John Rumm wrote:
Yes, you can only use each code once. You can pre-computer a few of them
and store them for later use. That will let you login without the
machine and card, but you still would not be able to authorise a new payee.

Yes, if you're using "identify" - the code generated is based on secret
details on the card and a counter. The bank knows which code was last
used, so they know what the counter is supposed to be. Try to use a
code that corresponds to a lower counter value, and they'll reject it.
IIRC they'll also reject it if you try to use a code that corresponds
to too high a counter value - you can skip some, but not too many.

The "respond" and "sign" modes incorporate the information you enter as
well as the card details and counter, so you could only pre-generate
the code if you knew what you would be asked to enter in order to
generate it.

All the calculations are done on the card, not the reader - this is what
makes it (almost) impossible to duplicate a chip card. The chip isn't
a memory device, it's a processor. You can't ask it to give you the
keys, only to respond to your requests. The reader is effectively just
a keypad and display for talking to the card, it doesn't contain any
information itself.

Mike

On Thu, 8 Mar 2018 11:02:14 +0000, Michael Chare wrote:

On 07/03/2018 15:03, Martin Brown wrote:
On 07/03/2018 14:21, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
He managed it by sending a four digit code to my phone, me then
reading the digits back to him.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why could I not progress with the online
banking, entering a new recipient?

Yes. I have one in front of me now. It looks like any other
banks home card reader except in Natwest colours and with a red
Natwest logo on the front. You need it to initiate any new or
novel online transfers.

No idea when they switched it on but at least 3 years ago.

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the
colour of the plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They
are annoyingly brand specific so you can't just use another
banks - it says "wrong card".


What annoys me is that I can't use these devices to check a
credit card pin.

The PIN is the 'something I know' part of two factor authentication,
so has to be input by you. If you don't know it the two factor
authentication won't, at least not by that route.

In article ,
Handsome Jack wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" posted
In article ,
Scott wrote:
They certainly cope with changes in the last four digits of the card.
Barclays change the 16 digit number each time a new debit card is
issued and I can assure you this does not require a new Pinsentry
machine.

I have two current accounts with different cards and PIN for both. Same
PINsentry unit works with both.


Is each card/PIN pair linked to just one of the accounts?

Yes.


Or does the
card/pin pair P1 generate a one-time code that gives you access to both
account A1 and account A2?

You need to use the appropriate card and PIN in conjunction with the
PINsentry unit to set up a new payee. And I suppose to set up some other
services. It's not really possible to do simultaneous operations to A1 and
A2, I think. Not that I can think of any reason to do so anyway.

--
*I wished the buck stopped here, as I could use a few*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article
,
Tim+ wrote:
With the Nationwide, one card/one PIN can be used to access and authorise
payments from all your online accounts. No need to carry multiple cards to
access your different online accounts.

Not sure there's much point in having more than one current account if one
card and PIN does for all? Domestically, that is.

--
*It IS as bad as you think, and they ARE out to get you.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why

I'd go to your local bank branch and ask them for help. If you have given
somebody your password change it quick.

FSVO local, like most banks Nat West have closed many branches.
It can be quite a hike to the nearest branch.

I €˜ve just got my Mother to obtain a reader so she can set up to pay some
regular traders like the window cleaner,despite using online banking for
some years she was unaware of it.
Because of closures her nearest branch is a 50 mile round trip which is
awkward if you have voluntarily stopped driving due to age.

GH

Michael Chare Wrote in message:
On 07/03/2018 22:49, John Rumm wrote:
On 07/03/2018 19:47, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
on 07/03/2018, Andrew supposed :
The non-backlit display on my Barclays version has got a bit dim,
so I went into the branch to complain and they just gave me
another one.

I inquired if it needed to be locked to my account, but apparently
they are generic, so if someone steals your card and knows your
pin, they can presumably still empty your account.

So, anyone could borrow anyone else's reader and it should work,
certainly if it the same bank? There is nothing coded in the reader, to
the account?

The readers all implement the same standard crypto signing system, so
although the banks don't all use them in exactly the same way, the
machines themselves should be interchangeable. Its the chip on the card
combined with your pin that makes the thing unique.


I have 3 different ones and as far as I am aware they are completely
interchangeable. If I go on holiday I usually take the one belonging to
the least important a/c.

How long do you go for?
--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

On 09/03/2018 11:03, Martin wrote:
On Thu, 8 Mar 2018 20:00:42 +0000, "dennis@home" wrote:


HSBC's can't read cards anyway its a OTP generator and you need a pin to
operate it.

Yes of course sorry if I caused confusion.

Its also locked to one account I think.

HSBC is vague on this subject

By account I meant account user.
Mine will work with my savings and current account.
However it won't work for the wife even though one of the accounts is a
joint account.
She can log on using here id and a different OTP device and see her
savings account and the joint but not my savings account.

The same is true of Santander but it uses the mobile phone for identity
checking with a OTP tested when required.

On 09/03/2018 00:37, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article
,
Tim+ wrote:
With the Nationwide, one card/one PIN can be used to access and authorise
payments from all your online accounts. No need to carry multiple cards to
access your different online accounts.

Not sure there's much point in having more than one current account if one
card and PIN does for all? Domestically, that is.


One account? You need several so you can get a decent interest rate on
any savings you may have. The current accounts and their linked savings
are about the only option for safe savings that make more tha inflation.

On 09/03/2018 00:37, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article
,
Tim+ wrote:
With the Nationwide, one card/one PIN can be used to access and authorise
payments from all your online accounts. No need to carry multiple cards to
access your different online accounts.

Not sure there's much point in having more than one current account if one
card and PIN does for all? Domestically, that is.

It is the only way to get 3% interest on modest savings if you can meet
the requirements to qualify for it. 1.5% on a couple of others - still
above what most deposit accounts will pay.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On 09/03/2018 13:14, Martin wrote:
On Fri, 9 Mar 2018 13:01:11 +0000, "dennis@home" wrote:

On 09/03/2018 00:37, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article
,
Tim+ wrote:
With the Nationwide, one card/one PIN can be used to access and authorise
payments from all your online accounts. No need to carry multiple cards to
access your different online accounts.

Not sure there's much point in having more than one current account if one
card and PIN does for all? Domestically, that is.


One account? You need several so you can get a decent interest rate on
any savings you may have. The current accounts and their linked savings
are about the only option for safe savings that make more tha inflation.

You get 2.5%12 month deposit account in an Australian bank and 0.1% in a Dutch
bank.


5% on some bank accounts but you need anew one every year or two.

"dennis@home" wrote in message
...

5% on some bank accounts but you need anew one every year or two.


That's regular saver accounts, Unfortunately with all of the 5%
ones anyway - you already need an account with that bank
or b/s
Theres usually a maximum limiit of between £2k and £3.5 k
for the account and you need to deposit between £200 - £300
per month; and they only last for a year.

Working backwards with a 2.5k limit and depositing £200 a month
you'd need to start with £100, This would then go £300, £500 etc.

So the great interest rate would only apply to relatively minor amounts
to start with, at least. Maybe its better than nothing but it involves a lot
of faffing around IMO.


michael adams

....

On 09/03/2018 18:18, Huge wrote:
On 2018-03-09, Marland wrote:

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why

I'd go to your local bank branch and ask them for help. If you have given
somebody your password change it quick.

FSVO local, like most banks Nat West have closed many branches.

The NatWest in out local small town is closed because they get less than
100 customers a month through the front door. 57 last November. No-one can
run a business on that kind of footfall.

But that's not relevant to those who see a local bank (and free banking)
as their fundamental human right.

I wondered the Wiki needed a page on DIY banking - in the form of credit
unions. But I've not yet had enough to drink to suggest the obvious
person to ....



--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

In article ,
Robin wrote:
The NatWest in out local small town is closed because they get less
than 100 customers a month through the front door. 57 last November.
No-one can run a business on that kind of footfall.

But that's not relevant to those who see a local bank (and free banking)
as their fundamental human right.

It's rather like complaining about a poor bus service you never use.

--
*Do paediatricians play miniature golf on Wednesdays?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Huge wrote:
If people want banking as a social good, the State should lay it on. In
Post Offices, for example. And, oh look, they have.

They've closed lots of those too. Much quicker for me to print out a
Hermes label and take the parcel to my local shop. Closer, less busy and
open longer than the nearest post office.

--
*If a thing is worth doing, wouldn't it have been done already?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.