"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

The use of lead-free solder to manufacture electronic goods has resulted
in a huge increase in reliability issues to a technology (soldering)
which was fully mature and totally predictable. The very low cost of the
Chinese and other far-eastern imported electronics which has flooded the
market, often makes the cost of repair of these items, prohibitive. So,
what then ?

They use the correct solder and do it properly.


By which you mean ... ??

Arfa

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Terry Fields" wrote in message
...

You couldn't make it up. Welcome to Broken Britain.

You have been reading the Daily Mail.

And the problem with that is ... ?? :-)


Not a lot IMHO, as long as you avoid all the columnists and the editorial
like the plague they are. If you do that, it (and the MoS) isn't bad. (ex
Grauniad reader who hasn't the time any more - or maybe age-onset fascism is
setting in ;o)


--
Bob Mannix
(anti-spam is as easy as 1-2-3 - not)

"Bob Mannix" wrote in message
...
"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Terry Fields" wrote in message
...

You couldn't make it up. Welcome to Broken Britain.

You have been reading the Daily Mail.

And the problem with that is ... ?? :-)


Not a lot IMHO, as long as you avoid all the columnists and the editorial
like the plague they are. If you do that, it (and the MoS) isn't bad. (ex
Grauniad reader who hasn't the time any more - or maybe age-onset fascism
is setting in ;o)


--
Bob Mannix
(anti-spam is as easy as 1-2-3 - not)


Some of the MoS columns are worth reading. William Rees-Mogg springs to
mind, and mostly Peter Hitchens, although some of his recent musings are a
bit 'radical' if perhaps the truth ...

Arfa

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Terry Fields" wrote in message
...

You couldn't make it up. Welcome to Broken Britain.

You have been reading the Daily Mail.

And the problem with that is ... ?? :-)

You don't know the problem with reading the Daily Mail? Are you serious?

"Bob Mannix" wrote in message
...
"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Terry Fields" wrote in message
...

You couldn't make it up. Welcome to Broken Britain.

You have been reading the Daily Mail.

And the problem with that is ... ?? :-)

Not a lot IMHO, as long as you avoid all the columnists and the editorial
like the plague they are.

Well apart from the football there is sweet FA left, so best avoid. The
hard of thinking read it.

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

The use of lead-free solder to manufacture electronic goods has resulted
in a huge increase in reliability issues to a technology (soldering)
which was fully mature and totally predictable. The very low cost of the
Chinese and other far-eastern imported electronics which has flooded the
market, often makes the cost of repair of these items, prohibitive. So,
what then ?

They use the correct solder and do it properly.

By which you mean ... ??

"They use the correct solder and do it properly." You must be a Daily Mail
reader.

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Terry Fields" wrote in message
...

You couldn't make it up. Welcome to Broken Britain.

You have been reading the Daily Mail.

And the problem with that is ... ?? :-)

You don't know the problem with reading the Daily Mail? Are you serious?

I am. Do tell ...

Arfa

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

The use of lead-free solder to manufacture electronic goods has
resulted in a huge increase in reliability issues to a technology
(soldering) which was fully mature and totally predictable. The very
low cost of the Chinese and other far-eastern imported electronics
which has flooded the market, often makes the cost of repair of these
items, prohibitive. So, what then ?

They use the correct solder and do it properly.

By which you mean ... ??

"They use the correct solder and do it properly." You must be a Daily
Mail reader.


Ah ... It is now abundantly clear why your nic is "Drivel"

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/drivel

Was it given to you, or did you pick it all on your own ... ?

Arfa

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

The use of lead-free solder to manufacture electronic goods has
resulted in a huge increase in reliability issues to a technology
(soldering) which was fully mature and totally predictable. The very
low cost of the Chinese and other far-eastern imported electronics
which has flooded the market, often makes the cost of repair of these
items, prohibitive. So, what then ?

They use the correct solder and do it properly.

By which you mean ... ??

"They use the correct solder and do it properly." You must be a Daily
Mail reader.


Ah ... It is now abundantly clear why your nic is "Drivel"

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/drivel

I instantly recognise drivel, that is why I an Doctor Drivel. I see it in
the Daily Mail.

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

The use of lead-free solder to manufacture electronic goods has
resulted in a huge increase in reliability issues to a technology
(soldering) which was fully mature and totally predictable. The very
low cost of the Chinese and other far-eastern imported electronics
which has flooded the market, often makes the cost of repair of these
items, prohibitive. So, what then ?

They use the correct solder and do it properly.

By which you mean ... ??

"They use the correct solder and do it properly." You must be a Daily
Mail reader.


Ah ... It is now abundantly clear why your nic is "Drivel"

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/drivel

I instantly recognise drivel, that is why I an Doctor Drivel. I see it in
the Daily Mail.


Riiiiiiggghht ... Gotcha now. You're the last genuine Daily Mirror reader.
Sorry. Didn't recognise you out there in the dark ...

Arfa

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Terry Fields" wrote in message
...

You couldn't make it up. Welcome to Broken Britain.

You have been reading the Daily Mail.

And the problem with that is ... ?? :-)

You don't know the problem with reading the Daily Mail? Are you serious?

I am. Do tell ...

Arfa

C'mon then Drivel. Cat got your tongue now ?

Arfa

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

The use of lead-free solder to manufacture electronic goods has
resulted in a huge increase in reliability issues to a technology
(soldering) which was fully mature and totally predictable. The very
low cost of the Chinese and other far-eastern imported electronics
which has flooded the market, often makes the cost of repair of these
items, prohibitive. So, what then ?

They use the correct solder and do it properly.

By which you mean ... ??

"They use the correct solder and do it properly." You must be a Daily
Mail reader.


You still make no sense. The words are English, but the meaning is Double
Dutch. Explain yourself. I don't know about your nic meaning that you can
spot drivel, seems to me that it holds far more meaning in regard of the
drivel you speak. As the saying goes, "Physician - heal thyself ..."

Arfa

On Feb 24, 5:56*pm, "Doctor Drivel" wrote:
"Arfa Daily" wrote in message

...







"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

The use of lead-free solder to manufacture electronic goods has
resulted in a huge increase in reliability issues to a technology
(soldering) which was fully mature and totally predictable. The very
low cost of the Chinese and other far-eastern imported electronics
which has flooded the market, often makes the cost of repair of these
items, prohibitive. So, what then ?

They use the correct solder and do it properly.

By which you mean ... ??

"They use the correct solder and do it properly." *You must be a Daily
Mail reader.

Ah ... *It is now abundantly clear why your nic is "Drivel"

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/drivel

I instantly recognise drivel, that is why I an Doctor Drivel. *I see it in
the Daily Mail.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -
..
From Canada.
While some of the newer CFLs (Compact Fluorescents) have a better
light spectrum there are now some problems showing up with
reliability. Locally, as discussed on our CBC (Canadian Broadcasting
Corp.) station, there have been a few burn ups. Not necessarily in
enclosed fixtures, although bathroom dampness MAY have been a factor
in one case. In another it set fire to the fixture and the house
needed considerable ventilation to get rid of a strong
'electrolytically' smell.
Some research found that there are recommendations from some other
places in North America to not to use them in 'damp' locations such
as, say, a bathroom (even a bathroom equipped with exhaust fan)!
Another not to use them in outdoor/damp fixtures!
Another poster complained about a high failure rate or MTBF (Mean time
between failures) although the supplier would replace any that failed
during first two years. It sounded in that case as though the use was
in a condo or apartment block where the high number of failures
compared to the 'expected' life would be more noticeable and, at from
$3 to $5 per CFL a more significant cost factor.
We have used CFLs on a very limited basis for two/three main reasons.
1) We heat electrically anyway. So any energy saving from CFLs merely
requires more electric heating!
2) CFLs are more costly. Compared to a 25 cent incandescent a
fluorescent costs 10 to 20 times more.
3) CFLs do not work as well when outside temps. are well below
freezing (Minus 20 Celsius) which is where wasted heat energy is lost
to outdoors!
4) It is recommended that CFL life is best if they are switched and
left on for extended periods. This is not the case for say, stairways,
bathrooms, closets and other short period uses.
5) Technically CFLs are classified as 'Hazardous waste' and SHOULD be
treated as such.
The one and only CFL failure we have had (cos we use so few anyway)
was;
a) Where the plastic base became loose. And the bulb now loose in the
fixture just sort of hung there by it's wires! Then b) There was a
defective component. Also later dissecting it we found two poorly
soldered wires in the little printed circuit board.
Conclusion: CFLs are not yet a proven product.
1) They may save energy in certain instances. Not in others.
2) More costly and require greater manufacturing use of various
materials, time and energy.
3) Not as suitable for low temperature use. e.g outside where they can
be an energy saver.
4) Not as suitable for on/off short term use; which manufacturers
themselves do not recommend. leaving them switched on therefore use
more energy!
5) Require treatment as Haz. Waste; although how many are just pitched
in the landfill? Our recycling depots won't even take them! And the
garbage collector crews are not supposed to take them either, but if
they are inside a bag of garbage!
6) Reliability and actual working life?

"stan" wrote in message
...
On Feb 24, 5:56 pm, "Doctor Drivel" wrote:
"Arfa Daily" wrote in message

...







"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

The use of lead-free solder to manufacture electronic goods has
resulted in a huge increase in reliability issues to a technology
(soldering) which was fully mature and totally predictable. The very
low cost of the Chinese and other far-eastern imported electronics
which has flooded the market, often makes the cost of repair of
these
items, prohibitive. So, what then ?

They use the correct solder and do it properly.

By which you mean ... ??

"They use the correct solder and do it properly." You must be a Daily
Mail reader.

Ah ... It is now abundantly clear why your nic is "Drivel"

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/drivel

I instantly recognise drivel, that is why I an Doctor Drivel. I see it in
the Daily Mail.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -
..
From Canada.
While some of the newer CFLs (Compact Fluorescents) have a better
light spectrum there are now some problems showing up with
reliability. Locally, as discussed on our CBC (Canadian Broadcasting
Corp.) station, there have been a few burn ups. Not necessarily in
enclosed fixtures, although bathroom dampness MAY have been a factor
in one case. In another it set fire to the fixture and the house
needed considerable ventilation to get rid of a strong
'electrolytically' smell.
Some research found that there are recommendations from some other
places in North America to not to use them in 'damp' locations such
as, say, a bathroom (even a bathroom equipped with exhaust fan)!
Another not to use them in outdoor/damp fixtures!
Another poster complained about a high failure rate or MTBF (Mean time
between failures) although the supplier would replace any that failed
during first two years. It sounded in that case as though the use was
in a condo or apartment block where the high number of failures
compared to the 'expected' life would be more noticeable and, at from
$3 to $5 per CFL a more significant cost factor.
We have used CFLs on a very limited basis for two/three main reasons.
1) We heat electrically anyway. So any energy saving from CFLs merely
requires more electric heating!
2) CFLs are more costly. Compared to a 25 cent incandescent a
fluorescent costs 10 to 20 times more.
3) CFLs do not work as well when outside temps. are well below
freezing (Minus 20 Celsius) which is where wasted heat energy is lost
to outdoors!
4) It is recommended that CFL life is best if they are switched and
left on for extended periods. This is not the case for say, stairways,
bathrooms, closets and other short period uses.
5) Technically CFLs are classified as 'Hazardous waste' and SHOULD be
treated as such.
The one and only CFL failure we have had (cos we use so few anyway)
was;
a) Where the plastic base became loose. And the bulb now loose in the
fixture just sort of hung there by it's wires! Then b) There was a
defective component. Also later dissecting it we found two poorly
soldered wires in the little printed circuit board.
Conclusion: CFLs are not yet a proven product.
1) They may save energy in certain instances. Not in others.
2) More costly and require greater manufacturing use of various
materials, time and energy.
3) Not as suitable for low temperature use. e.g outside where they can
be an energy saver.
4) Not as suitable for on/off short term use; which manufacturers
themselves do not recommend. leaving them switched on therefore use
more energy!
5) Require treatment as Haz. Waste; although how many are just pitched
in the landfill? Our recycling depots won't even take them! And the
garbage collector crews are not supposed to take them either, but if
they are inside a bag of garbage!
6) Reliability and actual working life?

I'm beginning to have real difficulty with this. Many of us here understand
the shortcomings of these lamps, and it would seem that you folk over in
Canada do too. Why are we all letting ourselves be steamrollered like this ?
Is it just that in the name of this deluge of eco-bollox from the green mist
brigade, we are becoming brow-beaten into just accepting that if the
government say so, it must be right ?

If anybody reading this doesn't know just what is in one of these lamps -
and hence the manufacturing budget to produce them, and why they go wrong -
take a look at

http://www.pavouk.org/hw/lamp/en_index.html

If you can get past the nvg English, it's a very good site.

Arfa

On Feb 26, 6:15*am, "Arfa Daily" wrote:

I'm beginning to have real difficulty with this. Many of us here understand
the shortcomings of these lamps, and it would seem that you folk over in
Canada do too. Why are we all letting ourselves be steamrollered like this ?
Is it just that in the name of this deluge of eco-bollox from the green mist
brigade, we are becoming brow-beaten into just accepting that if the
government say so, it must be right ?

If anybody reading this doesn't know just what is in one of these lamps -
and hence the manufacturing budget to produce them, and why they go wrong -
take a look at

http://www.pavouk.org/hw/lamp/en_index.html

If you can get past the nvg English, it's a very good site.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi Arfa! (Not Askey is it?)

Thanks for the comment; this thread coincides with a recent local
discussion (In this particular Can province), inspired by a medical
doctor after a 'near-fire' (It actually burnt her bathroom fixture! to
point where it had to be replaced!).
So she contacted the local Fire Dept./Fire Commissioner and learnt
that there HAD been some concerns with a few minor 'incidents'
involving CFLs. Whether more so than with other 'bulbs/lamps' was not
clear.

I heard her discussion on the local radio and contacted her to swap
experiences. An intelligent professional she immediately recognised my
contention that any/most electrcity brought into a home is, one way or
another, turned into heat. No matter how it is used. Two 'wasters',
however, being warm shower water that goes straight down the drain and
electric clothes dryer blowing warm damp air outside. Also come to
think of it a dishwasher that sends its effluent down the kitchen
drain ..... Ah well; it will wash away the dead peas and congealed
bacon grease!!!!

Also since New Year we have had several fire deaths (including three
children) blamed on 'An electrical problem'. However those electrical
problems could have been due, IMO, to anything; considering the bone-
headed risks some people take!

There seems to some sort of herd instinct towards being told "If it's
green it's the way to go". And CFLs are 'GREEN', right?

Well, MAYBE! And any energy conserving can be a) Good for environment
and b) Possibly defer capital expensditures?

But one would have thought that by now in this information age we
should all be cynical enough to not buy the instant solution, the
miracle drug, the 'fat cure', the car that runs on (or uses some
water) and so forth and especailly the government inspired 'Fast
solution'..

For example I have neighbours; very good ones by the way, one could
not ask for better, who have gone heavily into CFLs. My 'Buddy' now
complains when he comes over many nights for a 'cuppa' that his
electricity bill has not reduced at all!

Well that makes sense they, like us use electric heating and most
months of the year, here, require some heating. Especially cool
evenings when the lights tend to be on anyway! He does however have
three CFLS outside his front door and garage that are on all night
most nights. And despite low temps. they work quite well and are
saving him energy.

However to deter prowlers (An amusing story there, for another time!)
he installed (with my help) a mercury vapour back yard lamp controlled
by a built in photo cell. It also lights up the area behind his
transport truck which is parked next to his two bay garage and double
driveway. So that, while a powerful light, it uses another 100 or so
watts, for most of each night.

Maybe one of these days we will have an LED wall or ceiling or
reflective window that shines inwards and use less energy with greater
simplicity?

BTW just for giggles bought (At the one dollar emporium, everything
there is one dollar unless otherwise marked "Two for a dollar etc") a
one dollar LED night light bulb. That we are now trying out in the
bathroom in place of the 7 watt incandescent, in the existing little
plug in fixture that includes a photo cell, it replaces. It has a
number of components under a little plastic cover and this one has a
weird bright white metallic sort of light.

We already had a couple orange, non photo cell LEDs 'Night lights'
plugged into outlets in the passageway to bedrooms etc. The idea being
to see if there was any incompatibility between the little plug in
with its photo cell, designed for an incandescent but now fitted with
the mini-LED. That one dollar by the way is no more IIRC than the cost
of half of those two-pack 7 watt incandescent (Christmas tree style)
bulbs/lamps. So far after several weeks no signs of incompatibility!

Again talking about compatibility. Haven't tested the new LED for
radio noise (RFI) yet. Always a question. Some dimmers create a lot of
radio 'hash'*. For example we have one non-rechargeable AC plug in
shaver that creates clicks at radio frequencies when off. We have to
remember to unplug it! Probably a multi voltage device?

PS. Seem to remember that the word 'hash' was in use long before an
current connection with 'The weed'? And back when it originally meant
'Bubble and squeak' or Sunday's dinner fried up on Monday, it also
meant unwanted radio noise/interfereence.

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

The use of lead-free solder to manufacture electronic goods has
resulted in a huge increase in reliability issues to a technology
(soldering) which was fully mature and totally predictable. The very
low cost of the Chinese and other far-eastern imported electronics
which has flooded the market, often makes the cost of repair of these
items, prohibitive. So, what then ?

They use the correct solder and do it properly.

By which you mean ... ??

"They use the correct solder and do it properly." You must be a Daily
Mail reader.


You still make no sense. The words are English, but the meaning is Double
Dutch. Explain yourself.

What I write is clear - unfortunately you are brainwashed by the Daily Mail.

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

"Doctor Drivel" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...

The use of lead-free solder to manufacture electronic goods has
resulted in a huge increase in reliability issues to a technology
(soldering) which was fully mature and totally predictable. The very
low cost of the Chinese and other far-eastern imported electronics
which has flooded the market, often makes the cost of repair of these
items, prohibitive. So, what then ?

They use the correct solder and do it properly.

By which you mean ... ??

"They use the correct solder and do it properly." You must be a Daily
Mail reader.


You still make no sense. The words are English, but the meaning is Double
Dutch. Explain yourself.

What I write is clear - unfortunately you are brainwashed by the Daily
Mail.


You clearly don't have a brain at all. **** ...

Arfa