I will soon be refurbishing shower room. First thing I want to do is
replace the lights, currently 4 x halogen spots but will replace with a
central mounted LED fitting.
The light switch is located outside at the door so would I be safe to
assume it will go straight up and enter the ceiling void around that point.

Some more assumptions:
Is it likely that there will be a block connector (or similar) to then
take the feed to the halogens.
Can I then just disconnect this feed and use for my new fitting.

I suppose my main point is how do I find and trace the wiring to make
the changes, without ripping the ceiling out.
I have ordered one of those cheap borescope thingies which should arrive
in a couple of days but dont know if it will be of any use.

"ss" wrote in message
...
I will soon be refurbishing shower room. First thing I want to do is
replace the lights, currently 4 x halogen spots but will replace with a
central mounted LED fitting.
The light switch is located outside at the door so would I be safe to
assume it will go straight up and enter the ceiling void around that
point.

Some more assumptions:
Is it likely that there will be a block connector (or similar) to then
take the feed to the halogens.
Can I then just disconnect this feed and use for my new fitting.

I suppose my main point is how do I find and trace the wiring to make the
changes, without ripping the ceiling out.
I have ordered one of those cheap borescope thingies which should arrive
in a couple of days but dont know if it will be of any use.

The normal way would be to take the existing light fittings down and check
continuity/which goes where, with a meter.
Also the wires can be jerked and see if the other end moves or it rattles on
the ceiling.
The physical route of the wire is neither here nor there.

You might be able to"fish" he old wiring to the new position if they are
unsecured (to the ceiling joists.)
If they are secured (clipped) then some damage is probably unavoidable.

"ss" wrote in message ...

I will soon be refurbishing shower room. First thing I want to do is
replace the lights, currently 4 x halogen spots but will replace with a
central mounted LED fitting.
The light switch is located outside at the door so would I be safe to
assume it will go straight up and enter the ceiling void around that point.

Some more assumptions:
Is it likely that there will be a block connector (or similar) to then take
the feed to the halogens.
Can I then just disconnect this feed and use for my new fitting.

I suppose my main point is how do I find and trace the wiring to make the
changes, without ripping the ceiling out.
I have ordered one of those cheap borescope thingies which should arrive in
a couple of days but dont know if it will be of any use.

I use one of these with very good effect. Lets you follow wires in the
ceiling easily, but make sure that the circuits are powered off when you do
it:

http://www.bts-internet.co.uk/acatal...83.html#SID=32

Andrew

On 12/04/2015 21:27, ss wrote:
I will soon be refurbishing shower room. First thing I want to do is
replace the lights, currently 4 x halogen spots but will replace with a
central mounted LED fitting.
The light switch is located outside at the door so would I be safe to
assume it will go straight up and enter the ceiling void around that point.

Its a fair assumption...

Some more assumptions:
Is it likely that there will be a block connector (or similar) to then
take the feed to the halogens.

You would expect to find a junction box of some form. That will usually
contain the power in, out and switch wires, plus one (or more) feeds to
the lamp fittings. (depends a bit on if they are LV halogens with a
transformer or mains powered ones)

See:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?... iring_Options

Can I then just disconnect this feed and use for my new fitting.

Yes. Obviously you want to avoid having old sections of live cable
floating about in the ceiling unused - so you would need to disconnect
them at the junction box.

I suppose my main point is how do I find and trace the wiring to make
the changes, without ripping the ceiling out.

You should be able to do a fair bit just with a resistance meter.

I have ordered one of those cheap borescope thingies which should arrive
in a couple of days but dont know if it will be of any use.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 13/04/2015 07:55, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"ss" wrote in message ...

I will soon be refurbishing shower room. First thing I want to do is
replace the lights, currently 4 x halogen spots but will replace with
a central mounted LED fitting.
The light switch is located outside at the door so would I be safe to
assume it will go straight up and enter the ceiling void around that
point.

Some more assumptions:
Is it likely that there will be a block connector (or similar) to then
take the feed to the halogens.
Can I then just disconnect this feed and use for my new fitting.

I suppose my main point is how do I find and trace the wiring to make
the changes, without ripping the ceiling out.
I have ordered one of those cheap borescope thingies which should
arrive in a couple of days but dont know if it will be of any use.

I use one of these with very good effect. Lets you follow wires in the
ceiling easily, but make sure that the circuits are powered off when you
do it:

http://www.bts-internet.co.uk/acatal...83.html#SID=32


Andrew

I have one of these much cheaper ones, it works fine as long as you can
touch the tip on the insulated conductor.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_fr...cer&_saca t=0

Not sure if Andrew might be talking about following wires from the other
side of the plasterboard, if you see what I mean.

"newshound" wrote in message
o.uk...

On 13/04/2015 07:55, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"ss" wrote in message ...

I will soon be refurbishing shower room. First thing I want to do is
replace the lights, currently 4 x halogen spots but will replace with
a central mounted LED fitting.
The light switch is located outside at the door so would I be safe to
assume it will go straight up and enter the ceiling void around that
point.

Some more assumptions:
Is it likely that there will be a block connector (or similar) to then
take the feed to the halogens.
Can I then just disconnect this feed and use for my new fitting.

I suppose my main point is how do I find and trace the wiring to make
the changes, without ripping the ceiling out.
I have ordered one of those cheap borescope thingies which should
arrive in a couple of days but dont know if it will be of any use.

I use one of these with very good effect. Lets you follow wires in the
ceiling easily, but make sure that the circuits are powered off when you
do it:

http://www.bts-internet.co.uk/acatal...83.html#SID=32


Andrew

I have one of these much cheaper ones, it works fine as long as you can
touch the tip on the insulated conductor.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_fr...cer&_saca t=0

Not sure if Andrew might be talking about following wires from the other
side of the plasterboard, if you see what I mean.

Yes I am. A sparky working on my house refurb failed to connect two smoke
alarms into the common circuit for them all - only discovered when floors
and ceilings finished. After I'd fired him (!) I traced his wiring up a
partition wall, across a ceiling and under 300 mm of insulation in the loft,
where he'd left the unterminated coil of wire, all without opening up any
holes in walls and ceiling.

Andrew

On 13/04/2015 12:44, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"newshound" wrote in message
o.uk...

On 13/04/2015 07:55, Andrew Mawson wrote:
"ss" wrote in message ...

I will soon be refurbishing shower room. First thing I want to do is
replace the lights, currently 4 x halogen spots but will replace with
a central mounted LED fitting.
The light switch is located outside at the door so would I be safe to
assume it will go straight up and enter the ceiling void around that
point.

Some more assumptions:
Is it likely that there will be a block connector (or similar) to then
take the feed to the halogens.
Can I then just disconnect this feed and use for my new fitting.

I suppose my main point is how do I find and trace the wiring to make
the changes, without ripping the ceiling out.
I have ordered one of those cheap borescope thingies which should
arrive in a couple of days but dont know if it will be of any use.

I use one of these with very good effect. Lets you follow wires in the
ceiling easily, but make sure that the circuits are powered off when you
do it:

http://www.bts-internet.co.uk/acatal...83.html#SID=32



Andrew

I have one of these much cheaper ones, it works fine as long as you
can touch the tip on the insulated conductor.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_fr...cer&_saca t=0


Not sure if Andrew might be talking about following wires from the
other side of the plasterboard, if you see what I mean.

Yes I am. A sparky working on my house refurb failed to connect two
smoke alarms into the common circuit for them all - only discovered when
floors and ceilings finished. After I'd fired him (!) I traced his
wiring up a partition wall, across a ceiling and under 300 mm of
insulation in the loft, where he'd left the unterminated coil of wire,
all without opening up any holes in walls and ceiling.

Andrew

Good result! I must check out the "range" of mine, but most of my
ceilings are lath and plaster.

On 12/04/2015 21:27, ss wrote:
I will soon be refurbishing shower room. First thing I want to do is
replace the lights, currently 4 x halogen spots but will replace with a
central mounted LED fitting.
The light switch is located outside at the door so would I be safe to
assume it will go straight up and enter the ceiling void around that point.

Some more assumptions:
Is it likely that there will be a block connector (or similar) to then
take the feed to the halogens.
Can I then just disconnect this feed and use for my new fitting.

I suppose my main point is how do I find and trace the wiring to make
the changes, without ripping the ceiling out.
I have ordered one of those cheap borescope thingies which should arrive
in a couple of days but dont know if it will be of any use.

You haven't said whether they're mains or 12v halogens. If 12v, there
will be a transformer powered by the mains, with 4 directly-connected
outputs going to the halogens, or maybe with one output and a 4-way
junction box.

The halogen lamps will have sprung arms holding them against the
ceiling. You should be able to pull them down and feel around in the
void (or look around with your new toy) to work out what's going on.
--
Cheers,
Roger
____________
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checked.

On Sunday, 12 April 2015 21:27:35 UTC+1, ss wrote:
I suppose my main point is how do I find and trace the wiring to make
the changes, without ripping the ceiling out.

An induction look receiver will pick up mains borne interference from a cable through plaster, or you could de-energise the circuit and use a telecoms toner.

I discovered several sockets in my kitchen that had been plasterboarded over using this method. :-)

Owain