Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other ajustements.

On Thursday, 22 June 2017 08:17:08 UTC+1, DerbyBorn wrote:
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other ajustements.

Probably lots of them conveniently close to tingly high voltage bits.

I remember when all the 2ps we'd saved for the telephone became useless as the telephone got changed to 5ps and 10ps. (This was of course the telephone box down the road -- we didn't have one in the house.)

And being told to put the radio on at 5 to 1 for the 1 o'clock news - it needed time to 'warm up'.

Owain

Yes some of the ladies we had at rediffusion in Chessington could do purity
static and dynamic convergence on a set in about three minutes.
I really still don't know how they did it.
Seriously though. I think the secret is doing things in the correct order
or you muck it up.

Brian

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"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other ajustements.

I have a Rogers Amp on my computer like that. Four ecl 86s need a bit of
time to get their acts together.


Brian

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wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 22 June 2017 08:17:08 UTC+1, DerbyBorn wrote:
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other
ajustements.

Probably lots of them conveniently close to tingly high voltage bits.

I remember when all the 2ps we'd saved for the telephone became useless as
the telephone got changed to 5ps and 10ps. (This was of course the
telephone box down the road -- we didn't have one in the house.)

And being told to put the radio on at 5 to 1 for the 1 o'clock news - it
needed time to 'warm up'.

Owain

In message ,
writes

And being told to put the radio on at 5 to 1 for the 1 o'clock news -
it needed time to 'warm up'.

10 to 1, otherwise you'd miss the shipping forecast :-)
--
Graeme

"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other ajustements.

I used to be expert at that, and colour adjustment. The TV firm I worked for
had an exhibition display of about 9 sets stacked as a pyramid in the London
Hilton Hotel. Out of our factory they were all wildly different, but I was
able to make them look the same at first glance. Outside the open door was a
line of Americans queuing for something else, and a couple of them came in
saying they'd never seen anything like it - how is it done? - is there
secret equipment in the roof? The poor souls had only had experience of NTSC
in the US, "Never Twice The Same Colour", unlike our PAL, although the main
reason in both countries was just shoddy adjustment and component drift.
--
Dave W

Graeme wrote:
In message ,
writes

And being told to put the radio on at 5 to 1 for the 1 o'clock news -
it needed time to 'warm up'.

10 to 1, otherwise you'd miss the shipping forecast :-)

Many of our 'radios' (internet, etc.) take just as long to start up.
Give me a 'tranny' any day.

--
Chris Green
·

Brian Gaff wrote:
Yes some of the ladies we had at rediffusion in Chessington could do purity
static and dynamic convergence on a set in about three minutes.
I really still don't know how they did it.
Seriously though. I think the secret is doing things in the correct order
or you muck it up.

I used to service valve 'scopes (Marconi Instruments and Tektronix),
these had delay lines between the final valves of the amplifers and
the tube deflection plates so that one could see the rising edge of a
pulse that had triggered the scan.

The delay lines had to be 'tuned', there were 20 or 30 trimmers at
least, you trimmed them for minimum distortion of a 'good' square wave
at the front edge. Took ages!

--
Chris Green
·

Dave W wrote:
"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other ajustements.

I used to be expert at that, and colour adjustment. The TV firm I worked for
had an exhibition display of about 9 sets stacked as a pyramid in the London
Hilton Hotel. Out of our factory they were all wildly different, but I was
able to make them look the same at first glance. Outside the open door was a
line of Americans queuing for something else, and a couple of them came in
saying they'd never seen anything like it - how is it done? - is there
secret equipment in the roof? The poor souls had only had experience of NTSC
in the US, "Never Twice The Same Colour", unlike our PAL, although the main
reason in both countries was just shoddy adjustment and component drift.


The main problem with NTSC was multipath propagation and reflections in
distributed systems.

DerbyBorn wrote:
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other ajustements.


I moved on to using a series bus by 2000.

In article , Capitol
wrote:
Dave W wrote:
"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls. I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and
other ajustements.

I used to be expert at that, and colour adjustment. The TV firm I
worked for had an exhibition display of about 9 sets stacked as a
pyramid in the London Hilton Hotel. Out of our factory they were all
wildly different, but I was able to make them look the same at first
glance. Outside the open door was a line of Americans queuing for
something else, and a couple of them came in saying they'd never seen
anything like it - how is it done? - is there secret equipment in the
roof? The poor souls had only had experience of NTSC in the US, "Never
Twice The Same Colour", unlike our PAL, although the main reason in
both countries was just shoddy adjustment and component drift.


The main problem with NTSC was multipath propagation and reflections in
distributed systems.

those problems were not unique to NTSC

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other ajustements.

Reminds me of building analogue Moog synthesisers.

I think the thing about crts was that since the controls were all basically
either magnets or waveforms fed to the scan coils, one always affected
another. You cannot really screen one electon beam and only control that
one.
The shadow mask was of course fixed and one hoped the combined tolerances
of all the parts agreed enough that only minor adjustments were in fact
needed. the corners were always way out of course but apparently the eye
never noticed that much.

Why it took so long to phase out the CRT I shall never know as it was
obviously the week link in the chain. I suspect it was the complexity of
driving such a flat screen display that only became feasible with large
scale integration and digital processing.
Brian

--
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This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Chris Green" wrote in message
...
Brian Gaff wrote:
Yes some of the ladies we had at rediffusion in Chessington could do
purity
static and dynamic convergence on a set in about three minutes.
I really still don't know how they did it.
Seriously though. I think the secret is doing things in the correct
order
or you muck it up.

I used to service valve 'scopes (Marconi Instruments and Tektronix),
these had delay lines between the final valves of the amplifers and
the tube deflection plates so that one could see the rising edge of a
pulse that had triggered the scan.

The delay lines had to be 'tuned', there were 20 or 30 trimmers at
least, you trimmed them for minimum distortion of a 'good' square wave
at the front edge. Took ages!

--
Chris Green
·

Yes our first test sets were RCA ones with a pre decoder in them. Pretty
naff there was a hue and a tintcontrol on the front. You could make it look
really crazy with those.

I also had no idea that Bell and hwell sold tvs in the states till i saw
some of the ones in our lab.
Blimey I'm surprised GM did not sell one.


Brian

--
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The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Dave W" wrote in message
news

"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other
ajustements.

I used to be expert at that, and colour adjustment. The TV firm I worked
for had an exhibition display of about 9 sets stacked as a pyramid in the
London Hilton Hotel. Out of our factory they were all wildly different,
but I was able to make them look the same at first glance. Outside the
open door was a line of Americans queuing for something else, and a couple
of them came in saying they'd never seen anything like it - how is it
done? - is there secret equipment in the roof? The poor souls had only had
experience of NTSC in the US, "Never Twice The Same Colour", unlike our
PAL, although the main reason in both countries was just shoddy adjustment
and component drift.
--
Dave W

One of the fun devices was an electtron gun tube rejuvenator. When one of
the colours was so low emission it really needed a new tube ten mins on this
gadget seems to make it last at least another 6 months!
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Capitol" wrote in message
o.uk...
Dave W wrote:
"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other
ajustements.

I used to be expert at that, and colour adjustment. The TV firm I worked
for
had an exhibition display of about 9 sets stacked as a pyramid in the
London
Hilton Hotel. Out of our factory they were all wildly different, but I
was
able to make them look the same at first glance. Outside the open door
was a
line of Americans queuing for something else, and a couple of them came
in
saying they'd never seen anything like it - how is it done? - is there
secret equipment in the roof? The poor souls had only had experience of
NTSC
in the US, "Never Twice The Same Colour", unlike our PAL, although the
main
reason in both countries was just shoddy adjustment and component drift.


The main problem with NTSC was multipath propagation and reflections in
distributed systems.

On 22/06/2017 09:46, Chris Green wrote:
Graeme wrote:
In message ,
writes

And being told to put the radio on at 5 to 1 for the 1 o'clock news -
it needed time to 'warm up'.

10 to 1, otherwise you'd miss the shipping forecast :-)

Many of our 'radios' (internet, etc.) take just as long to start up.
Give me a 'tranny' any day.

Internet and DAB both take an age to get going. The big advantage of the
simple AM/FM transistor radio is that it runs a long time on batteries.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

In article , davewi11
@yahoo.co.uk says...

"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other ajustements.

I used to be expert at that, and colour adjustment. The TV firm I worked for
had an exhibition display of about 9 sets stacked as a pyramid in the London
Hilton Hotel. Out of our factory they were all wildly different, but I was
able to make them look the same at first glance. Outside the open door was a
line of Americans queuing for something else, and a couple of them came in
saying they'd never seen anything like it - how is it done? - is there
secret equipment in the roof? The poor souls had only had experience of NTSC
in the US, "Never Twice The Same Colour", unlike our PAL, although the main
reason in both countries was just shoddy adjustment and component drift.

I remember the trade shows in the late 60s. In 1967, Rank
Bush Murphy had theirs in the Lancaster Hotel* in Lancaster
Gate - it was also owned by Rank, of course!

They had a display of a large number of their first colour
set (CTV25 - later known as 'The Burning Bush' for obvious
reasons!) in three rows - probably about 6 or 8 in each
tier.

They were displaying test card F when I first saw them and
it was amazing to see how well set up they were. The black
and white balance was perfect with not a trace or hint of
colour on any of them. The colour reproduction of the centre
portion was similarly identical on every set plus, of
course, there were no convergence errors visible.

It must have been a wonderful job for someone to set them
all up!

* The weather was much like it's been recently and the air-
con was working overtime - so much so that, if you were
unlucky to stand in the wrong place you would get a shower
of ice cold water down the back of the neck where it was
condensing in the overhead pipework and dripping out of the
vents in the low ceilings!

I moved on to the Pye Group exhibition in the Grosvenor
House Hotel after that - what a contrast - light and airy
and beautifully cool with no added surprises!

--

Terry

On Thursday, 22 June 2017 11:00:07 UTC+1, Brian Gaff wrote:
I think the thing about crts was that since the controls were all basically
either magnets or waveforms fed to the scan coils, one always affected
another.

indeed

You cannot really screen one electon beam and only control that
one.

that has been done, but not in mass market sets. Early sequential colour systems involved doing that with a single gun tube.

The shadow mask was of course fixed

I saw one that wasn't. A weird viewing experience.

and one hoped the combined tolerances
of all the parts agreed enough that only minor adjustments were in fact
needed.

never true

the corners were always way out of course

they weren't

but apparently the eye
never noticed that much.

it did when they were

Why it took so long to phase out the CRT I shall never know as it was
obviously the week link in the chain.

cost.

I suspect it was the complexity of
driving such a flat screen display that only became feasible with large
scale integration and digital processing.
Brian

"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other ajustements.

magic eye valve radio....Mmmmmmmmmmm

"Martin Brown" wrote in message
news
On 22/06/2017 09:46, Chris Green wrote:
Graeme wrote:
In message ,
writes

And being told to put the radio on at 5 to 1 for the 1 o'clock news -
it needed time to 'warm up'.

10 to 1, otherwise you'd miss the shipping forecast :-)

Many of our 'radios' (internet, etc.) take just as long to start up.
Give me a 'tranny' any day.

Internet and DAB both take an age to get going. The big advantage of the
simple AM/FM transistor radio is that it runs a long time on batteries.

as the advert SHOULD say.... if you love radio don't buy a DAB .......

On 22/06/2017 10:20, Capitol wrote:
Dave W wrote:
"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other
ajustements.

I used to be expert at that, and colour adjustment. The TV firm I
worked for
had an exhibition display of about 9 sets stacked as a pyramid in the
London
Hilton Hotel. Out of our factory they were all wildly different, but I
was
able to make them look the same at first glance. Outside the open door
was a
line of Americans queuing for something else, and a couple of them
came in
saying they'd never seen anything like it - how is it done? - is there
secret equipment in the roof? The poor souls had only had experience
of NTSC
in the US, "Never Twice The Same Colour", unlike our PAL, although the
main
reason in both countries was just shoddy adjustment and component drift.


The main problem with NTSC was multipath propagation and
reflections in distributed systems.

I always thought it was the purple and green flashing makeup the US
newscasters used. Later they clamped chroma for everything near flesh
tones to surreal pale orange. Neither looked anything like realistic.

There was nothing much wrong with the NTSC standard itself - Japan used
a variant of NTSC but implemented it very much better just like they did
with RIAA equalisation on consumer phono pickups. PAL had the huge
advantage that systematic phase shifts were automagically cancelled out.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On Thu, 22 Jun 2017 11:04:58 +0100, Brian Gaff wrote:

One of the fun devices was an electtron gun tube rejuvenator. When one
of the colours was so low emission it really needed a new tube ten mins
on this gadget seems to make it last at least another 6 months!

I used similar devices back in the 1960s. I had a weekend/summer job with
Technical Trading in Brighton. They used to sell cut price valves.

They bought large quantities of used valves. We tested them using Mullard
valve testers (the ones with big punched paxolin cards for each valve
type, to select voltages and tests). If OK, we cleaned them off and
relabelled them by printing on the side.

If they had low emission, they went into an RF coil that would ignite
what was left of the getter. That usually got them to pass the test.

--
My posts are my copyright and if @diy_forums or Home Owners' Hub
wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor

Brian Gaff wrote:
I think the thing about crts was that since the controls were all basically
either magnets or waveforms fed to the scan coils, one always affected
another. You cannot really screen one electon beam and only control that
one.
The shadow mask was of course fixed and one hoped the combined tolerances
of all the parts agreed enough that only minor adjustments were in fact
needed. the corners were always way out of course but apparently the eye
never noticed that much.

Why it took so long to phase out the CRT I shall never know as it was
obviously the week link in the chain. I suspect it was the complexity of
driving such a flat screen display that only became feasible with large
scale integration and digital processing.
Brian


The driving techniques for flat screen were around 40+ years ago. What
was missing was the ability to produce small enough plasma cells
reliably. The advent of LCD volume production enabled todays screens.
CRTs AIUI are still difficult to beat for high brightness/temperatre
range displays.

In article ,
Jim GM4DHJ ... wrote:
Internet and DAB both take an age to get going. The big advantage of the
simple AM/FM transistor radio is that it runs a long time on batteries.

as the advert SHOULD say.... if you love radio don't buy a DAB .......

Another black and white type.

I have DAB in the car. In general, *reception* is far superior to AM or FM
in the SE of England.

It's very interesting to ask a DAB hater to tell which recording he is
listening to of something simulcast on DAB and FM. Provided you sync them
up and match the levels.

I did just that with a chunk of R2 from FM, DAB and FreeView. A panel of
10 'experts' gave almost entirely random results. But I'd guess even they
might have heard a difference with AM.

--
*Someday, we'll look back on this, laugh nervously and change the subject

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Brian Gaff wrote:
Why it took so long to phase out the CRT I shall never know as it was
obviously the week link in the chain. I suspect it was the complexity of
driving such a flat screen display that only became feasible with large
scale integration and digital processing.

Because it was a very long time - if ever - before LCD matched let alone
betered decent CRT in many ways.

CRT monitors were still in use for setting the pictures from TV cameras in
the studio etc long after they'd stopped being on sale as domestic sets.

But with domestic, a large slim cheap unit is far more important than
actual picture quality.

--
*On the other hand, you have different fingers*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Thursday, 22 June 2017 14:55:42 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Brian Gaff wrote:
Why it took so long to phase out the CRT I shall never know as it was
obviously the week link in the chain. I suspect it was the complexity of
driving such a flat screen display that only became feasible with large
scale integration and digital processing.

Because it was a very long time - if ever - before LCD matched let alone
betered decent CRT in many ways.

CRT monitors were still in use for setting the pictures from TV cameras in
the studio etc long after they'd stopped being on sale as domestic sets.

But with domestic, a large slim cheap unit is far more important than
actual picture quality.

Or program quality.
But at least Ghost hunters and ancient aliens makes me smile

On Thursday, 22 June 2017 14:55:42 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Brian Gaff wrote:
Why it took so long to phase out the CRT I shall never know as it was
obviously the week link in the chain. I suspect it was the complexity of
driving such a flat screen display that only became feasible with large
scale integration and digital processing.

Because it was a very long time - if ever - before LCD matched let alone
betered decent CRT in many ways.

CRT monitors were still in use for setting the pictures from TV cameras in
the studio etc long after they'd stopped being on sale as domestic sets.

But with domestic, a large slim cheap unit is far more important than
actual picture quality.

I had a passive colour screen on an early laptop, picture quality was abysmal. Huge amounts of noise & smear, and watching motion was unworkable due to excessive slowness.


NT

"charles" wrote in message
...
In article , Capitol
wrote:
Dave W wrote:
"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls. I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and
other ajustements.

I used to be expert at that, and colour adjustment. The TV firm I
worked for had an exhibition display of about 9 sets stacked as a
pyramid in the London Hilton Hotel. Out of our factory they were all
wildly different, but I was able to make them look the same at first
glance. Outside the open door was a line of Americans queuing for
something else, and a couple of them came in saying they'd never seen
anything like it - how is it done? - is there secret equipment in the
roof? The poor souls had only had experience of NTSC in the US, "Never
Twice The Same Colour", unlike our PAL, although the main reason in
both countries was just shoddy adjustment and component drift.


The main problem with NTSC was multipath propagation and reflections in
distributed systems.

those problems were not unique to NTSC

No, but the manifestation of them is worse with NTSC than with PAL, in that
NTSC suffers drift in the hue whereas PAL just suffers a reduction in
saturation without any change in hue.

I remember in the early 1970s my friend's parents had a Hitachi colour TV
and it had a tint control (we had fun tweaking it just before his granddad
wanted to watch the snooker!). I understand that Hitachi didn't pay the
royalty to use a genuine PAL decoder and converted PAL to NTSC and then used
an NTSC decoder (or something like that).

"charles" wrote in message
...
In article , Capitol
wrote:
Dave W wrote:
"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls. I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and
other ajustements.

I used to be expert at that, and colour adjustment.

I can remember having an old 405-line B&W telly that my grandpa was getting
rid of when he got a colour set, and it had all sorts of user-adjustable
controls such as frame and line hold, frame linearity, spot wobble - as well
as loads more inside near the "tingly bits". Even as a 9-year-old lad, I
knew enough not to go anywhere near the inside when the power was on or
until I'd run the end of an earthed 10 M ohm resistor across the HT
terminals and associated capacitors.

I remember when the "man" came to repair our rented colour TV he let me
watch him, providing I kept a safe distance away as he made adjustments
while the TV was on, and there was a whole rack of pots that you turned with
a screwdriver for tweaking different aspects of the picture. I was a bit
young to understand concepts like PAL decoder, colour sub-carrier phase,
back porch, sync pulse separation etc and how you used different parts of
the testcard to check the adjustment of them :-)

Some of the early colour PC monitors had all manner of esoteric convergence,
geometry, rotation and alignment controls. The only difference was that they
were accessed from on-screen menus rather than pots. But still plenty to
adjust if the picture was blurred or had coloured fringes, and enough
interdependence between the different settings to drive you mad. LED screens
are so much easier! They are also considerably lighter: my 21 inch CRT
monitor was about feet deep and *very* heavy.

On 22/06/2017 09:46, Chris Green wrote:
Graeme wrote:
In message ,
writes

And being told to put the radio on at 5 to 1 for the 1 o'clock news -
it needed time to 'warm up'.

10 to 1, otherwise you'd miss the shipping forecast :-)

Many of our 'radios' (internet, etc.) take just as long to start up.
Give me a 'tranny' any day.

Mains valve radios were up and running in 20 seconds.

A lot of modern equipment takes a lot longer than that. Apart from
(obvious) computers, TVs and mobile phones have quite restricted
functionality, or are very slow to respond, until a lot of background
tasks have finished running.

--
Max Demian

On 22/06/2017 08:26, wrote:
On Thursday, 22 June 2017 08:17:08 UTC+1, DerbyBorn wrote:
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other ajustements.

Probably lots of them conveniently close to tingly high voltage bits.

I remember when all the 2ps we'd saved for the telephone became useless as the telephone got changed to 5ps and 10ps. (This was of course the telephone box down the road -- we didn't have one in the house.)

When STD coin box phones came in, they took threepenny bits, sixpences
and shillings. They soon blocked up the threepenny slot, so doubling the
cost of short local calls.

--
Max Demian

On Thu, 22 Jun 2017 18:56:20 +0100, Max Demian wrote:

On 22/06/2017 09:46, Chris Green wrote:
Graeme wrote:
In message ,
writes

And being told to put the radio on at 5 to 1 for the 1 o'clock news -
it needed time to 'warm up'.

10 to 1, otherwise you'd miss the shipping forecast

Many of our 'radios' (internet, etc.) take just as long to start up.
Give me a 'tranny' any day.

Mains valve radios were up and running in 20 seconds.

Battery ones were even faster. Typically using the D?9? valves, they had
filaments that doubled as cathodes, which helped quite a bit.



--
My posts are my copyright and if @diy_forums or Home Owners' Hub
wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor

On Thursday, 22 June 2017 19:15:55 UTC+1, Bob Eager wrote:
On Thu, 22 Jun 2017 18:56:20 +0100, Max Demian wrote:

On 22/06/2017 09:46, Chris Green wrote:
Graeme wrote:
In message ,
writes

And being told to put the radio on at 5 to 1 for the 1 o'clock news -
it needed time to 'warm up'.

10 to 1, otherwise you'd miss the shipping forecast

Many of our 'radios' (internet, etc.) take just as long to start up.
Give me a 'tranny' any day.

Mains valve radios were up and running in 20 seconds.

Battery ones were even faster. Typically using the D?9? valves, they had
filaments that doubled as cathodes, which helped quite a bit.

ISTR they suffered a fair bit of distortion as the battery wilted. Poorly controlled bias.


NT

On Thu, 22 Jun 2017 14:53:27 +0100, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

CRT monitors were still in use for setting the pictures from TV cameras
in the studio etc long after they'd stopped being on sale as domestic
sets.

And sound may still have a CRT for checking sync. LCDs have an
inherent delay.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 22/06/2017 18:56, Max Demian wrote:
On 22/06/2017 09:46, Chris Green wrote:
Graeme wrote:
In message ,
writes

And being told to put the radio on at 5 to 1 for the 1 o'clock news -
it needed time to 'warm up'.

10 to 1, otherwise you'd miss the shipping forecast :-)

Many of our 'radios' (internet, etc.) take just as long to start up.
Give me a 'tranny' any day.

Mains valve radios were up and running in 20 seconds.

A lot of modern equipment takes a lot longer than that. Apart from
(obvious) computers, TVs and mobile phones have quite restricted
functionality, or are very slow to respond, until a lot of background
tasks have finished running.

Why do modern, but non-smart TVs take so long to start up? You'd have
thought they'd be up and running in seconds, but they take ages. What is
there to do other than switch on the back-light, clear the memory sync
the data stream from the last used input (or start from the next frame
when using UHF to ditribute around the house) and start displaying it?

SteveW

On 22/06/2017 17:17, pamela wrote:
On 08:26 22 Jun 2017, wrote:

On Thursday, 22 June 2017 08:17:08 UTC+1, DerbyBorn wrote:
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the
Convergenece Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other
ajustements.

Probably lots of them conveniently close to tingly high voltage
bits.

I remember when all the 2ps we'd saved for the telephone became
useless as the telephone got changed to 5ps and 10ps. (This was
of course the telephone box down the road -- we didn't have one
in the house.)

That's posively modern. Before 2ps were used in public
telephones it was 'Press Button A'.

And if you were to pay a visit to Crich tram museum, you could use the
only working Button A/Button B payphone still in operation to make a call.

SteveW

On 22/06/2017 18:59, Max Demian wrote:
On 22/06/2017 08:26, wrote:
On Thursday, 22 June 2017 08:17:08 UTC+1, DerbyBorn wrote:
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other
ajustements.

Probably lots of them conveniently close to tingly high voltage bits.

I remember when all the 2ps we'd saved for the telephone became
useless as the telephone got changed to 5ps and 10ps. (This was of
course the telephone box down the road -- we didn't have one in the
house.)

When STD coin box phones came in, they took threepenny bits, sixpences
and shillings. They soon blocked up the threepenny slot, so doubling the
cost of short local calls.

I think it was only in the '80s that they changed the tone received by
an operator from a payphone - until then they could not tell them from
private phones and people had learned that you could make free reverse
charges calls *to* phoneboxes.

SteveW

In article ,
Tim Streater wrote:
In article , Dave Plowman (News)
wrote:

In article ,
Jim GM4DHJ ... wrote:
Internet and DAB both take an age to get going. The big advantage
of the simple AM/FM transistor radio is that it runs a long time
on batteries.

as the advert SHOULD say.... if you love radio don't buy a DAB
.......

Another black and white type.

I have DAB in the car. In general, *reception* is far superior to AM or
FM in the SE of England.

It's very interesting to ask a DAB hater to tell which recording he is
...

Y'see there you go again Dave. If you don't love DAB you must hate it,
eh!

Good to see you fail to understand posts in pretty plain English again,
Tim.

Perhaps you'd give your interpretation of 'if you love radio don't buy a
DAB' ?

And not in the Boris style of answering a simple question.

--
*I pretend to work. - they pretend to pay me.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Thursday, June 22, 2017 at 8:22:33 PM UTC+1, DerbyBorn wrote:
"Jim GM4DHJ ..." wrote in
news

"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
Remember trying to improve an old TV by adjusting the Convergenece
Controls.
I recall, my old Murphy had about 20 potentiometers and other
ajustements.

magic eye valve radio....Mmmmmmmmmmm




The CRT was amazing how it became so good and could be mass produced.
Reminds me ot that old Cadbury Smash advert - Aliens laughing as it was
explained that electrons would fire through some magnetic coils and through
holes in a mask to hit little dots of phospor to make them glow.

Showing images extracted from a length of rust-coated plastic tape dragged past a spinning magnetised metal disc tilted at an angle.

On 23/06/2017 00:45, Steve Walker wrote:
On 22/06/2017 18:56, Max Demian wrote:
On 22/06/2017 09:46, Chris Green wrote:
Graeme wrote:
In message ,
writes

And being told to put the radio on at 5 to 1 for the 1 o'clock news -
it needed time to 'warm up'.

10 to 1, otherwise you'd miss the shipping forecast :-)

Many of our 'radios' (internet, etc.) take just as long to start up.
Give me a 'tranny' any day.

Mains valve radios were up and running in 20 seconds.

A lot of modern equipment takes a lot longer than that. Apart from
(obvious) computers, TVs and mobile phones have quite restricted
functionality, or are very slow to respond, until a lot of background
tasks have finished running.

Why do modern, but non-smart TVs take so long to start up? You'd have
thought they'd be up and running in seconds, but they take ages. What is
there to do other than switch on the back-light, clear the memory sync
the data stream from the last used input (or start from the next frame
when using UHF to ditribute around the house) and start displaying it?

At a guess you have to wait for it to go through hardware self test and
boot the realtime OS. It is only a few tens of seconds on most TVs.

My internet radio is considerably slower and handles much less data.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown