Yesterday evening, I decided to make a transfer from my NatWest
account, to a TSB account, via online banking. A transfer I have never
made before, so it involved setting up a 'new recipient'. I filled in
all the details on the popup panel which appeared, but there was no
visible 'next' or 'accept' button on the panel. It might have been
below the screen, but there was no way to scroll down.

That left me stumped, so I rang their phone banking number. Indian guy
answers who was very difficult to understand, but I explained what I
was trying to do and the place where I was getting stuck. He wittered
on about it couldn't be done, without a home card reader gadget. I then
asked if he could implement the cash transfer for me, first he said no,
not unless I had the reader, then seemed to change his mind.

He managed it by sending a four digit code to my phone, me then reading
the digits back to him.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why could I not progress with the online
banking, entering a new recipient?

On 07/03/2018 14:21, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
Yesterday evening, I decided to make a transfer from my NatWest account,
to a* TSB account, via online banking. A transfer I have never made
before, so it involved setting up a 'new recipient'. I filled in all the
details on the popup panel which appeared, but there was no visible
'next' or 'accept' button on the panel. It might have been below the
screen, but there was no way to scroll down.

That left me stumped, so I rang their phone banking number. Indian guy
answers who was very difficult to understand, but I explained what I was
trying to do and the place where I was getting stuck. He wittered on
about it couldn't be done, without a home card reader gadget. I then
asked if he could implement the cash transfer for me, first he said no,
not unless I had the reader, then seemed to change his mind.

He managed it by sending a four digit code to my phone, me then reading
the digits back to him.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why could I not progress with the online
banking, entering a new recipient?

I have one of their card readers. The system works very well, and it
certainly beats a call to CS.

I'm pretty sure that you can order one online, but otherwise call CS again.

GB wrote on 07/03/2018 :
I have one of their card readers. The system works very well, and it
certainly beats a call to CS.

I'm pretty sure that you can order one online, but otherwise call CS again.

Thanks, reader ordered and yes it can be ordered via online banking..

On 07/03/18 14:46, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
GB wrote on 07/03/2018 :
I have one of their card readers. The system works very well, and it
certainly beats a call to CS.

I'm pretty sure that you can order one online, but otherwise call CS
again.

Thanks, reader ordered and yes it can be ordered via online banking..

If you have another bank's, try that - my RBS reader works fine with
Nationwide.

On 07/03/2018 16:15, Tim Watts wrote:
On 07/03/18 14:46, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
GB wrote on 07/03/2018 :
I have one of their card readers. The system works very well, and it
certainly beats a call to CS.

I'm pretty sure that you can order one online, but otherwise call CS
again.

Thanks, reader ordered and yes it can be ordered via online banking..

If you have another bank's, try that - my RBS reader works fine with
Nationwide.

The non-backlit display on my Barclays version has got a bit dim,
so I went into the branch to complain and they just gave me
another one.

I inquired if it needed to be locked to my account, but apparently
they are generic, so if someone steals your card and knows your
pin, they can presumably still empty your account.

Andrew wrote:
On 07/03/2018 16:15, Tim Watts wrote:
On 07/03/18 14:46, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
GB wrote on 07/03/2018 :
I have one of their card readers. The system works very well, and it
certainly beats a call to CS.

I'm pretty sure that you can order one online, but otherwise call CS
again.

Thanks, reader ordered and yes it can be ordered via online banking..

If you have another bank's, try that - my RBS reader works fine with
Nationwide.

The non-backlit display on my Barclays version has got a bit dim,
so I went into the branch to complain and they just gave me
another one.

Did you try a new battery? You can adjust the contrast on the
Nationwide/NatWest ones.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

on 07/03/2018, Andrew supposed :
The non-backlit display on my Barclays version has got a bit dim,
so I went into the branch to complain and they just gave me
another one.

I inquired if it needed to be locked to my account, but apparently
they are generic, so if someone steals your card and knows your
pin, they can presumably still empty your account.

So, anyone could borrow anyone else's reader and it should work,
certainly if it the same bank? There is nothing coded in the reader, to
the account?

In article ,
Andrew wrote:
I inquired if it needed to be locked to my account, but apparently
they are generic, so if someone steals your card and knows your
pin, they can presumably still empty your account.

True. Perhaps you shouldn't have your PIN written on the card?

--
*If at first you do succeed, try not to look too astonished.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 07/03/2018 16:15, Tim Watts wrote:
On 07/03/18 14:46, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
GB wrote on 07/03/2018 :
I have one of their card readers. The system works very well, and it
certainly beats a call to CS.

I'm pretty sure that you can order one online, but otherwise call CS
again.

Thanks, reader ordered and yes it can be ordered via online banking..

If you have another bank's, try that - my RBS reader works fine with
Nationwide.

And Co-op works with Natwest.

On 07/03/2018 18:06, GB wrote:
On 07/03/2018 16:15, Tim Watts wrote:
On 07/03/18 14:46, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
GB wrote on 07/03/2018 :
I have one of their card readers. The system works very well, and it
certainly beats a call to CS.

I'm pretty sure that you can order one online, but otherwise call CS
again.

Thanks, reader ordered and yes it can be ordered via online banking..

If you have another bank's, try that - my RBS reader works fine with
Nationwide.

And Co-op works with Natwest.
RBS with Co-op, too.

On 07/03/2018 14:25, GB wrote:


All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why could I not progress with the online
banking, entering a new recipient?

I've had one for 10+ years. Didn't think you could set up a payee
online without one.

I have one of their card readers. The system works very well, and it
certainly beats a call to CS.

I'm pretty sure that you can order one online,

You can


--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

Robin presented the following explanation :
I've had one for 10+ years. Didn't think you could set up a payee online
without one.

You can/could with the Halifax, it would send you a four digit code as
a text, which you then typed into online banking.

I was able to set up a new payee in NatWest, by a similar process, but
only whilst actually talking to them on the phone, reading the texted
code back.

Harry Bloomfield wrote:
Yesterday evening, I decided to make a transfer from my NatWest
account, to a TSB account, via online banking. A transfer I have never
made before, so it involved setting up a 'new recipient'. I filled in
all the details on the popup panel which appeared, but there was no
visible 'next' or 'accept' button on the panel. It might have been
below the screen, but there was no way to scroll down.

That left me stumped, so I rang their phone banking number. Indian guy
answers who was very difficult to understand, but I explained what I
was trying to do and the place where I was getting stuck. He wittered
on about it couldn't be done, without a home card reader gadget. I then
asked if he could implement the cash transfer for me, first he said no,
not unless I had the reader, then seemed to change his mind.

He managed it by sending a four digit code to my phone, me then reading
the digits back to him.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers?

Um, pretty sure you should have received a home card reader when you set up
online banking. Its a pretty integral part of the security system.

Yes, you can do some stuff without it but my BS (Nationwide, which uses the
same card readers) requires it for setting up new payments.

Why could I not progress with the online
banking, entering a new recipient?

Its just another level of fraud protection. By generating codes that cant
be intercepted it makes it very hard for anyone without both your card,
your card reader and your account log in details to carry out any serious
fraud.

Gullible users and phishing emails make account details and login
names/passwords *relatively* easy to get hold of but without the card and
card reader, a third party accessing your account could only, at worst, pay
someone youve paid before, not transfer funds to a new account.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

"Tim+" wrote in message

Its just another level of fraud protection. By generating codes that
cant
be intercepted it makes it very hard for anyone without both your card,
your card reader and your account log in details to carry out any serious
fraud.

not much point in them "IF" you can use any card reader is there??


In theory you can use any bank's card reader with any banking app.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chip_A...cation_Program


-

On 07/03/2018 16:48, Mark wrote:
"Tim+" wrote in message

It€„¢s just another level of fraud protection. By generating codes that
can€„¢t
be intercepted it makes it very hard for anyone without both your card,
your card reader and your account log in details to carry out any serious
fraud.

not much point in them "IF" you can use any card reader is there??

Yes. It means that you can prove to the bank that you have both the
physical card and the PIN. You enter a one time transaction code that
partly encodes the value of the transfer in pennies and it scrambles it
when you enter your PIN to give another code that you type in.

It means new transactions can only be set up by someone who has control
of both card and PIN (and sometimes mobile phone or landline as well).

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On 07/03/2018 16:48, Mark wrote:
"Tim+" wrote in message

It’s just another level of fraud protection. By generating codes that
can’t
be intercepted it makes it very hard for anyone without both your card,
your card reader and your account log in details to carry out any serious
fraud.

not much point in them "IF" you can use any card reader is there??

The point of 2FA (two factor authentication) is that it requires two
separate stages in the security. In this case it verifies something you
know - i.e. account details, password, and bank card PIN etc, and also
verifies something you physically have - i.e. your bank card.

The reader is just a mechanism to allow you to safely transmit securely
something that proves you are in possession of the card - itself it does
not form part of the authentication since they are all the same.



--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In article ,
Mark wrote:
Its just another level of fraud protection. By generating codes
that cant be intercepted it makes it very hard for anyone without
both your card, your card reader and your account log in details to
carry out any serious fraud.

not much point in them "IF" you can use any card reader is there??

But you need your card and PIN?

--
*When everything's coming your way, you're in the wrong lane *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 07/03/2018 17:08, Huge wrote:
On 2018-03-07, Mark wrote:

"Tim+" wrote in message

Its just another level of fraud protection. By generating codes that
cant
be intercepted it makes it very hard for anyone without both your card,
your card reader and your account log in details to carry out any serious
fraud.

not much point in them "IF" you can use any card reader is there??

Wrong. All the information is in the card. The reader is irrelevant.



One great advantage of the way any reader works with any card is that
the muggers can carry a reader to check that you have given them the
right pin for your card, so they no longer need to march people to the
cash machine

--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

Jethro_uk wrote:


I suggested a while ago that banks could setup a (opt-in ?) mechanism
whereby entering the PIN backwards triggers an "insufficient funds"
message - and a call to the local plod ?



Just like all the urban legends then? ;-). Not a bad idea, just never been
implemented.

http://urbanlegendsonline.com/pin-number-reversal/

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On 07/03/2018 14:21, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
He managed it by sending a four digit code to my phone, me then reading
the digits back to him.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why could I not progress with the online
banking, entering a new recipient?

Yes. I have one in front of me now. It looks like any other banks home
card reader except in Natwest colours and with a red Natwest logo on the
front. You need it to initiate any new or novel online transfers.

No idea when they switched it on but at least 3 years ago.

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On Wednesday, 7 March 2018 15:03:54 UTC, Martin Brown wrote:

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".

Not always. I used my Barclays one yesterday to validate a Lloyds
transaction.
John

On 07/03/2018 15:35, wrote:
On Wednesday, 7 March 2018 15:03:54 UTC, Martin Brown wrote:

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".

Not always. I used my Barclays one yesterday to validate a Lloyds
transaction.

How odd. I'd have believed Halifax since they are part of Lloyds now.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

Martin wrote:
On Wed, 7 Mar 2018 07:35:06 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Wednesday, 7 March 2018 15:03:54 UTC, Martin Brown wrote:

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".

Not always. I used my Barclays one yesterday to validate a Lloyds
transaction.
John

They are pin code specific accord
ing to HSBC.

Maybe applies to the HSBC card reader but I can assure you that it makes no
difference which card reader I use to make a Nationwide payment, the
NatWest reader and the Nationwide one work identically when fed with the
same card/PIN.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On 07/03/2018 16:13, Tim+ wrote:
Martin wrote:
On Wed, 7 Mar 2018 07:35:06 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Wednesday, 7 March 2018 15:03:54 UTC, Martin Brown wrote:

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".

Not always. I used my Barclays one yesterday to validate a Lloyds
transaction.
John

They are pin code specific accord
ing to HSBC.

Maybe applies to the HSBC card reader but I can assure you that it makes no
difference which card reader I use to make a Nationwide payment, the
NatWest reader and the Nationwide one work identically when fed with the
same card/PIN.

That one I can test. You are right the Natwest card reader appears to
not be locked to a specific bank. I will experiment more. It was about
to get thrown out since I no longer bank with them either. But now their
card reader would appear to have some utility as being generic.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On 07/03/2018 16:39, Martin wrote:
On Wed, 7 Mar 2018 16:23:30 +0000, Martin Brown
wrote:

On 07/03/2018 16:13, Tim+ wrote:
Martin wrote:
On Wed, 7 Mar 2018 07:35:06 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Wednesday, 7 March 2018 15:03:54 UTC, Martin Brown wrote:

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".

Not always. I used my Barclays one yesterday to validate a Lloyds
transaction.
John

They are pin code specific accord
ing to HSBC.

Maybe applies to the HSBC card reader but I can assure you that it makes no
difference which card reader I use to make a Nationwide payment, the
NatWest reader and the Nationwide one work identically when fed with the
same card/PIN.

That one I can test. You are right the Natwest card reader appears to
not be locked to a specific bank. I will experiment more. It was about
to get thrown out since I no longer bank with them either. But now their
card reader would appear to have some utility as being generic.

If google you can find out how to change the pin code if you need to.

I think yours must be different.

The Natwest card reader seems to work with several major UK bank cards
and any valid PIN. It baulks at Santanders cards though.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

Martin wrote:
On 7 Mar 2018 16:13:07 GMT, Tim+ wrote:

Martin wrote:
On Wed, 7 Mar 2018 07:35:06 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Wednesday, 7 March 2018 15:03:54 UTC, Martin Brown wrote:

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".

Not always. I used my Barclays one yesterday to validate a Lloyds
transaction.
John

They are pin code specific accord
ing to HSBC.

Maybe applies to the HSBC card reader but I can assure you that it makes no
difference which card reader I use to make a Nationwide payment, the
NatWest reader and the Nationwide one work identically when fed with the
same card/PIN.

Which makes it pin code specific.

Not sure what point youre trying to make. One pin, one card works in
either machine. The card readers arent €œpaired€� with a specific card, or
paired with a specific PIN. Its only the cards that are paired with their
PIN. I would argue that this does not make the *reader* PIN code specific.

Incidentally, the link offered previously suggests that whilst many
machines are interchangeable, but HBOS isnt one of them. Maybe HSBC is
also a €œnon-standard€� one?

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

Tim+ wrote:
Incidentally, the link offered previously suggests that whilst many
machines are interchangeable, but HBOS isnt one of them. Maybe HSBC is
also a €œnon-standard€� one?

HSBC Group's (HSBC, First Direct, M&S Bank, maybe some others)
two-factor-authentication device is not a card reader. They're a Vasco
Digipass - the device is keyed to your account and is used instead of a
card, not with it:
https://www.vasco.com/products/two-f...ipass-270.html

Probably the most common EMV CAP (ie card readers) are made by Gemalto
(formerly Xiring):
https://www.gemalto.com/financial/ebanking/tokens
- these devices are mostly interchangeable. However you do need the EMV CAP
'app' on your card: you'll get a 'wrong card' or similar message if the card
has no CAP support. Generally, only cards that are used for online banking
have the CAP app - most credit cards, for instance, don't.

I don't think Lloyds Group (Lloyds, Halifax, Bank of Scotland) use card
readers or tokens, instead using codes sent by SMS - at least for consumer
banking.

(Many banks also rely on a mobile app as an alternative 2FA solution,
relying on passcodes or fingerprints to authenticate you to the app, and
then using that to generate login codes)

Theo

On 07/03/2018 16:10, Martin wrote:
On Wed, 7 Mar 2018 07:35:06 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Wednesday, 7 March 2018 15:03:54 UTC, Martin Brown wrote:

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".

Not always. I used my Barclays one yesterday to validate a Lloyds
transaction.
John

They are pin code specific accord
ing to HSBC.

That seems unlikely. I have more than one account with my bank and all
their cards work in the same card reader (different PINs).

Until recently HSBC used a magic clock 6 digit dongle device which was
user account linked but the new one is more like a card reader. I no
longer bank with them.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On Thu, 8 Mar 2018 09:04:43 +0000, Martin Brown
wrote:

On 07/03/2018 16:10, Martin wrote:
On Wed, 7 Mar 2018 07:35:06 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Wednesday, 7 March 2018 15:03:54 UTC, Martin Brown wrote:

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".

Not always. I used my Barclays one yesterday to validate a Lloyds
transaction.
John

They are pin code specific accord
ing to HSBC.

That seems unlikely. I have more than one account with my bank and all
their cards work in the same card reader (different PINs).

I tested mine with my Barclaycard and it produced produced a code, so
they cannot be account specific.

Until recently HSBC used a magic clock 6 digit dongle device which was
user account linked but the new one is more like a card reader. I no
longer bank with them.

Martin wrote:

They are pin code specific according to HSBC.

No, because for certain transactions in-branch, they will put your card
in their reader (same device as yours) and ask you to enter your pin
into it.

Martin Brown wrote:
On 07/03/2018 14:21, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
He managed it by sending a four digit code to my phone, me then reading
the digits back to him.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why could I not progress with the online
banking, entering a new recipient?

Yes. I have one in front of me now. It looks like any other banks home
card reader except in Natwest colours and with a red Natwest logo on the
front. You need it to initiate any new or novel online transfers.

No idea when they switched it on but at least 3 years ago.

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".


Um, we have a NatWest one and a Nationwide one. They both generate the same
codes.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

"Martin Brown" wrote in message
news
On 07/03/2018 14:21, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
He managed it by sending a four digit code to my phone, me then reading
the digits back to him.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why could I not progress with the online banking,
entering a new recipient?

Yes. I have one in front of me now. It looks like any other banks home
card reader except in Natwest colours and with a red Natwest logo on the
front. You need it to initiate any new or novel online transfers.

No idea when they switched it on but at least 3 years ago.

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".

I bank with Nat West and my wife banks with Barclays. We can use each
other's card readers - ie a NatWest reader will read a Barclays debit card
and vice versa.

I was told by the counter staff in my NatWest that this applies to all card
readers, but given other people's hit-and-miss experiences, it seems that
this isn't always the case...

On 07/03/2018 17:48, NY wrote:
"Martin Brown" wrote in message
news
On 07/03/2018 14:21, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
He managed it by sending a four digit code to my phone, me then
reading the digits back to him.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why could I not progress with the online
banking, entering a new recipient?

Yes. I have one in front of me now. It looks like any other banks home
card reader except in Natwest colours and with a red Natwest logo on
the front. You need it to initiate any new or novel online transfers.

No idea when they switched it on but at least 3 years ago.

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of
the plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly
brand specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong
card".

I bank with Nat West and my wife banks with Barclays. We can use each
other's card readers - ie a NatWest reader will read a Barclays debit
card and vice versa.

I was told by the counter staff in my NatWest that this applies to all
card readers, but given other people's hit-and-miss experiences, it
seems that this isn't always the case...

Some of the devices handed out for some banks are not actually card
readers, but real time secure token generators. They generate a code
based on the current time and the user's pin, but don't actually use the
card at all. In those cases the device itself is tied to the users
account and is not interchangeable.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 07/03/2018 15:03, Martin Brown wrote:
On 07/03/2018 14:21, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
He managed it by sending a four digit code to my phone, me then
reading the digits back to him.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why could I not progress with the online
banking, entering a new recipient?

Yes. I have one in front of me now. It looks like any other banks home
card reader except in Natwest colours and with a red Natwest logo on the
front. You need it to initiate any new or novel online transfers.

No idea when they switched it on but at least 3 years ago.

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".


What annoys me is that I can't use these devices to check a credit card pin.


--
Michael Chare

On Thu, 8 Mar 2018 11:02:14 +0000, Michael Chare
wrote:

On 07/03/2018 15:03, Martin Brown wrote:
On 07/03/2018 14:21, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
He managed it by sending a four digit code to my phone, me then
reading the digits back to him.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why could I not progress with the online
banking, entering a new recipient?

Yes. I have one in front of me now. It looks like any other banks home
card reader except in Natwest colours and with a red Natwest logo on the
front. You need it to initiate any new or novel online transfers.

No idea when they switched it on but at least 3 years ago.

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".


What annoys me is that I can't use these devices to check a credit card pin.

As I mentioned above, I tested mine with my Barclaycard and it worked
okay.

On 08/03/2018 11:30, Scott wrote:
On Thu, 8 Mar 2018 11:02:14 +0000, Michael Chare
wrote:

On 07/03/2018 15:03, Martin Brown wrote:

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".


What annoys me is that I can't use these devices to check a credit card pin.

As I mentioned above, I tested mine with my Barclaycard and it worked
okay.

It seems some cards don't like some readers and certain readers are a
lot more tolerant of other banks cards. There probably is a logic to it
somewhere based on which banks systems use home card readers. It seems
the ones that don't have cards which elicit a "wrong card" response.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

Martin Brown wrote:
It seems some cards don't like some readers and certain readers are a
lot more tolerant of other banks cards. There probably is a logic to it
somewhere based on which banks systems use home card readers. It seems
the ones that don't have cards which elicit a "wrong card" response.

Do we have examples of a card that works in reader A but not in reader B?
Which banks are involved?

If your card doesn't do EMV CAP it won't work in any reader, with the 'wrong
card' message. Some banks don't do CAP at all, or not for credit cards or
savings cards. However I'm curious to know if there are incompatibilities
between different CAP-enabled cards and readers I'm not aware of.

As I said upthread, HSBC Group is a red herring since they don't use card
readers.

Theo

On 08/03/2018 11:30, Scott wrote:
On Thu, 8 Mar 2018 11:02:14 +0000, Michael Chare
wrote:

On 07/03/2018 15:03, Martin Brown wrote:
On 07/03/2018 14:21, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
He managed it by sending a four digit code to my phone, me then
reading the digits back to him.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why could I not progress with the online
banking, entering a new recipient?

Yes. I have one in front of me now. It looks like any other banks home
card reader except in Natwest colours and with a red Natwest logo on the
front. You need it to initiate any new or novel online transfers.

No idea when they switched it on but at least 3 years ago.

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the colour of the
plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They are annoyingly brand
specific so you can't just use another banks - it says "wrong card".


What annoys me is that I can't use these devices to check a credit card pin.

As I mentioned above, I tested mine with my Barclaycard and it worked
okay.

I think I have to say that I have never before bothered to test that
card as I use it regularly and am sure of the PIN.


--
Michael Chare

On Thu, 8 Mar 2018 11:02:14 +0000, Michael Chare wrote:

On 07/03/2018 15:03, Martin Brown wrote:
On 07/03/2018 14:21, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
He managed it by sending a four digit code to my phone, me then
reading the digits back to him.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why could I not progress with the online
banking, entering a new recipient?

Yes. I have one in front of me now. It looks like any other
banks home card reader except in Natwest colours and with a red
Natwest logo on the front. You need it to initiate any new or
novel online transfers.

No idea when they switched it on but at least 3 years ago.

Looks to be identical to the Nationwide one apart from the
colour of the plastic and the type of cards it will accept. They
are annoyingly brand specific so you can't just use another
banks - it says "wrong card".


What annoys me is that I can't use these devices to check a
credit card pin.

The PIN is the 'something I know' part of two factor authentication,
so has to be input by you. If you don't know it the two factor
authentication won't, at least not by that route.

Yes a lot of these devices have been in the news again recently for
discriminating against blind users. the last time this happened on the
earlier keypad devices they Were forced to bring out talking keypads.
sounds like we are doing it all again for card readers now. lessons will not
be learned of course.
And people wonder why we don't want to use online banking.
Recently a minor change on the halifax web site, completely invisible to
the sighted completely ruined access by the blind to their accounts.
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Harry Bloomfield" wrote in message
news
Yesterday evening, I decided to make a transfer from my NatWest account,
to a TSB account, via online banking. A transfer I have never made
before, so it involved setting up a 'new recipient'. I filled in all the
details on the popup panel which appeared, but there was no visible 'next'
or 'accept' button on the panel. It might have been below the screen, but
there was no way to scroll down.

That left me stumped, so I rang their phone banking number. Indian guy
answers who was very difficult to understand, but I explained what I was
trying to do and the place where I was getting stuck. He wittered on about
it couldn't be done, without a home card reader gadget. I then asked if he
could implement the cash transfer for me, first he said no, not unless I
had the reader, then seemed to change his mind.

He managed it by sending a four digit code to my phone, me then reading
the digits back to him.

All very confusing, but it worked in the end. Has anyone heard of
NatWest's card readers? Why could I not progress with the online banking,
entering a new recipient?