On 06/05/2017 12:56, Capitol wrote:
Android IME has a naturally crap email system.

Android runs Outlook so email is not a problem.
You can even get outlook on the iPhone and Windows but its not free on
Windows.

You don't even need a manual, or at least most don't.

On 06/05/2017 16:43, charles wrote:

then there was the French facility that had to test every single VCR
imported into the country - with a staff of two.


They had a staff of one at the start.
It was import restrictions without breaking the word of the rules.

On 06/05/2017 13:09, Graeme wrote:
In message , The Natural Philosopher
writes

Unless the whole point is to bedazzle the user with the cleverness and
complexity of the product by disguising the ****tiness of the
underlying hardware and software.

Is that not true of the vast majority of electrical/electronic devices
on the market today? When did it take off? Perhaps today's 'smart'
phone is the direct descendent of all those awful 1980s 'hi fis' that
had a million useless knobs and switches that didn't really do very
much, were rarely necessary and were only there to impress the boys, and
disguise the crapiness of the underlying product.

Smart phones are extremely useful.
It saves carrying a phone and a tablet.
Once you actually know how to drive one you understand why they are good.
If you don't know how to use them then they are cr@p, just like linux is
to the majority of people.

Smart phones are computers that you can make calls with and if you don't
want a computer don't buy a smart phone.

En el artículo , Chris Hogg
escribió:

LOL! We had a temporary assistant working in the stores department,
who had been told to open every incoming package to check that
everything was there and in good condition.

There's a story, possibly apocryphal, about Intel suffering an
unexpected, unexplained poor yield of processors.

A post room or stock room worker was diligently opening the incoming
packets of silicon wafers to check they were receiving the correct
amount of each, unaware they were meant only to be opened in class 1
clean rooms, and in doing so contaminating them.

I can't find a link, but think the original story may have come from Bob
Cringely (www.cringely.com).

--
(\_/)
(='.'=) "Between two evils, I always pick
(")_(") the one I never tried before." - Mae West

On 06/05/2017 11:52, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 06/05/17 11:40, Richard wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news

On 06/05/17 09:33, Richard wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news This is not my phone, its an elderly neighbours phone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXBwDa1ohck

How is someone with a non working smart phone that doesn't even play
flash videos supposed to access that content?

His kindly neighbour shows him on his computer?
Does the elderly guy have a smart TV?

Only since I bought it for him two weeks ago.

He says he cant change channels on it yet though.

Why buy a smart TV when he doesn't want one?
I don't have a smart TV, however I can connect my computers to it and
then its much smarter.


But we are talking hypothetical here.

How does someone with no other internet connection and no printed
instructions get a smart phone online enough to get to the online manual?

Especially if all he wants it for is to make and receive phone calls.


Why get a computer when you only want to make calls?
A £15 phone would be better.


Maybe he needs to download the TV's app and use the phone to control it.

En el artículo , The Natural Philosopher
escribió:

I actually opened the package. There was a sheet saying 'insert sim card'

It took me 2 hours to work out how to do that.

Why doesn't that surprise me?

--
(\_/)
(='.'=) "Between two evils, I always pick
(")_(") the one I never tried before." - Mae West

On 06/05/2017 16:49, RJH wrote:

Yes, you're probably right. One of them, maybe, but 2 adults (assuming),
highly unlikely they couldn't find it.



Never underestimate how stupid people can be.
You have to assume there will be someone really stupid trying to use
your product.

On Saturday, 6 May 2017 14:12:58 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 06/05/17 12:14, tabbypurr wrote:
On Saturday, 6 May 2017 09:38:57 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

In fact you have totally proved my point. Having an alert to tell
you you have just done something that you know you have just done,
because you just did it, is the most useless and superfluous piece
of crap programming yet.

Unless the whole point is to bedazzle the user with the cleverness
and complexity of the product by disguising the ****tiness of the
underlying hardware and software.

In your case its obvipously worked.

It's a painless way to educate beginner users re what does what.
Iphones don't get everything right, and can be frustrating like any
other computer, but they are a lot better than the competition in
that respect.


I suppose my problem is that I come from a professional IT background
and this stuff wouldn't even get past goods inward inspection.

Do you remember the days when personal computers came with the BIOS
source code at the back of the paper manuals?

The though that there could be worse kit than an I-phone frankly scares me.

Its a toy. A fashion item., A gadget. a marketable piece of bling. It is
not a computer and it doesn't work as advertised either.

Its like the worst version of windows ever. Designed to sell, not to work.

Sorry but that's unrealistic. You had one bad moment - some of us have used them for years. No pocket computer is perfect, but they're fairly good.


Having finally arrived at a desktop that is almost professional in its
quality, I never want to touch a macintosh or a WinPc again.

Or an Iphone

Desktop UIs are older and better developed.


NT

On Saturday, 6 May 2017 14:19:15 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 06/05/17 12:52, charles wrote:
In article ,
Capitol wrote:

Her ipad has just missed another couple of emails!


perhaps the alert is not set loud enough. It can be adjusted:
Settings sounds ringer & alerts. top of column on my iPad mini

Is that a doric or a roman column?

Only Doros have doric columns.


NT

On 5/5/2017 11:16 PM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
hTrying to phone my neighbour,. No reply. eventually phoned him on te
landline, and invited him for dinner.

"Why didn't you answer your I phone?"
"It didn't ring"

Sure enough, it doesn't ring.

Went through every single menu, discover hundreds of combinations of 'I
don't want this phone to ring' and turn them all off.

It still doesn't ring.

two and half hours later I google "My ****ing i-phone won't ring"

And discover that unlike *EVERY OTHER FUNCTION* on the i-phone, there
is a PHYSICAL SWITCH to turn the ringer off. Nothing in any menu
indicated it was turned off. Nor did it come with any manual.

There are people here who say that the linux command line is old
fashioned and opaque. They have obviously never set up an I phone.

So that's 5 hours in total trying to solve basic simple problems like
'how the **** do I insert the sim card? and 'How the **** do I get this
heap of unadulterated wombat turds to do the MOST BASIC THING, like ring...

Even my nokia 102 is crap. The old nokias had a green telephone that you
pressed to answer a call, and a red telephone that you pressed to end
the call. Pretty obvious really. the 102 doesn't. It has an unside down
bath symbol and what looks like a speedometer. They bear no relationship
to making a call whatsoever. I am after over a year still not sure which
one does what and often cuts people off instead of answering the
phone.But that doesnt happen much anyway, because its got a vodaphone
sim in, and there is **** all vodaphone coverage.

What a delight now me mate has gone home and I know that if I want the
internet, I have a well thougfht out Linux machine that actually works
with a reasonably sane user interface, and a telepone handset connected
to copper that always ring and always gets me connected to the person I
am calling...

...Unless they have an I-phone of course.



:-)

In a past life I wrote "research" and then commercial code to automate
some scientific instruments (normally used by Russell Group PhDs and
DPhils). I reckoned I'd spend half the coding time writing traps for all
the possible invalid responses to relatively simple menus (either
calling for single keystroke letters, or numbers).

What you are describing is all too familiar. Developers who have become
so intimate with their products that they think "It is obvious how I am
asking the user to respond".

On 5/6/2017 7:38 PM, dennis@home wrote:
On 06/05/2017 16:43, charles wrote:

then there was the French facility that had to test every single VCR
imported into the country - with a staff of two.


They had a staff of one at the start.
It was import restrictions without breaking the word of the rules.


And whatever else you think about the French, you have to admire their
single-mindedness and ingenuity in that case.

On Saturday, 6 May 2017 20:06:50 UTC+1, dennis@home wrote:
On 06/05/2017 16:49, RJH wrote:

Yes, you're probably right. One of them, maybe, but 2 adults (assuming),
highly unlikely they couldn't find it.

Never underestimate how stupid people can be.
You have to assume there will be someone really stupid trying to use
your product.

Not really. You could cover every point in a huge manual, or cover enough for most people on one sheet. BT chose the latter.


NT

On 06/05/17 19:52, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artÃ*culo , The Natural Philosopher
escribió:

I actually opened the package. There was a sheet saying 'insert sim card'

It took me 2 hours to work out how to do that.

Why doesn't that surprise me?

Because you are a complete humourless ****
Next?


--
You can get much farther with a kind word and a gun than you can with a
kind word alone.

Al Capone

"Mike Tomlinson" wrote in message
...
En el artículo , The Natural Philosopher
escribió:

I actually opened the package. There was a sheet saying 'insert sim card'

It took me 2 hours to work out how to do that.

Why doesn't that surprise me?

because you are a big headed turd ? .....

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news

On 06/05/17 17:00, Andrew wrote:
On 06/05/2017 16:24, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 06/05/17 15:53, Andrew wrote:
On 06/05/2017 11:52, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Especially if all he wants it for is to make and receive phone calls.

Then why on earth did he buy a smart phone ??.

He didnt. He was sold it.


No he wasn't, he *agreed* to buy it. No-one forced him.


Effectively they did with special deals he didn't really understand

Well, let's hope the work which he has to do at 95 years of age does not
require him to understand life or death matters for other individuals.

"RJH" wrote in message
news
On 05/05/2017 23:16, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
hTrying to phone my neighbour,. No reply. eventually phoned him on te
landline, and invited him for dinner.

"Why didn't you answer your I phone?"
"It didn't ring"

Sure enough, it doesn't ring.

Went through every single menu, discover hundreds of combinations of 'I
don't want this phone to ring' and turn them all off.

It still doesn't ring.

two and half hours later I google "My ****ing i-phone won't ring"

And discover that unlike *EVERY OTHER FUNCTION* on the i-phone, there
is a PHYSICAL SWITCH to turn the ringer off. Nothing in any menu
indicated it was turned off. Nor did it come with any manual.

Given there's only a couple of physical buttons on the thing, it wouldn't
normally take too much in the way of deduction to conclude what it does

That assumes you have enough of a clue to try them.

- and it gives a screen indication of 'mute' when it's toggled.

But if you manage to move it accidentally
when say getting it out of your pocket, you wont
necessarily be able to see that when you move it.

Seems you and your friend missed that.

Not surprising, I managed to myself.

Also, in the 'Settings' app type 'ring' into the search dialogue - your
friend will see a variety of other options - vibration patterns, alerts,
visual cues.

But wont necessarily know to do that in settings.

Makes a lot more sense for the turnip to do a search
on iphone doesnt ring on the net, but he's so stupid
that it took him hours to manage even something as
simple as that.

Mike Tomlinson wrote
Rod Speed wrote

And there is no obvious indication of that on the screen.

Oh, that'll be why it pops up a "Ringer on/off" thing on the display
whenever I operate the switch, then. Even when it's in standby.

That's a very short term indication, when you actually switch it,
which isnt any help when you manage to switch it accidentally
when you are getting it out of your pocket and can't actually
see the screen when you manage to move the switch.

I meant there is no continuing indication in the status bar
that is visible quite a bit of the time. There is for do not
disturb, but not for the position of that physical switch.

Not clear why there isnt, there is enough room for it.

But then someone who isnt familiar with an iphone
having just got one may not realise what the icon
means. Tho a speaker with a bar thru it should be rather
obvious to anyone who isnt as stupid as the turnip.

wrote
The Natural Philosopher wrote

Trying to phone my neighbour,. No reply. eventually
phoned him on te landline, and invited him for dinner.
"Why didn't you answer your I phone?"
"It didn't ring"

A friend has lost his password to his icloud thing for email.

Apple's idea of password recovery is "shall we
email your new password to your icloud address?"

No, because that's the password he's lost.

You dont need to know you icloud password
to be able to receive a new password by email.

And emailing a new one isnt the only option anyway.
https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201487

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news
On 06/05/17 09:33, Richard wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news

On 06/05/17 08:09, Hankat wrote:


"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news On 06/05/17 00:06, wrote:
On Friday, 5 May 2017 23:16:27 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
hTrying to phone my neighbour,. No reply. eventually phoned him on
te landline, and invited him for dinner.

"Why didn't you answer your I phone?" "It didn't ring"

Sure enough, it doesn't ring.

Went through every single menu, discover hundreds of combinations
of 'I don't want this phone to ring' and turn them all off.

It still doesn't ring.

two and half hours later I google "My ****ing i-phone won't ring"

And discover that unlike *EVERY OTHER FUNCTION* on the i-phone,
there is a PHYSICAL SWITCH to turn the ringer off. Nothing in any
menu indicated it was turned off. Nor did it come with any manual.

There are people here who say that the linux command line is old
fashioned and opaque. They have obviously never set up an I phone.

So that's 5 hours in total trying to solve basic simple problems
like 'how the **** do I insert the sim card? and 'How the **** do I
get this heap of unadulterated wombat turds to do the MOST BASIC
THING, like ring....

Even my nokia 102 is crap. The old nokias had a green telephone
that you pressed to answer a call, and a red telephone that you
pressed to end the call. Pretty obvious really. the 102 doesn't. It
has an unside down bath symbol and what looks like a speedometer.
They bear no relationship to making a call whatsoever. I am after
over a year still not sure which one does what and often cuts
people off instead of answering the phone.But that doesnt happen
much anyway, because its got a vodaphone sim in, and there is ****
all vodaphone coverage.

What a delight now me mate has gone home and I know that if I want
the internet, I have a well thougfht out Linux machine that
actually works with a reasonably sane user interface, and a
telepone handset connected to copper that always ring and always
gets me connected to the person I am calling...

...Unless they have an I-phone of course.

Lol. Iphones are if anything better than the others in this respect.
And you can't really blame the iphone for the fact that you didn't
RTFM.

There was no ****ing manual!

Corse there is.
http://help.apple.com/iphone/10/

At least Unix came with an online manual.

So do iphones.

Mobiles are squarely marketed at kids, and are a whole lot of
fancy crap over functionality. I suppose that the phone UI isn't
something that has been established & settled over the years to the
same extent that desktop winlin has.

When apple made the first macintosh. OS/9 or whatever it was at least
had a consistent look and feel and some sort of logic to it.

So do iphones.

And it came with a manual.

So do iphones.


No, they do not.

I actually opened the package. There was a sheet saying 'insert sim
card'

It took me 2 hours to work out how to do that.

That was all it basically said.

This is not my phone, its an elderly neighbours phone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXBwDa1ohck

How is someone with a non working smart phone that doesn't even play flash
videos supposed to access that content?

They get real radical and actually try the youtube app.

"Tim Streater" wrote in message
.. .
In article , Hankat
wrote:

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news
On 06/05/17 11:19, Hankat wrote:

the point was that this phone and other apple products are marketed as
being really easy to use and get going.

And they are. Whoever sold you the ****ing phone will be
able to tell you how to insert the sim card if you are so ****ing
stupid that you can't work out where to get that basic info.

Er, Woddles, who might have been that "sold TNP the phone",

Never said anything about it being sold to the turnip.

then, since no one did?

Having fun thrashing that straw man ?

It was a gift to the neighbour,

You dont know that either. That not what the turnip said.

who then asked TNP for help.

Only when the turnip asked him why he didnt answer the phone.

We're not told who the gift was from.

You dont know that it was a gift from anyone.

I think you need to learn to read for comprehension.

I know you have never had a ****ing clue about anything at all, ever.

The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 06/05/17 19:52, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artÃ*culo , The Natural Philosopher
escribió:

I actually opened the package. There was a sheet saying 'insert sim
card'

It took me 2 hours to work out how to do that.

Why doesn't that surprise me?

Because you are a complete humourless ****
Next?



You missed out cat loving!

Graeme wrote
The Natural Philosopher wrote

Unless the whole point is to bedazzle the user with the
cleverness and complexity of the product by disguising
the ****tiness of the underlying hardware and software.

Is that not true of the vast majority of electrical/
electronic devices on the market today?

Nope, nothing ****ty about the underlying hardware
and software of a decent high end smartphone, or
tablet or laptop or TV or modem etc etc etc.

When did it take off?

Its always been like that with something
as fast moving as modern electronics.

Perhaps today's 'smart' phone is the direct descendent of
all those awful 1980s 'hi fis' that had a million useless knobs
and switches that didn't really do very much, were rarely
necessary and were only there to impress the boys, and
disguise the crapiness of the underlying product.

Nope. In fact modern smartphone have so much more
capability that its completely trivial to have very useful
functions like a switch on the side of the iphone which
allows even the most stupid to mute the phone with
a flick of the switch.

Corse that will inevitably mean that some do it by accident
when that isnt what they intended, and some are so ****ing
stupid that they can't even manage to use the net to see
why the phone that should ring isnt currently ringing.

Some gutless ****wit desperately cowering behind
The Natural Philosopher wrote
just the usual **** that it always ends up with when it
got done like a ****ing dinner, as it always is.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news
On 06/05/17 12:14, wrote:
On Saturday, 6 May 2017 09:38:57 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
On 06/05/17 09:17, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artÃ*culo , Rod Speed
escribió:

And there is no obvious indication of that on the screen.

Oh, that'll be why it pops up a "Ringer on/off" thing on the
display whenever I operate the switch, then. Even when it's in
standby.

I have no idea whether an alert popped up when my elderly neighbour
nudged it presumably with his finger while ansering a call. .

I certainly did not notice that when I turned it back on.

My point being that there is no PERMANENT rather than volatile
indication of the state.Like te little moon thing that comes up
when you put it into lunatic mode.


If I try and drive my car with the handbrake on, it shows me that
the handbrake is on. I dont need to be looking at the dashboard
just at the instant I put the handbrake on. Curiously enough that
is the one time when I KNOW I just put the handbrake on, and don't
need reminding

In fact you have totally proved my point. Having an alert to tell
you you have just done something that you know you have just done,
because you just did it, is the most useless and superfluous piece
of crap programming yet.

Unless the whole point is to bedazzle the user with the cleverness
and complexity of the product by disguising the ****tiness of the
underlying hardware and software.

In your case its obvipously worked.

It's a painless way to educate beginner users re what does what.
Iphones don't get everything right, and can be frustrating like any
other computer, but they are a lot better than the competition in
that respect.


I suppose my problem is that I come from a professional IT background

Nope, your real problem is that you are so ****ing
stupid that you can't even manage to do the most
basic google on what can see an iphone stop ringing.

Or even manage to use google to find where the ****ing manual is either.

and this stuff wouldn't even get past goods inward inspection.

Dang, didnt realise no one ever actually uses iphone in that industry.

Or androids which are even worse either.

Clearly not enough to keep Blackberry from going broke.

Do you remember the days when personal computers came with the BIOS source
code at the back of the paper manuals?

Yep. Makes a lot more sense to include a manual in the device now.

The though that there could be worse kit than an I-phone frankly scares
me.

Then you had better hide under the ****ing bed.

Its a toy. A fashion item., A gadget. a marketable piece of bling.

Its also a very useful device for those who arent so ****ing
stupid that they can't even manage the most basic stuff like
asking the operation they got it from how to insert the sim
if they are too stupid to actually google for that.

It is not a computer

Even sillier than you usually manage.

and it doesn't work as advertised either.

It does for anyone who isnt actually a terminal ****wit.

Its like the worst version of windows ever. Designed to sell, not to work.

You never could bull**** your way out of a wet paper bag.

Or even manage to find the ****ing manual.

Having finally arrived at a desktop that is almost professional in its
quality, I never want to touch a macintosh or a WinPc again.

Your problem, as always.

Or an Iphone

Yes, you are clearly so ****ing stupid you can't
manage even the most basic stuff like an iphone.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news
On 06/05/17 12:20, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , Hankat
wrote:

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news On 06/05/17 11:19, Hankat wrote:

the point was that this phone and other apple products are marketed
as being really easy to use and get going.

And they are. Whoever sold you the ****ing phone will be
able to tell you how to insert the sim card if you are so ****ing
stupid that you can't work out where to get that basic info.

Er, Woddles, who might have been that "sold TNP the phone", then, since
no one did? It was a gift to the neighbour, who then asked TNP for
help.

We're not told who the gift was from.

BT. Bt sold him FTTC, and a mobile package, and a router and an i-phone
arrived.

The router has a known fault, that sometimes causes it to lock up. They
all do.

Mine doesnt.

But it more or less worked.

The I-phone came with nothing but a single sheet of cardboard showing how
to connect it to BTs network, starting with 'first insert sim card'

But no instructions on how to insert the sim card.

And you were so ****ing stupid you couldnt even
manage to suggest that he ask BT how to do that.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news
On 06/05/17 12:40, charles wrote:
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 06/05/17 11:40, Richard wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news
On 06/05/17 09:33, Richard wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news This is not my phone, its an elderly neighbours phone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXBwDa1ohck

How is someone with a non working smart phone that doesn't even play
flash videos supposed to access that content?

His kindly neighbour shows him on his computer?
Does the elderly guy have a smart TV?

Only since I bought it for him two weeks ago.

He says he cant change channels on it yet though.

But we are talking hypothetical here.

How does someone with no other internet connection and no printed
instructions get a smart phone online enough to get to the online
manual?

Especially if all he wants it for is to make and receive phone calls.

The normsl way would be to ask the retailer.

I give you Sir charles new car.

te retailer is or was BT,. These days they don't even speak english

Even a terminal ****wit such as yourself should be able to google it.

On Saturday, 6 May 2017 22:43:09 UTC+1, Rod wrote:

Even a terminal ****wit such as yourself should be able to google it.

someone give this idiot a pill for his verbal diarrhoea

"pamela" wrote in message
...
On 09:32 6 May 2017, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 06/05/17 09:14, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artÃ*culo , The Natural
Philosopher escribió:

No there isn't any manual
On or off the phone

Oh, yes there is. It's installed at the factory. You're just
too stupid to find it. An it's online he

http://help.apple.com/iphone/10/

Your issue is a classic case of going at a problem like a bull
in a china shop farting about with the settings 'cos you think
you know it all. If you'd R the FM in the first place you
wouldn't have made yourself look a prat, would you?

Nowhere in the instructions that came with the phone does it say
it has a manual built in

Use your common sense.

He doesn’t have any of that. Too ****ing stupid to do even
the most basic stuff like google 'iphone not ringing' for hours.

Next you will be complaining that toilet paper
doesn't come with instructions on how to use it.

Yep.

"pamela" wrote in message
...
On 09:17 6 May 2017, Mike Tomlinson wrote:

En el artículo , Rod Speed
escribió:

And there is no obvious indication of that on the screen.

Oh, that'll be why it pops up a "Ringer on/off" thing on the
display whenever I operate the switch, then. Even when it's in
standby.


I wonder what the neighbour thought that switch was actually for all
this time he had the phone.

Likely just ignored it.

"pamela" wrote in message
...
On 08:12 6 May 2017, RJH wrote:

On 05/05/2017 23:16, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
hTrying to phone my neighbour,. No reply. eventually phoned him
on te landline, and invited him for dinner.

"Why didn't you answer your I phone?"
"It didn't ring"

Sure enough, it doesn't ring.

Went through every single menu, discover hundreds of
combinations of 'I don't want this phone to ring' and turn them
all off.

It still doesn't ring.

two and half hours later I google "My ****ing i-phone won't
ring"

And discover that unlike *EVERY OTHER FUNCTION* on the
i-phone, there is a PHYSICAL SWITCH to turn the ringer off.
Nothing in any menu indicated it was turned off. Nor did it
come with any manual.


Given there's only a couple of physical buttons on the thing, it
wouldn't normally take too much in the way of deduction to
conclude what it does - and it gives a screen indication of
'mute' when it's toggled. Seems you and your friend missed that.

It's almost beyond belief that it took several
hours to discover what that switch did.

Nope, he actually is that stupid. Too stupid to
even manage to google iphone manual either.

I wonder if this is all a troll?

Nope, he so defensive about his stupidity that it can't be that.

Also, in the 'Settings' app type 'ring' into the search dialogue
- your friend will see a variety of other options - vibration
patterns, alerts, visual cues.

"Andrew" wrote in message
news
On 06/05/2017 11:52, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Especially if all he wants it for is to make and receive phone calls.

Then why on earth did he buy a smart phone ??.

He needs emails on the go.

FFS, all he needs is the simplest of PAYG phones, or better still
no phone at all. Just use the BT one plugged into the wall.

Andrew wrote
The Natural Philosopher wrote

He does need to get emails on the go as well.

Why ?. No-one retired 'needs' such a facility.

But they may still be useful.

In the good old days, if you were expecting an important
letter, you stayed in until it was delivered.

And its a bit pointless waiting for that now, it wont happen.

"Capitol" wrote in message
o.uk...
Andrew wrote:
On 06/05/2017 14:06, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
He does need to get emails on the go as well.

Why ?. No-one retired 'needs' such a facility.

I do when traveling. However the phone is not reliable for emails,

Mine is.

so I also carry a Linux netbook.

More fool you.

"Andrew" wrote in message
news
On 06/05/2017 16:02, Capitol wrote:
Andrew wrote:
On 06/05/2017 14:06, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
He does need to get emails on the go as well.

Why ?. No-one retired 'needs' such a facility.

I do when traveling. However the phone is not reliable for emails,
so I also carry a Linux netbook.

Yes, but this person is described as 'elderly', so travelling
usually means shuffling down to Asda and back.

You have no idea what that person does.

I travelled the world between 1988 and 1990 and managed
without a mobile phone, email or indeed any means of
mobile communication. It's how it used to be.

And then the world moved on just a tad.

I defy anyone to prove that they 'need' mobile communication while on
holiday.

It aint about need, its about what is convenient.

I managed to miss the train and it was very convenient
to be able to check when the next one would be, and
work out what to do to fill in the time till the next one
was due to leave and to find somewhere to stay over
night, where to get a cheap meal in the evening, get
directions to where I chose to stay, what public
transport was best to get to the places I used to fill
in the time that day, etc etc etc.

I posted my Kodachrome films back to the Lab in
North London and they sent the slides back to a
relatives address. That was the only way they knew
I was still alive.

And now its much cheaper and more convenient
to be able to ring them for free, text them or even
get real radical and take a photo and have them
able to see it seconds later.

"Andrew" wrote in message
news
On 06/05/2017 16:33, charles wrote:
In article ,
Andrew wrote:
On 06/05/2017 14:06, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
He does need to get emails on the go as well.

Why ?. No-one retired 'needs' such a facility.

just because you've "retired" doesn't mean you've left the world. I
spent
14 years of my retirement running an amateur theatre with its own
building.
I've now "retired" from that but am still a trustee of 3 charities.

But I bet you could do all that without a mobile phone or emails, or the
internet, because prior to about 1985 people did just that.

Corse you could, but why bother with phones so cheap and convenient.

Plenty don’t even bother with a landline at all anymore, just have
a decent smartphone that does everything they want to do.

"pamela" wrote in message
...
On 17:09 6 May 2017, Tim Streater wrote:

In article , pamela
wrote:

On 09:17 6 May 2017, Mike Tomlinson wrote:

En el artÃ*culo , Rod Speed
escribió:

And there is no obvious indication of that on the screen.

Oh, that'll be why it pops up a "Ringer on/off" thing on the
display whenever I operate the switch, then. Even when it's
in standby.

I wonder what the neighbour thought that switch was actually for
all this time he had the phone.

He's prolly no different from the mass of consumers, who when
using e.g. Word see all these items in the menus and never think
to wonder what they are or try them.


Yes but there are only 3 buttons on that side of the phone.
Two are for volume. The only other button on the case is the
on-off switch. Surely that unknown button piqued some interest?

Clearly it didn’t with those two.

As the mystery button is right next to the volume
buttons then it wouldn't be too hard to guess it
might be connected with the volume of something.

That’s one of those easy to be wise after the event things.

Corse they could have got real radical and read the ****ing manual.

"dennis@home" wrote in message
eb.com...
On 06/05/2017 11:52, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 06/05/17 11:40, Richard wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news
On 06/05/17 09:33, Richard wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news This is not my phone, its an elderly neighbours phone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXBwDa1ohck

How is someone with a non working smart phone that doesn't even play
flash videos supposed to access that content?

His kindly neighbour shows him on his computer?
Does the elderly guy have a smart TV?

Only since I bought it for him two weeks ago.

He says he cant change channels on it yet though.

Why buy a smart TV when he doesn't want one?
I don't have a smart TV, however I can connect my computers to it and then
its much smarter.


But we are talking hypothetical here.

How does someone with no other internet connection and no printed
instructions get a smart phone online enough to get to the online manual?

Especially if all he wants it for is to make and receive phone calls.


Why get a computer when you only want to make calls?

He wants to do more than make calls.

A £15 phone would be better.

Makes more sense to get something that can make
calls and can also do other stuff you will find useful.

Maybe he needs to download the TV's app and use the phone to control it.

"dennis@home" wrote in message
eb.com...
On 06/05/2017 16:49, RJH wrote:

Yes, you're probably right. One of them, maybe, but 2 adults (assuming),
highly unlikely they couldn't find it.



Never underestimate how stupid people can be.
You have to assume there will be someone really stupid trying to use your
product.

But it can make a lot more sense to realise that the
really stupid will get the operation they bought
the phone from to set it up so it can be used
than to try to explain to the most stupid who
don’t even understand what a sim is for how to
get something so small and fiddly into an iphone.

wrote in message
...
On Saturday, 6 May 2017 14:12:58 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 06/05/17 12:14, tabbypurr wrote:
On Saturday, 6 May 2017 09:38:57 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

In fact you have totally proved my point. Having an alert to tell
you you have just done something that you know you have just done,
because you just did it, is the most useless and superfluous piece
of crap programming yet.

Unless the whole point is to bedazzle the user with the cleverness
and complexity of the product by disguising the ****tiness of the
underlying hardware and software.

In your case its obvipously worked.

It's a painless way to educate beginner users re what does what.
Iphones don't get everything right, and can be frustrating like any
other computer, but they are a lot better than the competition in
that respect.


I suppose my problem is that I come from a professional IT background
and this stuff wouldn't even get past goods inward inspection.

Do you remember the days when personal computers came with the BIOS
source code at the back of the paper manuals?

The though that there could be worse kit than an I-phone frankly scares
me.

Its a toy. A fashion item., A gadget. a marketable piece of bling. It is
not a computer and it doesn't work as advertised either.

Its like the worst version of windows ever. Designed to sell, not to
work.

Sorry but that's unrealistic. You had one bad moment - some of us have
used them for years. No pocket computer is perfect, but they're fairly
good.


Having finally arrived at a desktop that is almost professional in its
quality, I never want to touch a macintosh or a WinPc again.

Or an Iphone

Desktop UIs are older and better developed.

And are in fact much less intuitive than iOS is now.

"newshound" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 5/5/2017 11:16 PM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
hTrying to phone my neighbour,. No reply. eventually phoned him on te
landline, and invited him for dinner.

"Why didn't you answer your I phone?"
"It didn't ring"

Sure enough, it doesn't ring.

Went through every single menu, discover hundreds of combinations of 'I
don't want this phone to ring' and turn them all off.

It still doesn't ring.

two and half hours later I google "My ****ing i-phone won't ring"

And discover that unlike *EVERY OTHER FUNCTION* on the i-phone, there is
a PHYSICAL SWITCH to turn the ringer off. Nothing in any menu indicated
it was turned off. Nor did it come with any manual.

There are people here who say that the linux command line is old
fashioned and opaque. They have obviously never set up an I phone.

So that's 5 hours in total trying to solve basic simple problems like
'how the **** do I insert the sim card? and 'How the **** do I get this
heap of unadulterated wombat turds to do the MOST BASIC THING, like
ring...

Even my nokia 102 is crap. The old nokias had a green telephone that you
pressed to answer a call, and a red telephone that you pressed to end the
call. Pretty obvious really. the 102 doesn't. It has an unside down bath
symbol and what looks like a speedometer. They bear no relationship to
making a call whatsoever. I am after over a year still not sure which one
does what and often cuts people off instead of answering the phone.But
that doesnt happen much anyway, because its got a vodaphone sim in, and
there is **** all vodaphone coverage.

What a delight now me mate has gone home and I know that if I want the
internet, I have a well thougfht out Linux machine that actually works
with a reasonably sane user interface, and a telepone handset connected
to copper that always ring and always gets me connected to the person I
am calling...

...Unless they have an I-phone of course.



:-)

In a past life I wrote "research" and then commercial code to automate
some scientific instruments (normally used by Russell Group PhDs and
DPhils). I reckoned I'd spend half the coding time writing traps for all
the possible invalid responses to relatively simple menus (either calling
for single keystroke letters, or numbers).

What you are describing is all too familiar. Developers who have become so
intimate with their products that they think "It is obvious how I am
asking the user to respond".

That isnt the case with the iphone mute switch.