I've been doing a job that involves drilling a lot of small holes in
steel and aluminium. The sizes vary. I started to get irritated because
the boxes of small HSS drill bits (I buy in boxes of ten) were starting
to be empty, yet there were lots of drills scattered around, on the
shelf behind the pedestal drill, all over the place in fact, and I was
having to use a micrometer just to be sure I had the correct drill in my
hand, since the sizes on the shanks aren't always legible or even
present. With metric and imperial sizes in use there was scope for
confusion.

I decided to buy a 24 drawer storage unit, one with 250mm deep drawers,
and use it for my HSS drills.

When the unit arrived I set about the task of putting the drill bits in
it. This meant sorting them out. The first move was to collect together
all the drill bits. I found that I had a great many boxes of drills, in
a variety of locations. Some of them I had forgotten about many years
ago. As well as handfuls of small sizes, sitting on shelves, there were
three boxes 5" x 6" x 4" labelled 'metric', 'imperial', and 'special'.
These boxes were full. The contents were jumbled. There were also two
incomplete sets of imperial drills (1/16" to 1/2" in 1/32" increments)
and two incomplete sets of metric drills (1mm to 13mm in 0.5mm
increments). There was a rotary drill dispenser containing some but not
all imperial sizes from 1/16" to 3/8", including, oddly, two 64th inch
sizes.

Clearly, what has been happening for the last 40 years is that I have
taken a drill from a box of ten, used it, then not bothered to find the
box to replace it. The box has become empty so I have bought another
one. For instance, I found six boxes of 1/8" drills, each containing
between three and ten drills, plus something like fifty loose 1/8"
drills. Some other commonly used sizes were the same. I found three full
boxes of 10mm drills, plus about a dozen loose ones.

Incidentally I have been surprised at the variation in size of drills
that should all be the same. For instance I have drills labelled 1/8" on
the shank that are various diameters from 2.85 to 3.25mm.

Bill

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
I've been doing a job that involves drilling a lot of small holes in steel
and aluminium. The sizes vary. I started to get irritated because the
boxes of small HSS drill bits (I buy in boxes of ten) were starting to be
empty, yet there were lots of drills scattered around, on the shelf behind
the pedestal drill, all over the place in fact, and I was having to use a
micrometer just to be sure I had the correct drill in my hand, since the
sizes on the shanks aren't always legible or even present. With metric and
imperial sizes in use there was scope for confusion.

I decided to buy a 24 drawer storage unit, one with 250mm deep drawers,
and use it for my HSS drills.

When the unit arrived I set about the task of putting the drill bits in
it. This meant sorting them out. The first move was to collect together
all the drill bits. I found that I had a great many boxes of drills, in a
variety of locations. Some of them I had forgotten about many years ago.
As well as handfuls of small sizes, sitting on shelves, there were three
boxes 5" x 6" x 4" labelled 'metric', 'imperial', and 'special'. These
boxes were full. The contents were jumbled. There were also two incomplete
sets of imperial drills (1/16" to 1/2" in 1/32" increments) and two
incomplete sets of metric drills (1mm to 13mm in 0.5mm increments). There
was a rotary drill dispenser containing some but not all imperial sizes
from 1/16" to 3/8", including, oddly, two 64th inch sizes.

Clearly, what has been happening for the last 40 years is that I have
taken a drill from a box of ten, used it, then not bothered to find the
box to replace it. The box has become empty so I have bought another one.
For instance, I found six boxes of 1/8" drills, each containing between
three and ten drills, plus something like fifty loose 1/8" drills. Some
other commonly used sizes were the same. I found three full boxes of 10mm
drills, plus about a dozen loose ones.

Incidentally I have been surprised at the variation in size of drills that
should all be the same. For instance I have drills labelled 1/8" on the
shank that are various diameters from 2.85 to 3.25mm.

Bill
As an apprentice, the first thing I made was a drill gauge.

As an apprentice, the first thing I made was a drill gauge.


A drill gauge is only a rough check unless you have carefully calibrated it
somehow. Use a micrometer.

On 17/10/2014 10:02, DerbyBorn wrote:
As an apprentice, the first thing I made was a drill gauge.


A drill gauge is only a rough check unless you have carefully calibrated it
somehow. Use a micrometer.


Particularly if you have every number drill from 30 to 80 and need to
tell the smaller ones apart.

--
Colin Bignell

"Nightjar \"cpb\"@" "insert my surname here wrote in
news
On 17/10/2014 10:02, DerbyBorn wrote:
As an apprentice, the first thing I made was a drill gauge.


A drill gauge is only a rough check unless you have carefully
calibrated it somehow. Use a micrometer.


Particularly if you have every number drill from 30 to 80 and need to
tell the smaller ones apart.


Apprentices made drill gauges in order to get practice and making
something. They were not intended to be used!!

On Fri, 17 Oct 2014 10:05:12 GMT, DerbyBorn
wrote:

"Nightjar \"cpb\"@" "insert my surname here wrote in
news
On 17/10/2014 10:02, DerbyBorn wrote:
As an apprentice, the first thing I made was a drill gauge.


A drill gauge is only a rough check unless you have carefully
calibrated it somehow. Use a micrometer.


Particularly if you have every number drill from 30 to 80 and need to
tell the smaller ones apart.


Apprentices made drill gauges in order to get practice and making
something. They were not intended to be used!!

The first thing we had to make in metalwork at school was an aluminium
protector for the jaws of a vice.

The first thing we had to make at college, was a soldering heat-shunt
which were copper extensions soldered to the jaws of a crocodile clip.

--

Graham.

%Profound_observation%

On 17/10/2014 10:09, "Nightjar \"cpb\""@ insert my surname here wrote:
On 17/10/2014 10:02, DerbyBorn wrote:


Particularly if you have every number drill from 30 to 80 and need to
tell the smaller ones apart.


I have every number drill, every letter drill, full set of imperial and
a 2 box set of metric in 0.1mm steps (0.1 to 12mm) ... which is
probably not a cheap item nowadays.

and I still usually have the one I want missing :-)

Some drills also have different cutting angles and some even have a
narrower or wider bit neer the tip itself. I don't know if these designs
mean the drill was intended to drill different material though, as as you
yourself find, their original boxes are long gone.
Some drills are soft and some very brittle and one cannot tell until one
either bends or breaks.
it is a minefield really. I don't get to drill much these days but I have
definitely succumbed to what you describe in the past.
Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
I've been doing a job that involves drilling a lot of small holes in steel
and aluminium. The sizes vary. I started to get irritated because the
boxes of small HSS drill bits (I buy in boxes of ten) were starting to be
empty, yet there were lots of drills scattered around, on the shelf behind
the pedestal drill, all over the place in fact, and I was having to use a
micrometer just to be sure I had the correct drill in my hand, since the
sizes on the shanks aren't always legible or even present. With metric and
imperial sizes in use there was scope for confusion.

I decided to buy a 24 drawer storage unit, one with 250mm deep drawers,
and use it for my HSS drills.

When the unit arrived I set about the task of putting the drill bits in
it. This meant sorting them out. The first move was to collect together
all the drill bits. I found that I had a great many boxes of drills, in a
variety of locations. Some of them I had forgotten about many years ago.
As well as handfuls of small sizes, sitting on shelves, there were three
boxes 5" x 6" x 4" labelled 'metric', 'imperial', and 'special'. These
boxes were full. The contents were jumbled. There were also two incomplete
sets of imperial drills (1/16" to 1/2" in 1/32" increments) and two
incomplete sets of metric drills (1mm to 13mm in 0.5mm increments). There
was a rotary drill dispenser containing some but not all imperial sizes
from 1/16" to 3/8", including, oddly, two 64th inch sizes.

Clearly, what has been happening for the last 40 years is that I have
taken a drill from a box of ten, used it, then not bothered to find the
box to replace it. The box has become empty so I have bought another one.
For instance, I found six boxes of 1/8" drills, each containing between
three and ten drills, plus something like fifty loose 1/8" drills. Some
other commonly used sizes were the same. I found three full boxes of 10mm
drills, plus about a dozen loose ones.

Incidentally I have been surprised at the variation in size of drills that
should all be the same. For instance I have drills labelled 1/8" on the
shank that are various diameters from 2.85 to 3.25mm.

Bill

On 17/10/2014 08:58, Brian Gaff wrote:
Some drills also have different cutting angles and some even have a
narrower or wider bit neer the tip itself. I don't know if these designs
mean the drill was intended to drill different material though, as as you
yourself find, their original boxes are long gone.
Some drills are soft and some very brittle and one cannot tell until one
either bends or breaks.
it is a minefield really. I don't get to drill much these days but I have
definitely succumbed to what you describe in the past.
Brian

The ones I have that are wider near the tip are masonry drills.

On Friday, October 17, 2014 3:05:27 AM UTC+1, Bill Wright wrote:

I've been doing a job that involves drilling a lot of small holes in
steel and aluminium. The sizes vary. I started to get irritated because
the boxes of small HSS drill bits (I buy in boxes of ten) were starting
to be empty, yet there were lots of drills scattered around, on the
shelf behind the pedestal drill, all over the place in fact, and I was
having to use a micrometer just to be sure I had the correct drill in my
hand, since the sizes on the shanks aren't always legible or even
present. With metric and imperial sizes in use there was scope for
confusion.
I decided to buy a 24 drawer storage unit, one with 250mm deep drawers,
and use it for my HSS drills.
When the unit arrived I set about the task of putting the drill bits in
it. This meant sorting them out. The first move was to collect together
all the drill bits. I found that I had a great many boxes of drills, in
a variety of locations. Some of them I had forgotten about many years
ago. As well as handfuls of small sizes, sitting on shelves, there were
three boxes 5" x 6" x 4" labelled 'metric', 'imperial', and 'special'.
These boxes were full. The contents were jumbled. There were also two
incomplete sets of imperial drills (1/16" to 1/2" in 1/32" increments)
and two incomplete sets of metric drills (1mm to 13mm in 0.5mm
increments). There was a rotary drill dispenser containing some but not
all imperial sizes from 1/16" to 3/8", including, oddly, two 64th inch
sizes.
Clearly, what has been happening for the last 40 years is that I have
taken a drill from a box of ten, used it, then not bothered to find the
box to replace it. The box has become empty so I have bought another
one. For instance, I found six boxes of 1/8" drills, each containing
between three and ten drills, plus something like fifty loose 1/8"
drills. Some other commonly used sizes were the same. I found three full
boxes of 10mm drills, plus about a dozen loose ones.
Incidentally I have been surprised at the variation in size of drills
that should all be the same. For instance I have drills labelled 1/8" on
the shank that are various diameters from 2.85 to 3.25mm.
Bill

If you treat them all as having millimetre sizes its practical to just have one series containing all the sizes, regardless of what sizing system they initially used. This way the old imperial stuff becomes a lot more useful IME.


NT

wrote:

If you treat them all as having millimetre sizes its practical to just have one series containing all the sizes,

regardless of what sizing system they initially used. This way the old
imperial stuff becomes a lot more useful IME.


NT

I was vaguely thinking that. I'm going to put the sizes in metric on the
labels for the imperial drills.

Bill

Bill Wright wrote:
wrote:

If you treat them all as having millimetre sizes its practical to just
have one series containing all the sizes,

regardless of what sizing system they initially used. This way the old
imperial stuff becomes a lot more useful IME.


NT

I was vaguely thinking that. I'm going to put the sizes in metric on the
labels for the imperial drills.

Bill

I've done it now.

Bill

On Fri, 17 Oct 2014 03:05:27 +0100
Bill Wright wrote:

For instance I have drills labelled 1/8" on
the shank that are various diameters from 2.85 to 3.25mm.

You are asking them to change system from Imperial to metric, so they
have become confused. Once an Imperial, always an Imperial. None of
that foreign rubbish. g

--
Davey.

On 17/10/2014 03:05, Bill Wright wrote:
I have drills labelled

What we need is not labels - but some mark that can be seen without any
difficulty. I would have said colour (e.g. using different colours for
1, 2, ...9, and, maybe a collar colour for 0.5 increments), but that
wouldn't be acceptable for the colour blind or, sometimes, in
challenging illumination. So perhaps a combination of colours and rings?

And what we desperately want NOT to have is every flaming manufacturer
coming up with their own, distinct, an incompatible scheme.

--
Rod

In article , polygonum
scribeth thus
On 17/10/2014 03:05, Bill Wright wrote:
I have drills labelled

What we need is not labels - but some mark that can be seen without any
difficulty. I would have said colour (e.g. using different colours for
1, 2, ...9, and, maybe a collar colour for 0.5 increments), but that
wouldn't be acceptable for the colour blind or, sometimes, in
challenging illumination. So perhaps a combination of colours and rings?

And what we desperately want NOT to have is every flaming manufacturer
coming up with their own, distinct, an incompatible scheme.


Nowt wrong with the resistor colour code, done that with some tools here
a Yellow means an M4 nut driver etc...
--
Tony Sayer

On 17/10/2014 20:15, tony sayer wrote:
In article , polygonum
scribeth thus
On 17/10/2014 03:05, Bill Wright wrote:
I have drills labelled

What we need is not labels - but some mark that can be seen without any
difficulty. I would have said colour (e.g. using different colours for
1, 2, ...9, and, maybe a collar colour for 0.5 increments), but that
wouldn't be acceptable for the colour blind or, sometimes, in
challenging illumination. So perhaps a combination of colours and rings?

And what we desperately want NOT to have is every flaming manufacturer
coming up with their own, distinct, an incompatible scheme.


Nowt wrong with the resistor colour code, done that with some tools here
a Yellow means an M4 nut driver etc...

No specific argument with that but a newly agreed universal
number-to-colour mapping which was thoroughly tested (check usability by
the colour blind, ensure that the colours can be made with safe and
stable pigments/dyes, etc.) would be needed - even if based on resistors.

--
Rod

On Saturday, October 18, 2014 8:46:18 AM UTC+1, polygonum wrote:
On 17/10/2014 20:15, tony sayer wrote:

Nowt wrong with the resistor colour code, done that with some tools here
a Yellow means an M4 nut driver etc...

No specific argument with that but a newly agreed universal
number-to-colour mapping which was thoroughly tested (check usability by
the colour blind, ensure that the colours can be made with safe and
stable pigments/dyes, etc.) would be needed - even if based on resistors.

How do you propose to make a colour coding system accessible to the colour blind? It partially works in electronics due to the E series, but no such equivalent either exists or is likely to ever exist with drill bits.

I believe safe stable pigments have existed and been in widespread use for a very long time now.


NT

On Sat, 18 Oct 2014 03:06:16 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

On Saturday, October 18, 2014 8:46:18 AM UTC+1, polygonum wrote:
On 17/10/2014 20:15, tony sayer wrote:

Nowt wrong with the resistor colour code, done that with some tools here
a Yellow means an M4 nut driver etc...

No specific argument with that but a newly agreed universal
number-to-colour mapping which was thoroughly tested (check usability by
the colour blind, ensure that the colours can be made with safe and
stable pigments/dyes, etc.) would be needed - even if based on resistors.

How do you propose to make a colour coding system accessible to the colour blind? It partially works in electronics due to the E series, but no such equivalent either exists or is likely to ever exist with drill bits.

I believe safe stable pigments have existed and been in widespread use for a very long time now.


Try telling that to Dave Ploughman in the "Disappearing Needles"
thread. :-)
--
J B Good

wrote in
:

On Saturday, October 18, 2014 8:46:18 AM UTC+1, polygonum wrote:
On 17/10/2014 20:15, tony sayer wrote:

Nowt wrong with the resistor colour code, done that with some tools
here a Yellow means an M4 nut driver etc...

No specific argument with that but a newly agreed universal
number-to-colour mapping which was thoroughly tested (check usability
by the colour blind, ensure that the colours can be made with safe
and stable pigments/dyes, etc.) would be needed - even if based on
resistors.

How do you propose to make a colour coding system accessible to the
colour blind? It partially works in electronics due to the E series,
but no such equivalent either exists or is likely to ever exist with
drill bits.

I believe safe stable pigments have existed and been in widespread use
for a very long time now.


NT

Hardly a chore to use a micrometer to measure a drill!