Mother's old creda standalone fan oven cooker is on its way out.
A top model for its time re solarglo grill & hob, fan oven, catalytic
liners.
However 16yrs old it has rusted holes, various screws near the bottom
have fallen out from perforation, rust blisters all over the doors,
sides, front & hob rear (fortunately it is brown so they blend in!).
The top fan is grinding not just resonating. The oven fan is shrieking
like a banshee. Door seal is on the way out.

Quite a lot to repair, replace - particularly at her age. Then there
is the cooker :-)

Current alternatives seem dire in quality from play-n-twiddles despite
high prices.

Bosch 2009 standalone cookers (B) are not actually fan ovens, they are
"2D" airflow.
Bosch 2010 standalone cookers (A) are fan ovens, with "3D" airflow.

One big factor in price is the lining - oxylitic adds about £80-90.
Pyrolitic is the 480oC stuff from Miele/Bosch that DOES work at a huge
premium.

Are oxylitic linings worth it - £520 becomes £635, that's £115 off a
better washer?

On Apr 11, 11:05*pm, Colin Harper wrote:
I think they work. We have oxylytic on the top and back only. They are
noticeably cleaner than the sides. Wish we'd gone for all round linings but
there you go. Still, the back and especially top are the hardest to clean,
and the top gets dirtiest, so perhaps it's not all bad.

Thanks, will telephone Bosch and see where the linings are.

The 2009 Bosch cookers had them top, rear & sides.
The old Creda has them rear & sides - but not top bizarrely.

js.b1 wrote:


Current alternatives seem dire in quality from play-n-twiddles despite
high prices.

We've had several Bosch cookers over the years, all with the Bosch
catalytic liners, which they brand as oxylitic. They have been good, but
I'm not sure if they are suitable for someone old to use. This holds
true for all catalytic liners.

To clean the oven it must be run empty at a high temperature from time
to time. Is your mother likely to do this? Bear in mind that when the
oven is run hot to clean it, it smokes quite heavily. It's better if the
installation has a proper extractor hood which vents externally (i.e.
not a recirculating cooker hood).

The other brand that we have been happy with is Baumatic. It's built in
Italy despite the slightly Germanic sounding name but the quality is
good. The negative with Baumatic is that very few models have catalytic
liners available. The positive is that they are well built and
relatively cheap.

On Apr 12, 7:33*am, (Steve Firth) wrote:

We've had several Bosch cookers over the years, all with the Bosch

I dont know whether you mean at the same property, if so that would be
pretty damning. Hopefully not though.


NT

On Apr 12, 7:33*am, (Steve Firth) wrote:
js.b1 wrote:
Current alternatives seem dire in quality from play-n-twiddles despite
high prices.

We've had several Bosch cookers over the years, all with the Bosch
catalytic liners, which they brand as oxylitic. They have been good, but
I'm not sure if they are suitable for someone old to use. This holds
true for all catalytic liners.
To clean the oven it must be run empty at a high temperature from time
to time. Is your mother likely to do this? Bear in mind that when the
oven is run hot to clean it, it smokes quite heavily. It's better if the
installation has a proper extractor hood which vents externally (i.e.
not a recirculating cooker hood).

The existing cooker cleans by the same method, empty, 2hrs on max.
Cooker hood is extractive so not a problem there, fortunately.

The other brand that we have been happy with is Baumatic. It's built in
Italy despite the slightly Germanic sounding name but the quality is
good. The negative with Baumatic is that very few models have catalytic
liners available. The positive is that they are well built and
relatively cheap.

Will look, it needs to be standalone electric.

A "novel" thing about Bosch is door-shut grill, no pan-handle-tray.
That ironically could be quite useful, if not she gets a toaster :-)

One big downside is most grills seem to be "MICS element", the
Creda has a Solarglo grill which is much faster. I know this because
I bought the parts list to upgrade from "MICS" to "Solarglo". So I
think a toaster will be due anyway re warm up time.

One big downside is most grills seem to be "MICS element", the
Creda has a Solarglo grill which is much faster. I know this because
I bought the parts list to upgrade from "MICS" to "Solarglo". So I
think a toaster will be due anyway re warm up time.


As heat rises I have thought that toasters are more efficient anyway.

Cheese on toast - I pop it into the microwave for 30 seconds to melt the
cheese. Not quite the same - but not bad.

John wrote:

As heat rises I have thought that toasters are more efficient anyway.

Well, hot air rises but toasting bread needs radiant heat which isn't
interested in up or down so that doesn't affect efficiency. On the other
hand the elements of the average toaster heat up quicker than a grill so
there's an energy saving there.

--
Mike Clarke

NT wrote:

On Apr 12, 7:33 am, (Steve Firth) wrote:

We've had several Bosch cookers over the years, all with the Bosch

I dont know whether you mean at the same property, if so that would be
pretty damning. Hopefully not though.

No, we moved house a few times and my wife had a Bosch discount via
work.

js.b1 wrote:

A "novel" thing about Bosch is door-shut grill, no pan-handle-tray.
That ironically could be quite useful, if not she gets a toaster :-)

Bit here and there that feature. It's a grill pan with a handle that
detaches. If it's still the same design it's NBG for people with
arthritis or rheumatism. Has to be tried to be appreciated.

On Apr 12, 10:11*pm, (Steve Firth) wrote:
js.b1 wrote:
A "novel" thing about Bosch is door-shut grill, no pan-handle-tray.
That ironically could be quite useful, if not she gets a toaster :-)

Bit here and there that feature. It's a grill pan with a handle that
detaches. If it's still the same design it's NBG for people with
arthritis or rheumatism. Has to be tried to be appreciated.

Bosch described it as a tray - anything can be put under the grill.
They did not mention a detachable handle or similar "apparatus" :-)

So in that respect it is like handling any oven tray, I think.

js.b1 wrote:

On Apr 12, 10:11 pm, (Steve Firth) wrote:
js.b1 wrote:
A "novel" thing about Bosch is door-shut grill, no pan-handle-tray.
That ironically could be quite useful, if not she gets a toaster :-)

Bit here and there that feature. It's a grill pan with a handle that
detaches. If it's still the same design it's NBG for people with
arthritis or rheumatism. Has to be tried to be appreciated.

Bosch described it as a tray - anything can be put under the grill.
They did not mention a detachable handle or similar "apparatus" :-)

So in that respect it is like handling any oven tray, I think.

Yes, that sounds like the one. You have to consider how the tray is to
be removed from the oven. Ours came with a bizarre two-handled
contraption that slots over one edge of the tray and can then be used to
lift it. But it needs two hands, the tray is enamelled steel and very
heavy and the handle isn't secured to the tray in any way other than
clipping onto one long edge.

On Apr 12, 11:46*pm, (Steve Firth) wrote:
Yes, that sounds like the one. You have to consider how the tray is to
be removed from the oven. Ours came with a bizarre two-handled
contraption that slots over one edge of the tray and can then be used to
lift it. But it needs two hands, the tray is enamelled steel and very
heavy and the handle isn't secured to the tray in any way other than
clipping onto one long edge.

Is it not possible to use a smaller tray and just oven gloves?
That is to say, as you would remove a tray of roast spuds?

She is unlikely to use the grill, anything slower than Slowlarglo
means a toaster would be purchase #2 whatever is bought :-)

js.b1 wrote:

On Apr 12, 11:46 pm, (Steve Firth) wrote:
Yes, that sounds like the one. You have to consider how the tray is to
be removed from the oven. Ours came with a bizarre two-handled
contraption that slots over one edge of the tray and can then be used to
lift it. But it needs two hands, the tray is enamelled steel and very
heavy and the handle isn't secured to the tray in any way other than
clipping onto one long edge.

Is it not possible to use a smaller tray

It wouldn't fit the runners.

and just oven gloves? That is to say, as you would remove a tray of roast
spuds?

All I can say is try it, it doesn't work for me and my wife.

She is unlikely to use the grill, anything slower than Slowlarglo
means a toaster would be purchase #2 whatever is bought :-)

Ah righto.

On Apr 13, 7:09*am, (Steve Firth) wrote:
js.b1 wrote:
Is it not possible to use a smaller tray

It wouldn't fit the runners.

Ah, that information is very useful - thanks.

Will try/need to find a Bosch before I buy.
She does not use the grill, but an unusable grill is something to
avoid.
Temporary repair first whilst I look around then. Thanks.

js.b1 wrote:

Ah, that information is very useful - thanks.

You're welcome.

On 12 Apr, 07:33, (Steve Firth) wrote:
js.b1 wrote:

Current alternatives seem dire in quality from play-n-twiddles despite
high prices.

We've had several Bosch cookers over the years, all with the Bosch
catalytic liners, which they brand as oxylitic. They have been good, but
I'm not sure if they are suitable for someone old to use. This holds
true for all catalytic liners.

To clean the oven it must be run empty at a high temperature from time
to time. Is your mother likely to do this? Bear in mind that when the
oven is run hot to clean it, it smokes quite heavily. It's better if the
installation has a proper extractor hood which vents externally (i.e.
not a recirculating cooker hood).

The other brand that we have been happy with is Baumatic. It's built in
Italy despite the slightly Germanic sounding name but the quality is
good. The negative with Baumatic is that very few models have catalytic
liners available. The positive is that they are well built and
relatively cheap.

Had very unhappy experiences with Baumatic, British company with
assembley anywhere cheap including Italy and Turkey, thing is designs
change so often high likelyhood of getting a parts bin special with
all the spares available used to assemble yours, in its own speshul
way.

Don`t even go there on customer service, made Currys look like the Red
Cross.

In the end sold the Baumatic rubbish for scrap and replaced it with
Neff, not cheap like Baumatic and the styling is staid, but the
construction quality is fully in a different universe from Baumatic
and Neff customer service is truly excellent.

Cheers
Adam

Adam Aglionby wrote:

Had very unhappy experiences with Baumatic,

Have you, how sad.

British company with assembley anywhere cheap including Italy and Turkey,

I've only had Italian built appliances from them. Assembly in Italy
isn't cheap BTW.

thing is designs change so often high likelyhood of getting a parts bin
special with all the spares available used to assemble yours, in its own
speshul way.

Not my experience. I've not encountered any such approach and the
likelihood seems low, if as you say the design had changed.

Don`t even go there on customer service, made Currys look like the Red
Cross.

The only time that I needed customer support was when I broke a part
from a cooker hood. I called the help line with my call being answered
almost immediately. The service centre sent me a bag containing a new
fitting kit for that model of cooker hood. The spares arrived within 24
hours of my call.

Glad to hear that you like Naff. Personally I find their products ugly,
over-priced tat but hey ho, eh?

On 13 Apr, 22:04, (Steve Firth) wrote:
Adam Aglionby wrote:
Had very unhappy experiences with Baumatic,

Have you, how sad.

British company with assembley anywhere cheap including Italy and Turkey,

I've only had Italian built appliances from them. Assembly in Italy
isn't cheap BTW.

thing is designs change so often high likelyhood of getting a parts bin
special with all the spares available used to assemble yours, in its own
speshul way.

Not my experience. I've not encountered any such approach and the
likelihood seems low, if as you say the design had changed.

Don`t even go there on customer service, made Currys look like the Red
Cross.

The only time that I needed customer support was when I broke a part
from a cooker hood. I called the help line with my call being answered
almost immediately. The service centre sent me a bag containing a new
fitting kit for that model of cooker hood. The spares arrived within 24
hours of my call.

Glad to hear that you like Naff. Personally I find their products ugly,
over-priced tat but hey ho, eh?

Perhaps my experience with Baumatic was an isolated one and/or things
have improved since 10 years ago.

Neff will rarely win points for style and build ,spares and customer
support have to be paid for.

Some kitchen appliances appear to be built as fashion items, expected
to be dispensed with when a new kitchen is fitted with changing
fashions.Price being absolutely no guide to `quality`

Like having a brown TV when they all turned black, then silver , then
black again..

Cheers
Adam