We are about to let our house and the landlord's gas safety test has
detected a fault. When the system is shut off from the main the
pressure after at meter drops by about 0.01 mB per second. I think
the pressure was around 20 mB. It was a digital meter.

Now, the first puzzle is that BG and another plumber both passed the
pressure test a year ago when the meter was moved and some pipwork
rerouted. Nothing has been done to the gas system since then.

The second puzzle is that he said that when he measured it, the
pressur "held OK for a bit and then started to drop".

The house has a mix of copper and old iron gas pipes, all are capped
except at the boiler. It's a 3 bed end terrace.

Any thoughts?

On Fri, 13 Nov 2009 02:56:45 -0800 (PST), RobertL
wrote:


We are about to let our house and the landlord's gas safety test has
detected a fault. When the system is shut off from the main the
pressure after at meter drops by about 0.01 mB per second. I think
the pressure was around 20 mB. It was a digital meter.

Now, the first puzzle is that BG and another plumber both passed the
pressure test a year ago when the meter was moved and some pipwork
rerouted. Nothing has been done to the gas system since then.

The second puzzle is that he said that when he measured it, the
pressur "held OK for a bit and then started to drop".

The house has a mix of copper and old iron gas pipes, all are capped
except at the boiler. It's a 3 bed end terrace.

Any thoughts?

Don't strike a match :-)

--
Frank Erskine

"RobertL" wrote in message
...

We are about to let our house and the landlord's gas safety test has
detected a fault. When the system is shut off from the main the
pressure after at meter drops by about 0.01 mB per second. I think
the pressure was around 20 mB. It was a digital meter.

Now, the first puzzle is that BG and another plumber both passed the
pressure test a year ago when the meter was moved and some pipwork
rerouted. Nothing has been done to the gas system since then.

The second puzzle is that he said that when he measured it, the
pressur "held OK for a bit and then started to drop".

The house has a mix of copper and old iron gas pipes, all are capped
except at the boiler. It's a 3 bed end terrace.

Any thoughts?

.
Robert

I had exactly the same failure when my tame plumber came to fit a new pipe
for the gas cooker in my revamped kitchen. After some head-scratching, we
arrived at the open-flame gas fire in the lounge (one of those things with
ceramic 'coals' in it.) At some point during the summer season, the pilot
had gone out, so the auto cut-off had dropped the gas supply. However, the
valve hadn't *quite* closed solidly, allowing a tiny amount of gas to
continuously seep past it and out of the pilot jet. The plumber said this
was quite common, and happened because the valve was not a regularly
'exercised' device. He gave it a sharp rap with the butt end of a spanner,
and you could actually hear it click. The pressure test then held ok.

Arfa

On Fri, 13 Nov 2009 02:56:45 -0800, RobertL wrote:

We are about to let our house and the landlord's gas safety test has
detected a fault. When the system is shut off from the main the
pressure after at meter drops by about 0.01 mB per second. I think
the pressure was around 20 mB. It was a digital meter.

Now, the first puzzle is that BG and another plumber both passed the
pressure test a year ago when the meter was moved and some pipwork
rerouted. Nothing has been done to the gas system since then.

So a mechanical system that's faulty now was OK a year ago. Why is that a
puzzle? If your car's OK now does that mean it'll still be OK a year from
now?!

The second puzzle is that he said that when he measured it, the
pressur "held OK for a bit and then started to drop".

The house has a mix of copper and old iron gas pipes, all are capped
except at the boiler. It's a 3 bed end terrace.


0.01mBar per second (if that's correct) equates to a drop of 1.2mB over
120s which is within the allowed tolerance for a standard meter and
standard domestic pipework, if appliances are connected.

What's the drop with the boiler isolated?

If it's within tolerance (no discernable drop) with the boiler isolated
then the drop is within the boiler which is OK, though you'd want to check
the gas valve (I'm assuming it's an old boiler) and internal boiler gas
pipework to ensure there's nothing actually leaking in there.

If it drops with the boiler isolated then you need to find and fix the
leak. First port of call is always the hose connecting the test instrument
to the gas meter test nipple :-)


--
John Stumbles -- http://yaph.co.uk

Many hands make light work. Too many cooks spoil the broth.

On Nov 13, 11:31*am, YAPH wrote:

So a mechanical system that's faulty now was OK a year ago. Why is that a
puzzle? If your car's OK now does that mean it'll still be OK a year from
now?!

POint taken, but I wouldn't normally expect pipework to suddenly start
leaking unless it had been worked on or hit. The leak is not in the
boiler (the only applicance).



0.01mBar per second (if that's correct) equates to a drop of 1.2mB over
120s which is within the allowed tolerance for a standard meter and
standard domestic pipework, if appliances are connected.

Yes, it was 0.1 mB/sec I watched the display of his meter.

What's the drop with the boiler isolated?

exactly the same.

If it's within tolerance (no discernable drop) with the boiler isolated
then the drop is within the boiler which is OK, though you'd want to check
the gas valve (I'm assuming it's an old boiler) and internal boiler gas
pipework to ensure there's nothing actually leaking in there.

If it drops with the boiler isolated then you need to find and fix the
leak. First port of call is always the hose connecting the test instrument
to the gas meter test nipple :-)

That's what I suspect also, especially as it gave an OK result at
first and then started to drop. However, his first port of call is to
disconnect the parts of the pipework that lead to terminations that
don't have appliances on them.

We are getting the original plumber aback who did the previous test
(and some pipe works).

Thanks for your guidance people.

Robert

RobertL wrote:

That's what I suspect also, especially as it gave an OK result at
first and then started to drop. However, his first port of call is to
disconnect the parts of the pipework that lead to terminations that
don't have appliances on them.

We are getting the original plumber aback who did the previous test
(and some pipe works).

Thanks for your guidance people.

If you bought your own manometer (B&Q sell them) you could rule out leaks at
the nipple. If it turned out to be that then you could probably ask for a
retest.

Tim

On 13 Nov, 10:56, RobertL wrote:
We are about to let our house and the landlord's gas safety test has
detected a fault. *When the system is shut off from the main the
pressure after at meter drops by about 0.01 mB per second. *I think
the pressure was around 20 mB. * *It was a digital meter.

Now, the first puzzle is that BG and another plumber both passed the
pressure test a year ago when the meter was moved and some pipwork
rerouted. *Nothing has been done to the gas system since then.

The second puzzle is that he said that when he measured it, the
pressur "held OK for a bit and then started to drop".

The house has a mix of copper and old iron gas pipes, all are capped
except at the boiler. *It's a 3 bed end terrace.

Any thoughts?

*.
Robert

If it held up for a while then started to drop I would immediately
wonder if the bloke knew what governor lock up is.

Remember there are 2 ways of doing gas pipework:

A) Cheap copper - high labour
Can involve labour hours of cutting, jointing, soldering. Leaves you
wish bad soldering risk be error or deliberate.

B) Pricey tracpipe - low labour
Uncoil, few minutes to terminate, factory y/o plastic coating. No
defect risk except at joints - which must be accessible :-) The only
downside is that Tracpipe is large, 22mm is actually 28mm o.d.

On Nov 13, 6:05*pm, "Tim" wrote:

If you bought your own manometer (B&Q sell them) you could rule out leaks at
the nipple. *If it turned out to be that then you could probably ask for a
retest.

THat's an interesting idea. In fact I'm havoing another trusted
plumber in to retest. I've cancelled the proposed repiping of the
firt guy.

I worked out that to drop 0.01mB per second it must vent many litres
of gas per day. I woudl expect to be able smell that (we live in the
house at presnt and have done for many years). There is no smell
inside the house or under the floor where the pipes are routed.

Roert

On Nov 13, 8:52*pm, wrote:
On 13 Nov, *
* * *RobertL wrote:

The second puzzle is that he said that when he measured it, the
pressur "held OK for a bit and then started to drop".

Possibly due to the volume of gas at higher pressure before the regulator
keeping the pressure up until exausted. Pilot light somewhere?

--
* B Thumbs
* Change lycos to yahoo to reply

Yes, that's a thought. Given tha tthere is no smell of gas anywhere I
am suspecting his manomoeter hose connection.

We'll see when the second plumber gets here next week. He's the one
who tested it previously. I post further so people hear the whole
story.

R

On Nov 14, 8:33*am, RobertL wrote:
On Nov 13, 8:52*pm, wrote:

On 13 Nov, *
* * *RobertL wrote:

The second puzzle is that he said that when he measured it, the
pressur "held OK for a bit and then started to drop".

Possibly due to the volume of gas at higher pressure before the regulator
keeping the pressure up until exausted. Pilot light somewhere?

--
* B Thumbs
* Change lycos to yahoo to reply

Yes, that's a thought. *Given tha tthere is no smell of gas anywhere I
am suspecting his manomoeter hose connection.

We'll see when the second plumber gets here next week. * He's the one
who tested it previously. *I post further so people hear the whole
story.

R



UPdate:

second plumber came today. Tested (several times to be sure), found
all acceptable and issued certificate.

Robert

On Fri, 13 Nov 2009 08:55:40 -0800, RobertL wrote:

POint taken, but I wouldn't normally expect pipework to suddenly start
leaking unless it had been worked on or hit. The leak is not in the
boiler (the only applicance).

I saw your follow-ups but for the record, reasons pipework could start
leaking include:

1. some corrodible pipework has corroded through

2. a fluxed but un-soldered joint has dried out

3. something else neither you nor I have thought of ;-)



--
John Stumbles -- http://yaph.co.uk

I've got nothing against racists - I just wouldn't want my daughter to marry one

On Nov 15, 11:51*pm, YAPH wrote:
On Fri, 13 Nov 2009 08:55:40 -0800, RobertL wrote:
POint taken, but I wouldn't normally expect pipework to suddenly start
leaking unless it had been worked on or hit. *The leak is not in the
boiler (the only applicance).

I saw your follow-ups but for the record, reasons pipework could start
leaking include:

1. some corrodible pipework has corroded through

2. a fluxed but un-soldered joint has dried out

3. something else neither you nor I have thought of ;-)


Thank you, there are all intersting possibilities. For good measure
the second plumbver also wandered all over the place with a sniffer
but found nothing. Tyhree's no smell of gas anywhere, including under
the floor.


Robert