I've got a detached house with an integral unheated garage, built in
1997 with the insulation standards of that time. The garage door is
up/over with considerable gaps, so that in winter the garage interior
is notg much warmer than the outside air.

All the interior walls in the garage are made of a thermal block
material, but I am unsure if there is also an insulated cavity on the
house side. I suspect not, as it is probably considered to be an
internal wall.

The 'garage side' walls of all the house rooms adjoining the garage
are noticeabily colder in winter, and I am wondering if it would make
sense to clad the garage/house wall with some form of insulation on
the garage side.


Can anyone suggest a suitable insulation material, ideally in panel
form, for easy attachment to the interior of my garage/house wall.

David J

Kingspan/celotex, or kingspan/celotex-backed plasterboard.

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-GA3000

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-PL3000

"David J" wrote

I've got a detached house with an integral unheated garage, built in
1997 with the insulation standards of that time. The garage door is
up/over with considerable gaps, so that in winter the garage interior
is notg much warmer than the outside air.

Probably worth fitting sealer strips around the garage door to reduce the
draft (wind) chill of the internal space.

Phil

RubberBiker wrote:
Kingspan/celotex, or kingspan/celotex-backed plasterboard.

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-GA3000

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-PL3000

Jablite is cheaper, and probably adequate for a garage.

In article , Stuart
Noble writes
RubberBiker wrote:
Kingspan/celotex, or kingspan/celotex-backed plasterboard.

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-GA3000

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-PL3000

Jablite is cheaper, and probably adequate for a garage.

Just to be clear to the o/p though, it is an inferior product, requiring
5" to get the same insulating effect as 3" of Celotex or Kingspan.
--
fred
BBC3, ITV2/3/4, channels going to the DOGs

On Mon, 21 Sep 2009 09:30:45 GMT, Stuart Noble
wrote:

RubberBiker wrote:
Kingspan/celotex, or kingspan/celotex-backed plasterboard.

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-GA3000

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-PL3000

Jablite is cheaper, and probably adequate for a garage.

Thanks everyone for your suggestions here - Jablite is quite cheap.
Any idea how that material can be fixed to a vertical surface?

David J

David J
wibbled on Monday 21 September 2009 11:33

On Mon, 21 Sep 2009 09:30:45 GMT, Stuart Noble
wrote:

RubberBiker wrote:
Kingspan/celotex, or kingspan/celotex-backed plasterboard.

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-GA3000

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-PL3000

Jablite is cheaper, and probably adequate for a garage.

Thanks everyone for your suggestions here - Jablite is quite cheap.
Any idea how that material can be fixed to a vertical surface?

David J

Siroflex PU foam drywall adhesive - an expanding foam with low expansivity.
I'm not sure if it would attack EPS (jablite) but I'm happy to try a bit
for you.

Otherwise, screws/nails and *big* washers (like 30mm+ big).

Or surface it off with ply and screw the ply though the EPS into the wall.
Jablite is good in compression. If you use heavy ply this would give you
the advantage of being able to fix shelves (upto a point) to the ply,
especially of the ply is supported along the bottom edge.

(Better for shelf fixing) - batten the wall out, infill with jablite and fix
ply to battens. You now can fix heavy shelving to the battens if required.

Certain tile adhesives will stick passably to EPS too - including Mapei
kerabond (I've tried) so a dot'n'dab approach might work too.

Or look out for "2nd grade" celotex (I have some Ballytherm - same stuff,
few dints, but just as good from any practical POV). Same fixing methods
apply.

HTH

Tim

--
Tim Watts
The ****artist formerly known as Tim S

fred wrote:
In article , Stuart
Noble writes
RubberBiker wrote:
Kingspan/celotex, or kingspan/celotex-backed plasterboard.

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-GA3000

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-PL3000

Jablite is cheaper, and probably adequate for a garage.

Just to be clear to the o/p though, it is an inferior product, requiring
5" to get the same insulating effect as 3" of Celotex or Kingspan.

Sure, but any insulation makes a big difference to a garage. I'd
probably go for 25mm celotex as a balance between price and loss of space

In article , Stuart
Noble writes
fred wrote:
In article , Stuart
Noble writes
RubberBiker wrote:
Kingspan/celotex, or kingspan/celotex-backed plasterboard.

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-GA3000

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-PL3000

Jablite is cheaper, and probably adequate for a garage.

Just to be clear to the o/p though, it is an inferior product, requiring
5" to get the same insulating effect as 3" of Celotex or Kingspan.

Sure, but any insulation makes a big difference to a garage. I'd
probably go for 25mm celotex as a balance between price and loss of space

I think the objective is to improve the comfort level in the house by
insulating the wall between the garage and the house.

As you say, anything is better than nothing and it looks like the o/p
likes the cost of Jablite :-)
--
fred
BBC3, ITV2/3/4, channels going to the DOGs

In article , Tim W
writes
David J
wibbled on Monday 21 September 2009 11:33

On Mon, 21 Sep 2009 09:30:45 GMT, Stuart Noble
wrote:

RubberBiker wrote:
Kingspan/celotex, or kingspan/celotex-backed plasterboard.

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-GA3000

http://www.celotex.co.uk/Products/Ce...Celotex-PL3000

Jablite is cheaper, and probably adequate for a garage.

Thanks everyone for your suggestions here - Jablite is quite cheap.
Any idea how that material can be fixed to a vertical surface?

David J

Siroflex PU foam drywall adhesive - an expanding foam with low expansivity.
I'm not sure if it would attack EPS (jablite) but I'm happy to try a bit
for you.

Otherwise, screws/nails and *big* washers (like 30mm+ big).

Or surface it off with ply and screw the ply though the EPS into the wall.
Jablite is good in compression. If you use heavy ply this would give you
the advantage of being able to fix shelves (upto a point) to the ply,
especially of the ply is supported along the bottom edge.

(Better for shelf fixing) - batten the wall out, infill with jablite and fix
ply to battens. You now can fix heavy shelving to the battens if required.

Certain tile adhesives will stick passably to EPS too - including Mapei
kerabond (I've tried) so a dot'n'dab approach might work too.

Or look out for "2nd grade" celotex (I have some Ballytherm - same stuff,
few dints, but just as good from any practical POV). Same fixing methods
apply.

Added tip: As the garage is a draughty space, make sure there is no path
for the draughts to pass behind the insulation, negating its effect. My
preferred choice would be to foam up any gaps the sides and top of the
sheets and tape the joins between sheets, probably just with duct tape
for this kind of job. My pref is also to leave a small unsealed gap at
the bottom of each sheet in case of moisture ingress or flood so that it
can be seen and escape.

So Tim, was 'S' your maiden name ;-)
--
fred
BBC3, ITV2/3/4, channels going to the DOGs

fred
wibbled on Monday 21 September 2009 12:22

So Tim, was 'S' your maiden name ;-)

Yes - I married Norman so that when I'm old and senile, I'll still be able
to feel good about myself.

--
Tim Watts
The ****artist formerly known as Tim S

Siroflex PU foam drywall adhesive - an expanding foam with low expansivity.
I'm not sure if it would attack EPS (jablite) but I'm happy to try a bit
for you.


Watching a DG installer using foam the other day I was struck by how
well behaved the stuff was when applied with a gun rather than an
aerosol. I'm going to shell out for one, even if I only use it once in a
blue moon. It also means you don't have to throw away part used containers

Owain
wibbled on Monday 21 September 2009 13:08

On 21 Sep, 11:50, Tim W wrote:
Or surface it off with ply and screw the ply though the EPS into the
wall.

I think I'd prefer a less flammable wall covering than ply, especially
in a garage.

Owain

That mostly leaves plasterboard and cement board or metal sheet. Ply's more
helpful in terms of fixing stuff to it. It's a valid concern - though I'd
be more worried about the smoke from EPS in a fire, than something setting
ply alight (it would take an initial small fire to get it going - it's not
that easy to light).

Cheers

Tim

--
Tim Watts
The ****artist formerly known as Tim S

Stuart Noble
wibbled on Monday 21 September 2009 13:13


Siroflex PU foam drywall adhesive - an expanding foam with low
expansivity. I'm not sure if it would attack EPS (jablite) but I'm happy
to try a bit for you.


Watching a DG installer using foam the other day I was struck by how
well behaved the stuff was when applied with a gun rather than an
aerosol. I'm going to shell out for one, even if I only use it once in a
blue moon. It also means you don't have to throw away part used containers

Yes - and the foam I mentioned is exceptionally well behaved if you're
careful - it expands very little beyond the initial application. Sticky as
a sticky thing though which is good for the job and bad for your clothes!

If you were in the habit of using 2 types of foam it might even be worth
buying 2 guns - you really can leave the gun attached and it doesn't gunk
up save for the outside of the nozzle.

--
Tim Watts
The ****artist formerly known as Tim S

On Mon, 21 Sep 2009 12:13:36 GMT
Stuart Noble wrote:


Siroflex PU foam drywall adhesive - an expanding foam with low expansivity.
I'm not sure if it would attack EPS (jablite) but I'm happy to try a bit
for you.


Watching a DG installer using foam the other day I was struck by how
well behaved the stuff was when applied with a gun rather than an
aerosol. I'm going to shell out for one, even if I only use it once in a
blue moon. It also means you don't have to throw away part used containers

Buy some gunnable gun cleaner when you do, otherwise you will be
throwing the gun away instead! Also be aware that the foam canisters
have a short Use-by date. I'm still using stuff I bought long ago that
is 2 years out of date with zero effect though - still works fine.

R.

Tim W wrote:
Stuart Noble
wibbled on Monday 21 September 2009 13:13

Siroflex PU foam drywall adhesive - an expanding foam with low
expansivity. I'm not sure if it would attack EPS (jablite) but I'm happy
to try a bit for you.

Watching a DG installer using foam the other day I was struck by how
well behaved the stuff was when applied with a gun rather than an
aerosol. I'm going to shell out for one, even if I only use it once in a
blue moon. It also means you don't have to throw away part used containers

Yes - and the foam I mentioned is exceptionally well behaved if you're
careful - it expands very little beyond the initial application. Sticky as
a sticky thing though which is good for the job and bad for your clothes!

The last foam aerosol I used spat and hiccupped before delivering an
uncontollable mass. Yes, I shook it to death before use too.

If you were in the habit of using 2 types of foam it might even be worth
buying 2 guns - you really can leave the gun attached and it doesn't gunk
up save for the outside of the nozzle.


I also observed this DG guy doing the silicone seal. Wipe with
forefinger, wipe forefinger down T shirt was his method. I imagine he
leaned said item of clothing against the wall when he got home.
He reckons if you apply the right amount, you don't need any implements,
let alone a Fugenboy.

He was also telling me how superglue has transformed the DG industry.
The accelerator spray sets it instantly, so you can fix one end of a
moulding before lining it up and spraying the rest. Essential if you're
working alone I would have thought

In article , Tim W
writes
fred
wibbled on Monday 21 September 2009 12:22

So Tim, was 'S' your maiden name ;-)

Yes - I married Norman so that when I'm old and senile, I'll still be able
to feel good about myself.

I'm not altogether convinced of the benefits of newer models, they might
look the part but seem to vanish quickly when dirt under fingernails is
even a remote possibility.
--
fred
BBC3, ITV2/3/4, channels going to the DOGs

On Mon, 21 Sep 2009 01:46:23 +0100, a certain chimpanzee, David J
randomly hit the keyboard and produced:

I've got a detached house with an integral unheated garage, built in
1997 with the insulation standards of that time. The garage door is
up/over with considerable gaps, so that in winter the garage interior
is notg much warmer than the outside air.

All the interior walls in the garage are made of a thermal block
material, but I am unsure if there is also an insulated cavity on the
house side. I suspect not, as it is probably considered to be an
internal wall.

The 'garage side' walls of all the house rooms adjoining the garage
are noticeabily colder in winter, and I am wondering if it would make
sense to clad the garage/house wall with some form of insulation on
the garage side.

For the thermal insulation requirements of the Building Regulations,
any wall between a heated and an unheated space should be insulated.
There is a small insulation value for the still air within the garage,
but the insulation of the wall between the two is usually the same as
for an external wall.

That is of course no guarantee that the walls have been insulated
properly.
--
Hugo Nebula
"If no-one on the internet wants a piece of this,
just how far from the pack have you strayed?"

On Mon, 21 Sep 2009 19:15:24 +0100, Hugo Nebula abuse@localhost
wrote:

On Mon, 21 Sep 2009 01:46:23 +0100, a certain chimpanzee, David J
randomly hit the keyboard and produced:

I've got a detached house with an integral unheated garage, built in
1997 with the insulation standards of that time. The garage door is
up/over with considerable gaps, so that in winter the garage interior
is notg much warmer than the outside air.

All the interior walls in the garage are made of a thermal block
material, but I am unsure if there is also an insulated cavity on the
house side. I suspect not, as it is probably considered to be an
internal wall.

The 'garage side' walls of all the house rooms adjoining the garage
are noticeabily colder in winter, and I am wondering if it would make
sense to clad the garage/house wall with some form of insulation on
the garage side.

For the thermal insulation requirements of the Building Regulations,
any wall between a heated and an unheated space should be insulated.
There is a small insulation value for the still air within the garage,
but the insulation of the wall between the two is usually the same as
for an external wall.

That is of course no guarantee that the walls have been insulated
properly.

Very interesting.

The outside wall of the garage is brick faced and continues to the
rear of the house to become the wall of the utility room. Above are
bedrooms. So I have to assume that an insulated cavity with thermal
blocks as the inner leaf is the construction of the entire wall here.

It's rather perverse for the builder to then install a single thermal
block wall on the division between the unheated garage and the house,
where the insulation is really needed.

I have already discovered that the builders failed to insulate the
small roof cavity above the downstairs toilet, which has a tiled roof
at the first floor level - so corners were cut where possible..

David J

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember Stuart Noble
saying something like:

I also observed this DG guy doing the silicone seal. Wipe with
forefinger, wipe forefinger down T shirt was his method. I imagine he
leaned said item of clothing against the wall when he got home.
He reckons if you apply the right amount, you don't need any implements,
let alone a Fugenboy.

Ditto, except the t-shirt part. I prefer to wipe it on the curtains.