Does anyone here have experience of self-regulating trace heating
cable within domestic settings? Keen to prevent future 'occurrences'
if December's conditions are repeated, I've been looking at my options
to protect a mixture of 15 and 22mm copper in our eaves.
I have found the following 10W/m cable:
http://www.qvsdirect.com/Trace-J-Sel...-pr-16688.html
What does “Maximum exposure temperatu 85°C - intermittent, 65°C
continuous” actually mean? I'm thinking along the lines of don't power
it up in free air unattached to a pipe. Am I correct?
I notice that the same company sells a connection and end seal kit:
http://www.qvsdirect.com/Frostop-Con...-pr-16689.html
Is this expensive for what it is if I was to install several separate
cable runs? Could I just purchase heatshrink etc of appropriate
diameters instead.
I have read of the need for C type MCBs due to inrush currents,
thermostats, etc.

Would anyone care to do a wiki page along the lines of the one on SWA:
http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...erminating_SWA

Thank you very much.

In article ,
Part timer writes:
Does anyone here have experience of self-regulating trace heating
cable within domestic settings? Keen to prevent future 'occurrences'
if December's conditions are repeated, I've been looking at my options
to protect a mixture of 15 and 22mm copper in our eaves.

What's it used for?

I have found the following 10W/m cable:
http://www.qvsdirect.com/Trace-J-Sel...-pr-16688.htm=
l
What does =93Maximum exposure temperatu 85=B0C - intermittent, 65=B0C
continuous=94 actually mean? I'm thinking along the lines of don't power
it up in free air unattached to a pipe. Am I correct?

Don't think so. I think it means unsuitable for use on pipework
which carries water in excess of those temperatures.

I notice that the same company sells a connection and end seal kit:
http://www.qvsdirect.com/Frostop-Con...-pr-16689.html
Is this expensive for what it is if I was to install several separate
cable runs? Could I just purchase heatshrink etc of appropriate
diameters instead.
I have read of the need for C type MCBs due to inrush currents,
thermostats, etc.

Really? That's surprising.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On Feb 4, 10:42*pm, Part timer wrote:

Does anyone here have experience of self-regulating trace heating
cable within domestic settings? Keen to prevent future 'occurrences'
if December's conditions are repeated, I've been looking at my options
to protect a mixture of 15 and 22mm copper in our eaves.
I have found the following 10W/m cable:http://www.qvsdirect.com/Trace-J-Sel...g-Cable-pr-166...
What does “Maximum exposure temperatu 85°C - intermittent, 65°C
continuous” actually mean? I'm thinking along the lines of don't power
it up in free air unattached to a pipe. Am I correct?
I notice that the same company sells a connection and end seal kit:http://www.qvsdirect.com/Frostop-Con...-pr-16689.html
Is this expensive for what it is if I was to install several separate
cable runs? Could I just purchase heatshrink etc of appropriate
diameters instead.
I have read of the need for C type MCBs due to inrush currents,
thermostats, etc.

For that to be an issue you'd need to be up near the max circuit
current rating. For a 6A circuit thats 6x240=1.5kW, at 10W/m that's
150m of pipe. Sounds unlikely.

At £6.75 a metre it would in many cases be cheaper to use a clamp on
thermostat, transformer and resistance wire. If the pipe configuration
happened to be suitable, you could omit the resistance wire and use a
1 or 2 turn transformer.


Would anyone care to do a wiki page along the lines of the one on SWA:http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...erminating_SWA

Thank you very much.


NT

On Feb 4, 10:42*pm, Part timer wrote:
Does anyone here have experience of self-regulating trace heating
cable within domestic settings? Keen to prevent future 'occurrences'
if December's conditions are repeated, I've been looking at my options
to protect a mixture of 15 and 22mm copper in our eaves.
I have found the following 10W/m cable:http://www.qvsdirect.com/Trace-J-Sel...g-Cable-pr-166...
What does “Maximum exposure temperatu 85°C - intermittent, 65°C
continuous” actually mean? I'm thinking along the lines of don't power
it up in free air unattached to a pipe. Am I correct?
I notice that the same company sells a connection and end seal kit:http://www.qvsdirect.com/Frostop-Con...-pr-16689.html
Is this expensive for what it is if I was to install several separate
cable runs? Could I just purchase heatshrink etc of appropriate
diameters instead.
I have read of the need for C type MCBs due to inrush currents,
thermostats, etc.

Would anyone care to do a wiki page along the lines of the one on SWA:http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...erminating_SWA

Thank you very much.

At £6.75 PER METRE it aint cheap.
I would be concerned that it seems to be intended for maintaining hot
water pipes hot rather than cold water pipes warm enough to prevent
freezing. Most trace heating suppliers offer two versions of self
regulating tape to cater for the two different requirements. Google
Raychem and follow their links.

In message
,
Part timer writes
Does anyone here have experience of self-regulating trace heating
cable within domestic settings? Keen to prevent future 'occurrences'
if December's conditions are repeated, I've been looking at my options
to protect a mixture of 15 and 22mm copper in our eaves.
I have found the following 10W/m cable:
http://www.qvsdirect.com/Trace-J-Sel...-pr-16688.html

Self regulating trace heating cable is *unaffordable* in my view.

You can buy soil warming cable for seed germination/plant propagation
etc. Controlled by a frost thermostat, I wonder if this could be adapted
for your purpose.

regards

--
Tim Lamb

On Feb 4, 10:42*pm, Part timer wrote:
Does anyone here have experience of self-regulating trace heating
cable within domestic settings? Keen to prevent future 'occurrences'
if December's conditions are repeated, I've been looking at my options
to protect a mixture of 15 and 22mm copper in our eaves.
I have found the following 10W/m cable:http://www.qvsdirect.com/Trace-J-Sel...g-Cable-pr-166...
What does “Maximum exposure temperatu 85°C - intermittent, 65°C
continuous” actually mean? I'm thinking along the lines of don't power
it up in free air unattached to a pipe. Am I correct?
I notice that the same company sells a connection and end seal kit:http://www.qvsdirect.com/Frostop-Con...-pr-16689.html
Is this expensive for what it is if I was to install several separate
cable runs? Could I just purchase heatshrink etc of appropriate
diameters instead.
I have read of the need for C type MCBs due to inrush currents,
thermostats, etc.

Would anyone care to do a wiki page along the lines of the one on SWA:http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...erminating_SWA

Thank you very much.

In days of yore trace heating was exclusively done with steam. Later,
non regulating electric tapes came i that were wound round pipework
and left permanently on. They were just a bit of nichrome wire
insulated with butyl rubber, the same stuff as was used in underfloor
heating. They were fixed wattage and fixed length, single wire.
The stuff you refer to came in about twenty years ago and has two
parallel conductors and the higher resistance stuff between them that
heats up. They are rated in X wats per meter run (Variable ratings
available). This means you can just cut a bit off, attach the leads to
one end and a "blanking cap" to the other end, usually crimped on.
The wattage per meter you select depends on the insulation of the pipe
& temperature (ambient and pipe). Some are self regulating to a
degree in that as they get hotter the resistance of the tricky bit
betweem the conductors increases.

Back then when I had anything to do with them they were quite
unreliable, maybe the technology has been sorted out by now.

On Feb 5, 10:46*am, harry wrote:
On Feb 4, 10:42*pm, Part timer wrote:





Does anyone here have experience of self-regulating trace heating
cable within domestic settings? Keen to prevent future 'occurrences'
if December's conditions are repeated, I've been looking at my options
to protect a mixture of 15 and 22mm copper in our eaves.
I have found the following 10W/m cable:http://www.qvsdirect.com/Trace-J-Sel...g-Cable-pr-166...
What does “Maximum exposure temperatu 85°C - intermittent, 65°C
continuous” actually mean? I'm thinking along the lines of don't power
it up in free air unattached to a pipe. Am I correct?
I notice that the same company sells a connection and end seal kit:http://www.qvsdirect.com/Frostop-Con...-pr-16689.html
Is this expensive for what it is if I was to install several separate
cable runs? Could I just purchase heatshrink etc of appropriate
diameters instead.
I have read of the need for C type MCBs due to inrush currents,
thermostats, etc.

Would anyone care to do a wiki page along the lines of the one on SWA:http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...erminating_SWA

Thank you very much.

In days of yore trace heating was exclusively done with steam. Later,
non regulating electric tapes came i that were wound round pipework
and left permanently on. *They were just a bit of nichrome wire
insulated with butyl rubber, the same stuff as was used in underfloor
heating. *They were fixed wattage and fixed length, single wire.
The stuff you refer to came in about twenty years ago and has two
parallel conductors and the higher resistance stuff between them that
heats up. They are *rated in X wats per meter run (Variable ratings
available). This means you can just cut a bit off, attach the leads to
one end and a "blanking *cap" to the other end, usually crimped on.
The wattage per meter you select depends on the insulation of the pipe
& temperature (ambient and pipe). *Some are self regulating to a
degree in that as they get hotter the resistance of the tricky bit
betweem the conductors increases.

Back then when I had anything to do with them they were quite
unreliable, maybe the technology has been sorted out by now.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

The old two wires with heating wire between them has been superceded
with two wires with a semiconductor type material between them. The
"blurb" says this stuff has a non-linear resistance, rapidly
increasing at the design temperature so as to be self limiting. A
frost stat to prevent low current usage through the whole year is
required for the frost protection version

Thanks for your replies.
Andrew Gabriel: the copper pipes are mains-fed cold water feeding a
tank, then the outlets from the tank. I won't be worrying about the
max exposure temperatures then. I accept your (an Tabby's) correction
about MCB types. I wouldn't be using massive lengths of the stuff. I'm
not keen on home-brew methods, hence wanting a reputable product for
DIY. Not keen on a lack of water either when pipes freeze, never mind
bursts.
cynic: the website I linked to says "Designed specifically for frost
protection and low temperature maintenance". http://preview.tinyurl.com/4gmwfsj
has FS-A-2X Self-regulating frost protection cable 10W/m at 5°C.
What's the difference?
Tim Lamb: by "unaffordable" what do you mean? I'm prepared to throw
£50+ at my problem this year so I have cold water to feed the hot
water system when (not if) the weather turns nasty like it was in
December. I've briefly looked at soil warming cables and they cost
similar per metre.
cynic (2nd post): your explanation is as I understand how they work.

In message
,
Part timer writes
Tim Lamb: by "unaffordable" what do you mean? I'm prepared to throw
£50+ at my problem this year so I have cold water to feed the hot
water system when (not if) the weather turns nasty like it was in

Your money:-)

My problem is isolated standpipes as well as plastic pipe runs through
agricultural buildings. Consequential damage is not the issue for me.
Just the inconvenience of no water. I knew roughly the cost of self
regulating cable but assumed that a fixed length of under soil would be
cheaper.

December. I've briefly looked at soil warming cables and they cost
similar per metre.

I'll look again later.

cynic (2nd post): your explanation is as I understand how they work.

regards

--
Tim Lamb