help, my gloworm combi boiler is heating my water but not heating the
radiators,
i have bled all rads incase air lock but from the middle floor to top floor
there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water. any ideas?

--
for full context, visit http://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy/...g-1179724-.htm

In article s.com, nicola
m wrote:
help, my gloworm combi boiler is heating my water but not heating the
radiators, i have bled all rads incase air lock but from the middle floor
to top floor there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water. any
ideas?

your header tank is not refilling.and the water level in the system has
dropped .

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

On Tuesday, 27 December 2016 13:44:03 UTC, nicola wrote:

help, my gloworm combi boiler is heating my water but not heating the
radiators,
i have bled all rads incase air lock but from the middle floor to top floor
there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water. any ideas?

Start here
http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...Heating_Repair


NT

On 27/12/2016 13:54, charles wrote:
In article s.com, nicola
m wrote:
help, my gloworm combi boiler is heating my water but not heating the
radiators, i have bled all rads incase air lock but from the middle floor
to top floor there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water. any
ideas?

your header tank is not refilling.and the water level in the system has
dropped .

Most combis are sealed system. I would have thought there will be a
filling loop that needs attention?

If that is the case there should be a gauge on the boiler of course -
somewhere!

nicola wrote:
help, my gloworm combi boiler is heating my water but not heating the
radiators,
i have bled all rads incase air lock but from the middle floor to top
floor there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water. any
ideas?

The system has no pressure if there's nothing coming out of the rads.

I'm not really expecting a reply to this as homo club posters, rarely, if
ever bother to reply to posts they've made, or, if they do it's usually 17
years later.

There will be a filling loop under the boiler allowing re-pressurisation,
and a gauge showing system pressure. It will currently be on zero and it
needs to be over 1 bar after all the rads have been bled.

See you in 2034 if either of us are still alive.

On Tue, 27 Dec 2016 15:59:02 +0000, Phil L wrote:

nicola wrote:
help, my gloworm combi boiler is heating my water but not heating the
radiators,
i have bled all rads incase air lock but from the middle floor to top
floor there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water. any
ideas?

The system has no pressure if there's nothing coming out of the rads.


If there is no pressure, there will be no hot water either.
Another poster says the header tank needs filling! Why even reply if you
havent got any idea about these things?
It is a combi boiler, it will be pressurised, it has hot water, but no
radiators.
It could be a few things, but my money would be on a stuck diverter
valve. Other areas to check would be sensors on the CH outputs, or even a
PCB failure, a pump that is failing, but working enough to pump the HW
around the boiler, a fault with the programmer/stat, or even a total
blockage on the CH pipes.

Do any of the CH output pipes get hotter when calling for heat?
Is there a crucnching/sticking noise when the diverter valve moves/tries
to move?
Does the boiler fire up at all when calling for heat?

Check the boiler is getting an input from the programmer/stat.
Take the cover off to see / hear if the diverter is moving.
It is fires up, see how long for, and of the output pipes get hot, and
if / when it cuts out.

Get someone in who knows what they are doing.

On 27/12/2016 17:27, Alan wrote:
On Tue, 27 Dec 2016 15:59:02 +0000, Phil L wrote:

nicola wrote:
help, my gloworm combi boiler is heating my water but not heating the
radiators,
i have bled all rads incase air lock but from the middle floor to top
floor there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water. any
ideas?

The system has no pressure if there's nothing coming out of the rads.


If there is no pressure, there will be no hot water either.
Another poster says the header tank needs filling! Why even reply if you
havent got any idea about these things?
It is a combi boiler, it will be pressurised, it has hot water, but no
radiators.
It could be a few things, but my money would be on a stuck diverter
valve.

How can a stuck diverter valve have the symptoms of "middle floor to top
floor there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water"?

Other areas to check would be sensors on the CH outputs, or even a
PCB failure, a pump that is failing, but working enough to pump the HW
around the boiler, a fault with the programmer/stat, or even a total
blockage on the CH pipes.

Do any of the CH output pipes get hotter when calling for heat?
Is there a crucnching/sticking noise when the diverter valve moves/tries
to move?
Does the boiler fire up at all when calling for heat?

Check the boiler is getting an input from the programmer/stat.
Take the cover off to see / hear if the diverter is moving.
It is fires up, see how long for, and of the output pipes get hot, and
if / when it cuts out.

Get someone in who knows what they are doing.

Yes quite. Perhaps first check if there is some water pressure? If there
is then perhaps supply heat to the house to thaw out any ice?

On 27/12/2016 15:59, Phil L wrote:

There will be a filling loop under the boiler allowing re-pressurisation,
and a gauge showing system pressure. It will currently be on zero and it
needs to be over 1 bar after all the rads have been bled.

I am surprised that the boiler lights at all if the pressure is that low
that there's nothing in the upstairs system at all.

On 27/12/2016 18:02, GB wrote:
On 27/12/2016 15:59, Phil L wrote:

There will be a filling loop under the boiler allowing re-pressurisation,
and a gauge showing system pressure. It will currently be on zero and it
needs to be over 1 bar after all the rads have been bled.

I am surprised that the boiler lights at all if the pressure is that low
that there's nothing in the upstairs system at all.

Hmm. I know a Vaillant that will light up, once to the detriment of the
heat exchanger.

replying to Alan, Nicola wrote:
Thanks guys. I've got a plumber coming tomorrow just making kids put dressing
gowns on for now hahaha
Boiler fires up when waters on but not with heating I've turned it off and
tried firing it back up. My husband thinks it's a valve

--
for full context, visit http://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy/...g-1179724-.htm

On Tue, 27 Dec 2016 13:44:01 +0000, nicola wrote:

help, my gloworm combi boiler is heating my water but not heating the
radiators,
i have bled all rads incase air lock but from the middle floor to top
floor there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water. any
ideas?

Is there an LCD display on the front of the boiler? If so, what does it
say, is it flashing 0.4 ?

On Tuesday, 27 December 2016 19:44:03 UTC, Nicola wrote:
replying to Alan, Nicola wrote:
Thanks guys. I've got a plumber coming tomorrow just making kids put dressing
gowns on for now hahaha
Boiler fires up when waters on but not with heating I've turned it off and
tried firing it back up. My husband thinks it's a valve

It does sound like loss of pressure on the primary circuit. If so it can be got going again by adding some water. A picture of the underneath & front of the boiler could help.


NT

Fredxxx wrote:

On 27/12/2016 18:02, GB wrote:
On 27/12/2016 15:59, Phil L wrote:

There will be a filling loop under the boiler allowing re-pressurisation,
and a gauge showing system pressure. It will currently be on zero and it
needs to be over 1 bar after all the rads have been bled.

I am surprised that the boiler lights at all if the pressure is that low
that there's nothing in the upstairs system at all.

Hmm. I know a Vaillant that will light up, once to the detriment of the
heat exchanger.

As long as the water level is above the top of the boiler, why should it
not work perfectly well in hot water mode with no CH circulation? I
know mine (an old oil-burning cast iron combi) does, although I suppose
it is possible modern ones need a CH circuit to dissipate excess heat.


--

Roger Hayter

In article ,
Alan wrote:
On Tue, 27 Dec 2016 15:59:02 +0000, Phil L wrote:

nicola wrote:
help, my gloworm combi boiler is heating my water but not heating the
radiators,
i have bled all rads incase air lock but from the middle floor to top
floor there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water. any
ideas?

The system has no pressure if there's nothing coming out of the rads.


If there is no pressure, there will be no hot water either.
Another poster says the header tank needs filling! Why even reply if you
havent got any idea about these things?

Because the fauklt description fits that scenario perfectly.


It is a combi boiler, it will be pressurised, it has hot water, but no
radiators.

More than no radiators, no water in some radiators.


It could be a few things, but my money would be on a stuck diverter
valve.

There would still be water in the radiators.


Other areas to check would be sensors on the CH outputs, or even a
PCB failure, a pump that is failing, but working enough to pump the HW
around the boiler, a fault with the programmer/stat, or even a total
blockage on the CH pipes.

Do any of the CH output pipes get hotter when calling for heat?
Is there a crucnching/sticking noise when the diverter valve moves/tries
to move?
Does the boiler fire up at all when calling for heat?

Check the boiler is getting an input from the programmer/stat.
Take the cover off to see / hear if the diverter is moving.
It is fires up, see how long for, and of the output pipes get hot, and
if / when it cuts out.

Get someone in who knows what they are doing.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

In article s.com,
Nicola m wrote:
replying to Alan, Nicola wrote: Thanks guys. I've got a plumber coming
tomorrow just making kids put dressing gowns on for now hahaha Boiler
fires up when waters on but not with heating I've turned it off and tried
firing it back up. My husband thinks it's a valve

do let us know what the problem turnns out to be.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

replying to John #9, Nicola wrote:
Yes there is but no error code at all. It just shows temperature

--
for full context, visit http://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy/...g-1179724-.htm

wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 27 December 2016 19:44:03 UTC, Nicola wrote:
replying to Alan, Nicola wrote:
Thanks guys. I've got a plumber coming tomorrow just making kids put
dressing
gowns on for now hahaha
Boiler fires up when waters on but not with heating I've turned it off
and
tried firing it back up. My husband thinks it's a valve

It does sound like loss of pressure on the primary circuit.

Doesnt explain why they have hot water but no heating.

If so it can be got going again by adding some water.
A picture of the underneath & front of the boiler could help.

Bet its the valve.

On 27/12/2016 20:37, Roger Hayter wrote:
Fredxxx wrote:

On 27/12/2016 18:02, GB wrote:
On 27/12/2016 15:59, Phil L wrote:

There will be a filling loop under the boiler allowing re-pressurisation,
and a gauge showing system pressure. It will currently be on zero and it
needs to be over 1 bar after all the rads have been bled.

I am surprised that the boiler lights at all if the pressure is that low
that there's nothing in the upstairs system at all.

Hmm. I know a Vaillant that will light up, once to the detriment of the
heat exchanger.

As long as the water level is above the top of the boiler, why should it
not work perfectly well in hot water mode with no CH circulation? I
know mine (an old oil-burning cast iron combi) does, although I suppose
it is possible modern ones need a CH circuit to dissipate excess heat.



They might be able to work, as you say, but they have a pressure sensing
valve that is supposed to shut them off if the water pressure is low.

On 27/12/16 19:44, Nicola wrote:
replying to Alan, Nicola wrote:
Thanks guys. I've got a plumber coming tomorrow just making kids put
dressing
gowns on for now hahaha Boiler fires up when waters on but not with
heating I've turned it off and
tried firing it back up. My husband thinks it's a valve

Has your husband checked the system pressure on the gauge on the front
of the boiler? Should be 1 bar or the needle should be in the green segment.

GB wrote:

On 27/12/2016 20:37, Roger Hayter wrote:
Fredxxx wrote:

On 27/12/2016 18:02, GB wrote:
On 27/12/2016 15:59, Phil L wrote:

There will be a filling loop under the boiler allowing re-pressurisation,
and a gauge showing system pressure. It will currently be on zero and it
needs to be over 1 bar after all the rads have been bled.

I am surprised that the boiler lights at all if the pressure is that low
that there's nothing in the upstairs system at all.

Hmm. I know a Vaillant that will light up, once to the detriment of the
heat exchanger.

As long as the water level is above the top of the boiler, why should it
not work perfectly well in hot water mode with no CH circulation? I
know mine (an old oil-burning cast iron combi) does, although I suppose
it is possible modern ones need a CH circuit to dissipate excess heat.



They might be able to work, as you say, but they have a pressure sensing
valve that is supposed to shut them off if the water pressure is low.

OIC. Mine doesn't, but it is somewhat old.

--

Roger Hayter

charles wrote:

In article ,
Alan wrote:
On Tue, 27 Dec 2016 15:59:02 +0000, Phil L wrote:

nicola wrote:
help, my gloworm combi boiler is heating my water but not heating the
radiators,
i have bled all rads incase air lock but from the middle floor to top
floor there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water. any
ideas?

The system has no pressure if there's nothing coming out of the rads.


If there is no pressure, there will be no hot water either.
Another poster says the header tank needs filling! Why even reply if you
havent got any idea about these things?

Because the fauklt description fits that scenario perfectly.

I think the point he is making is that combi boilers don't have header
tanks, they are closed, pressurised systems with an air-filled expansion
tank.

--

Roger Hayter

replying to Nicola, Nicola wrote:
Plumbers been and all fixed. A valve was stuck that's in upstairs airing
cupboard and he said all radiators r cheap ones it's a new build house onlybin
since 2008 but once valves on rads open he put a pin in n the air came out. We
have been replacing them because they looked cheap and the new ones were all
fine. Thankfully not cost a fortune thanks for all your help

--
for full context, visit http://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy/...g-1179724-.htm

On Tue, 27 Dec 2016 20:37:05 +0000, Roger Hayter wrote:

Hmm. I know a Vaillant that will light up, once to the detriment
of the heat exchanger.

As long as the water level is above the top of the boiler, why
should it not work perfectly well in hot water mode with no CH
circulation? I know mine (an old oil-burning cast iron combi)
does, although I suppose it is possible modern ones need a CH
circuit to dissipate excess heat.

Yes these 38kW Vaillant boilers push out a LOT of energy, it has to
go somewhere and if it can't the boiler is likely to crash.

Alan wrote:
On Tue, 27 Dec 2016 15:59:02 +0000, Phil L wrote:

nicola wrote:
help, my gloworm combi boiler is heating my water but not heating
the radiators,
i have bled all rads incase air lock but from the middle floor to
top floor there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water.
any ideas?

The system has no pressure if there's nothing coming out of the rads.


If there is no pressure, there will be no hot water either.

So you've obviously never had or seen a combi boiler then.

Another poster says the header tank needs filling! Why even reply if
you havent got any idea about these things?
It is a combi boiler, it will be pressurised, it has hot water, but no
radiators.

Is it pressurised when you buy it from the combi shop? - *NO*, you have to
pressurise it yourself when you install it, and when it loses pressure,
through a leak or from being manually drained, we call this
'depressurisation' as there is no pressure in the system - it's all self
explanatory really.
Please see the OP's bit about 'no water or air coming from the bleed valves'


It could be a few things, but my money would be on a stuck diverter
valve. Other areas to check would be sensors on the CH outputs, or
even a PCB failure, a pump that is failing, but working enough to
pump the HW around the boiler, a fault with the programmer/stat, or
even a total blockage on the CH pipes.

Do any of the CH output pipes get hotter when calling for heat?
Is there a crucnching/sticking noise when the diverter valve
moves/tries to move?
Does the boiler fire up at all when calling for heat?

Check the boiler is getting an input from the programmer/stat.
Take the cover off to see / hear if the diverter is moving.
It is fires up, see how long for, and of the output pipes get hot, and
if / when it cuts out.

Get someone in who knows what they are doing.

She's paying a plumber £300 today and he will turn on the little tap
underneath which will repressurise the system, then when it reaches 1.5 bar
on the gauge, he'll turn it back off and the boiler will fire up once the
rads have been bled, not bad for 15 minutes 'work'

On 28/12/16 16:56, Phil L wrote:
Alan wrote:
On Tue, 27 Dec 2016 15:59:02 +0000, Phil L wrote:

nicola wrote:
help, my gloworm combi boiler is heating my water but not heating
the radiators,
i have bled all rads incase air lock but from the middle floor to
top floor there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water.
any ideas?

The system has no pressure if there's nothing coming out of the rads.


If there is no pressure, there will be no hot water either.

So you've obviously never had or seen a combi boiler then.

Another poster says the header tank needs filling! Why even reply if
you havent got any idea about these things?
It is a combi boiler, it will be pressurised, it has hot water, but no
radiators.

Is it pressurised when you buy it from the combi shop? - *NO*, you have to
pressurise it yourself when you install it, and when it loses pressure,
through a leak or from being manually drained, we call this
'depressurisation' as there is no pressure in the system - it's all self
explanatory really.
Please see the OP's bit about 'no water or air coming from the bleed valves'


It could be a few things, but my money would be on a stuck diverter
valve. Other areas to check would be sensors on the CH outputs, or
even a PCB failure, a pump that is failing, but working enough to
pump the HW around the boiler, a fault with the programmer/stat, or
even a total blockage on the CH pipes.

Do any of the CH output pipes get hotter when calling for heat?
Is there a crucnching/sticking noise when the diverter valve
moves/tries to move?
Does the boiler fire up at all when calling for heat?

Check the boiler is getting an input from the programmer/stat.
Take the cover off to see / hear if the diverter is moving.
It is fires up, see how long for, and of the output pipes get hot, and
if / when it cuts out.

Get someone in who knows what they are doing.

She's paying a plumber �300 today and he will turn on the little tap
underneath which will repressurise the system, then when it reaches 1.5 bar
on the gauge, he'll turn it back off and the boiler will fire up once the
rads have been bled, not bad for 15 minutes 'work'


Especially as he wont check the ****ed pressure vessel so it will have
no pressure in a days time again.

GB wrote:
On 27/12/2016 15:59, Phil L wrote:

There will be a filling loop under the boiler allowing
re-pressurisation, and a gauge showing system pressure. It will
currently be on zero and it needs to be over 1 bar after all the
rads have been bled.

I am surprised that the boiler lights at all if the pressure is that
low that there's nothing in the upstairs system at all.

It doesn't fire up for heat, it will fire up for hot water as there's a
constant flow from the mains

Phil L wrote:
Alan wrote:

Another poster says the header tank needs filling! Why even reply if
you havent got any idea about these things?
It is a combi boiler, it will be pressurised, it has hot water, but no
radiators.

Is it pressurised when you buy it from the combi shop? - *NO*, you have to
pressurise it yourself when you install it, and when it loses pressure,
through a leak or from being manually drained, we call this
'depressurisation' as there is no pressure in the system - it's all self
explanatory really.
Please see the OP's bit about 'no water or air coming from the bleed valves'

Get off your high horse. If you'd read all the replies you'd realise that
Alan was quoting Charles who suggested that the header tank wasn't filling.
He doesn't say it doesn't need pressurising, just that it won't have a
header tank.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

Tim+ wrote:
Phil L wrote:
Alan wrote:

Another poster says the header tank needs filling! Why even reply if
you havent got any idea about these things?
It is a combi boiler, it will be pressurised, it has hot water, but
no radiators.

Is it pressurised when you buy it from the combi shop? - *NO*, you
have to pressurise it yourself when you install it, and when it
loses pressure, through a leak or from being manually drained, we
call this 'depressurisation' as there is no pressure in the system -
it's all self explanatory really.
Please see the OP's bit about 'no water or air coming from the bleed
valves'

Get off your high horse. If you'd read all the replies you'd realise
that Alan was quoting Charles who suggested that the header tank

And if you'd read the direct reply to my post, Alan typed:

"If there is no pressure, there will be no hot water either.
Another poster says the header tank needs filling! Why even reply if you
havent got any idea about these things?"
---------------------------


He was quoting Charles in the *second* sentence.

I can drain my CH system down and still have as much hot water as I like
from my combi.

IOW he misquoted, and made a mistaken guess as to what it was, while at the
same time having a pop at those more knowledgable than him

wasn't filling. He doesn't say it doesn't need pressurising, just
that it won't have a header tank.

Tim

If you read it carefully, he says:

"It is a combi boiler, it will be pressurised, it has hot water, but no
radiators."
-------------------


How can it be pressurised when nothing comes out of any bleed valves? - air
or water.

On Wed, 28 Dec 2016 12:44:01 +0000, Nicola
m wrote:

snip

once valves on rads open he put a pin in n the air came out.

I helped out a mate with that 'trick' ... he was a plumber. ;-(

Cheers, T i m

"Phil L" wrote in message
...
Alan wrote:
On Tue, 27 Dec 2016 15:59:02 +0000, Phil L wrote:

nicola wrote:
help, my gloworm combi boiler is heating my water but not heating
the radiators,
i have bled all rads incase air lock but from the middle floor to
top floor there is nothing coming out of the ras, no air or water.
any ideas?

The system has no pressure if there's nothing coming out of the rads.


If there is no pressure, there will be no hot water either.

So you've obviously never had or seen a combi boiler then.

Another poster says the header tank needs filling! Why even reply if
you havent got any idea about these things?
It is a combi boiler, it will be pressurised, it has hot water, but no
radiators.

Is it pressurised when you buy it from the combi shop? - *NO*, you have to
pressurise it yourself when you install it, and when it loses pressure,
through a leak or from being manually drained, we call this
'depressurisation' as there is no pressure in the system - it's all self
explanatory really.
Please see the OP's bit about 'no water or air coming from the bleed
valves'


It could be a few things, but my money would be on a stuck diverter
valve. Other areas to check would be sensors on the CH outputs, or
even a PCB failure, a pump that is failing, but working enough to
pump the HW around the boiler, a fault with the programmer/stat, or
even a total blockage on the CH pipes.

Do any of the CH output pipes get hotter when calling for heat?
Is there a crucnching/sticking noise when the diverter valve
moves/tries to move?
Does the boiler fire up at all when calling for heat?

Check the boiler is getting an input from the programmer/stat.
Take the cover off to see / hear if the diverter is moving.
It is fires up, see how long for, and of the output pipes get hot, and
if / when it cuts out.

Get someone in who knows what they are doing.

She's paying a plumber £300 today and he will turn on the little tap
underneath which will repressurise the system, then when it reaches 1.5
bar on the gauge, he'll turn it back off and the boiler will fire up once
the rads have been bled, not bad for 15 minutes 'work'

Turns out that isnt what happened.

On 28/12/2016 15:04, Tim+ wrote:
Phil L wrote:
Alan wrote:

Another poster says the header tank needs filling! Why even reply if
you havent got any idea about these things?
It is a combi boiler, it will be pressurised, it has hot water, but no
radiators.

Is it pressurised when you buy it from the combi shop? - *NO*, you have to
pressurise it yourself when you install it, and when it loses pressure,
through a leak or from being manually drained, we call this
'depressurisation' as there is no pressure in the system - it's all self
explanatory really.
Please see the OP's bit about 'no water or air coming from the bleed valves'

Get off your high horse. If you'd read all the replies you'd realise that
Alan was quoting Charles who suggested that the header tank wasn't filling.
He doesn't say it doesn't need pressurising, just that it won't have a
header tank.

Tim


Except that it might have retained the original hot tank and header
tank, with the primary circuit connected to the combi as a zone.
Unusual but not impossible.

On 28/12/2016 12:44, Nicola wrote:
replying to Nicola, Nicola wrote:
Plumbers been and all fixed. A valve was stuck that's in upstairs airing
cupboard and he said all radiators r cheap ones it's a new build house
onlybin
since 2008 but once valves on rads open he put a pin in n the air came
out. We
have been replacing them because they looked cheap and the new ones were
all
fine. Thankfully not cost a fortune thanks for all your help

"It's a new build ", but you moved there in 2008 and are not the
first owner. Sounds old enough for most things boiler-related
to fail.

So perhaps it was a condensing boiler, and not a combi boiler
all along ?. There is a subtle difference, but one that will
confuse the argumentative s0ds that live on uk-d-i-y !!!!.

Or is it a combi with additional heating zones ?. Even more
unusual, but again not impossible.

"he said all radiators r cheap ones " ...
translation : 'I would really be only too happy to remove them
all and fit new ones and charge you 'list price' (price list to
prove it) while only pay trade price (the price list he definately
won't show you).

'List price' is of course anything from 50% to 100% more than trade
price.

On 31/12/2016 15:18, Andrew wrote:
On 28/12/2016 12:44, Nicola wrote:
replying to Nicola, Nicola wrote:
Plumbers been and all fixed. A valve was stuck that's in upstairs airing
cupboard and he said all radiators r cheap ones it's a new build house
onlybin
since 2008 but once valves on rads open he put a pin in n the air came
out. We
have been replacing them because they looked cheap and the new ones were
all
fine. Thankfully not cost a fortune thanks for all your help

"It's a new build ", but you moved there in 2008 and are not the
first owner. Sounds old enough for most things boiler-related
to fail.

So perhaps it was a condensing boiler, and not a combi boiler
all along ?. There is a subtle difference, but one that will
confuse the argumentative s0ds that live on uk-d-i-y !!!!.

Or is it a combi with additional heating zones ?. Even more
unusual, but again not impossible.

"he said all radiators r cheap ones " ...
translation : 'I would really be only too happy to remove them
all and fit new ones and charge you 'list price' (price list to
prove it) while only pay trade price (the price list he definately
won't show you).

'List price' is of course anything from 50% to 100% more than trade
price.


They tend to be called system boilers.
However that just implies they have the pump and expansion tank in them.
I have one and a cylinder that is zoned.