a coaxial power
plug.

It comes as no surprise that a maker doesn't want to follow a standard.

a coaxial mains plug a standard ? At least 4 different sizes and lots of
different voltages.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

several laptops now run/charge over USB, rather than a coaxial power plug.

It comes as no surprise that a maker doesn't want to follow a standard.

But USB-PD *is* a standard designed to allow just that sort of thing
(although implementations appear to be somewhat sloppy)

On Monday, 28 October 2019 17:58:20 UTC, ARW wrote:

Incidentally, this socket would be going in the side of a kitchen island and so would arguably be even more warranting of protection given the flammable surrounding materials.


You can buy intumescent dry liners.

Yes, just found those - they seem ideal for this application.

On 29/10/2019 14:27, Andy Burns wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

The USB outlets on my sockets are identical to the very first USB one I
ever saw. Voltage still 5v.


currents vary from original 500mA, 1A, 2A, several variants of
QC/QC2/QC3, some devices will start to insist on USB-C to get up to 20V
at up to 5A.


several laptops now run/charge over USB, rather than a coaxial power plug.

https://www.scolmore.com/technical_s...%20Modules.pdf

Is what we have fitted at a few places (not houses)

--
Adam

On 29/10/2019 17:30, Mathew Newton wrote:
On Monday, 28 October 2019 17:58:20 UTC, ARW wrote:

Incidentally, this socket would be going in the side of a kitchen island and so would arguably be even more warranting of protection given the flammable surrounding materials.


You can buy intumescent dry liners.

Yes, just found those - they seem ideal for this application.


I agree.

You can also get intumescent liners/covers that are cheaper.

Just get whatever will suit your needs.

--
Adam

On Tuesday, 29 October 2019 08:01:55 UTC, Andy Burns wrote:
polygonum_on_google wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/SRGAUSBPB22/dp/B00N63FTMC

quite expensive for what it is.

Normal sockets would stay in place for decades, USB has a habit of
changing connectors, voltages or currents every couple of years, how
much more often will sockets with USB need replacing?

I guess they won't run that cool, being enclosed.

Maybe get the Jamaican ones?

On 29/10/2019 08:01, Andy Burns wrote:
polygonum_on_google wrote:

Andy BurnsÂ* wrote:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/SRGAUSBPB22/dp/B00N63FTMC

Â*quite expensive for what it is.

Normal sockets would stay in place for decades,Â* USB has a habit of
changing connectors, voltages or currents every couple of years, how
much more often will sockets with USB need replacing?

USB voltage has remained the same throughout. The current it can supply
has increased a number of times, but devices will still charge at lower
currents - they'll just take longer. The connector changes only require
a different lead, the charger end remains the same.

I guess they won't run that cool, being enclosed.

Yes. I don't think the life of them will be very good - but they'll
carry on working as mains sockets.

SteveW

Steve Walker wrote:

USB voltage has remained the same throughout.

Not really, initial standard was 5V, the qualcom proprietary quick
charging uses higher voltages, as does the standards based USB Power
Delivery (both up to 20V by negotiation)

On 29/10/2019 22:00, Andy Burns wrote:
Steve Walker wrote:

USB voltage has remained the same throughout.

Not really, initial standard was 5V, the qualcom proprietary quick
charging uses higher voltages, as does the standards based USB Power
Delivery (both up to 20V by negotiation)

While that might be useful for a laptop, there's no good reason for
phones, tablets, satnavs and host of other USB devices to have the added
complexity of a move from a basic 5V supply. I am happy enough to plug a
dedicated PSU in for a laptop.

SteveW

Steve Walker wrote:
While that might be useful for a laptop, there's no good reason for
phones, tablets, satnavs and host of other USB devices to have the added
complexity of a move from a basic 5V supply. I am happy enough to plug a
dedicated PSU in for a laptop.

The good reason is for the ~10Wh battery in a phone to charge in half an
hour - even more so for a tablet where the batteries can be up to 40Wh. A
fill on a standard 5V 2.1A charger would take at least 4 hours, while a
USB-C PD charger can do it in just over an hour.

All modern devices already have the complexity - a switching regulator able
to accept different voltage inputs - already inside them.

Theo

On Sunday, 27 October 2019 19:58:34 UTC, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
It is always on, at least all the ones I've seen are basically mini wall
warts of the switch mode which interfere with almost everything just wired
across the mains with a thermal cut out.

You can lose/mislay them is the main problem, kick them out of the socket, cats can use them as scratch blocks. Sometimes they can be borrowed and not returned when you most need them.
But I still prefer them generally speaking.


What is wrong with just using a normal wall wart and unplugging it?
Brian