A couple of years ago I sprayed the underside of my dining room
suspended floor with
Wickes woodworm killer.
I recently noticed new exit holes in the Osmo waxed floorboards and
discovered that a couple of joist ends have been quite badly affected.
Not sure if they were like that originally as the areas are out of
sight and were probably not effectively treated being harder to get
at.
I don't want to use more of the same product and do not want to mix
different organic compounds
for health reasons. I don't know what if anything was applied before I
bought the Edwardian house but cocktails of organic long-lasting
chemicals are bad news.
Boron products look the safest but looking for products I see that I
can buy di Sodium Tetraborate Pentahydrate GPC at a fraction of the
cost of disodium octaborate tetrahydrate. The latter seems
to be available from one supplier (http://www.boron.org.uk/
technical.htm) and the former from
http://shop.readyreagents.co.uk/epag...cts/GPC8040-5Y
I obviously don't want the false economy of saving money now and
spending a lot more on timber
in the future.
Does anyone know if both chemicals are effective for treating woodworm?

On 26 June, 16:50, Michael wrote:
A couple of years ago I sprayed the underside of my dining room
suspended floor with
Wickes woodworm killer.
I recently noticed new exit holes in the Osmo waxed floorboards and
discovered that a couple of joist ends have been quite badly affected.
Not sure if they were like that originally as the areas are out of
sight and were probably not effectively treated being harder to get
at.
I don't want to use *more of the same product and do not want to mix
different organic compounds
for health reasons. I don't know what if anything was applied before I
bought the Edwardian house but cocktails of organic long-lasting
chemicals are bad news.
Boron products look the safest but looking for products I see that I
can buy di Sodium Tetraborate Pentahydrate GPC at a fraction of the
cost of disodium octaborate tetrahydrate. The latter seems
to be available from one supplier (http://www.boron.org.uk/
technical.htm) and the former fromhttp://shop.readyreagents.co.uk/epages/es115347.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=...
I obviously don't want the false economy of saving money now and
spending a lot more on timber
in the future.
Does anyone know if both chemicals are effective for treating woodworm?

If they are still around Sovereign Chemicals of Barrow in Furness had
a product called deepkill paste which killed all known insect and dry
rot infestation. I am not aware of any human casualties so I would not
spend too much time worrying myself into a frenzy over something which
isn't going to keep me awake at night. My descendants can sue who they
like if I die before I get older than I am now.

On 26 June, 20:55, cynic wrote:
On 26 June, 16:50, Michael wrote:



A couple of years ago I sprayed the underside of my dining room
suspended floor with
Wickes woodworm killer.
I recently noticed new exit holes in the Osmo waxed floorboards and
discovered that a couple of joist ends have been quite badly affected.
Not sure if they were like that originally as the areas are out of
sight and were probably not effectively treated being harder to get
at.
I don't want to use *more of the same product and do not want to mix
different organic compounds
for health reasons. I don't know what if anything was applied before I
bought the Edwardian house but cocktails of organic long-lasting
chemicals are bad news.
Boron products look the safest but looking for products I see that I
can buy di Sodium Tetraborate Pentahydrate GPC at a fraction of the
cost of disodium octaborate tetrahydrate. The latter seems
to be available from one supplier (http://www.boron.org.uk/
technical.htm) and the former fromhttp://shop.readyreagents.co.uk/epages/es115347.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=...
I obviously don't want the false economy of saving money now and
spending a lot more on timber
in the future.
Does anyone know if both chemicals are effective for treating woodworm?

If they are still around Sovereign Chemicals of Barrow in Furness had
a product called deepkill paste which killed all known insect and dry
rot infestation. I am not aware of any human casualties so I would not
spend too much time worrying myself into a frenzy over something which
isn't going to keep me awake at night. My descendants can sue who they
like if I die before I get older than I am now.

Looked at Sovereign - they don't see Boron chemicals.
Maybe I should ask the question on a chemistry forum

On Jun 27, 8:09*pm, Michael wrote:
On 26 June, 20:55, cynic wrote:



On 26 June, 16:50, Michael wrote:

A couple of years ago I sprayed the underside of my dining room
suspended floor with
Wickes woodworm killer.
I recently noticed new exit holes in the Osmo waxed floorboards and
discovered that a couple of joist ends have been quite badly affected..
Not sure if they were like that originally as the areas are out of
sight and were probably not effectively treated being harder to get
at.
I don't want to use *more of the same product and do not want to mix
different organic compounds
for health reasons. I don't know what if anything was applied before I
bought the Edwardian house but cocktails of organic long-lasting
chemicals are bad news.
Boron products look the safest but looking for products I see that I
can buy di Sodium Tetraborate Pentahydrate GPC at a fraction of the
cost of disodium octaborate tetrahydrate. The latter seems
to be available from one supplier (http://www.boron.org.uk/
technical.htm) and the former fromhttp://shop.readyreagents.co.uk/epages/es115347.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=...
I obviously don't want the false economy of saving money now and
spending a lot more on timber
in the future.
Does anyone know if both chemicals are effective for treating woodworm?

If they are still around Sovereign Chemicals of Barrow in Furness had
a product called deepkill paste which killed all known insect and dry
rot infestation. I am not aware of any human casualties so I would not
spend too much time worrying myself into a frenzy over something which
isn't going to keep me awake at night. My descendants can sue who they
like if I die before I get older than I am now.

Looked at Sovereign - they don't see Boron chemicals.
Maybe I should ask the question on a chemistry forum

its unusa to be unable to find answers to such things with google.
Chem-name woodworm should do it


NT

On 26 June, 16:50, Michael wrote:
A couple of years ago I sprayed the underside of my dining room
suspended floor with
Wickes woodworm killer.
I recently noticed new exit holes in the Osmo waxed floorboards and
discovered that a couple of joist ends have been quite badly affected.
Not sure if they were like that originally as the areas are out of
sight and were probably not effectively treated being harder to get
at.
I don't want to use *more of the same product and do not want to mix
different organic compounds
for health reasons. I don't know what if anything was applied before I
bought the Edwardian house but cocktails of organic long-lasting
chemicals are bad news.
Boron products look the safest but looking for products I see that I
can buy di Sodium Tetraborate Pentahydrate GPC at a fraction of the
cost of disodium octaborate tetrahydrate. The latter seems
to be available from one supplier (http://www.boron.org.uk/
technical.htm) and the former fromhttp://shop.readyreagents.co.uk/epages/es115347.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=...
I obviously don't want the false economy of saving money now and
spending a lot more on timber
in the future.
Does anyone know if both chemicals are effective for treating woodworm?

Dear Michael

I am uncertain as to the law on an individual amateur applying a
chemical for such use but would be surprised if it is significantly
different to that which applies to professional users.
It is against the COPR (1986) to buy sell store use etc etc any
chemical as a pesticide without it first having been passed by the HSE
testing and vetting procedure and having been given an HSE number.
That was true then and it is even truer now when the Eurocrats have
even told us that we cannot use established products unless we spend
many tens of thousands of pounds providing efficacy and other data.
Consenquently, we have fewer of our traditional effective pesticides
as the manufacturers cannot afford to pay to prove them ok

Wikes woodworm killer was probably in an organic solvent (professional
ones generally are water borne carriers of the active ingredient
carried in an emuslsion). IF you have local infestation on a few
joist ends I would treat them and anywhere else that you think you may
have missed. I would then put some paper on the top - tissue or
lining paper of the affected timbers and look at them in September
2011 to look for any post treatment emergence. Absent any and you
have fixed it - If you look at it each Sept of each year you can get
a graph of the (hopefully) declining post treatment emergence - which
is a normal phenomenon for treated wood.

I suggest it is a waste of time to make your own chemicals and may
well be illegal and lead to being used as evidence in criminal
proceedings against you.
I ceased to use Sovereign Chemicals 20 years ago when they stopped my
firms account without notice just because of too infrequent use of it
and keep telling their salesmen each time they knock on my door trying
to set up one that they should not have unilaterally and rudely cut
off my credit account.
I have been with Safeguard Chemicals ever since.
Chris
d

Michael,

It occurred to me that the main reason our houses aren't all riddled
with woodworm is that they are just too dry. You don't have any damp
around do you?

Andy

On Fri, 26 Jun 2009 08:50:47 -0700 (PDT), Michael
wrote:

Boron products look the safest but looking for products I see that I
can buy di Sodium Tetraborate Pentahydrate GPC at a fraction of the
cost of disodium octaborate tetrahydrate. The latter seems
to be available from one supplier (http://www.boron.org.uk/
technical.htm) and the former from
http://shop.readyreagents.co.uk/epag...cts/GPC8040-5Y
I obviously don't want the false economy of saving money now and
spending a lot more on timber
in the future.
Does anyone know if both chemicals are effective for treating woodworm?

AFAIK they are both effective. From what I recall when looking into it a few
years ago, when in similar circumstances: The difference between the two is in
the solubility in water. There needs to be a minimum amount of boron in the
timber. To reach this, a borax solution needs to be applied more often (ISTR ten
to twelve times), or as a very hot solution (as more will dissolve in the water
as long as it's hot). The octaborate aka Tim-Bor is more soluble, and ISTR three
cold or two warm applications are sufficient.

Someone else in the thread has commented on the issue of regulatory approval.



Thomas Prufer