A collegue from my Council days contacted me yesterday.
She's got an elderly client, analogue TV about to be turned
off, Free Digibox men came around to give him a set-top
box.

Oh no, mate. You need a new TV mate. Can't plug this in
mate, waving a SCART plug at him.

No, he just needs a UHF aerial lead, just like my TV, I showed
her. Here, have a spare lead, I can pop around and plug it in
for him.

Working now, but he's got a crappy little indoor aerial and the
digital pictures and sound break up. He hasn't got an outdoor
aerial. What indoor aerial would people recommend. He's
got line of sight to Crosspool transmitter about 3 miles
away which his analogue channels are currently tuned in to.

Ta.

JGH

On 21/06/2011 11:57, jgharston wrote:
A collegue from my Council days contacted me yesterday.
She's got an elderly client, analogue TV about to be turned
off, Free Digibox men came around to give him a set-top
box.

Oh no, mate. You need a new TV mate. Can't plug this in
mate, waving a SCART plug at him.

No, he just needs a UHF aerial lead, just like my TV, I showed
her. Here, have a spare lead, I can pop around and plug it in
for him.

Working now, but he's got a crappy little indoor aerial and the
digital pictures and sound break up.

Rare box now, it has a modulator. Which one was it?

Following DSO is there a chance signal strength may increase in his area?

--
Adrian C

In article
,
jgharston wrote:
A collegue from my Council days contacted me yesterday.
She's got an elderly client, analogue TV about to be turned
off, Free Digibox men came around to give him a set-top
box.

Oh no, mate. You need a new TV mate. Can't plug this in
mate, waving a SCART plug at him.

No, he just needs a UHF aerial lead, just like my TV, I showed
her. Here, have a spare lead, I can pop around and plug it in
for him.

Working now, but he's got a crappy little indoor aerial and the
digital pictures and sound break up. He hasn't got an outdoor
aerial. What indoor aerial would people recommend. He's
got line of sight to Crosspool transmitter about 3 miles
away which his analogue channels are currently tuned in to.

The power output of the FreeView transmitters increases when analogue is
finally switched off in your area. So that indoor aerial may be alright
then.

--
*Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Owain wrote:
The digital help scheme includes aerial replacement where necessary.
Whether that includes provision where there is no existing aerial I
don't know but it would be worth asking.

I had a look at the outside of his block of flats and there's
notably an absence of aerial, so he would need a new one, not
a replacement one. I'll give them a phone call.

The boxes used by the Help Scheme are listed he

It's the Goodmans one.

JGH

John Rumm wrote:
got line of sight to Crosspool transmitter about 3 miles
away which his analogue channels are currently tuned in to.
The Sheffield transmitter has a shaped output - so reception from the W
and NW of it is harder.

Ok, he's in Upperthorpe, with something similar to one of these:
http://goo.gl/052pb pointing straight through the window
towards Crosspool. No intervening buildings or trees, etc.

TV is an old Hitatchi with manual roller tuners. Analogue channels
1 to 5 all currently perfectly satisfactory, other than the TV's
colour balance is a bit off. He's not interested in replacing the
TV as he wouldn't use it long enough to get the benefit of the
investment. IYKWIM.

JGH

John Rumm wrote:
got line of sight to Crosspool transmitter about 3 miles
away which his analogue channels are currently tuned in to.
The Sheffield transmitter has a shaped output - so reception from the W
and NW of it is harder.

Ok, he's in Upperthorpe, with something similar to one of these:
http://goo.gl/052pb pointing straight through the window
towards Crosspool. No intervening buildings or trees, etc.

TV is an old Hitatchi with manual roller tuners. Analogue channels
1 to 5 all currently perfectly satisfactory, other than the TV's
colour balance is a bit off. He's not interested in replacing the
TV as he wouldn't use it long enough to get the benefit of the
investment. IYKWIM.

JGH

jgharston wrote:
A collegue from my Council days contacted me yesterday.
She's got an elderly client, analogue TV about to be turned
off, Free Digibox men came around to give him a set-top
box.

Oh no, mate. You need a new TV mate. Can't plug this in
mate, waving a SCART plug at him.

No, he just needs a UHF aerial lead, just like my TV, I showed
her. Here, have a spare lead, I can pop around and plug it in
for him.

Working now, but he's got a crappy little indoor aerial and the
digital pictures and sound break up. He hasn't got an outdoor
aerial. What indoor aerial would people recommend. He's
got line of sight to Crosspool transmitter about 3 miles
away which his analogue channels are currently tuned in to.

Almost no indoor aerial works with digital.

You need some sor of directional thing as high as you can get it.

Try a camping antenna.


Ta.

JGH

In message , The Natural Philosopher
writes
jgharston wrote:
A collegue from my Council days contacted me yesterday.
She's got an elderly client, analogue TV about to be turned
off, Free Digibox men came around to give him a set-top
box.
Oh no, mate. You need a new TV mate. Can't plug this in
mate, waving a SCART plug at him.
No, he just needs a UHF aerial lead, just like my TV, I showed
her. Here, have a spare lead, I can pop around and plug it in
for him.
Working now, but he's got a crappy little indoor aerial and the
digital pictures and sound break up. He hasn't got an outdoor
aerial. What indoor aerial would people recommend. He's
got line of sight to Crosspool transmitter about 3 miles
away which his analogue channels are currently tuned in to.

Almost no indoor aerial works with digital.

Nonsense. An indoor aerial leaves a lot to be desired, but if you can
get satisfactory analogue, you'll probably get digital OK.

You need some sor of directional thing as high as you can get it.

It certainly helps - but, in this situation, is it necessary?

Try a camping antenna.

As the aerial is pointing out of the window, and can actually see the
transmitter, I'm surprised the digital is no good. If five analogue
signs were perfectly OK, the digital signals should be OK. Even if they
are in a different of the UHF spectrum, that aerial at
http://goo.gl/052pb
is a log periodic, so it is (supposed to be) wideband. I'm surprised it
doesn't work. Has moving it around a little been tried?
--
ian

On 21/06/2011 17:06, jgharston wrote:

Ok, he's in Upperthorpe, with something similar to one of these:
http://goo.gl/052pb pointing straight through the window
towards Crosspool. No intervening buildings or trees, etc.

TV is an old Hitatchi with manual roller tuners. Analogue channels
1 to 5 all currently perfectly satisfactory, other than the TV's
colour balance is a bit off. He's not interested in replacing the
TV as he wouldn't use it long enough to get the benefit of the
investment. IYKWIM.


You could always sign up to the local Freecycle/Freegle group. People
give away perfectly good CRT TVs all the time on ours.

Andy

On Tue, 21 Jun 2011 19:32:35 +0100
Andy Champ wrote:

On 21/06/2011 17:06, jgharston wrote:

Ok, he's in Upperthorpe, with something similar to one of these:
http://goo.gl/052pb pointing straight through the window
towards Crosspool. No intervening buildings or trees, etc.

TV is an old Hitatchi with manual roller tuners. Analogue channels
1 to 5 all currently perfectly satisfactory, other than the TV's
colour balance is a bit off. He's not interested in replacing the
TV as he wouldn't use it long enough to get the benefit of the
investment. IYKWIM.


You could always sign up to the local Freecycle/Freegle group.
People give away perfectly good CRT TVs all the time on ours.

Andy

Same here, every day there is usually at least one, often more. He
could upgrade, for free! Look out for one with a SCART socket,
obviously.
--
Davey.

"jgharston" wrote in message ...
Owain wrote:
The digital help scheme includes aerial replacement where necessary.
Whether that includes provision where there is no existing aerial I
don't know but it would be worth asking.

I had a look at the outside of his block of flats and there's
notably an absence of aerial, so he would need a new one, not
a replacement one. I'll give them a phone call.

The boxes used by the Help Scheme are listed he

It's the Goodmans one.

JGH

Sounds like the installer needs to RTFM.
The manual mind, not the Easy Read guide
http://www.helpscheme.co.uk/files/he...Alba-ADR10.pdf

"No - I can't plug a SCART lead in. Follow these steps".

Is the only hint in the guide that the Goodmans box has a modulator.
Nowhere does it tell you to tune your TV into it, let alone how to change the RF channel on the box if
it is occupied locally.

--
Graham.

%Profound_observation%

Owain wrote:
On Jun 21, 5:05 pm, jgharston wrote:
Ok, he's in Upperthorpe, with something similar to one of these: http://goo.gl/052pb pointing straight through the window
towards Crosspool. No intervening buildings or trees, etc.

You can get an amplified indoor aerial, or a booster, for under a
tenner in Argos. That may be enough to make the difference. Both have
the 30 day guarantee so you can take it back if not.

Owain

not really. if the S/N ration is rubbish yo will simply amplify the noise.

In message , The Natural Philosopher
writes
Owain wrote:
On Jun 21, 5:05 pm, jgharston wrote:
Ok, he's in Upperthorpe, with something similar to one of these:
http://goo.gl/052pb pointing straight through the window
towards Crosspool. No intervening buildings or trees, etc.
You can get an amplified indoor aerial, or a booster, for under a
tenner in Argos. That may be enough to make the difference. Both have
the 30 day guarantee so you can take it back if not.
Owain

not really. if the S/N ration is rubbish yo will simply amplify the
noise.

The OP does say, "Analogue channels 1 to 5 all currently perfectly
satisfactory". Surely that tells us something important?
--
Ian

DerbyBoy wrote:
Is the TV properly tuned into the output of the Set Top Box?

Err... that's irrelevant. You either get a nice sharp picture of
lots of square blocks breaking up, or a fuzzy picture of lots of
square blocks breaking up. How well the *TV* is tuned in to the
decoder makes no difference to how well the *decoder* is receiving
the signal.

JGH

Ian Jackson wrote:
In message , The Natural Philosopher
writes
Owain wrote:
On Jun 21, 5:05 pm, jgharston wrote:
Ok, he's in Upperthorpe, with something similar to one of these:
http://goo.gl/052pb pointing straight through the window
towards Crosspool. No intervening buildings or trees, etc.
You can get an amplified indoor aerial, or a booster, for under a
tenner in Argos. That may be enough to make the difference. Both have
the 30 day guarantee so you can take it back if not.
Owain

not really. if the S/N ration is rubbish yo will simply amplify the
noise.

The OP does say, "Analogue channels 1 to 5 all currently perfectly
satisfactory". Surely that tells us something important?


That analogue is on higher power?

In article ,
Ian Jackson wrote:
The OP does say, "Analogue channels 1 to 5 all currently perfectly
satisfactory". Surely that tells us something important?

There are degrees of satisfactory. ;-)

--
*Despite the cost of living, have you noticed how it remains so popular?*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Wed, 22 Jun 2011 09:09:09 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

The OP does say, "Analogue channels 1 to 5 all currently perfectly

satisfactory". Surely that tells us something important?

That analogue is on higher power?

But digits don't require as much power for an acceptable signal...

TBH the monkeys that came in to do this work haven't a clue and the
company that they are employed by should be contacted and dragged
back to do the work properly. Why should this old gent spend his cash
on a new telly when one is not required. There is plenty of money
sloshy about in the DSO fund for this sort of thing to be done and
not line the pockets of cowboys.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Tue, 21 Jun 2011 19:07:11 -0700 (PDT), jgharston
wrote:

DerbyBoy wrote:
Is the TV properly tuned into the output of the Set Top Box?

Err... that's irrelevant. You either get a nice sharp picture of
lots of square blocks breaking up, or a fuzzy picture of lots of
square blocks breaking up. How well the *TV* is tuned in to the
decoder makes no difference to how well the *decoder* is receiving
the signal.

If the transmitter is close and in direct line of sight maybe the
signal is too strong. An attenuator would help in that case.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) Due to the amount of spam posted via googlegroups and
(")_(") their inaction to the problem. I am blocking some articles
posted from there. If you wish your postings to be seen by
everyone you will need use a different method of posting.

John Rumm wrote:
TBH the monkeys that came in to do this work haven't a clue and the
Indeed.

His carer came around this morning and is now arguing with his
social worker (my former colleague) and saying that he needs to
get a new TV because that will solve the problem of the digital
picture breaking up....

JGH

On Jun 22, 3:07*am, jgharston wrote:
DerbyBoy wrote:
Is the TV properly tuned into the output of the Set Top Box?

Err... that's irrelevant. You either get a nice sharp picture of
lots of square blocks breaking up, or a fuzzy picture of lots of
square blocks breaking up. How well the *TV* is tuned in to the
decoder makes no difference to how well the *decoder* is receiving
the signal.

JGH

I agree - but I didn't see any reference to performing this tuning. If
it is a sharp picture of lots of squares then this has been done - did
the OP select (say) Channel 6 on the tuner and fine tune it. This
cannot be disregarded. But your comments do stand. Descriptions of a
poor picture and sound are not always totally descriptive.

DerbyBorn wrote:
I agree - but I didn't see any reference to performing this tuning. If
it is a sharp picture of lots of squares then this has been done - did

Sorry, I thought I'd implied that in the OP. I tuned preset 8 into
the STB installation page and got a nice crisp steady image. I
set it autotuning and it found 16 channels. When selecting them
I got a nice crisp steady image of lots of digital squares breaking
up and the sound stuttering.

Phoned the Digital people earlier, installing a new outdoor aerial
where one does not previous exist is covered, so Ken's got the
option of a replacement indoor aerial or a new outdoor aerial.

JGH

"jgharston" wrote in message
...
DerbyBorn wrote:
I agree - but I didn't see any reference to performing this tuning. If
it is a sharp picture of lots of squares then this has been done - did

Sorry, I thought I'd implied that in the OP. I tuned preset 8 into
the STB installation page and got a nice crisp steady image. I
set it autotuning and it found 16 channels. When selecting them
I got a nice crisp steady image of lots of digital squares breaking
up and the sound stuttering.

Phoned the Digital people earlier, installing a new outdoor aerial
where one does not previous exist is covered, so Ken's got the
option of a replacement indoor aerial or a new outdoor aerial.

If he is willing to pay a small extra charge I believe the switchover people
will even fit free sat for about £20, probably a better choice.

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember jgharston
saying something like:

His carer came around this morning and is now arguing with his
social worker (my former colleague) and saying that he needs to
get a new TV because that will solve the problem of the digital
picture breaking up....

The carer knows just enough to be dangerous.

On 21/06/11 11:57, jgharston wrote:
A collegue from my Council days contacted me yesterday.
She's got an elderly client, analogue TV about to be turned
off, Free Digibox men came around to give him a set-top
box.

Oh no, mate. You need a new TV mate. Can't plug this in
mate, waving a SCART plug at him.

No, he just needs a UHF aerial lead, just like my TV, I showed
her. Here, have a spare lead, I can pop around and plug it in
for him.

Working now, but he's got a crappy little indoor aerial and the
digital pictures and sound break up. He hasn't got an outdoor
aerial. What indoor aerial would people recommend. He's
got line of sight to Crosspool transmitter about 3 miles
away which his analogue channels are currently tuned in to.


You might be better off asking in uk.tech.digital-tv

Thanks for the advice from everybody, I'm currently waiting
for Digital Help Scheme to get back to me to arrange
an aerial installation.

JGH

jgharston wrote:
Thanks for the advice from everybody, I'm currently waiting
for Digital Help Scheme to get back to me to arrange
an aerial installation.

They've replied and said that as Ken's receiving 16 channels
he's not entitled to an aerial installation. Makes no
difference that the channels he receives are constantly
breaking up into square boxes and the sound stutters
constantly, the box has found 16 channels, end of argument.

JGH

jgharston wrote:
Thanks for the advice from everybody, I'm currently waiting
for Digital Help Scheme to get back to me to arrange
an aerial installation.

They got back to me and said he doesn't qualify for an aerial:
"only when signal is not reliable on terrestrial TV channels
(BBC1 – Channel 5) will an engineer consider replacing an aerial"

His social worker has spoken to them saying that yes, the analogue
channels are ok, but all the channels the digital box can find...

Oh, it can find the channels, you don't qualify for an aerial.

No, yes, it can find the channels, but they're all breaking
up into little squares the sound is a continuous suttering.

No, you don't qualify for an aerial.

So, will have to go back to them in September when terrestial
TV channels will be nonexistant and see if the digital signal
is any better.

JGH

In article
,
jgharston wrote:
jgharston wrote:
Thanks for the advice from everybody, I'm currently waiting
for Digital Help Scheme to get back to me to arrange
an aerial installation.

They got back to me and said he doesn't qualify for an aerial:
"only when signal is not reliable on terrestrial TV channels
(BBC1 " Channel 5) will an engineer consider replacing an aerial"

His social worker has spoken to them saying that yes, the analogue
channels are ok, but all the channels the digital box can find...

Oh, it can find the channels, you don't qualify for an aerial.

No, yes, it can find the channels, but they're all breaking
up into little squares the sound is a continuous suttering.

No, you don't qualify for an aerial.

So, will have to go back to them in September when terrestial
TV channels will be nonexistant and see if the digital signal
is any better.

Alternatively, the social worker should ask whoever is telling them this to
give the name and contact for their manager or whoever is responsible for
resolving such a failure by the 'Digital Help sic Scheme'. Failing that,
a trip to the local MP surgery may invoke a letter that will awaken the
innocents involved. Alternatively, ask the local CAB to help unblock the
relevant pipe of compentence. The clues here may be in the name of the
'Scheme'...

Slainte,

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

In article
s.com, jgharston scribeth thus
jgharston wrote:
Thanks for the advice from everybody, I'm currently waiting
for Digital Help Scheme to get back to me to arrange
an aerial installation.

They've replied and said that as Ken's receiving 16 channels
he's not entitled to an aerial installation. Makes no
difference that the channels he receives are constantly
breaking up into square boxes and the sound stutters
constantly, the box has found 16 channels, end of argument.

JGH

Jeezzz don't some real clueless prats get involved in these things!..


--
Tony Sayer

On Saturday, June 25th, 2011 at 11:20:09h +0100, Tony Sayer wrote:

In article
s.com, jgharston scribeth thus
They've replied and said that as Ken's receiving 16 channels he's not
entitled to an aerial installation. Makes no difference that the
channels he receives are constantly breaking up into square boxes and
the sound stutters constantly, the box has found 16 channels, end of
argument.

JGH

don't some real clueless prats get involved in these things!..

Err no. You do not seem to understand that if they do an installation
of an antenna that will severely impact the profit that they are making.

So a truly clued up person will supply a pretty good excuse as to
why they are not obligated to install an antenna.

Remember the employees of the company providing the digital help scheme
have to answer to their managers who want their bonuses and of course
to the stockholders who want the maximum return on their investment.

tony sayer wrote:
In article
s.com, jgharston scribeth thus
jgharston wrote:
Thanks for the advice from everybody, I'm currently waiting
for Digital Help Scheme to get back to me to arrange
an aerial installation.
They've replied and said that as Ken's receiving 16 channels
he's not entitled to an aerial installation. Makes no
difference that the channels he receives are constantly
breaking up into square boxes and the sound stutters
constantly, the box has found 16 channels, end of argument.

JGH

Jeezzz don't some real clueless prats get involved in these things!..


All these schemes (Channel Four, Channel Five, OnDigital, now Digital
UK) used or use subcontractors and the quality is extremely variable. At
present we are having many difficulties with our social housing
contracts. People are going in and handing out some ludicrously bad
advice, and also slagging off our systems unjustifiably.

Bill

"jgharston" wrote in message
...
jgharston wrote:
Thanks for the advice from everybody, I'm currently waiting
for Digital Help Scheme to get back to me to arrange
an aerial installation.

They've replied and said that as Ken's receiving 16 channels
he's not entitled to an aerial installation. Makes no
difference that the channels he receives are constantly
breaking up into square boxes and the sound stutters
constantly, the box has found 16 channels, end of argument.

JGH



One of the things that they rely upon heavily is that Tx power is
going up considerably at DSO - Crosspool goes from the current
50W to 1KW which will give a signal voltage increase of something
over 4 times which ought to clear the pixelation.

However you do have a claim against the Digital Help Scheme as to
say that if you can receive three muxes it is enough is not
acceptable when the Tx you are using is radiating six!
Furthermore three of the six muxes are and will be in aerial
group B where existing analogue transmissions are in group A, so
a wideband aerial will become mandatory.

You say that Ken has line of sight to Crosspool but from which
direction? Crosspool has directional signals to avoid
interference from other sites. Maybe he should be using a
different transmitter?


--
Woody

harrogate three at ntlworld dot com

On Sat, 25 Jun 2011 11:21:05 -0700 (PDT), Owain
wrote:

However the Freeview isn't as good after analogue switch-off as
before.

Why not?
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) Due to the amount of spam posted via googlegroups and
(")_(") their inaction to the problem. I am blocking some articles
posted from there. If you wish your postings to be seen by
everyone you will need use a different method of posting.

Woody wrote:
You say that Ken has line of sight to Crosspool but from which
direction? Crosspool has directional signals to avoid
interference from other sites. Maybe he should be using a
different transmitter?

Without giving away personal details, his flat is on the south
side of his block with a line of sight west-south-west straight
up Upperthorpe (not Upperthorpe Road, the road called Upperthorpe)
towards Crosspool, 1.5m Google Walking distance.

Failing that, a trip to the local MP surgery may invoke a letter

People keep coming to me with these things because I used to be
the local councillor and "Jonathan knows TV things" having been
a Channel 5 retuner doing the jobs too complicated for the
swathes of electricians and decorators that made up the majority
of the retuners back then.

JGH

Woody wrote:
You say that Ken has line of sight to Crosspool but from which
direction? Crosspool has directional signals to avoid
interference from other sites. Maybe he should be using a
different transmitter?

Odd. I replied to this this morning.

His flat is on the south side of his building with a direct
line of sight straight up Upperthorpe (not Upperthorpe Road,
the road called Upperthorpe) in a west-south-west direction
directly towards Crosspool, about 1.5 miles Google Walking
distance.

Jim wrote:
Failing that, a trip to the local MP surgery may invoke

People keep coming to me because I was one of their local
councillors until a year ago, and because I did Channel 5
retuning work 15 years ago "Jonathan knows TV".

JGH

"jgharston" wrote in message
...
Woody wrote:
You say that Ken has line of sight to Crosspool but from which
direction? Crosspool has directional signals to avoid
interference from other sites. Maybe he should be using a
different transmitter?

Odd. I replied to this this morning.

His flat is on the south side of his building with a direct
line of sight straight up Upperthorpe (not Upperthorpe Road,
the road called Upperthorpe) in a west-south-west direction
directly towards Crosspool, about 1.5 miles Google Walking
distance.

Jim wrote:
Failing that, a trip to the local MP surgery may invoke

People keep coming to me because I was one of their local
councillors until a year ago, and because I did Channel 5
retuning work 15 years ago "Jonathan knows TV".

JGH

Sorry for highjacking the thread a little.

I was born in Jessop's and used to live at 46 Sherde Road. Upperthorpe was
my growing up ground. Then we went to live at Intake. Once married, we lived
at Crookes. Now living in County Durham.
Such a pleasant surprise to see someone on the news groups from somewhere I
know so well.
Jim

jgharston wrote...

Odd. I replied to this this morning.

Google groups have been having problems, resolved today according to:
http://goo.gl/GVUAv

--
Ken O'Meara
http://www.btinternet.com/~unsteadyken/