Hi All !

I'm having some down lights fitted in the ceiling of a loft area and
just realised how expensive to run about 10 of the low voltage
(transformer down to 12 volt) halogen bulbs will be - they mostly
appear as 50 watts each - that's a lot of power !

Then there are the mains versions of the halogens - but still little
in the way of power savings - but why on earth does anyone now bother
with the transformer versions of these down light fittings when the
mains halogens are available ? Aren't the transformers troublesome?

Enter the world of cheap LED lamps that fit into the mains versions of
the down lights fittings - are they called GU10 ? Is this correct?
Anyway these LEDs look promising - but what would the light output be
like? I am considering the Omicron Energy Saving LED Lamp OMC0025,
Colour:6400k, 500 Lumens, 24mA - these apparently use a mere 1.3w each
and currently cost only £1 each.

Can anyone help with all this ? I am utterly confused and out of my
depth.

Thanks, Tom

On 21 Dec, 16:30, Tom wrote:
I am considering the Omicron Energy Saving LED Lamp OMC0025,
Colour:6400k, 500 Lumens, 24mA - these apparently use a mere 1.3w each
and currently cost only £1 each.

Where can you get those?

12V halogen lamps are AC, 12V LED lamps are DC.

On Dec 21, 4:30*pm, Tom wrote:
Hi All !

I'm having some down lights fitted in the ceiling of a loft area and
just realised how expensive to run about 10 of the low voltage
(transformer down to 12 volt) halogen bulbs will be - they mostly
appear as 50 watts each - that's a lot of power !

Then there are the mains versions of the halogens - but still little
in the way of power savings - but why on earth does anyone now bother
with the transformer versions of these down light fittings when the
mains halogens are available ? Aren't the transformers troublesome?

LV halogen has all the advantages over mains, other than needing a
transformer


Enter the world of cheap LED lamps that fit into the mains versions of
the down lights fittings - are they called GU10 ? Is this correct?
Anyway these LEDs look promising - but what would the light output be
like? I am considering the Omicron Energy Saving LED Lamp OMC0025,
Colour:6400k, 500 Lumens, 24mA - these apparently use a mere 1.3w each
and currently cost only £1 each.

Can anyone help with all this ? I am utterly confused and out of my
depth.

Thanks, Tom

6400K is hideous, and the CRI is poor as well.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...egory:Lighting


NT

In article ,
Onetap writes:
On 21 Dec, 16:30, Tom wrote:
I am considering the Omicron Energy Saving LED Lamp OMC0025,
Colour:6400k, 500 Lumens, 24mA - these apparently use a mere 1.3w each
and currently cost only £1 each.
Where can you get those?
12V halogen lamps are AC, 12V LED lamps are DC.

12V MR16 LEDs are AC (or DC).

The OMC0025 looks like it's a GU10 format, not MR16.

The light output above is obviously a lie - no one has invented
an LED that efficient, even in laboratory conditions.
Assume the light output will be about the same as a 1.3W halogen,
and you probably won't go far wrong.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

In article
,
Tom wrote:
I'm having some down lights fitted in the ceiling of a loft area and
just realised how expensive to run about 10 of the low voltage
(transformer down to 12 volt) halogen bulbs will be - they mostly
appear as 50 watts each - that's a lot of power !

Use 20 watt ones. You'll hardly notice the difference.

--
*What happens when none of your bees wax? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Tom wrote:
Hi All !

I'm having some down lights fitted in the ceiling of a loft area and
just realised how expensive to run about 10 of the low voltage
(transformer down to 12 volt) halogen bulbs will be - they mostly
appear as 50 watts each - that's a lot of power !

Well, you could put 20W bulbs in instead and get a 60% reduction in
power dissipation.

Don't forget that in the winter that's 10 x 50W = 500W of space heating
you don't have to provide by other means.


Then there are the mains versions of the halogens - but still little
in the way of power savings - but why on earth does anyone now bother
with the transformer versions of these down light fittings when the
mains halogens are available ? Aren't the transformers troublesome?

In fact, it's the other way around. The mains version (GU10) has a very
thin filament and consequently in many cases a *very* short life. Decent
transformers are not a problem if you can get 'em (often pot-luck).
Usually even when you buy a low-voltage fitting from a shed, half the
bulbs they supply don't last 5 minutes. Put decent branded bulbs in and
it's all good.


Enter the world of cheap LED lamps that fit into the mains versions of
the down lights fittings - are they called GU10 ? Is this correct?
Anyway these LEDs look promising - but what would the light output be
like? I am considering the Omicron Energy Saving LED Lamp OMC0025,
Colour:6400k, 500 Lumens, 24mA - these apparently use a mere 1.3w each
and currently cost only £1 each.

What Andy Gabriel says.

On 21 Dec, 17:42, Onetap wrote:
On 21 Dec, 16:30, Tom wrote:

*I am considering the Omicron Energy Saving LED Lamp OMC0025,
Colour:6400k, 500 Lumens, 24mA - these apparently use a mere 1.3w each
and currently cost only £1 each.

Where can you get those?

12V halogen lamps are AC, 12V LED lamps are DC.

They sell them at Robert Dyas.

The OMC0025 looks like it's a GU10 format, not MR16.

The light output above is obviously a lie - no one has invented
an LED that efficient, even in laboratory conditions.


The packaging claims 500 Lumens - the bulbs have 20 LEDs in them - is
this not possible? I did think the low wattage looked too good to be
true (1.3W) !

Thanks for the replies.

Tom

On 21 Dec, 16:30, Tom wrote:
Hi All !

I'm having some down lights fitted in the ceiling of a loft area

Whats the use, office, bedroom, home theatre, gym...?

and
just realised how expensive to run about 10 of the low voltage
(transformer down to 12 volt) halogen bulbs will be - they mostly
appear as 50 watts each - that's a lot of power !

Sun delivers a bit under 2kW/m^2 in summer, lighting like heating is
anenergy intensive activity.

Then there are the mains versions of the halogens - but still little
in the way of power savings - but why on earth does anyone now bother
with the transformer versions of these down light fittings when the
mains halogens are available ? Aren't the transformers troublesome?

Covered by other posters and repeated rants by myself in archives, LV
halogen is much better and pennies more expensive at install.
Mode transformers are gold standard some cheapies almost as good some
terrible.

Enter the world of cheap LED lamps that fit into the mains versions of
the down lights fittings - are they called GU10 ? Is this correct?
Anyway these LEDs look promising - but what would the light output be
like? I am considering the Omicron Energy Saving LED Lamp OMC0025,
Colour:6400k, 500 Lumens, 24mA - these apparently use a mere 1.3w each
and currently cost only £1 each.

Cannae change the laws of physics, a 100% efficient lamp would attain
236 lumens out for 1Watt of energy in.
These Omnicrons have beat the limit of Stokes Efficiency and are
hitting over 386 l/W for a quid each the worlds energy crisis is
solved.

Can anyone help with all this ? I am utterly confused and out of my
depth.

Confusion is very deliberate on behalf f the marketeers.

Depends on use of space , perhaps concealed fluro might be appropriate
for general lighting with additional task and/or mood lighting.

Heat load in loft space may be significant in summer.

Bit more info on intended use might get better suggestions on
solutions, just stay away from GU10s ;-)



Thanks, Tom

Cheers
Adam

"Tom" wrote in message
...


The OMC0025 looks like it's a GU10 format, not MR16.

The light output above is obviously a lie - no one has invented
an LED that efficient, even in laboratory conditions.


The packaging claims 500 Lumens - the bulbs have 20 LEDs in them - is
this not possible? I did think the low wattage looked too good to be
true (1.3W) !

Thanks for the replies.

Tom

The key parameter is "lumens per watt".

Cheap non-quartz halogen is likely to be under 20 lumens per watt. Well
under in some cases.

Latest LED technology can comfortably exceed 100 lumens per watt.

Do some Googling because there's a lot of information out there.

You need to be looking at a 3 or 4 watt LED to have a chance of delivering a
useful amount of light.

You then need to consider the structure of the light as well. I can tell
you empirically that the 3 Watt 48SMD designs readily available on eBay are
pretty good. NO WAY do they meet their claims to be as brigt as 50 Watts
Halogen, but they certainly compare with 20W.

"Dave Osborne" wrote in message
...
Tom wrote:
Hi All !

I'm having some down lights fitted in the ceiling of a loft area and
just realised how expensive to run about 10 of the low voltage
(transformer down to 12 volt) halogen bulbs will be - they mostly
appear as 50 watts each - that's a lot of power !

Well, you could put 20W bulbs in instead and get a 60% reduction in power
dissipation.

Don't forget that in the winter that's 10 x 50W = 500W of space heating
you don't have to provide by other means.

But why one would put 500W heating in downlighter holes in a loft ceiling ?
Most sensible people would put it where the heat was needed.

This "lightbulbs as a useful heat source" argument is often trotted out,
but has never struck me as sensible. Is it efficient to place space heaters
at the highest point in the room?

On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 10:09:02 -0000, OG wrote:

This "lightbulbs as a useful heat source" argument is often trotted
out, but has never struck me as sensible.

Nor me. Yes there will be a bit of extra heat in the room but more or
less negligible in the scheme of things. Lets keep it simple an
ignore really lossy things like windows and doors and have a 4 x 5 x
2m room so total surface area of:

= 2 * (4*5 + 5*2 + 4*2)
= 2 * (20 + 10 + 8)
= 2 * 38
= 76m^2

Say 100W/m^2 heat loss = 7,600W is a hundred watts from a lamp really
significant? Open the door and more that that disappears through
it...

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 22 Dec, 11:13, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:
On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 10:09:02 -0000, OG wrote:
This "lightbulbs as a useful heat source" *argument is often trotted
out, but has never struck me as sensible.

Nor me. Yes there will be a bit of extra heat in the room but more or
less negligible in the scheme of things. Lets keep it simple an
ignore really lossy things like windows and doors and have a 4 x 5 x
2m room so total surface area of:

*= 2 * (4*5 + 5*2 + 4*2)
*= 2 * (20 + 10 + 8)
*= 2 * 38
*= 76m^2

Say 100W/m^2 heat loss = 7,600W is a hundred watts from a lamp really
significant? Open the door and more that that disappears through
it...

--
Cheers
Dave.

Until its summer, the Sun requires pulling the blinds and have a
couple computers running, another 1/2K of heat is really not whats
needed...

Cheers
Adam

"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message
ll.co.uk...

Say 100W/m^2 heat loss

How much? ? ?
That might be reasonable for a greenhouse, but not for a room

http://diydata.com/information/u_values/u_values.php

OG wrote:
"Dave Osborne" wrote in message
...
Tom wrote:
Hi All !

I'm having some down lights fitted in the ceiling of a loft area and
just realised how expensive to run about 10 of the low voltage
(transformer down to 12 volt) halogen bulbs will be - they mostly
appear as 50 watts each - that's a lot of power !
Well, you could put 20W bulbs in instead and get a 60% reduction in power
dissipation.

Don't forget that in the winter that's 10 x 50W = 500W of space heating
you don't have to provide by other means.

But why one would put 500W heating in downlighter holes in a loft ceiling ?
Most sensible people would put it where the heat was needed.

This "lightbulbs as a useful heat source" argument is often trotted out,
but has never struck me as sensible. Is it efficient to place space heaters
at the highest point in the room?



Actually, it was tongue-in-cheek on my part. Should've done a ;-)

On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 13:08:08 -0000, OG wrote:

Say 100W/m^2 heat loss

How much? ? ?
That might be reasonable for a greenhouse, but not for a room

I did pull the figure from the air but

http://diydata.com/information/u_values/u_values.php

9" solid brick wall with 23C across it (-3 outside 20C inside) is 23
x 2.2W/m^2 = 50W/m^2 so with air changes as well 100W/m^2 total heat
loss is not that far from the mark.

A modern hermetically sealed rabbit hutch with 11" brick/block cavity
insulated with the same temp difference is 13W/m^2 or just over 1kW,
The 100W lamp is still only 1/10th of the required energy input and
do people really use 100W lamps? I find them far to harsh, 60W perl
is much kinder on the eye.

--
Cheers
Dave.

"Tom" wrote in message
...
Hi All !

I'm having some down lights fitted in the ceiling of a loft area and
just realised how expensive to run about 10 of the low voltage
(transformer down to 12 volt) halogen bulbs will be - they mostly
appear as 50 watts each - that's a lot of power !

Then there are the mains versions of the halogens - but still little
in the way of power savings - but why on earth does anyone now bother
with the transformer versions of these down light fittings when the
mains halogens are available ? Aren't the transformers troublesome?

Enter the world of cheap LED lamps that fit into the mains versions of
the down lights fittings - are they called GU10 ? Is this correct?
Anyway these LEDs look promising - but what would the light output be
like? I am considering the Omicron Energy Saving LED Lamp OMC0025,
Colour:6400k, 500 Lumens, 24mA - these apparently use a mere 1.3w each
and currently cost only £1 each.

Can anyone help with all this ? I am utterly confused and out of my
depth.

Thanks, Tom
------

Hi Tom,
Whilst I've not got experience of GU10 LEDs, both types of low voltage MR16s
that I've had have exhibited varying degress of interference with FM and DAB
radios in the house i.e the lights work but the radio signal degrades to a
level that is unlistenable to. Turn the lights off and 'Hey Presto' the
radios work again.
GU10 may not be a problem but I thought I should mention it.
That said, the 4 Exergi 4W MR16 bulbs I've got in the bathroom are great -
but don't install them near a radio.

Cheers,
Keith

In article , KD
wrote:
Whilst I've not got experience of GU10 LEDs, both types of low voltage
MR16s that I've had have exhibited varying degress of interference with
FM and DAB radios in the house i.e the lights work but the radio signal
degrades to a level that is unlistenable to. Turn the lights off and
'Hey Presto' the radios work again.

Are you talking about some form of 'CFL' MR16? Proper MR16 are tungsten
and won't cause interference. Nor should the power supplies for them.

--
*If a pig loses its voice, is it disgruntled?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article , KD
wrote:
Whilst I've not got experience of GU10 LEDs, both types of low voltage
MR16s that I've had have exhibited varying degress of interference with
FM and DAB radios in the house i.e the lights work but the radio signal
degrades to a level that is unlistenable to. Turn the lights off and
'Hey Presto' the radios work again.

Are you talking about some form of 'CFL' MR16? Proper MR16 are tungsten
and won't cause interference. Nor should the power supplies for them.

--
*If a pig loses its voice, is it disgruntled?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

They're LED lamps. About 20 quid a pop.

http://www.exergi.co.uk/led-mr16/xm4...fications.aspx

There may be interference from the internal regulator gubbins. I'm more
inclined to think the external (probably switched mode) PSU does not like
having such a low load. I'd try powering one of these lamps from a car
battery and see if there is interference then.

These http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/LTYT50.html work fine for me with
LED.

"Vortex4" wrote in message
...

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article , KD
wrote:
Whilst I've not got experience of GU10 LEDs, both types of low voltage
MR16s that I've had have exhibited varying degress of interference with
FM and DAB radios in the house i.e the lights work but the radio signal
degrades to a level that is unlistenable to. Turn the lights off and
'Hey Presto' the radios work again.

Are you talking about some form of 'CFL' MR16? Proper MR16 are tungsten
and won't cause interference. Nor should the power supplies for them.

--
*If a pig loses its voice, is it disgruntled?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

They're LED lamps. About 20 quid a pop.

http://www.exergi.co.uk/led-mr16/xm4...fications.aspx

There may be interference from the internal regulator gubbins. I'm more
inclined to think the external (probably switched mode) PSU does not like
having such a low load. I'd try powering one of these lamps from a car
battery and see if there is interference then.

These http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/LTYT50.html work fine for me
with LED.

Thanks Vortex4, I'll give those a go.
To add some confusion (I'm not a great DIYer) here is the sequence of events
for previous LEDs....

a) Bought some Deltech MR16 LEDs off ebay. I took the chance of not
replacing the original transformers. Interference from the bulbs caused ALL
radios in the house to lose reception.
b) Replaced all of the appropriate transformers with 12V DC LED drivers.
This did not solve the problem.
c) Contacted Deltech who have said that there may be a problem with their
MR16 (but not GU10) LEDs. They're working on it and will give me
replacements when fixed.
d) Took the plunge and bought some Exergi LEDs. Fitted those and the
interference went away.
e) Bought 4 more for the kitchen ... installed these without changing the
original transformers and there is interference on the kitchen radio.

I have requested to return them but since you've been so kind as to post a
link to more affordable transformers than I've previously seen, I've just
ordered 4 LTYT70s (the others were out of stock) and I'll give that a go
first.

Cheers,
Keith

"KD" wrote in message
...

"Vortex4" wrote in message
...

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article , KD
wrote:
Whilst I've not got experience of GU10 LEDs, both types of low voltage
MR16s that I've had have exhibited varying degress of interference with
FM and DAB radios in the house i.e the lights work but the radio signal
degrades to a level that is unlistenable to. Turn the lights off and
'Hey Presto' the radios work again.

Are you talking about some form of 'CFL' MR16? Proper MR16 are tungsten
and won't cause interference. Nor should the power supplies for them.

--
*If a pig loses its voice, is it disgruntled?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

They're LED lamps. About 20 quid a pop.

http://www.exergi.co.uk/led-mr16/xm4...fications.aspx

There may be interference from the internal regulator gubbins. I'm more
inclined to think the external (probably switched mode) PSU does not like
having such a low load. I'd try powering one of these lamps from a car
battery and see if there is interference then.

These http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/LTYT50.html work fine for me
with LED.

Thanks Vortex4, I'll give those a go.
To add some confusion (I'm not a great DIYer) here is the sequence of
events for previous LEDs....

a) Bought some Deltech MR16 LEDs off ebay. I took the chance of not
replacing the original transformers. Interference from the bulbs caused
ALL radios in the house to lose reception.
b) Replaced all of the appropriate transformers with 12V DC LED drivers.
This did not solve the problem.
c) Contacted Deltech who have said that there may be a problem with their
MR16 (but not GU10) LEDs. They're working on it and will give me
replacements when fixed.
d) Took the plunge and bought some Exergi LEDs. Fitted those and the
interference went away.
e) Bought 4 more for the kitchen ... installed these without changing the
original transformers and there is interference on the kitchen radio.

I have requested to return them but since you've been so kind as to post a
link to more affordable transformers than I've previously seen, I've just
ordered 4 LTYT70s (the others were out of stock) and I'll give that a go
first.

Cheers,
Keith

Let us know how you get on!

"Vortex4" wrote in message
...

"KD" wrote in message
...

"Vortex4" wrote in message
...

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article , KD
wrote:
Whilst I've not got experience of GU10 LEDs, both types of low voltage
MR16s that I've had have exhibited varying degress of interference
with
FM and DAB radios in the house i.e the lights work but the radio
signal
degrades to a level that is unlistenable to. Turn the lights off and
'Hey Presto' the radios work again.

Are you talking about some form of 'CFL' MR16? Proper MR16 are tungsten
and won't cause interference. Nor should the power supplies for them.

--
*If a pig loses its voice, is it disgruntled?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

They're LED lamps. About 20 quid a pop.

http://www.exergi.co.uk/led-mr16/xm4...fications.aspx

There may be interference from the internal regulator gubbins. I'm more
inclined to think the external (probably switched mode) PSU does not
like having such a low load. I'd try powering one of these lamps from a
car battery and see if there is interference then.

These http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/LTYT50.html work fine for me
with LED.

Thanks Vortex4, I'll give those a go.
To add some confusion (I'm not a great DIYer) here is the sequence of
events for previous LEDs....

a) Bought some Deltech MR16 LEDs off ebay. I took the chance of not
replacing the original transformers. Interference from the bulbs caused
ALL radios in the house to lose reception.
b) Replaced all of the appropriate transformers with 12V DC LED drivers.
This did not solve the problem.
c) Contacted Deltech who have said that there may be a problem with their
MR16 (but not GU10) LEDs. They're working on it and will give me
replacements when fixed.
d) Took the plunge and bought some Exergi LEDs. Fitted those and the
interference went away.
e) Bought 4 more for the kitchen ... installed these without changing the
original transformers and there is interference on the kitchen radio.

I have requested to return them but since you've been so kind as to post
a link to more affordable transformers than I've previously seen, I've
just ordered 4 LTYT70s (the others were out of stock) and I'll give that
a go first.

Cheers,
Keith

Let us know how you get on!



Will do, I've just confirmed that the Skot transformers, model ET60T-5, are
rated as 20-60W so I'm hopeful that the power draw, or lack of it, is the
cause of the problem with the Exergi LEDs. Other LEDs that I've looked at
specifiy DC but the Exergi bulbs say AC/DC so that hopefully won't be an
issue either.

Thanks once again,
Have a Merry Christmas,
Keith

In article , Dave Osborne wrote:
Tom wrote:
Hi All !

I'm having some down lights fitted in the ceiling of a loft area and
just realised how expensive to run about 10 of the low voltage
(transformer down to 12 volt) halogen bulbs will be - they mostly
appear as 50 watts each - that's a lot of power !

Well, you could put 20W bulbs in instead and get a 60% reduction in
power dissipation.

And if you actually need 50W, you've got no chance of finding
LED bulbs with comparable output anyway. (What you definitely don't
want to do is what the previous owner of my house did, which was
to run three 50W bulbs off a transformer rated at 60W.)

"KD" wrote in message
...

"Vortex4" wrote in message
...

"KD" wrote in message
...

"Vortex4" wrote in message
...

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article , KD
wrote:
Whilst I've not got experience of GU10 LEDs, both types of low
voltage
MR16s that I've had have exhibited varying degress of interference
with
FM and DAB radios in the house i.e the lights work but the radio
signal
degrades to a level that is unlistenable to. Turn the lights off and
'Hey Presto' the radios work again.

Are you talking about some form of 'CFL' MR16? Proper MR16 are
tungsten
and won't cause interference. Nor should the power supplies for them.

--
*If a pig loses its voice, is it disgruntled?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

They're LED lamps. About 20 quid a pop.

http://www.exergi.co.uk/led-mr16/xm4...fications.aspx

There may be interference from the internal regulator gubbins. I'm
more inclined to think the external (probably switched mode) PSU does
not like having such a low load. I'd try powering one of these lamps
from a car battery and see if there is interference then.

These http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/LTYT50.html work fine for me
with LED.

Thanks Vortex4, I'll give those a go.
To add some confusion (I'm not a great DIYer) here is the sequence of
events for previous LEDs....

a) Bought some Deltech MR16 LEDs off ebay. I took the chance of not
replacing the original transformers. Interference from the bulbs caused
ALL radios in the house to lose reception.
b) Replaced all of the appropriate transformers with 12V DC LED drivers.
This did not solve the problem.
c) Contacted Deltech who have said that there may be a problem with
their MR16 (but not GU10) LEDs. They're working on it and will give me
replacements when fixed.
d) Took the plunge and bought some Exergi LEDs. Fitted those and the
interference went away.
e) Bought 4 more for the kitchen ... installed these without changing
the original transformers and there is interference on the kitchen
radio.

I have requested to return them but since you've been so kind as to post
a link to more affordable transformers than I've previously seen, I've
just ordered 4 LTYT70s (the others were out of stock) and I'll give that
a go first.

Cheers,
Keith

Let us know how you get on!



Will do, I've just confirmed that the Skot transformers, model ET60T-5,
are rated as 20-60W so I'm hopeful that the power draw, or lack of it, is
the cause of the problem with the Exergi LEDs. Other LEDs that I've
looked at specifiy DC but the Exergi bulbs say AC/DC so that hopefully
won't be an issue either.

Thanks once again,
Have a Merry Christmas,
Keith

Hmmm. The transformers have turned up but are those type with pre-soldered
cables for the light fitting. I had expected, as with the LED drivers, to
be able to simply swap the fittings over without fannying about with
anything else. This might take a little longer than planned. Ho hum.

Keith

"KD" wrote in message
...

"KD" wrote in message
...

"Vortex4" wrote in message
...

"KD" wrote in message
...

"Vortex4" wrote in message
...

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article , KD
wrote:
Whilst I've not got experience of GU10 LEDs, both types of low
voltage
MR16s that I've had have exhibited varying degress of interference
with
FM and DAB radios in the house i.e the lights work but the radio
signal
degrades to a level that is unlistenable to. Turn the lights off
and
'Hey Presto' the radios work again.

Are you talking about some form of 'CFL' MR16? Proper MR16 are
tungsten
and won't cause interference. Nor should the power supplies for them.

--
*If a pig loses its voice, is it disgruntled?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

They're LED lamps. About 20 quid a pop.

http://www.exergi.co.uk/led-mr16/xm4...fications.aspx

There may be interference from the internal regulator gubbins. I'm
more inclined to think the external (probably switched mode) PSU does
not like having such a low load. I'd try powering one of these lamps
from a car battery and see if there is interference then.

These http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/LTYT50.html work fine for
me with LED.

Thanks Vortex4, I'll give those a go.
To add some confusion (I'm not a great DIYer) here is the sequence of
events for previous LEDs....

a) Bought some Deltech MR16 LEDs off ebay. I took the chance of not
replacing the original transformers. Interference from the bulbs
caused ALL radios in the house to lose reception.
b) Replaced all of the appropriate transformers with 12V DC LED
drivers. This did not solve the problem.
c) Contacted Deltech who have said that there may be a problem with
their MR16 (but not GU10) LEDs. They're working on it and will give me
replacements when fixed.
d) Took the plunge and bought some Exergi LEDs. Fitted those and the
interference went away.
e) Bought 4 more for the kitchen ... installed these without changing
the original transformers and there is interference on the kitchen
radio.

I have requested to return them but since you've been so kind as to
post a link to more affordable transformers than I've previously seen,
I've just ordered 4 LTYT70s (the others were out of stock) and I'll
give that a go first.

Cheers,
Keith

Let us know how you get on!



Will do, I've just confirmed that the Skot transformers, model ET60T-5,
are rated as 20-60W so I'm hopeful that the power draw, or lack of it, is
the cause of the problem with the Exergi LEDs. Other LEDs that I've
looked at specifiy DC but the Exergi bulbs say AC/DC so that hopefully
won't be an issue either.

Thanks once again,
Have a Merry Christmas,
Keith

Hmmm. The transformers have turned up but are those type with
pre-soldered cables for the light fitting. I had expected, as with the
LED drivers, to be able to simply swap the fittings over without fannying
about with anything else. This might take a little longer than planned.
Ho hum.

Keith

Hi all,
Sorry for replying to my own post. I've cobbled up the wires with
connection blocks temporarily and have now installed one LED. Though not
scientific, I connected an Exergi with the original transformer and noticed
a 90-100% drop off in DAB signal strength when I turned it on.
I've now cut out the old transformer and replaced with an LTYT70. Having
installed the same LED, I'm noticing a nominal drop off in DAB signal though
this may be a coincidence as the signal strength-o-meter does vary a lot
anyway and I'm naturally pessimistic.

So, I think I'm happy to progress with putting the remaining Exergi bulbs
and replacement transformers in place. One point I would make is that the
Exergi bulbs say they accept AC/DC. Just be aware that most info on LEDs out
there say that you should use a DC driver only.

Cheers,
Keith

On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 09:54:02 -0000, "Vortex4" wrote:


"Tom" wrote in message
...


The OMC0025 looks like it's a GU10 format, not MR16.

The light output above is obviously a lie - no one has invented
an LED that efficient, even in laboratory conditions.


The packaging claims 500 Lumens - the bulbs have 20 LEDs in them - is
this not possible? I did think the low wattage looked too good to be
true (1.3W) !

Thanks for the replies.

Tom

The key parameter is "lumens per watt".

Cheap non-quartz halogen is likely to be under 20 lumens per watt. Well
under in some cases.

Latest LED technology can comfortably exceed 100 lumens per watt.

Do some Googling because there's a lot of information out there.

You need to be looking at a 3 or 4 watt LED to have a chance of delivering a
useful amount of light.

Agreed. I have some 5W LED GU10 bulbs, which are about as bright as
the halogens. These are very expensive though and one went wrong
after 13 months.

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(='.'=) Due to the amount of spam posted via googlegroups and
(")_(") their inaction to the problem. I am blocking most articles
posted from there. If you wish your postings to be seen by
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snip
Hi all,
Sorry for replying to my own post. I've cobbled up the wires with
connection blocks temporarily and have now installed one LED. Though not
scientific, I connected an Exergi with the original transformer and
noticed a 90-100% drop off in DAB signal strength when I turned it on.
I've now cut out the old transformer and replaced with an LTYT70. Having
installed the same LED, I'm noticing a nominal drop off in DAB signal
though this may be a coincidence as the signal strength-o-meter does vary
a lot anyway and I'm naturally pessimistic.

So, I think I'm happy to progress with putting the remaining Exergi bulbs
and replacement transformers in place. One point I would make is that the
Exergi bulbs say they accept AC/DC. Just be aware that most info on LEDs
out there say that you should use a DC driver only.

Cheers,
Keith




Hi again,
One last, final update. I've just added the second (of four) Exergi LED
MR16 + new LTYT70 transformer replacements into the mix and have lost DAB
completely in the kitchen. I tried another bulb to ensure it's not just a
faulty one and this caused problems as well. Looks like my experiment with
LEDs has failed - radios really don't like them. Off back for a refund

Sorry for reporting the bad news,
Keith

KD wrote:
snip
Hi all,
Sorry for replying to my own post. I've cobbled up the wires with
connection blocks temporarily and have now installed one LED. Though not
scientific, I connected an Exergi with the original transformer and
noticed a 90-100% drop off in DAB signal strength when I turned it on.
I've now cut out the old transformer and replaced with an LTYT70. Having
installed the same LED, I'm noticing a nominal drop off in DAB signal
though this may be a coincidence as the signal strength-o-meter does vary
a lot anyway and I'm naturally pessimistic.

So, I think I'm happy to progress with putting the remaining Exergi bulbs
and replacement transformers in place. One point I would make is that the
Exergi bulbs say they accept AC/DC. Just be aware that most info on LEDs
out there say that you should use a DC driver only.

Cheers,
Keith




Hi again,
One last, final update. I've just added the second (of four) Exergi LED
MR16 + new LTYT70 transformer replacements into the mix and have lost DAB
completely in the kitchen. I tried another bulb to ensure it's not just a
faulty one and this caused problems as well. Looks like my experiment with
LEDs has failed - radios really don't like them. Off back for a refund

Sorry for reporting the bad news,
Keith


Its down to the "transformer" (really a switched mode power supply) not
the LEDs themselves.