AFAICS there is nothing preventing a regular wallplate switch being used
to control an electrically-heated towel rail in a bathroom provided that
the switch is outside zone 2 and the installation is protected by a 30mA
RCD. Have I missed anything?

On 23/07/2019 21:55, wrote:
AFAICS there is nothing preventing a regular wallplate switch being used
to control an electrically-heated towel rail in a bathroom provided that
the switch is outside zone 2 and the installation is protected by a 30mA
RCD. Have I missed anything?




Are all the electrics in the bathroom "protected" with a 30mA RCD?

--
Adam

On 23/07/2019 22:58, ARW wrote:
On 23/07/2019 21:55, wrote:
AFAICS there is nothing preventing a regular wallplate switch being
used to control an electrically-heated towel rail in a bathroom
provided that the switch is outside zone 2 and the installation is
protected by a 30mA RCD. Have I missed anything?




Are all the electrics in the bathroom "protected" with a 30mA RCD?

Yes, the whole house is on 30mA RCDs

On 23/07/2019 21:55, wrote:
AFAICS there is nothing preventing a regular wallplate switch being used
to control an electrically-heated towel rail in a bathroom provided that
the switch is outside zone 2 and the installation is protected by a 30mA
RCD. Have I missed anything?

Answering my own question ... although there is nothing specifically
against it there is the general provision that every item of equipment
is to be of a design appropriate to the situation in which it is to be
used, or its mode of installation shall take account of the conditions
likely to be encountered. Condensation is a concern so I'll put the FCU
outside the room.

On 24/07/2019 13:46, wrote:
On 23/07/2019 21:55, wrote:
AFAICS there is nothing preventing a regular wallplate switch being
used to control an electrically-heated towel rail in a bathroom
provided that the switch is outside zone 2 and the installation is
protected by a 30mA RCD. Have I missed anything?

Answering my own question ... although there is nothing specifically
against it there is the general provision that every item of equipment
is to be of a design appropriate to the situation in which it is to be
used, or its mode of installation shall take account of the conditions
likely to be encountered. Condensation is a concern so I'll put the FCU
outside the room.

It was one that I was questioned about on a NICEIC inspection a few
years ago.

I answered the question correctly about the zones and then said I would
not fit the switch in the same place in a hotel, youth hostel, scout hut
etc as the fit for use might be different to a professionals apartment.

Condensation was not mentioned. Horse play was.

--
Adam

ARW wrote:

On 24/07/2019 13:46, wrote:
On 23/07/2019 21:55, wrote:
AFAICS there is nothing preventing a regular wallplate switch being
used to control an electrically-heated towel rail in a bathroom
provided that the switch is outside zone 2 and the installation is
protected by a 30mA RCD. Have I missed anything?

Answering my own question ... although there is nothing specifically
against it there is the general provision that every item of equipment
is to be of a design appropriate to the situation in which it is to be
used, or its mode of installation shall take account of the conditions
likely to be encountered. Condensation is a concern so I'll put the FCU
outside the room.

It was one that I was questioned about on a NICEIC inspection a few
years ago.

I answered the question correctly about the zones and then said I would
not fit the switch in the same place in a hotel, youth hostel, scout hut
etc as the fit for use might be different to a professionals apartment.

Condensation was not mentioned. Horse play was.

I wouldn't put such a switch in my own bathroom, because of the risk of
it being operated with wet hands. More likely to cause unpleasant
tingles than real danger, but it might lead to complaints.


--

Roger Hayter

On 25/07/2019 20:29, Roger Hayter wrote:
ARW wrote:

On 24/07/2019 13:46, wrote:
On 23/07/2019 21:55, wrote:
AFAICS there is nothing preventing a regular wallplate switch being
used to control an electrically-heated towel rail in a bathroom
provided that the switch is outside zone 2 and the installation is
protected by a 30mA RCD. Have I missed anything?

Answering my own question ... although there is nothing specifically
against it there is the general provision that every item of equipment
is to be of a design appropriate to the situation in which it is to be
used, or its mode of installation shall take account of the conditions
likely to be encountered. Condensation is a concern so I'll put the FCU
outside the room.

It was one that I was questioned about on a NICEIC inspection a few
years ago.

I answered the question correctly about the zones and then said I would
not fit the switch in the same place in a hotel, youth hostel, scout hut
etc as the fit for use might be different to a professionals apartment.

Condensation was not mentioned. Horse play was.

I wouldn't put such a switch in my own bathroom, because of the risk of
it being operated with wet hands. More likely to cause unpleasant
tingles than real danger, but it might lead to complaints.


I agree, but struggle to find a difference between wet hands in a
bathroom (outside Z2) and having wet hands when walking through the
front door and turning the light on after being caught in a downpour.

I put my light switches on the landing or hall walls for bathrooms and shower rooms as I find pull cord switches get dirty and do not last long with all the tugging that goes onto them.

On 25/07/2019 20:54, wrote:
On 25/07/2019 20:29, Roger Hayter wrote:

Condensation was not mentioned. Horse play was.

I wouldn't put such a switch in my own bathroom, because of the risk of
it being operated with wet hands.Â* More likely to cause unpleasant
tingles than real danger, but it might lead to complaints.


I agree, but struggle to find a difference between wet hands in a
bathroom (outside Z2) and having wet hands when walking through the
front door and turning the light on after being caught in a downpour.

The difference is that, in the worst case, one could envisage the inside
of the switch getting damp in a bathroom either from direct condensation
or (perhaps) from condensation in a ceiling void running down a conduit
into the switch.

In article ,
wrote:
I put my light switches on the landing or hall walls for bathrooms and shower rooms as I find pull cord switches get dirty and do not last long with all the tugging that goes onto them.

last year I replace my bathroom pull switch.It was 40 years old. There
another in the house which is well over 40 years old - it was here when we
moved in. Oh, you can buy replacement cords.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

"Roger Hayter" wrote in message
...
ARW wrote:

On 24/07/2019 13:46, wrote:
On 23/07/2019 21:55, wrote:
AFAICS there is nothing preventing a regular wallplate switch being
used to control an electrically-heated towel rail in a bathroom
provided that the switch is outside zone 2 and the installation is
protected by a 30mA RCD. Have I missed anything?

Answering my own question ... although there is nothing specifically
against it there is the general provision that every item of equipment
is to be of a design appropriate to the situation in which it is to be
used, or its mode of installation shall take account of the conditions
likely to be encountered. Condensation is a concern so I'll put the FCU
outside the room.

It was one that I was questioned about on a NICEIC inspection a few
years ago.

I answered the question correctly about the zones and then said I would
not fit the switch in the same place in a hotel, youth hostel, scout hut
etc as the fit for use might be different to a professionals apartment.

Condensation was not mentioned. Horse play was.

I wouldn't put such a switch in my own bathroom, because of the risk of
it being operated with wet hands.

I have them in mine because they are allowed here
and there is no risk when using them with wet hands.

More likely to cause unpleasant tingles

In fact that doesn’t happen.

than real danger, but it might lead to complaints.

It doesn’t here.

wrote in message
...
On 25/07/2019 20:29, Roger Hayter wrote:
ARW wrote:

On 24/07/2019 13:46, wrote:
On 23/07/2019 21:55, wrote:
AFAICS there is nothing preventing a regular wallplate switch being
used to control an electrically-heated towel rail in a bathroom
provided that the switch is outside zone 2 and the installation is
protected by a 30mA RCD. Have I missed anything?

Answering my own question ... although there is nothing specifically
against it there is the general provision that every item of equipment
is to be of a design appropriate to the situation in which it is to be
used, or its mode of installation shall take account of the conditions
likely to be encountered. Condensation is a concern so I'll put the FCU
outside the room.

It was one that I was questioned about on a NICEIC inspection a few
years ago.

I answered the question correctly about the zones and then said I would
not fit the switch in the same place in a hotel, youth hostel, scout hut
etc as the fit for use might be different to a professionals apartment.

Condensation was not mentioned. Horse play was.

I wouldn't put such a switch in my own bathroom, because of the risk of
it being operated with wet hands. More likely to cause unpleasant
tingles than real danger, but it might lead to complaints.


I agree, but struggle to find a difference between wet hands in a bathroom
(outside Z2) and having wet hands when walking through the front door and
turning the light on after being caught in a downpour.

One obvious difference is that you are much less likely to do that
with bare feet with the front door. But it works fine when you do
that and I have in fact done that with bare feet and a wet concrete
floor inside the house and got no tingle what so ever.

gOn Fri, 26 Jul 2019 09:44:05 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


One obvious difference is that you are much less likely to do that


What are you NOW smartassing about again, you clincally insane,
nym-shifting, trolling know-it-all? LOL

--
FredXX to Rot Speed:
"You are still an idiot and an embarrassment to your country. No wonder
we shipped the likes of you out of the British Isles. Perhaps stupidity
and criminality is inherited after all?"
Message-ID:

On Fri, 26 Jul 2019 09:39:47 +1000, Swer, better known as cantankerous
trolling senile geezer Rodent Speed, wrote:



I have them

Nobody gives a **** what you have or don't have, you quarrelsome obnoxious
senile Ozzie pest!

--
Sqwertz to Rot Speed:
"This is just a hunch, but I'm betting you're kinda an argumentative
asshole.
MID:

I find pull cord switches get dirty and do not last long with all the tugging that goes onto them.

and think what it does to your dick, as well

--
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as
foolish, and by the rulers as useful.

(Seneca the Younger, 65 AD)

On 25/07/2019 21:03, newshound wrote:
On 25/07/2019 20:54, wrote:
On 25/07/2019 20:29, Roger Hayter wrote:

Condensation was not mentioned. Horse play was.

I wouldn't put such a switch in my own bathroom, because of the risk of
it being operated with wet hands.Â* More likely to cause unpleasant
tingles than real danger, but it might lead to complaints.


I agree, but struggle to find a difference between wet hands in a
bathroom (outside Z2) and having wet hands when walking through the
front door and turning the light on after being caught in a downpour.

The difference is that, in the worst case, one could envisage the inside
of the switch getting damp in a bathroom either from direct condensation
or (perhaps) from condensation in a ceiling void running down a conduit
into the switch.

And you are more likely to be stood with bare, wet feet, on a wet floor,
with the water (or you) in contact with a nicely earthed radiator pipe,
in a bathroom.

SteveW

On 30/07/2019 22:00, Steve Walker wrote:
On 25/07/2019 21:03, newshound wrote:
On 25/07/2019 20:54, wrote:
On 25/07/2019 20:29, Roger Hayter wrote:

Condensation was not mentioned. Horse play was.

I wouldn't put such a switch in my own bathroom, because of the risk of
it being operated with wet hands.Â* More likely to cause unpleasant
tingles than real danger, but it might lead to complaints.


I agree, but struggle to find a difference between wet hands in a
bathroom (outside Z2) and having wet hands when walking through the
front door and turning the light on after being caught in a downpour.

The difference is that, in the worst case, one could envisage the
inside of the switch getting damp in a bathroom either from direct
condensation or (perhaps) from condensation in a ceiling void running
down a conduit into the switch.

And you are more likely to be stood with bare, wet feet, on a wet floor,
with the water (or you) in contact with a nicely earthed radiator pipe,
in a bathroom.


And the number of deaths caused by that in the UK in 2018 were?


When the first death happens supplementary bonding will be reinstated.

It will happen.

--
Adam

On 30/07/2019 23:03, ARW wrote:
On 30/07/2019 22:00, Steve Walker wrote:
On 25/07/2019 21:03, newshound wrote:
On 25/07/2019 20:54, wrote:
On 25/07/2019 20:29, Roger Hayter wrote:

Condensation was not mentioned. Horse play was.

I wouldn't put such a switch in my own bathroom, because of the
risk of
it being operated with wet hands.Â* More likely to cause unpleasant
tingles than real danger, but it might lead to complaints.


I agree, but struggle to find a difference between wet hands in a
bathroom (outside Z2) and having wet hands when walking through the
front door and turning the light on after being caught in a downpour.

The difference is that, in the worst case, one could envisage the
inside of the switch getting damp in a bathroom either from direct
condensation or (perhaps) from condensation in a ceiling void running
down a conduit into the switch.

And you are more likely to be stood with bare, wet feet, on a wet
floor, with the water (or you) in contact with a nicely earthed
radiator pipe, in a bathroom.


And the number of deaths caused by that in the UK in 2018 were?


When the first death happens supplementary bonding will be reinstated.

It will happen.

But we don't have switches where someone is likely to be stood in such
conditions, due to the rules on their location. Surely, that is exactly
the reason that we both have those rules and why people don't normally
die of electrocution in such circumstances in the UK?

SteveW

On 30/07/2019 23:27, Steve Walker wrote:
On 30/07/2019 23:03, ARW wrote:
On 30/07/2019 22:00, Steve Walker wrote:
On 25/07/2019 21:03, newshound wrote:
On 25/07/2019 20:54, wrote:
On 25/07/2019 20:29, Roger Hayter wrote:

Condensation was not mentioned. Horse play was.

I wouldn't put such a switch in my own bathroom, because of the
risk of
it being operated with wet hands.Â* More likely to cause unpleasant
tingles than real danger, but it might lead to complaints.


I agree, but struggle to find a difference between wet hands in a
bathroom (outside Z2) and having wet hands when walking through the
front door and turning the light on after being caught in a downpour.

The difference is that, in the worst case, one could envisage the
inside of the switch getting damp in a bathroom either from direct
condensation or (perhaps) from condensation in a ceiling void
running down a conduit into the switch.

And you are more likely to be stood with bare, wet feet, on a wet
floor, with the water (or you) in contact with a nicely earthed
radiator pipe, in a bathroom.


And the number of deaths caused by that in the UK in 2018 were?


When the first death happens supplementary bonding will be reinstated.

It will happen.

But we don't have switches where someone is likely to be stood in such
conditions, due to the rules on their location. Surely, that is exactly
the reason that we both have those rules and why people don't normally
die of electrocution in such circumstances in the UK?

SteveW
Although I decided not to do it, switches *are* allowed in bathrooms
outside Z2. Sockets are also allowed provided they're at least 3m from
Z2. Both of these are subject to the general provisions I mentioned earlier.

On 30/07/2019 23:27, Steve Walker wrote:
On 30/07/2019 23:03, ARW wrote:
On 30/07/2019 22:00, Steve Walker wrote:
On 25/07/2019 21:03, newshound wrote:
On 25/07/2019 20:54, wrote:
On 25/07/2019 20:29, Roger Hayter wrote:

Condensation was not mentioned. Horse play was.

I wouldn't put such a switch in my own bathroom, because of the
risk of
it being operated with wet hands.Â* More likely to cause unpleasant
tingles than real danger, but it might lead to complaints.


I agree, but struggle to find a difference between wet hands in a
bathroom (outside Z2) and having wet hands when walking through the
front door and turning the light on after being caught in a downpour.

The difference is that, in the worst case, one could envisage the
inside of the switch getting damp in a bathroom either from direct
condensation or (perhaps) from condensation in a ceiling void
running down a conduit into the switch.

And you are more likely to be stood with bare, wet feet, on a wet
floor, with the water (or you) in contact with a nicely earthed
radiator pipe, in a bathroom.


And the number of deaths caused by that in the UK in 2018 were?


When the first death happens supplementary bonding will be reinstated.

It will happen.

But we don't have switches where someone is likely to be stood in such
conditions, due to the rules on their location. Surely, that is exactly
the reason that we both have those rules and why people don't normally
die of electrocution in such circumstances in the UK?


Slight drift - one of my main concerns is that with the RCD protection
that we now rely on instead of supplementary bonding is that RCDs fail.
And not only do they fail they fail unnoticed in most houses.

How many people do you know that test their RCD every 6 months?

Mind you how many people have you seen that are **** wet through, naked
but for a towel wrapped around them, walking from the kitchen through
the living room to go upstairs?. I did not ask as I was at a
https://www.ongo.co.uk/ house. It's not like I walked in unannounced,
they made me wait at the front door whilst they locked the dogs in the
downstairs toilet.


--
Adam