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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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#1
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Central heating alterations
A couple of weeks back I asked on here about soldering joints on existing
pipework. Having now had a good look around, i see that Conex et al produceflame-free copper push fit pipe fittings, which are less chunky and exactly what I need. Also, Screwfix stock a plastic pipe system by FloPlast (Flo-Fit) at a good price. Does anyone have any experience of it? (Screwfix is finally coming to Cornwall on November 9th!) Thanks |
#2
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Central heating alterations
On Thu, 3 Nov 2011 08:11:36 -0000, DIYer wrote:
Also, Screwfix stock a plastic pipe system by FloPlast (Flo-Fit) at a good price. Check the temperature and pressure ratings. The pressure rating drops dramatically as the temperature rises. Plastic also needs to be well supported if you aren't going to get excessive sagging, over time, between supports. -- Cheers Dave. |
#3
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Central heating alterations
On Nov 3, 8:11*am, "DIYer" wrote:
A couple of weeks back I asked on here about soldering joints on existing pipework. *Having now had a good look around, i see that Conex et al produceflame-free copper push fit pipe fittings, which are less chunky and exactly what I need. fA AAAAAAAAa Also, Screwfix stock a plastic pipe system by FloPlast (Flo-Fit) at a good price. *Does anyone have any experience of it? (Screwfix is finally coming to Cornwall on November 9th!) Thanks Additional to above, you need the inserts to go in plastic pipe cut ends. |
#4
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Central heating alterations
In message o.uk, Dave
Liquorice writes On Thu, 3 Nov 2011 08:11:36 -0000, DIYer wrote: Also, Screwfix stock a plastic pipe system by FloPlast (Flo-Fit) at a good price. Check the temperature and pressure ratings. The pressure rating drops dramatically as the temperature rises. Is that likely to be a problem with any of the plastic plumbing systems though and even a pressurised system is only run at 1 bar or so. Hep2O and Speedfit are fine. I've no experience with flopast, it looks similar to Speedfit, which is fine. They have their own website if yoiu want more info. http://www.floplast.co.uk/ Plastic also needs to be well supported if you aren't going to get excessive sagging, over time, between supports. True, and I'd not use it in visible areas where appearance mattered. but it's easy to install and I find it useful when working in awkward areas -- Chris French |
#5
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Central heating alterations
On 03/11/2011 08:11, DIYer wrote:
A couple of weeks back I asked on here about soldering joints on existing pipework. Having now had a good look around, i see that Conex et al produceflame-free copper push fit pipe fittings, which are less chunky and exactly what I need. Also, Screwfix stock a plastic pipe system by FloPlast (Flo-Fit) at a good price. Does anyone have any experience of it? (Screwfix is finally coming to Cornwall on November 9th!) Thanks Why not just use solder fittings? I (like many) consider push-fit to be crap, especially on CH systems. Soldering really isn't hard, and will remain mechanically strong and leak-free for decades. Push-fit relies on rubber 'O' rings. |
#6
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Central heating alterations
On Thu, 3 Nov 2011 10:25:51 +0000, chris French wrote:
Check the temperature and pressure ratings. The pressure rating drops dramatically as the temperature rises. Is that likely to be a problem with any of the plastic plumbing systems though and even a pressurised system is only run at 1 bar or so. Just a heads up more than anything else. The drop in pressure rating with temperature is quite dramatic. Do rodents like it? They don't attack copper but nice soft chewy things seem to be a magnet for little teeth. They might not be able to get a start on plain pipe but the sticky out bits of fittings are just asking to gnawed and once they can get a bit of purchase the little bleeders don't stop. -- Cheers Dave. |
#7
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Central heating alterations
"AlanD" wrote in message ... On 03/11/2011 08:11, DIYer wrote: A couple of weeks back I asked on here about soldering joints on existing pipework. Having now had a good look around, i see that Conex et al produceflame-free copper push fit pipe fittings, which are less chunky and exactly what I need. Also, Screwfix stock a plastic pipe system by FloPlast (Flo-Fit) at a good price. Does anyone have any experience of it? (Screwfix is finally coming to Cornwall on November 9th!) Thanks Why not just use solder fittings? I (like many) consider push-fit to be crap, especially on CH systems. Soldering really isn't hard, and will remain mechanically strong and leak-free for decades. Push-fit relies on rubber 'O' rings. The problem that brought this about, was expelling water / steam in the existing pipework |
#8
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Central heating alterations
On Thu, 03 Nov 2011 10:47:59 +0000, AlanD wrote:
Why not just use solder fittings? IIRC the OP can't get the pipe dry... -- Cheers Dave. |
#9
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Central heating alterations
Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Thu, 03 Nov 2011 10:47:59 +0000, AlanD wrote: Why not just use solder fittings? IIRC the OP can't get the pipe dry... There are always Cuprofit (IIRC) - pushfit for copper and the fitting is brass. Can be demounted wiht a special (but cheap) tool. Still has o-rings, but is otherwise bomb (and mouse) proof. -- Tim Watts |
#10
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Central heating alterations
On Thu, 03 Nov 2011 11:20:58 +0000, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Thu, 03 Nov 2011 10:47:59 +0000, AlanD wrote: Why not just use solder fittings? IIRC the OP can't get the pipe dry... Solder the joint up dry on the bench, then attach it to the system with a couple of push-fits... ;-) |
#11
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Central heating alterations
In article , chris French wrote:
In message o.uk, Dave Liquorice writes On Thu, 3 Nov 2011 08:11:36 -0000, DIYer wrote: Also, Screwfix stock a plastic pipe system by FloPlast (Flo-Fit) at a good price. Check the temperature and pressure ratings. The pressure rating drops dramatically as the temperature rises. Is that likely to be a problem with any of the plastic plumbing systems though and even a pressurised system is only run at 1 bar or so. Hep2O and Speedfit are fine. If you've got mains pressure hot water, that can get a fair bit over 1 bar. (Without checking the ratings, I don't know if it's likely to be a problem.) |
#12
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Central heating alterations
On 03/11/2011 08:11, DIYer wrote:
A couple of weeks back I asked on here about soldering joints on existing pipework. Having now had a good look around, i see that Conex et al produceflame-free copper push fit pipe fittings, which are less chunky and exactly what I need. Yup, they work ok, bit pricey though... Also, Screwfix stock a plastic pipe system by FloPlast (Flo-Fit) at a good price. Does anyone have any experience of it? The fittings yes, the pipe no. Not been that impressed with FloPlast fittings - they seem to need quite high insertion forces to get a properly seated joint, and they are not at all tolerant of any misalignment on entry. The pipe however may well be fine since I can't see much they could do wrong with that! (Screwfix is finally coming to Cornwall on November 9th!) Thanks -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#13
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Central heating alterations
Alan Braggins wrote:
In article , chris French wrote: In message o.uk, Dave Liquorice writes On Thu, 3 Nov 2011 08:11:36 -0000, DIYer wrote: Also, Screwfix stock a plastic pipe system by FloPlast (Flo-Fit) at a good price. Check the temperature and pressure ratings. The pressure rating drops dramatically as the temperature rises. Is that likely to be a problem with any of the plastic plumbing systems though and even a pressurised system is only run at 1 bar or so. Hep2O and Speedfit are fine. If you've got mains pressure hot water, that can get a fair bit over 1 bar. (Without checking the ratings, I don't know if it's likely to be a problem.) Temporary fit Speedfit here - 4.5bar pressure on the hot water side, up to 60C, no problems. -- Tim Watts |
#14
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Central heating alterations
In message , Alan Braggins
writes In article , chris French wrote: In message o.uk, Dave Liquorice writes On Thu, 3 Nov 2011 08:11:36 -0000, DIYer wrote: Also, Screwfix stock a plastic pipe system by FloPlast (Flo-Fit) at a good price. Check the temperature and pressure ratings. The pressure rating drops dramatically as the temperature rises. Is that likely to be a problem with any of the plastic plumbing systems though and even a pressurised system is only run at 1 bar or so. Hep2O and Speedfit are fine. If you've got mains pressure hot water, that can get a fair bit over 1 bar. (Without checking the ratings, I don't know if it's likely to be a problem.) I can't remember now without looking it up, but Hep2O was fine for the mains pressure water in our old house - and that had pretty high pressure. Of course this ha smade me go and look it up :-) http://www.floplast.co.uk/pages.asp?pageid=43012753&catid=312 for Floplast it gives a max working pressure of 12 bar at 20C at 85C, 4 bar -- Chris French |
#15
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Central heating alterations
In message o.uk, Dave
Liquorice writes On Thu, 3 Nov 2011 10:25:51 +0000, chris French wrote: Check the temperature and pressure ratings. The pressure rating drops dramatically as the temperature rises. Is that likely to be a problem with any of the plastic plumbing systems though and even a pressurised system is only run at 1 bar or so. Just a heads up more than anything else. The drop in pressure rating with temperature is quite dramatic. Do rodents like it? They don't attack copper but nice soft chewy things seem to be a magnet for little teeth. They might not be able to get a start on plain pipe but the sticky out bits of fittings are just asking to gnawed and once they can get a bit of purchase the little bleeders don't stop. Anecdotally, no. In our old house I used it quite a bit and it had mice but we had no problems with nibbling. I've had abit in this house for a couple of years (running a temporary replacement supply out through the old stable and that's also fine. -- Chris French |
#16
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Central heating alterations
"AlanD" wrote in message ... Why not just use solder fittings? I (like many) consider push-fit to be crap, especially on CH systems. Soldering really isn't hard, and will remain mechanically strong and leak-free for decades. Push-fit relies on rubber 'O' rings. I have seen copper pipe fail after less than 20 years and fittings that never worked, I have yet to see any plastic pipe/joints/fittings fail even in heating systems. I have plastic pipe in my heating system, its ~29 years old. |
#17
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Central heating alterations
dennis@home wrote:
"AlanD" wrote in message ... Why not just use solder fittings? I (like many) consider push-fit to be crap, especially on CH systems. Soldering really isn't hard, and will remain mechanically strong and leak-free for decades. Push-fit relies on rubber 'O' rings. I have seen copper pipe fail after less than 20 years and fittings that never worked, I have yet to see any plastic pipe/joints/fittings fail even in heating systems. So says the bloke who still see the fairies in the bottom of his garden. -- Adam |
#18
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Central heating alterations
In article , chris French wrote:
In message , Alan Braggins writes In article , chris French wrote: In message o.uk, Dave Liquorice writes On Thu, 3 Nov 2011 08:11:36 -0000, DIYer wrote: Also, Screwfix stock a plastic pipe system by FloPlast (Flo-Fit) at a good price. Check the temperature and pressure ratings. The pressure rating drops dramatically as the temperature rises. Is that likely to be a problem with any of the plastic plumbing systems though and even a pressurised system is only run at 1 bar or so. Hep2O and Speedfit are fine. If you've got mains pressure hot water, that can get a fair bit over 1 bar. (Without checking the ratings, I don't know if it's likely to be a problem.) I can't remember now without looking it up, but Hep2O was fine for the mains pressure water in our old house - and that had pretty high pressure. Of course this ha smade me go and look it up :-) http://www.floplast.co.uk/pages.asp?pageid=43012753&catid=312 for Floplast it gives a max working pressure of 12 bar at 20C at 85C, 4 bar Hmm. In the middle of the night when the mains pressure might reach 10 bar in some areas you won't be running hot water through it, and you won't run your hot taps or shower at 85C. But I think you would want to be cautious about how close you ran it to a combi boiler or thermal store heat exchanger. |
#19
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Central heating alterations
Alan Braggins wrote:
Hmm. In the middle of the night when the mains pressure might reach 10 bar in some areas you won't be running hot water through it, and you won't run your hot taps or shower at 85C. But I think you would want to be cautious about how close you ran it to a combi boiler or thermal store heat exchanger. This is true. One set of boiler installation instructions I read said to take the last bit (1m, IIRC) in metal pipework and not plastic. -- Tim Watts |
#20
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Central heating alterations
"Tim Watts" wrote in message ... Alan Braggins wrote: Hmm. In the middle of the night when the mains pressure might reach 10 bar in some areas you won't be running hot water through it, and you won't run your hot taps or shower at 85C. But I think you would want to be cautious about how close you ran it to a combi boiler or thermal store heat exchanger. This is true. One set of boiler installation instructions I read said to take the last bit (1m, IIRC) in metal pipework and not plastic. That is to limit damage when the boiler decides to keep firing after the stat has broken. |
#21
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Central heating alterations
On Thu, 03 Nov 2011 22:26:45 +0000, Tim Watts
wrote: This is true. One set of boiler installation instructions I read said to take the last bit (1m, IIRC) in metal pipework and not plastic. I had to rectify a cowboy's work on a new boiler. The tosser had connected the Qualpex right onto the boiler. It had lasted three months or so, which surprised me. |
#22
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Central heating alterations
In message , Tim Watts
writes Alan Braggins wrote: Hmm. In the middle of the night when the mains pressure might reach 10 bar in some areas you won't be running hot water through it, and you won't run your hot taps or shower at 85C. But I think you would want to be cautious about how close you ran it to a combi boiler or thermal store heat exchanger. This is true. One set of boiler installation instructions I read said to take the last bit (1m, IIRC) in metal pipework and not plastic. I think that is the recommendations of the plastic pipe makers as well. -- Chris French |
#23
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Central heating alterations
In message , ARWadsworth
writes dennis@home wrote: "AlanD" wrote in message ... Why not just use solder fittings? I (like many) consider push-fit to be crap, especially on CH systems. Soldering really isn't hard, and will remain mechanically strong and leak-free for decades. Push-fit relies on rubber 'O' rings. I have seen copper pipe fail after less than 20 years and fittings that never worked, I have yet to see any plastic pipe/joints/fittings fail even in heating systems. So says the bloke who still see the fairies in the bottom of his garden. The one 'random - failure of material leak' I've had to deal with was in copper pipe. A pinhole developed in the pipe, dripping water slowly. -- Chris French |
#24
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Central heating alterations
On Thu, 3 Nov 2011 18:47:50 +0000, chris French wrote:
for Floplast it gives a max working pressure of 12 bar at 20C at 85C, 4 bar Our mains pressure is about 5 bar... OK you won't have mains pressure in the CH but I still think it's begining to sail a bit close to the wind even with DHW. -- Cheers Dave. |
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