We were planning on installing Vaillant but we may have to change plumbers
as our first choice isn't well at the moment.

Next choice plumber recommended by the builders in a Viessman installer and
only deals in these.
Which? only seems to recommend Vaillant and Worcester Bosch.

Plus points:
5 year warranty against 2 year on the others
10 year warranty on heat exchanger if installed by agent.
CH will go down to 7.9/8 kW

Minus points:
Some bad reviews around 2008 (from quick Google)
Not as relaible as Vaillant/Worcester Bosch according to Which?
Lower than usual hot water flow 35kW does 14 or 14.3l/min compared to
15.2l/min for the 37kW Vaillants

Pricing seems similar.

So any recommendations?
Don't want to be forced to take an inferior boiler just because the plumber
is an agent.

The simple specs gleaned from the Which? site seem to suggest that the
Viessman may be a more efficient CH boiler, but the main use will be for
running one or two showers all year round, so the peak flow rate may be the
killer. Should make no difference for one shower, but could be crucial if
running two together.

Which brings me to wonder if the WB38kW is a better bet than the Vaillant
37kW as it modulates lower and has the same maximum flow rate.

Ah, choices.
Get well soon, #1 plumber!

Cheers


Dave R

--
No plan survives contact with the enemy.
[Not even bunny]

Helmuth von Moltke the Elder

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

"David WE Roberts" wrote:
We were planning on installing Vaillant but we may have to change plumbers
as our first choice isn't well at the moment.

Next choice plumber recommended by the builders in a Viessman installer
and only deals in these.
Which? only seems to recommend Vaillant and Worcester Bosch.

Plus points:
5 year warranty against 2 year on the others
10 year warranty on heat exchanger if installed by agent.
CH will go down to 7.9/8 kW

Minus points:
Some bad reviews around 2008 (from quick Google)
Not as relaible as Vaillant/Worcester Bosch according to Which?
Lower than usual hot water flow 35kW does 14 or 14.3l/min compared to
15.2l/min for the 37kW Vaillants

Pricing seems similar.

So any recommendations?
Don't want to be forced to take an inferior boiler just because the
plumber is an agent.

The simple specs gleaned from the Which? site seem to suggest that the
Viessman may be a more efficient CH boiler, but the main use will be for
running one or two showers all year round, so the peak flow rate may be
the killer. Should make no difference for one shower, but could be crucial
if running two together.

Which brings me to wonder if the WB38kW is a better bet than the Vaillant
37kW as it modulates lower and has the same maximum flow rate.

Ah, choices.
Get well soon, #1 plumber!

Cheers


Dave R

--
No plan survives contact with the enemy.
[Not even bunny]

Helmuth von Moltke the Elder

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

http://www.worcester-bosch.co.uk/ins...ntee-promotion

On 21/08/2012 15:20, David WE Roberts wrote:
We were planning on installing Vaillant but we may have to change
plumbers as our first choice isn't well at the moment.

Next choice plumber recommended by the builders in a Viessman
installer and only deals in these.
Which? only seems to recommend Vaillant and Worcester Bosch.

Plus points:
5 year warranty against 2 year on the others
10 year warranty on heat exchanger if installed by agent.
CH will go down to 7.9/8 kW

Minus points:
Some bad reviews around 2008 (from quick Google)
Not as relaible as Vaillant/Worcester Bosch according to Which?
Lower than usual hot water flow 35kW does 14 or 14.3l/min compared to
15.2l/min for the 37kW Vaillants

Pricing seems similar.

So any recommendations?
Don't want to be forced to take an inferior boiler just because the
plumber is an agent.

The simple specs gleaned from the Which? site seem to suggest that the
Viessman may be a more efficient CH boiler, but the main use will be
for running one or two showers all year round, so the peak flow rate
may be the killer. Should make no difference for one shower, but could
be crucial if running two together.

Which brings me to wonder if the WB38kW is a better bet than the
Vaillant 37kW as it modulates lower and has the same maximum flow rate.

Ah, choices.
Get well soon, #1 plumber!

Cheers


Dave R


I believe they are good boilers but parts are expensive! You could get 5
year warranty on the Vaillant if installed by a Vaillant accredited
installer I think.

The Vaillant Ecotec 837 combi boiler will modulate down to 6.4kw*
compared to 9.4kw on the Worcester. I also find the Vaillant boilers to
be easier to work on and more robust overall.

*The figures on the website haven't been updated for the newer Ecotec
range. See brochure.

--
David

On Tue, 21 Aug 2012 15:20:44 +0100, "David WE Roberts"
wrote:

We were planning on installing Vaillant but we may have to change plumbers
as our first choice isn't well at the moment.

Next choice plumber recommended by the builders in a Viessman installer and
only deals in these.
Which? only seems to recommend Vaillant and Worcester Bosch.

Plus points:
5 year warranty against 2 year on the others
10 year warranty on heat exchanger if installed by agent.
CH will go down to 7.9/8 kW


I was given a 7 year parts and labour warranty on a Worcester Bosch
30CDi by a WB accredited installer last month.
--
rbel

"David WE Roberts" wrote in message
...
We were planning on installing Vaillant but we may have to change plumbers
as our first choice isn't well at the moment.

Next choice plumber recommended by the builders in a Viessman installer
and only deals in these.
Which? only seems to recommend Vaillant and Worcester Bosch.

snip

O.K. - thanks for the responses so far.
Nobody has yet fessed up to having a Viessman or installing one.
Vaillant still seems to be getting the most recommendations.

--
No plan survives contact with the enemy.
[Not even bunny]

Helmuth von Moltke the Elder

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

In message , David WE Roberts
writes

"David WE Roberts" wrote in message
...
We were planning on installing Vaillant but we may have to change
plumbers as our first choice isn't well at the moment.

Next choice plumber recommended by the builders in a Viessman
installer and only deals in these.
Which? only seems to recommend Vaillant and Worcester Bosch.

snip

O.K. - thanks for the responses so far.
Nobody has yet fessed up to having a Viessman or installing one.
Vaillant still seems to be getting the most recommendations.

I had one installed about 2 years ago. It is currently only looking
after an underfloor heating circuit so I'm not able to comment on DHW
performance. Only 25kW so smaller than your needs.

The installer made a hash of fitting so it is not a good idea to stand
underneath the flue when it fires up:-(

regards


--
Tim Lamb

In article ,
David WE Roberts wrote:

"David WE Roberts" wrote in message
...
We were planning on installing Vaillant but we may have to change
plumbers as our first choice isn't well at the moment.

Next choice plumber recommended by the builders in a Viessman
installer and only deals in these. Which? only seems to recommend
Vaillant and Worcester Bosch.

snip

O.K. - thanks for the responses so far.
Nobody has yet fessed up to having a Viessman or installing one.
Vaillant still seems to be getting the most recommendations.

I have one, but it's not a combi. I self installed it and had some
teething problems due to the instructions not being the best - I added the
weather compensation pack and a remote programmer both of which requires
software alteration. Their tech department was very helpful and sent out
an engineer free of charge. Who knew about the same as me about the
software. ;-)

Their tech guy eventually took me through it step by step over the phone.
All I can say about it - since other than that it's been fine - is it
looks very well made and should be easy to repair if and when needed.

I'd hope their current products would have more accessible software -
perhaps PC controlled.

--
*I'm not being rude. You're just insignificant

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Aug 22, 7:30*am, "David WE Roberts" wrote:
"David WE Roberts" wrote in ...

We were planning on installing Vaillant but we may have to change plumbers
as our first choice isn't well at the moment.

Next choice plumber recommended by the builders in a Viessman installer
and only deals in these.
Which? only seems to recommend Vaillant and Worcester Bosch.

snip

O.K. - thanks for the responses so far.
Nobody has yet fessed up to having a Viessman or installing one.
Vaillant still seems to be getting the most recommendations.

--
No plan survives contact with the enemy.
[Not even bunny]

Helmuth von Moltke the Elder

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

I have three Viessman boilers (2 in holiday lets). They are all
different models. They have been installed for four years and have
given no problems, except for 1 circuit board, which was quickly
replaced by them under warranty. I do get them serviced once a year.
Not enough for a statistical sample but I don't feel I want to get rid
of them. The ones in the lets are combis and do drive one shower over
the bath but I have had no complaints about it. The water seems hot
enough when I use it to clean the bath.

Jonathan

On 22/08/2012 07:30, David WE Roberts wrote:

"David WE Roberts" wrote in message
...
We were planning on installing Vaillant but we may have to change
plumbers as our first choice isn't well at the moment.

Next choice plumber recommended by the builders in a Viessman
installer and only deals in these.
Which? only seems to recommend Vaillant and Worcester Bosch.

snip

O.K. - thanks for the responses so far.
Nobody has yet fessed up to having a Viessman or installing one.
Vaillant still seems to be getting the most recommendations.


FWIW, we own a Vaillant with weather compensation but have only had it
for about 4 years so it's too early to comment on reliability, a
relative has had an older Vaillant Ecomax which is 8 years old now and
hasn't given any trouble. My aunt has had a Viessman combi installed for
about 2-3 years and this too has been reliable. I don't think you could
go far wrong with either tbh.

--
David

"David WE Roberts" wrote in message
...

"David WE Roberts" wrote in message
...
We were planning on installing Vaillant but we may have to change
plumbers as our first choice isn't well at the moment.

Next choice plumber recommended by the builders in a Viessman installer
and only deals in these.
Which? only seems to recommend Vaillant and Worcester Bosch.

snip

O.K. - thanks for the responses so far.
Nobody has yet fessed up to having a Viessman or installing one.
Vaillant still seems to be getting the most recommendations.


Thanks for the further responses - only remaining question is the slightly
reduced flow through the DHW compared to the norm.
14.3 lpm compared to 15.2 lpm doesn't seem a massive amount but if you can
only just get away with the 15.2 lpm then this could be the straw that
breaks etc.

As a matter of interest why do nearly all the mid range combis have a
maximum flow rate of 15.2 lpm?
Something to do with size of heat exchangers, 15mm piping, or similar?
You would think they would all have minor variations.

Cheers

Dave R
--
No plan survives contact with the enemy.
[Not even bunny]

Helmuth von Moltke the Elder

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

In article ,
David WE Roberts wrote:
Thanks for the further responses - only remaining question is the
slightly reduced flow through the DHW compared to the norm. 14.3 lpm
compared to 15.2 lpm doesn't seem a massive amount but if you can only
just get away with the 15.2 lpm then this could be the straw that
breaks etc.

As a matter of interest why do nearly all the mid range combis have a
maximum flow rate of 15.2 lpm? Something to do with size of heat
exchangers, 15mm piping, or similar? You would think they would all have
minor variations.

Are you certain they're all measured in the same way?

--
*Parenthetical remarks (however relevant) are (usually) unnecessary *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
David WE Roberts wrote:
Thanks for the further responses - only remaining question is the
slightly reduced flow through the DHW compared to the norm. 14.3 lpm
compared to 15.2 lpm doesn't seem a massive amount but if you can only
just get away with the 15.2 lpm then this could be the straw that
breaks etc.

As a matter of interest why do nearly all the mid range combis have a
maximum flow rate of 15.2 lpm? Something to do with size of heat
exchangers, 15mm piping, or similar? You would think they would all have
minor variations.

Are you certain they're all measured in the same way?


No idea - but still, why do they mainly seem to be the same value?

--
No plan survives contact with the enemy.
[Not even bunny]

Helmuth von Moltke the Elder

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

In article ,
David WE Roberts wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
David WE Roberts wrote:
Thanks for the further responses - only remaining question is the
slightly reduced flow through the DHW compared to the norm. 14.3 lpm
compared to 15.2 lpm doesn't seem a massive amount but if you can only
just get away with the 15.2 lpm then this could be the straw that
breaks etc.

As a matter of interest why do nearly all the mid range combis have a
maximum flow rate of 15.2 lpm? Something to do with size of heat
exchangers, 15mm piping, or similar? You would think they would all
have minor variations.

Are you certain they're all measured in the same way?


No idea - but still, why do they mainly seem to be the same value?

Assuming the boilers are the same size, I doubt there'd be much to pick
and choose between the flow rates at a given temp. Since they are all
pretty close efficiency wise. Which is why I wonder if they're measured
in a different way.

--
*Why are a wise man and a wise guy opposites? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In message , David WE Roberts
writes
We were planning on installing Vaillant but we may have to change
plumbers as our first choice isn't well at the moment.

Next choice plumber recommended by the builders in a Viessman installer
and only deals in these.
Which? only seems to recommend Vaillant and Worcester Bosch.

Plus points:
5 year warranty against 2 year on the others

Very important consideration, don't underestimate it

I'll wait and see what other people say about the other points before
making further comments



--
geoff

In message , gremlin_95
writes
On 22/08/2012 07:30, David WE Roberts wrote:

"David WE Roberts" wrote in message
...
We were planning on installing Vaillant but we may have to change
plumbers as our first choice isn't well at the moment.

Next choice plumber recommended by the builders in a Viessman
installer and only deals in these.
Which? only seems to recommend Vaillant and Worcester Bosch.

snip

O.K. - thanks for the responses so far.
Nobody has yet fessed up to having a Viessman or installing one.
Vaillant still seems to be getting the most recommendations.


FWIW, we own a Vaillant with weather compensation but have only had it
for about 4 years so it's too early to comment on reliability, a
relative has had an older Vaillant Ecomax which is 8 years old now and
hasn't given any trouble. My aunt has had a Viessman combi installed
for about 2-3 years and this too has been reliable. I don't think you
could go far wrong with either tbh.

I shall save that little gem for later ...

--
geoff