Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?


--
geoff

On May 15, 6:06*pm, geoff wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

--
geoff

you couldtry cleanig the **** of it after you use it
Smoe people live like ****en pigs

On Sun, 15 May 2011 18:06:17 +0100, geoff wrote:



Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

Angle grinder, of course...

--
Frank Erskine

On May 15, 6:06*pm, geoff wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

--
geoff

Harpic?

geoff wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

You could try washing it with chas' head. I doubt it would work but it's a
plan with no drawbacks.

--
Adam

geoff wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

Alternate, heavy, prolonged doses of bleach and limescale remover, with
several flushes and a good brushing in-between.

On May 15, 6:06*pm, geoff wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

The glaze is glass, which doesnt discolour. Either there's something
on the surface, or its so badly scratched its looking lighter due to
light scattering. Surface muck is effectively removed with 97%
sulphuric acid - but do treat it with real respect.


NT

In message
,
chas writes
On May 15, 6:06*pm, geoff wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

--
geoff

you couldtry cleanig the **** of it after you use it
Smoe people live like ****en pigs


You could always come back when you've developed a basic understanding
of the english language

If you don't understand the meaning of "rejuvinating the enamel", leave
such grammatically advanced concepts to those that do

now **** off


--
geoff

In message , ARWadsworth
writes
geoff wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

You could try washing it with chas' head. I doubt it would work but it's a
plan with no drawbacks.

I think that the tenants would complain that the bowl was blocked with
****


--
geoff

In message
,
Tabby writes
On May 15, 6:06*pm, geoff wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

The glaze is glass, which doesnt discolour. Either there's something
on the surface, or its so badly scratched its looking lighter due to
light scattering. Surface muck is effectively removed with 97%
sulphuric acid - but do treat it with real respect.


No, it's the ceramic under the glaze, which is why I was wondering, on
the off chance, that there was some technique I was unaware of


--
geoff

geoff wrote:


Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?


caustic soda

On 15/05/2011 20:25, Tabby wrote:
On May 15, 6:06 pm, wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

The glaze is glass, which doesnt discolour. Either there's something
on the surface, or its so badly scratched its looking lighter due to
light scattering. Surface muck is effectively removed with 97%
sulphuric acid - but do treat it with real respect.


NT

That can also damage the glaze. Use Harpic more than once.


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

geoff wrote:
In message
,
Tabby writes
On May 15, 6:06 pm, geoff wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

The glaze is glass, which doesnt discolour. Either there's something
on the surface, or its so badly scratched its looking lighter due to
light scattering. Surface muck is effectively removed with 97%
sulphuric acid - but do treat it with real respect.


No, it's the ceramic under the glaze, which is why I was wondering, on
the off chance, that there was some technique I was unaware of


caustic soda

geoff wrote:
In message
,
Tabby writes
On May 15, 6:06 pm, geoff wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

The glaze is glass, which doesnt discolour. Either there's something
on the surface, or its so badly scratched its looking lighter due to
light scattering. Surface muck is effectively removed with 97%
sulphuric acid - but do treat it with real respect.


No, it's the ceramic under the glaze, which is why I was wondering, on
the off chance, that there was some technique I was unaware of

Perhaps I'm being thick here, but what's going to penetrate the glaze
without removing it, in order to clean the ceramic?

In message , The Natural Philosopher
writes
geoff wrote:
In message
,
Tabby writes
On May 15, 6:06 pm, geoff wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

The glaze is glass, which doesnt discolour. Either there's something
on the surface, or its so badly scratched its looking lighter due to
light scattering. Surface muck is effectively removed with 97%
sulphuric acid - but do treat it with real respect.

No, it's the ceramic under the glaze, which is why I was wondering,
on the off chance, that there was some technique I was unaware of

caustic soda

I've got 20 kilos of that sitting around absorbing moisture - I'll give
it a shot

--
geoff

Fredxx wrote:
geoff wrote:
In message
,
Tabby writes
On May 15, 6:06 pm, geoff wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?
The glaze is glass, which doesnt discolour. Either there's something
on the surface, or its so badly scratched its looking lighter due to
light scattering. Surface muck is effectively removed with 97%
sulphuric acid - but do treat it with real respect.

No, it's the ceramic under the glaze, which is why I was wondering, on
the off chance, that there was some technique I was unaware of

Perhaps I'm being thick here, but what's going to penetrate the glaze
without removing it, in order to clean the ceramic?



the same thing that got the stain in the first place.

water

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
geoff wrote:


Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?


caustic soda


I've found barkeepers friend to be very good.!

In message , polly
filler writes

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
geoff wrote:


Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?


caustic soda


I've found barkeepers friend to be very good.!


I'll try it if caustic soda doesn't work, ta


--
geoff

On Sun, 15 May 2011 18:06:17 +0100, geoff wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

Only if it's got scale on it and you can etch that off. (I heard of on chap that
plugged the siphon, put citric acid in, and shoved an immersion heater in --a
"Tauchsieder"-- and gave it a good boil and it came up new... Cuppa tea? No?)

If it's the old enamel that's sensitive to acid, or it's enamel or porcelain
rough with age and scouring with Vim, you don't have a chance, or not much of
one. I had a man in who said he could polish up our old acid-etched bathtub, but
it didn't do enough to be worth the trouble or quoted expense. He used an angle
grinder (you knew it was coming, right?) with a Scotchbrite-style pad, something
he called enamel powder liberally as an abrasive, and an acidic cleaner (mostly
phosphoric acid, AFAIK), all at the same time. Oh, and ear defenders. And he
didn't charge anywhere near the quted cost, at the result wasn't what he and I
had hoped for. (He also said he'd tried all the car polish/wax tricks, and they
weren't more that temporary fixes).


Thomas Prufer

On Sun, 15 May 2011 18:06:17 +0100, geoff wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?


I threw the pan from the house my son bought last autumn because we were
unable to remove heavy staining and limescale from the bottom of the trap.
It laid among a load of other detritus pending a trip to the tip with the
trailer right through the winter. When I did get around to dumping it, it
was clean!
It seems the winter frosts had dislodged whole sheets of limescale and other
muck.

Mike

Tabby wrote:

On May 15, 6:06 pm, geoff wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

The glaze is glass, which doesnt discolour. Either there's something
on the surface, or its so badly scratched its looking lighter due to
light scattering. Surface muck is effectively removed with 97%
sulphuric acid - but do treat it with real respect.


NT


97%? Bit extreme!

A trick my old man did was to take a balloon, fit to a bit of hose,insert
baloon round u-bend and inflate - then pinch off the hose.

Now fill the bowl to the rim with water make up to dilute strength (5%)
with an acid of your choice (he used some left over CH descaler). Leave
overnight, deflate baloon, rinse. Water is in constant contact so conc acid
not necessary. I'd use HCl personally - chloride salts are generally more
soluable than sulphates so more chance of the dissolved stuff staying
dissolved.

--
Tim Watts

On 16/05/2011 08:31, MuddyMike wrote:
On Sun, 15 May 2011 18:06:17 +0100, wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?


I threw the pan from the house my son bought last autumn because we were
unable to remove heavy staining and limescale from the bottom of the trap.
It laid among a load of other detritus pending a trip to the tip with the
trailer right through the winter. When I did get around to dumping it, it
was clean!
It seems the winter frosts had dislodged whole sheets of limescale and other
muck.

Mike


Block it up with a bunch of plastic bags, fill to the rim, and drop a
couple of packs of kettle descaler in. Only problem is, you need to
leave it overnight. IME the time it takes to work is not related to the
strength of the acid, so no point in messing with sulphuric or
hydrochloric. IIRC limescale is soluble at PH4 or less so a mild acid is
all that's required. It's not clear to me why caustic soda would have
any effect.

stuart noble wrote:
On 16/05/2011 08:31, MuddyMike wrote:
On Sun, 15 May 2011 18:06:17 +0100, wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?


I threw the pan from the house my son bought last autumn because we
were unable to remove heavy staining and limescale from the bottom
of the trap. It laid among a load of other detritus pending a trip
to the tip with the trailer right through the winter. When I did get
around to dumping it, it was clean!
It seems the winter frosts had dislodged whole sheets of limescale
and other muck.

Mike


Block it up with a bunch of plastic bags, fill to the rim, and drop a
couple of packs of kettle descaler in. Only problem is, you need to
leave it overnight. IME the time it takes to work is not related to
the strength of the acid, so no point in messing with sulphuric or
hydrochloric. IIRC limescale is soluble at PH4 or less so a mild acid
is all that's required. It's not clear to me why caustic soda would
have any effect.

I guess caustic soda would dissolve the glass below and the limescale would
then just lift-off.

On May 15, 8:25*pm, Tabby wrote:
On May 15, 6:06*pm, geoff wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

The glaze is glass, which doesnt discolour. Either there's something
on the surface, or its so badly scratched its looking lighter due to
light scattering. Surface muck is effectively removed with 97%
sulphuric acid - but do treat it with real respect.

NT

Glaze isn't glass. Glaze is composed of clay and metallic oxides,
which vary according to the desired colour. Fired, it provides an
impervious decorative finish. Porcelain santaryware is glazed with a
white porcelain glaze.

Cheers
Richard

"Thomas Prufer" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 15 May 2011 18:06:17 +0100, geoff wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

Only if it's got scale on it and you can etch that off. (I heard of on
chap that
plugged the siphon, put citric acid in, and shoved an immersion heater
in --a
"Tauchsieder"-- and gave it a good boil and it came up new... Cuppa tea?
No?)

If it's the old enamel that's sensitive to acid, or it's enamel or
porcelain
rough with age and scouring with Vim, you don't have a chance, or not much
of
one. I had a man in who said he could polish up our old acid-etched
bathtub, but
it didn't do enough to be worth the trouble or quoted expense. He used an
angle
grinder (you knew it was coming, right?) with a Scotchbrite-style pad,
something
he called enamel powder liberally as an abrasive, and an acidic cleaner
(mostly
phosphoric acid, AFAIK), all at the same time. Oh, and ear defenders. And
he
didn't charge anywhere near the quted cost, at the result wasn't what he
and I
had hoped for. (He also said he'd tried all the car polish/wax tricks, and
they
weren't more that temporary fixes).


Thomas Prufer

Another good fix is full strength Coca Cola, leave it to soak overnight,
works wonders

On 16/05/2011 09:58, stuart noble wrote:
On 16/05/2011 08:31, MuddyMike wrote:
On Sun, 15 May 2011 18:06:17 +0100, wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?


I threw the pan from the house my son bought last autumn because we were
unable to remove heavy staining and limescale from the bottom of the
trap.
It laid among a load of other detritus pending a trip to the tip with the
trailer right through the winter. When I did get around to dumping it, it
was clean!
It seems the winter frosts had dislodged whole sheets of limescale and
other
muck.


There's the answer then. Place in the freezer for 3 months, next to the
fish fingers.... sorted.

In article , geoff
writes


Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

Dunno, but someone once told me that those tablets that denture wearers
use to clean them (Steradent? or similar) makes the bowl sparkling.
Chuck one in and leave overnight. Kill two birds with one stone and pop
your gnashers in too, but don't flush if you go for a midnight pee.

--
Mike Tomlinson

In message , stuart noble
writes
On 16/05/2011 08:31, MuddyMike wrote:
On Sun, 15 May 2011 18:06:17 +0100, wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?


I threw the pan from the house my son bought last autumn because we were
unable to remove heavy staining and limescale from the bottom of the trap.
It laid among a load of other detritus pending a trip to the tip with the
trailer right through the winter. When I did get around to dumping it, it
was clean!
It seems the winter frosts had dislodged whole sheets of limescale and other
muck.

Mike


Block it up with a bunch of plastic bags, fill to the rim, and drop a
couple of packs of kettle descaler in. Only problem is, you need to
leave it overnight. IME the time it takes to work is not related to the
strength of the acid, so no point in messing with sulphuric or
hydrochloric. IIRC limescale is soluble at PH4 or less so a mild acid
is all that's required. It's not clear to me why caustic soda would
have any effect.

I'll try both - I've got some phosphoric acid lying about, that'll do
(as long as it doesn't start removing the glaze)

got some NaOH which is thick as treacle so I'll try that later

(or should I just lob it in on top and run ?)

--
geoff

In message , Thomas Prufer
writes
On Sun, 15 May 2011 18:06:17 +0100, geoff wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

Only if it's got scale on it and you can etch that off. (I heard of on
chap that
plugged the siphon, put citric acid in, and shoved an immersion heater in --a
"Tauchsieder"--

Oh please, no

You'll get MM Kylix going again


--
geoff

In message , polly
filler writes

"Thomas Prufer" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 15 May 2011 18:06:17 +0100, geoff wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

Only if it's got scale on it and you can etch that off. (I heard of on
chap that
plugged the siphon, put citric acid in, and shoved an immersion heater
in --a
"Tauchsieder"-- and gave it a good boil and it came up new... Cuppa tea?
No?)

If it's the old enamel that's sensitive to acid, or it's enamel or
porcelain
rough with age and scouring with Vim, you don't have a chance, or not much
of
one. I had a man in who said he could polish up our old acid-etched
bathtub, but
it didn't do enough to be worth the trouble or quoted expense. He used an
angle
grinder (you knew it was coming, right?) with a Scotchbrite-style pad,
something
he called enamel powder liberally as an abrasive, and an acidic cleaner
(mostly
phosphoric acid, AFAIK), all at the same time. Oh, and ear defenders. And
he
didn't charge anywhere near the quted cost, at the result wasn't what he
and I
had hoped for. (He also said he'd tried all the car polish/wax tricks, and
they
weren't more that temporary fixes).


Thomas Prufer

Another good fix is full strength Coca Cola, leave it to soak overnight,
works wonders


That's only very dilute phosphoric acid at best

I have the real thing here (and coke, it ain't)


--
geoff

In message , Thomas Prufer
writes
On Sun, 15 May 2011 18:06:17 +0100, geoff wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

Only if it's got scale on it and you can etch that off. (I heard of on
chap that
plugged the siphon, put citric acid in, and shoved an immersion heater in --a
"Tauchsieder"--

Ich lieber gern ein siedler tauchen

ha ha

(yes, it's meant to be bad grammar)

--
geoff

On May 15, 8:47*pm, geoff wrote:
In message
,
chas writes

On May 15, 6:06*pm, geoff wrote:
Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

--
geoff

you couldtry cleanig the **** of it after you use it
Smoe people live like ****en pigs

You could always come back when you've developed a basic understanding
of the *english language

If you don't understand the meaning of "rejuvinating the enamel",

That's "rejuvenate".

leave
such grammatically advanced concepts to those that do

now **** off

Your welcome.

MBQ

On May 16, 3:51*pm, "polly filler" wrote:
"Thomas Prufer" wrote in message

...









On Sun, 15 May 2011 18:06:17 +0100, geoff wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

Only if it's got scale on it and you can etch that off. (I heard of on
chap that
plugged the siphon, put citric acid in, and shoved an immersion heater
in --a
"Tauchsieder"-- and gave it a good boil and it came up new... Cuppa tea?
No?)

If it's the old enamel that's sensitive to acid, or it's enamel or
porcelain
rough with age and scouring with Vim, you don't have a chance, or not much
of
one. I had a man in who said he could polish up our old acid-etched
bathtub, but
it didn't do enough to be worth the trouble or quoted expense. He used an
angle
grinder (you knew it was coming, right?) with a Scotchbrite-style pad,
something
he called enamel powder liberally as an abrasive, and an acidic cleaner
(mostly
phosphoric acid, AFAIK), all at the same time. Oh, and ear defenders. And
he
didn't charge anywhere near the quted cost, at the result wasn't what he
and I
had hoped for. (He also said he'd tried all the car polish/wax tricks, and
they
weren't more that temporary fixes).

Thomas Prufer

Another good fix is full strength Coca Cola, leave it to soak overnight,
works wonders

Unless you are a real tight wad, just buy toilet limescale remover
that is designed for, and does, the job.

MBQ

On 16 May, 18:29, Chris Hogg wrote:
On Mon, 16 May 2011 07:39:41 -0700 (PDT), geraldthehamster





wrote:
On May 15, 8:25*pm, Tabby wrote:
On May 15, 6:06*pm, geoff wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

The glaze is glass, which doesnt discolour. Either there's something
on the surface, or its so badly scratched its looking lighter due to
light scattering. Surface muck is effectively removed with 97%
sulphuric acid - but do treat it with real respect.

NT

Glaze isn't glass. Glaze is composed of clay and metallic oxides,
which vary according to the desired colour. Fired, it provides an
impervious decorative finish. Porcelain santaryware is glazed with a
white porcelain glaze.

Glaze _is_ glass, or at least a type of glass, although not like
window glass or tableware glass. A sanitaryware glaze is usually made
up of quartz and feldspar, with lesser amounts of some or all of
whiting, zinc oxide, talc, barium carbonate, china clay, and sometimes
a borax frit. Opacifiers are usually added: zircon (zirconium
silicate) if the glaze is plain white, or complex pigments if it's
coloured. The pigments do not dissolve in the molten glaze when it's
fired, so the structure is that of a glass containing undissolved
pigments.

--

Chris- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I don't disagree; in a sense glaze is a type of glass, just as glass
is itself a ceramic ;-). But it's not glass in the sense that seemed
to be assumed - a clear coating with the pigment in the "ceramic"
behind it.

Cheers
Richard

In article ,
geoff writes:


Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

The debris tends to be a mixture of limescale, with embedded organic
matter for colouring.

Brick acid (Hydrochloric) is excellent at dissolving limescale at even
quite weak dilutions (a few splashes into the U-trap water will sort out
a loo which isn't too bad). The organic matter simply comes free when the
limescale is gone - literally one wipe with the toilet brush after it's
been standing for a while, and it's as good as new.

You shouldn't use brick acid regularly as it may attack cast iron drains,
mortar joints, etc. Also, don't use it on an antique Victorian crapper,
but on a reasonably modern pan with undamaged glaze, it should be fine.
Flush several times to clear out pipework.
(Don't use it on enameled baths though - it will wreck the polished finish,
making the surface much harder to keep clean.)

With some weaker proprietry descalers, they seem not to work through the
organic matter, so you only remove the top layer of limescale and it
doesn't get any further. Bleach is good at temporarily making the organic
matter invisible, but much less effective at removing it. If you use a weak
descaler, you may need to alternate with something to tackle the organic
matter. Washing machine or dishwasher detergent (powder or liquid) work
very well for this, particularly if heated. Caustic soda is rather OTT.
In any event, don't use one cleaner after another without completely
flushing the first from the pan and sewer pipework.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

In message
, Man
at B&Q writes


If you don't understand the meaning of "rejuvinating the enamel",

That's "rejuvenate".



You know what?

You're correct - Skitt's law, eh?

--
geoff

In message , Mike Tomlinson
writes
En el artículo
roups.com, Man at B&Q escribió:

That's "rejuvenate".

leave
such grammatically advanced concepts to those that do

now **** off

Your welcome.

That's "You're".

You're welcome.


Isn't Skitt's Law wonderful


--
geoff

In message
,
geraldthehamster writes
On 16 May, 18:29, Chris Hogg wrote:
On Mon, 16 May 2011 07:39:41 -0700 (PDT), geraldthehamster





wrote:
On May 15, 8:25*pm, Tabby wrote:
On May 15, 6:06*pm, geoff wrote:

Is there any realistic way of "rejuvinating" the enamel of a toilet?

The glaze is glass, which doesnt discolour. Either there's something
on the surface, or its so badly scratched its looking lighter due to
light scattering. Surface muck is effectively removed with 97%
sulphuric acid - but do treat it with real respect.

NT

Glaze isn't glass. Glaze is composed of clay and metallic oxides,
which vary according to the desired colour. Fired, it provides an
impervious decorative finish. Porcelain santaryware is glazed with a
white porcelain glaze.

Glaze _is_ glass, or at least a type of glass, although not like
window glass or tableware glass. A sanitaryware glaze is usually made
up of quartz and feldspar, with lesser amounts of some or all of
whiting, zinc oxide, talc, barium carbonate, china clay, and sometimes
a borax frit. Opacifiers are usually added: zircon (zirconium
silicate) if the glaze is plain white, or complex pigments if it's
coloured. The pigments do not dissolve in the molten glaze when it's
fired, so the structure is that of a glass containing undissolved
pigments.

--

Chris- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I don't disagree; in a sense glaze is a type of glass, just as glass
is itself a ceramic ;-). But it's not glass in the sense that seemed
to be assumed - a clear coating with the pigment in the "ceramic"
behind it.

I think that this is all getting just a bit intense for a poor old
crapper coating


--
geoff