"Capitol" wrote in message
...

IMM wrote in message ...

Domestic CH in the near future
will not be a big problem.


Sadly this is not the case. Heating
in the east is still wood/coal/oil
fired. As economic activity increases,
the pollution will get much, much
worse.

As boiler production increase to EU standards, the levels will be set for
other parts of the world too. The third world will be dragged along too.

On another point, Arthur Scargill is a failure as a trade union leader, as
his actions caused the loss of most of his members jobs.

He saw the writing on the wall and only had one alternative. Not to do
anything would against his contract of employment.

Calling a heating
strike as you go into the summer, when the generating stations have been
stocking up for the previous year, was an act of monumental stupidity.
Deep
mined coal is uneconomic as a fuel with UK labour rates and more so with
national insurance/tax increases. Surface mined coal is readily available
from all over the world at much lower costs. UK coal in its present form
has
only survived courtesy of various government baleouts. Scargill could have
negotiated a controlled rundown of the industry but failed to do so.

The overall cost to the UK was negative. Unemployment benefits, expensive
imports, etc.

Whilst I have reservations about gas and oil fired electricity generation
in
their present form, in the long run, nuclear generation is the least
polluting system on the planet, albeit disposal problems at end of life
need
improving.

The disposal problems means it is the most polluting. Local combined heat
and power generation systems, as they have in Sweden is the long term
future. Or the Microgen CHP gas powered boiler connected to the grid. This
is highly efficient as there are no line losses. If all the millions of new
homes to be built in the UK had these fitted, there would be less need for
major electricity infrastructure and the wind power generation can go ahead.

I see we are being subjected to a proposal to bring in the minimum wage
for
16 year olds. As IMO the minimum wage was only brought in to increase the
NI
and income tax grab( 10% wage increase=30% tax grab increase?), I guess
the
same trick is being worked again to fill the holes in Brown's overspent
budget.

A minimum wage is "essential".

With income and corporation tax revenues falling (how?, in spite of
pseudo full employnent), one wonders when the bubble will burst?

More right wing doom and gloom hoping.


---
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On Sun, 4 Jan 2004 16:30:35 -0000, "Capitol"
wrote:

I see we are being subjected to a proposal to bring in the minimum wage for
16 year olds. As IMO the minimum wage was only brought in to increase the NI
and income tax grab( 10% wage increase=30% tax grab increase?), I guess the
same trick is being worked again to fill the holes in Brown's overspent
budget. With income and corporation tax revenues falling (how?, in spite of
pseudo full employnent)

I think part of the reasoning here will be related to votes for
Labour. I suspec they are getting worried that the general electorate
are getting p'd off with them, and their majority is at stake.

A short time ago they were advocating voting at 16 via Lord Falconer:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/3297739.stm

This makes sense by virtue of the fact that at age 16 the young ones
haven't been crippled by university top-up fees, and by the time they
have it will be too late for those youngsters who think that Blair and
Co are the best thing since sliced bread.

The minimum wage applied to 16 year olds is the same process IMHO,
make the 16/17 year olds feel that they've got a government doing
something for them, and grab a few more votes to maintain them in
power.

one wonders when the bubble will burst?

Yes, that is in my mind a major issue. One more term of Labour should
do it. Unfortunately it will do the country in as well. Perhaps the
upside is that by then they will have p'd off so many young people
that Labour won't be in government again anytime in the next 20 years.

Whilst I hate Labour with a vengeance, part of me wants them to get
back in because then the electorate will have a chance to equate
conditions with a government that has been in power circa 10 years or
more. And the electorate has a very long memory - it's only because
many of the voters in the 70's have a headstone over their last
resting place that they've managed to get in for the last 6 years.

What I do not want to happen is for (say) a Tory administration to get
in and start correcting things, because there will definitely be some
bad medicine in there. That means that at the following election
Labour will get in, and it will be the same old game of ping-pong that
brought this country into a state of crisis in the 70's.

PoP

Replying to the email address given by my news reader
will result in your own email address being instantly
added to my anti-spam database! If you really want to
contact me try changing the prefix in the given email
address to my newsgroup posting name.....

"PoP" wrote in message
...

Whilst I hate Labour with a vengeance,

Not another brainwashed Tory voter. My God, you obviously don't know.

Please read Who Runs Britain by Paxman and Who owns Britain By cahill. Then
if you think the Tories have the common man in mind you are mad.



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In article , IMM
wrote:

My God, you obviously don't know.

I had heard that these pseudo-commies still existed, but never actually met
on "in the wild".

I had typed up quite a good argument and then thought "What's the point?"
There's no way of educating a commie.


--
AJL Electronics (G6FGO) Ltd : Satellite and TV aerial systems
http://www.classicmicrocars.co.uk : http://www.ajlelectronics.co.uk

"Andy Luckman (AJL Electronics)" wrote in message
...
In article , IMM
wrote:

My God, you obviously don't know.

I had heard that these pseudo-commies still existed, but never actually
met
on "in the wild".

I had typed up quite a good argument and then thought "What's the point?"
There's no way of educating a commie.

Which commie do you refer?


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"Andy Luckman (AJL Electronics)" wrote in message
...
In article , IMM
wrote:

My God, you obviously don't know.

I had heard that these pseudo-commies still existed, but never actually
met
on "in the wild".

I had typed up quite a good argument

What good argument might this be. It can only have good grammar, as the
content will be vacant.


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In message , Andrew
writes
In article , geoff
writes
In message , Capitol
writes
An American friend's definition of the USA was "350 million people motivated
by greed". The results are impressive. They have a population with a work
ethic from childhood. They still have a democracy that works, we sadly
don't! Their local and national politicians are much more responsive to the
electorate than ours and know they are expendable. The people also respect
success, want to know how to achieve it and don't descend into envy, which
sadly is always the case here. They unfortunately have not yet achieved the
UK's biggest success, the NHS (with most of it's faults being caused by
political interference).

They are also the world's biggest polluters, they have really bad social
problems, they have a massive national debt propped up only because oil
etc are traded in dollars, which is the only reason that the dollar is a
strong currency.


The Dollar is currently suffering from benign neglect and is now very
weak. (£1 = $1.79). Most economists are worried that this parallels the
period up to Jimmy Carters presidency. My 2p FWIW, in 5 years we will be
back to hyper inflation and interest rates of 10% +, once the Federal
Reserve belatedly try to correct the problem.

.... But this would mean that Bush isn't going to get Mars as the 53rd
state

--
geoff

On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 01:55:20 +0000, geoff wrote:

In message , Andrew


The Dollar is currently suffering from benign neglect and is now very
weak. (£1 = $1.79). Most economists are worried that this parallels the
period up to Jimmy Carters presidency. My 2p FWIW, in 5 years we will be
back to hyper inflation and interest rates of 10% +, once the Federal
Reserve belatedly try to correct the problem.

... But this would mean that Bush isn't going to get Mars as the 53rd
state

This is a diversion. The same thing that Kennedy did. Generally
it's better to have a grandiose announcement like this when leading up
to an election. Wars tend to be during mid terms.

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 01:55:20 +0000, geoff wrote:

... But this would mean that Bush isn't going to get Mars as the 53rd
state

They will have to figure out how to reconfigure Area 51 to look like
the Mars landscape this time. What's the betting some gook will find a
photograph of the 1969 moon landscape that directly correlates with
the 2013 Mars landscape?

PoP

If you really must use the email address provided
with my newsreader please be aware that the email
is processed with spamcop. As a result your email
to me might be treated as spam!

Dave Plowman wrote:

In article ,
PoP wrote:
If there's one person that I distrust more than a
government minister it's King Arthur.

Shows the power of the press and media. His job was as a union leader, and
he did his very best for his members. If 10% of our politicians did the
same we'd be the best country in the world in every way.

And I *have* met the man,

I haven't, I'm sad to say.

and would be proud to have him as a friend.

ditto.


Dave - was that you I heard on PM last night?

--
Ben Blaney
Must try harder

On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 01:55:20 +0000, geoff wrote:

In message , Andrew
writes
In article , geoff
writes
In message , Capitol
writes
An American friend's definition of the USA was "350 million people motivated
by greed". The results are impressive. They have a population with a work
ethic from childhood. They still have a democracy that works, we sadly
don't! Their local and national politicians are much more responsive to the
electorate than ours and know they are expendable. The people also respect
success, want to know how to achieve it and don't descend into envy, which
sadly is always the case here. They unfortunately have not yet achieved the
UK's biggest success, the NHS (with most of it's faults being caused by
political interference).

The UK NHS is not a success,it is a failure and needs major surgery
itself.

"Ben Blaney" wrote in message
...
Dave Plowman wrote:

In article ,
PoP wrote:
If there's one person that I distrust more than a
government minister it's King Arthur.

Shows the power of the press and media. His job was as a union leader,
and
he did his very best for his members. If 10% of our politicians did the
same we'd be the best country in the world in every way.

And I *have* met the man,

I haven't, I'm sad to say.

I have met him, but that is not too difficult when he used to live 2 miles
away and a close member of your family is somewhere high up in the old NCB,
and most of all the other relatives worked down a mine.

and would be proud to have him as a friend.

ditto.

I am not sure about being a friend, maybe only if my enemies enemy is my
friend. I would never be able to call him a liar thought.

--
Adam

In message , PoP
writes
On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 01:55:20 +0000, geoff wrote:

... But this would mean that Bush isn't going to get Mars as the 53rd
state

They will have to figure out how to reconfigure Area 51 to look like
the Mars landscape this time. What's the betting some gook will find a
photograph of the 1969 moon landscape that directly correlates with
the 2013 Mars landscape?

A Dubya brainscan for example
--
geoff

"tarquinlinbin" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 01:55:20 +0000, geoff wrote:

In message , Andrew
writes
In article , geoff
writes
In message , Capitol
writes
An American friend's definition of the USA was "350 million people
motivated
by greed". The results are impressive. They have a population with a
work
ethic from childhood. They still have a democracy that works, we sadly
don't! Their local and national politicians are much more responsive
to the
electorate than ours and know they are expendable. The people also
respect
success, want to know how to achieve it and don't descend into envy,
which
sadly is always the case here. They unfortunately have not yet
achieved the
UK's biggest success, the NHS (with most of it's faults being caused
by
political interference).

The UK NHS is not a success,it is a failure and needs major surgery
itself.

failure? Please????


---
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On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 00:15:59 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"tarquinlinbin" wrote in message
.. .
On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 01:55:20 +0000, geoff wrote:

In message , Andrew
writes
In article , geoff
writes
In message , Capitol
writes
An American friend's definition of the USA was "350 million people
motivated
by greed". The results are impressive. They have a population with a
work
ethic from childhood. They still have a democracy that works, we sadly
don't! Their local and national politicians are much more responsive
to the
electorate than ours and know they are expendable. The people also
respect
success, want to know how to achieve it and don't descend into envy,
which
sadly is always the case here. They unfortunately have not yet
achieved the
UK's biggest success, the NHS (with most of it's faults being caused
by
political interference).

The UK NHS is not a success,it is a failure and needs major surgery
itself.

failure? Please????

Failure.


---

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 00:15:59 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"tarquinlinbin" wrote in message
.. .
On Sat, 10 Jan 2004 01:55:20 +0000, geoff wrote:

In message , Andrew
writes
In article , geoff

writes
In message , Capitol
writes
An American friend's definition of the USA was "350 million people
motivated
by greed". The results are impressive. They have a population with
a
work
ethic from childhood. They still have a democracy that works, we
sadly
don't! Their local and national politicians are much more
responsive
to the
electorate than ours and know they are expendable. The people also
respect
success, want to know how to achieve it and don't descend into
envy,
which
sadly is always the case here. They unfortunately have not yet
achieved the
UK's biggest success, the NHS (with most of it's faults being
caused
by
political interference).

The UK NHS is not a success,it is a failure and needs major surgery
itself.

failure? Please????

Failure.

Proof, figures, etc, not brainwashed Tory propaganda.


---
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On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 11:08:25 -0000, "IMM" wrote:




Proof, figures, etc, not brainwashed Tory propaganda.


I'll give you three examples - I don't have time to waste on
researching figures.

1) On four different occasions over the last few years being offered
consultant appointments between 6 and 18 months out and then having
them cancelled twice two weeks beforehand because they had run out of
budget. That's not acceptable handling of the patient and it is
not an acceptable lead time either. In almost all cases,
appointment lead time should be one month absolute maximum. I can
get that with private cover, yet I also have to pay outrageous sums to
support an outmoded state system.

2) Emergency facilities at at least two local hospitals inferior to
several that I've seen in the 3rd world.

3) Money wasted on the wrong things. One simple example. One local
hospital has construction work going on involving the use of a tower
crane. There's an enormous illuminated blue sign with NHS on it.
Why? Marketing? A public service organisation spends money on
marketing because we don't know it's there? What a waste of money.

As a very minimum there should be a voucher system so that I can take
my contributions to the state health system and spend them where I
like.

Ideally, the whole thing should be shut down and operated on a 21st
century basis, not an early 20th century one.


---

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 11:08:25 -0000, "IMM" wrote:




Proof, figures, etc, not brainwashed Tory propaganda.


I'll give you three examples - I don't have time to waste on
researching figures.

1) On four different occasions over the last few years being offered
consultant appointments between 6 and 18 months out and then having
them cancelled twice two weeks beforehand because they had run out of
budget. That's not acceptable handling of the patient and it is
not an acceptable lead time either. In almost all cases,
appointment lead time should be one month absolute maximum. I can
get that with private cover, yet I also have to pay outrageous sums to
support an outmoded state system.

2) Emergency facilities at at least two local hospitals inferior to
several that I've seen in the 3rd world.

3) Money wasted on the wrong things. One simple example. One local
hospital has construction work going on involving the use of a tower
crane. There's an enormous illuminated blue sign with NHS on it.
Why? Marketing? A public service organisation spends money on
marketing because we don't know it's there? What a waste of money.

As a very minimum there should be a voucher system so that I can take
my contributions to the state health system and spend them where I
like.

Ideally, the whole thing should be shut down and operated on a 21st
century basis, not an early 20th century one.

The government is building hospitals like mad. The biggest medial
construction phase ever. I have only had god service from the NHS. The
overall figures are what matters, not individual experiences.



---
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On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 11:36:09 +0000, Andy Hall
wrote:

Ideally, the whole thing should be shut down and operated on a 21st
century basis, not an early 20th century one.

I share your thoughts on many things to do with the NHS.

However to be fair, my son had a skateboard accident nearly two years
ago and broke his femur (that's the large bone between knee and pelvis
for those who aren't sure.

Paramedics arrived very promptly. He was rushed under twos and blues
to Reading accident admissions - they bypassed the usual wait for four
hours (plus) in the waiting room and he went straight into the
casualty room - reason being that if you smash your femur there's a
chance that you will puncture the major artery that runs down your
leg, ending up with possible death. The staff there were excellent and
quite outstanding.

The consultant who looked after my son for the next 3 months in
traction was absolutely brilliant too. Really good bedside manner to
put my son at ease. Although he only came round once a week it was an
occasion to look forward to each week because he was great at
answering questions - of which I had many over the weeks.

Most of the nurses were top rate too. One or two maybe needed to
improve their social skills, but I can't say I had a complaint about
the quality of nursing care.

Now for the downside......

My son was put into the maternity ward at Reading hospital for the 3
months he was there. They didn't have beds anywhere else. There were 4
fracture beds in that corner of the maternity ward due to this
problem. Basically I considered this to be a complete pain in the arse
because in the middle of the night babies would cry out and need to be
taken care of.

Things have probably improved now because of the new wing they were
building 2 years ago. But regardless of that, the location of Reading
hospital is the pits if you live outside of Reading - the traffic
system is 3rd world and if an ambulance hits the rush hour it must
cost lives in lost time.

That hospital should be relocated to somewhere with better access,
maybe at the Winnersh A329M junction, or the M4/A33 junction. Burying
it in the town centre may have been okay when it was originally
opened, but it isn't okay now. Even the train station is a fair old
walk away.

PoP

If you really must use the email address provided
with my newsreader please be aware that the email
is processed with spamcop. As a result your email
to me might be treated as spam!

On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 12:04:37 -0000, "IMM" wrote:




The government is building hospitals like mad.

They should be built and maintained by the private sector.

The biggest medial
construction phase ever. I have only had god service from the NHS.

In the chapel?

The
overall figures are what matters, not individual experiences.


To me, like most patients, it is my individual experience that matters
to me first of all and that of my family. I do also care that others
can receive good medical care, but the fact is that the state megalith
does not deliver it as far as I am concerned. Waiting times are too
long, the environment of most hospitals is appalling and there is huge
waste on bureaucracy.



---

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 12:41:35 +0000, PoP wrote:

On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 11:36:09 +0000, Andy Hall
wrote:

Ideally, the whole thing should be shut down and operated on a 21st
century basis, not an early 20th century one.

I share your thoughts on many things to do with the NHS.

However to be fair, my son had a skateboard accident nearly two years
ago and broke his femur (that's the large bone between knee and pelvis
for those who aren't sure.

Paramedics arrived very promptly. He was rushed under twos and blues
to Reading accident admissions - they bypassed the usual wait for four
hours (plus) in the waiting room and he went straight into the
casualty room - reason being that if you smash your femur there's a
chance that you will puncture the major artery that runs down your
leg, ending up with possible death. The staff there were excellent and
quite outstanding.

The consultant who looked after my son for the next 3 months in
traction was absolutely brilliant too. Really good bedside manner to
put my son at ease. Although he only came round once a week it was an
occasion to look forward to each week because he was great at
answering questions - of which I had many over the weeks.

Most of the nurses were top rate too. One or two maybe needed to
improve their social skills, but I can't say I had a complaint about
the quality of nursing care.

I completely agree and was careful not to criticise the medical staff,
who are generally underpaid, not appreciated and have to work in poor
conditions.

Then I look at the huge sums of money going in at the other end and
wonder where it is all going.




Now for the downside......

My son was put into the maternity ward at Reading hospital for the 3
months he was there. They didn't have beds anywhere else. There were 4
fracture beds in that corner of the maternity ward due to this
problem. Basically I considered this to be a complete pain in the arse
because in the middle of the night babies would cry out and need to be
taken care of.

Things have probably improved now because of the new wing they were
building 2 years ago. But regardless of that, the location of Reading
hospital is the pits if you live outside of Reading - the traffic
system is 3rd world and if an ambulance hits the rush hour it must
cost lives in lost time.

That hospital should be relocated to somewhere with better access,
maybe at the Winnersh A329M junction, or the M4/A33 junction. Burying
it in the town centre may have been okay when it was originally
opened, but it isn't okay now. Even the train station is a fair old
walk away.

Exactly. It is a nonsense having the hospital close to the centre
of the town, surrounded by a one way system and mainly narrow roads.
The comings and goings are a PITA for local residents.
The other one at the other end of Reading is even worse for access.
As you say, building on the landfill near M4 J11 would make far more
sense.





PoP

If you really must use the email address provided
with my newsreader please be aware that the email
is processed with spamcop. As a result your email
to me might be treated as spam!

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 12:04:37 -0000, "IMM" wrote:

The government is building hospitals like mad.

They should be built and maintained by the private sector.

They are. Private contractors build them and invariably a raft of private
companies maintain them in some way.


The biggest medial
construction phase ever. I have only had god service from the NHS.

In the chapel?

LOL!! Such fun.

The overall figures are what matters,
not individual experiences.

To me, like most patients, it is my individual experience that matters
to me first of all and that of my family.

So you may have a bad experience, so the largest employer in Europe is
totally useless. What strange logic.



---
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"PoP" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 11:36:09 +0000, Andy Hall
wrote:

Ideally, the whole thing should be shut down and operated on a 21st
century basis, not an early 20th century one.

I share your thoughts on many things to do with the NHS.

However to be fair, my son had a skateboard accident nearly two years
ago and broke his femur (that's the large bone between knee and pelvis
for those who aren't sure.

Paramedics arrived very promptly. He was rushed under twos and blues
to Reading accident admissions - they bypassed the usual wait for four
hours (plus) in the waiting room and he went straight into the
casualty room - reason being that if you smash your femur there's a
chance that you will puncture the major artery that runs down your
leg, ending up with possible death. The staff there were excellent and
quite outstanding.

The consultant who looked after my son for the next 3 months in
traction was absolutely brilliant too. Really good bedside manner to
put my son at ease. Although he only came round once a week it was an
occasion to look forward to each week because he was great at
answering questions - of which I had many over the weeks.

Most of the nurses were top rate too. One or two maybe needed to
improve their social skills, but I can't say I had a complaint about
the quality of nursing care.

Now for the downside......

My son was put into the maternity ward at Reading hospital for the 3
months he was there. They didn't have beds anywhere else. There were 4
fracture beds in that corner of the maternity ward due to this
problem. Basically I considered this to be a complete pain in the arse
because in the middle of the night babies would cry out and need to be
taken care of.

Things have probably improved now because of the new wing they were
building 2 years ago. But regardless of that, the location of Reading
hospital is the pits if you live outside of Reading - the traffic
system is 3rd world and if an ambulance hits the rush hour it must
cost lives in lost time.

That hospital should be relocated to somewhere with better access,
maybe at the Winnersh A329M junction, or the M4/A33 junction. Burying
it in the town centre may have been okay when it was originally
opened, but it isn't okay now. Even the train station is a fair old
walk away.

Maybe they should build better roads to it.


---
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On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 13:17:29 -0000, "IMM" wrote:



So you may have a bad experience,

I'm hardly the only one, am I.

so the largest employer in Europe is
totally useless.

Therein lies the main problem - the shear size.


What strange logic.



---

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 13:19:54 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"PoP" wrote in message
.. .


That hospital should be relocated to somewhere with better access,
maybe at the Winnersh A329M junction, or the M4/A33 junction. Burying
it in the town centre may have been okay when it was originally
opened, but it isn't okay now. Even the train station is a fair old
walk away.

Maybe they should build better roads to it.


Not practical.....



---

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 13:17:29 -0000, "IMM" wrote:



So you may have a bad experience,

I'm hardly the only one, am I.

But they are few and far between compared to how many people they treat.

so the largest employer in Europe is
totally useless.

Therein lies the main problem - the shear size.

Nonsense. It is split up into regions, etc.



---
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In article ,
Ben Blaney wrote:
Dave - was that you I heard on PM last night?

Heh heh - they read out an e-mail from me, rather badly. They got two of
the mics wrong - and they were only letters and numbers, so hardly
difficult to read out.

--
*Why do we say something is out of whack? What is a whack? *

Dave Plowman London SW 12
RIP Acorn

In article ,
ARWadsworth wrote:
and would be proud to have him as a friend.

ditto.

I am not sure about being a friend, maybe only if my enemies enemy is my
friend. I would never be able to call him a liar thought.

Yes, and an honest man in politics is rare enough to worth being a friend.
I'd class him rather in with Ken Livingston in some ways. The press hate
politicians who are too honest.

--
*How do they get the deer to cross at that yellow road sign?

Dave Plowman London SW 12
RIP Acorn

In article ,
Andy Hall wrote:
Exactly. It is a nonsense having the hospital close to the centre
of the town, surrounded by a one way system and mainly narrow roads.
The comings and goings are a PITA for local residents.
The other one at the other end of Reading is even worse for access.
As you say, building on the landfill near M4 J11 would make far more
sense.

You can't win with hospital positioning. Remember many who attend as
outpatients and visitors will be elderly, and want it to be close to the
centre with good public transport links. The average younger person would
prefer an outer town 'supermarket' type site with easy parking and road
access.

--
*Hard work has a future payoff. Laziness pays off NOW.

Dave Plowman London SW 12
RIP Acorn

In article ,
Andy Hall wrote:
So you may have a bad experience,

I'm hardly the only one, am I.

No organisation can be perfect, and the larger it is the more complaints
there will be. What is more important is the percentages.

I've only personally needed hospital attention once - a dodgy back treated
by physiotherapy at St George's in Tooting and I've nothing but praise.
Never once had to wait more than a couple of minutes later than the
appointment time over a series of a dozen or so visits. Had the same chap
on every visit who was polite, friendly and informative - as well as just
downright good at his job. A++

My mother developed dementia suddenly late in life and was well cared for
in a NHS geriatric nursing home - for free, and for many years.

My sister-in-law's sister had MS and again was well cared for by the NHS.

--
*I have plenty of talent and vision. I just don't care.

Dave Plowman London SW 12
RIP Acorn

On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 13:15:45 +0000, Andy Hall
wrote:

Then I look at the huge sums of money going in at the other end and
wonder where it is all going.

This might help just a little:

http://www.nursing-pay.com/

Notice Justin Jewitt at the top. He was (maybe still is?) paid more
than the Health Minister in the Labour Government. Indeed, if memory
serves me right, he was paid more than the Prime Minister!

Obviously with Milburns name just below the quality of this
information is a bit out of date, but it tells you that under Labour
they have no problem with paying managers from tax budgets.

PoP

If you really must use the email address provided
with my newsreader please be aware that the email
is processed with spamcop. As a result your email
to me might be treated as spam!

On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 13:54:56 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 13:17:29 -0000, "IMM" wrote:



So you may have a bad experience,

I'm hardly the only one, am I.

But they are few and far between compared to how many people they treat.

Nonsense. If that were the case, why does the government make such a
fuss about reducing waiting times to under two years? As I said, I
would consider a month max. to be the acceptable limit.


so the largest employer in Europe is
totally useless.

Therein lies the main problem - the shear size.

Nonsense. It is split up into regions, etc.

It is still the largest employer in western Europe. It should be
broken up into individual units and outsourced.

Individuals should have the option of whether they wish to spend their
healthcare money at state run or private facilities without incurring
additional cost as they do today.



---

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 14:16:34 +0000 (GMT), Dave Plowman
wrote:

In article ,
Andy Hall wrote:
So you may have a bad experience,

I'm hardly the only one, am I.

No organisation can be perfect, and the larger it is the more complaints
there will be. What is more important is the percentages.

Not to the individual.

I've only personally needed hospital attention once - a dodgy back treated
by physiotherapy at St George's in Tooting and I've nothing but praise.
Never once had to wait more than a couple of minutes later than the
appointment time over a series of a dozen or so visits. Had the same chap
on every visit who was polite, friendly and informative - as well as just
downright good at his job. A++

I'm not particularly criticising the medical staff, more the notion of
a megalithically run national system with huge waste and a lack of
choice for the individual. It should be possible for the individual
to be able to use private healthcare if they wish to supplement their
state provision. At present one pays twice for that.


My mother developed dementia suddenly late in life and was well cared for
in a NHS geriatric nursing home - for free, and for many years.

That's good. I've not long ago seen a relative in a similar
situation in what can only be described as absolutely awful conditions
with inadequate budget and facilities.



My sister-in-law's sister had MS and again was well cared for by the NHS.

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

Dave Plowman wrote:

In article ,
Ben Blaney wrote:
Dave - was that you I heard on PM last night?

Heh heh - they read out an e-mail from me, rather badly.

It wasn't the best. Still made me grin, though.

They got two of
the mics wrong - and they were only letters and numbers, so hardly
difficult to read out.

So, you reckon it's all ********, then - them saying that the bells were
live?

--
Ben Blaney
Must try harder

On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 14:05:38 +0000 (GMT), Dave Plowman
wrote:

In article ,
Andy Hall wrote:
Exactly. It is a nonsense having the hospital close to the centre
of the town, surrounded by a one way system and mainly narrow roads.
The comings and goings are a PITA for local residents.
The other one at the other end of Reading is even worse for access.
As you say, building on the landfill near M4 J11 would make far more
sense.

You can't win with hospital positioning. Remember many who attend as
outpatients and visitors will be elderly, and want it to be close to the
centre with good public transport links. The average younger person would
prefer an outer town 'supermarket' type site with easy parking and road
access.

The area that I am thinking of has good road connections to the town
centre and an improved bus service would be simple to provision.

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 13:58:35 +0000 (GMT), Dave Plowman
wrote:

In article ,
Ben Blaney wrote:
Dave - was that you I heard on PM last night?

Heh heh - they read out an e-mail from me, rather badly. They got two of
the mics wrong - and they were only letters and numbers, so hardly
difficult to read out.

So did we find out what mic. is actually used to relay the bells of
the Westminster clock tower? Don't you have any BBC tech. contacts?





..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

In article ,
Andy Hall wrote:
Individuals should have the option of whether they wish to spend their
healthcare money at state run or private facilities without incurring
additional cost as they do today.

That's fine for the reasonably well off. The poor would simply get a far
worse state system, since those better off (and in better health) would be
cherry picked by insurance companies.

I assume you get the same quality of water, electricity etc no matter how
rich or poor you are. Why should health care be any different?

--
*If you try to fail and succeed, which have you done? *

Dave Plowman London SW 12
RIP Acorn

In article ,
Andy Hall wrote:
No organisation can be perfect, and the larger it is the more complaints
there will be. What is more important is the percentages.

Not to the individual.

To that individual anything that goes wrong is one too many faults. But
if you have figures to say that private care is actually better in
percentage terms it would be nice to have them. There is plenty of
evidence of private hospitals making a bodge of treatment. And private
nursing homes treating their residents badly.

--
*Why is the word abbreviation so long?

Dave Plowman London SW 12
RIP Acorn

In article ,
Ben Blaney wrote:
They got two of
the mics wrong - and they were only letters and numbers, so hardly
difficult to read out.

So, you reckon it's all ********, then - them saying that the bells were
live?

No. I heard their recording of what was transmitted at midnight and you
could clearly hear the crowd in Trafalgar Square as opposed to the more
usual traffic - few would be driving at that time of the year. And it
seems the fireworks didn't actually start until after the 'bongs' had
finished.

Can't see why they'd want to use a recording - unless the clock was
faulty. The mics in the tower are available at all times to the 'studio' -
they simply fade them up as required. Much easier than playing in a
recording.

--
*Sorry, I don't date outside my species.

Dave Plowman London SW 12
RIP Acorn

In article ,
Andy Hall wrote:
Heh heh - they read out an e-mail from me, rather badly. They got two of
the mics wrong - and they were only letters and numbers, so hardly
difficult to read out.

So did we find out what mic. is actually used to relay the bells of
the Westminster clock tower?

To quote Eddie Mair - no.

Don't you have any BBC tech. contacts?

Many. And have had as many different answers about what is currently in
use from them. That was the purpose of the e-mail. And I'd guess they
asked their studio engineers who didn't know for certain either.

I know the original mics were STC 'apple and biscuit' omni directional -
one and a spare, each with its own circuit to both BH and Bush House. I've
got that from an old BBC handbook, with pics.
But I remember *hearing* they were changed for AKG D202 - similar to the
mics you see on the desk in parliament on the prime minister etc - when
everything went stereo in the late '80s. But no one can confirm or deny
this.

I'd guess - not having seen them - that whatever they are - are enclosed
in a large 'windshield' to protect them from the elements, so short of
dismantling could be anyone of hundreds of makes in there. You don't need
an expensive highly directional condenser mic for this use - just
something half decent and above all reliable.

--
*Ambition is a poor excuse for not having enough sense to be lazy *

Dave Plowman London SW 12
RIP Acorn