Hi All,

I currently have a double 13A socket that is going to be temporarily
lost behind a unit in the lounge and would like to replace that with a
suitable (switched / fused) faceplate running ~1m to a 4 way gang that
I can then plug light / portable stuff into (mobile phone chargers,
network kit and the like). Ideally the faceplate would have bottom
rather than front cable entry to keep the profile as low as possible.

Now I've seen all combinations in the single box size but not double
(I'd be happy with a single outlet and the other half blank but it
would all have to be the size of a double).

I would like to have maybe 10A (just in case) so a clock socket
probably wouldn't do (and only come in singles I think).

Any thoughts please?

All the best ..

T i m

p.s. I don't really want to move the socket elsewhere, re-work the
double back box into a single nor cut the unit in that area if I can
help it . :-(

p.p.s I'm more bothered about doing it easily, neatly and safely than
anything else wink.

On Mon, 01 Sep 2008 15:49:04 +0100, T i m wrote:

Hi All,

I currently have a double 13A socket that is going to be temporarily
lost behind a unit in the lounge and would like to replace that with a
suitable (switched / fused) faceplate running ~1m to a 4 way gang that
I can then plug light / portable stuff into (mobile phone chargers,
network kit and the like). Ideally the faceplate would have bottom
rather than front cable entry to keep the profile as low as possible.

Now I've seen all combinations in the single box size but not double
(I'd be happy with a single outlet and the other half blank but it
would all have to be the size of a double).

I would like to have maybe 10A (just in case) so a clock socket
probably wouldn't do (and only come in singles I think).

Any thoughts please?

All the best ..

T i m

p.s. I don't really want to move the socket elsewhere, re-work the
double back box into a single nor cut the unit in that area if I can
help it . :-(

p.p.s I'm more bothered about doing it easily, neatly and safely than
anything else wink.

I've no idea what it is you are looking for but can't you use an
extension lead .I have one that is both switched and fused and iirc
has 4 sockets . The switch does disconnect ALL the sockets but you can
get something like this
http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?...C=SO&U=Strat15

wrote in message
...
On Mon, 01 Sep 2008 15:49:04 +0100, T i m wrote:

Hi All,

I currently have a double 13A socket that is going to be temporarily
lost behind a unit in the lounge and would like to replace that with a
suitable (switched / fused) faceplate running ~1m to a 4 way gang that
I can then plug light / portable stuff into (mobile phone chargers,
network kit and the like). Ideally the faceplate would have bottom
rather than front cable entry to keep the profile as low as possible.

Now I've seen all combinations in the single box size but not double
(I'd be happy with a single outlet and the other half blank but it
would all have to be the size of a double).

I would like to have maybe 10A (just in case) so a clock socket
probably wouldn't do (and only come in singles I think).

Any thoughts please?

All the best ..

T i m

p.s. I don't really want to move the socket elsewhere, re-work the
double back box into a single nor cut the unit in that area if I can
help it . :-(

p.p.s I'm more bothered about doing it easily, neatly and safely than
anything else wink.

I've no idea what it is you are looking for but can't you use an
extension lead .I have one that is both switched and fused and iirc
has 4 sockets . The switch does disconnect ALL the sockets but you can
get something like this

I know exactly what he is looking for but I can't see the advantage in using
a switched FCU over an extension lead. In either case the switch will be
inaccessible. Even with an unswitched FCU the fuse will be inaccesible. This
being the case, why not just use the extension lead?

By enlarging the hole sideways about 25mm you could fit one of these:

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/AP636.html

and then fit two FCU's side by side or an FCU and a blanking plate. The
advantage of this approach is that it still doesn't look too bad if it is
revealed at a later state and converted to two single 13A sockets.


--
Bob Mannix
(anti-spam is as easy as 1-2-3 - not)

"T i m" wrote in message
...
Hi All,

I currently have a double 13A socket that is going to be temporarily
lost behind a unit in the lounge and would like to replace that with a
suitable (switched / fused) faceplate running ~1m to a 4 way gang that
I can then plug light / portable stuff into (mobile phone chargers,
network kit and the like). Ideally the faceplate would have bottom
rather than front cable entry to keep the profile as low as possible.

Now I've seen all combinations in the single box size but not double
(I'd be happy with a single outlet and the other half blank but it
would all have to be the size of a double).

I would like to have maybe 10A (just in case) so a clock socket
probably wouldn't do (and only come in singles I think).

Any thoughts please?

All the best ..

T i m

p.s. I don't really want to move the socket elsewhere, re-work the
double back box into a single nor cut the unit in that area if I can
help it . :-(

p.p.s I'm more bothered about doing it easily, neatly and safely than
anything else wink.

One option is

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/74950/Electrical/Switches-Sockets/MK-Grid-Plus/13A-Fuse-Unit-Module

feeding

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/63994/Electrical/Switches-Sockets/MK-Grid-Plus/20A-SP-2-Way-Secret-Key-Switch-Module

with this
http://www.screwfix.com/prods/82380/Electrical/Switches-Sockets/MK-Grid-Plus/3G-Module-White-Front-Plate

this

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/40024/Electrical/Switches-Sockets/MK-Grid-Plus/3-Module-Grid-Frame

and this

a blanking module that is not for sale at Screwfix

Carefully cut/file/drill the faceplate at the point you wish to bring the
cable out and you should not have to worry too much about the profile.

Not a cheap way of doing it though.

Adam

On Mon, 1 Sep 2008 16:55:52 +0100, "Bob Mannix"
wrote:


I know exactly what he is looking for

phew ;-)

but I can't see the advantage in using
a switched FCU over an extension lead. In either case the switch will be
inaccessible. Even with an unswitched FCU the fuse will be inaccesible. This
being the case, why not just use the extension lead?

Ah, ok, I'll try to explain better. The space between the unit and the
existing double 13A socket is too small to even allow a std 13A
plug-top to be plugged in. So I was hoping to 'temporarily' remove the
double socket and fit some form of cable outlet and then a trailing
socket (4 way will do). I don't really want or need a fuse or switch
there but thought I might have to have one (and / or should have one
to protect the flex) and why I mentioned having a higher rating fuse
in this socket than in the trailing lead (so the lead in the fuse
would blow before the one in the plate ... hopefully). If I had to I
could pull the unit out (to change a fuse etc).

By enlarging the hole sideways about 25mm you could fit one of these:

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/AP636.html

and then fit two FCU's side by side or an FCU and a blanking plate. The
advantage of this approach is that it still doesn't look too bad if it is
revealed at a later state and converted to two single 13A sockets.

I had thought of that Bob but it will involve quite a bit of work (and
potential damage) as I fitted these boxes / sockets some years ago and
I'm pretty sure they won't come out easily.

But still, a good option for the reasons you gave (so thanks). It's on
the option list now. ;-)

All the best ..

T i m

On Mon, 01 Sep 2008 17:10:00 GMT someone who may be "ARWadworth"
wrote this:-

Carefully cut/file/drill the faceplate at the point you wish to bring the
cable out and you should not have to worry too much about the profile.

How is the flex emerging from the faceplate to be clamped?


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

On Mon, 01 Sep 2008 19:30:40 +0100 someone who may be T i m
wrote this:-

So I was hoping to 'temporarily' remove the
double socket and fit some form of cable outlet and then a trailing
socket (4 way will do).

I have never seen what you want. That doesn't mean they don't exist,
but I haven't seen anything suitable. You might want to peruse the
grid ranges of Crabtree and MK to see if anything suitable could be
assembled, but make sure there is a clam for the outgoing cable and
proper protection against chafing.

I don't really want or need a fuse or switch
there but thought I might have to have one (and / or should have one
to protect the flex) and why I mentioned having a higher rating fuse
in this socket than in the trailing lead (so the lead in the fuse
would blow before the one in the plate ... hopefully). If I had to I
could pull the unit out (to change a fuse etc).

I wouldn't bank on discrimination between the fuses, even if one is
10A and one 3A.




--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

On Mon, 01 Sep 2008 17:10:00 GMT, "ARWadworth"
wrote:


One option is

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/74950/Electrical/Switches-Sockets/MK-Grid-Plus/13A-Fuse-Unit-Module

feeding

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/63994/Electrical/Switches-Sockets/MK-Grid-Plus/20A-SP-2-Way-Secret-Key-Switch-Module

with this
http://www.screwfix.com/prods/82380/Electrical/Switches-Sockets/MK-Grid-Plus/3G-Module-White-Front-Plate

this

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/40024/Electrical/Switches-Sockets/MK-Grid-Plus/3-Module-Grid-Frame

and this

a blanking module that is not for sale at Screwfix

Cripes, thanks for that (and I could see where you were going after
the first link). ;-)

Carefully cut/file/drill the faceplate at the point you wish to bring the
cable out and you should not have to worry too much about the profile.

Ah, I wondered how you were going to get past that stage Bob g. I
thought the last one was going to be a cable exit / gland but as you
say it would probably stick out too far.

Not a cheap way of doing it though.

No, but it might be cheaper in time and effort ... and easily
reversible.

So, I assume the grid mates with a standard double back box (I
probably fitted deep ones)?

So, from the electrical pov, *should* I have a (DP probably) switch
and fuse, to protect the cable from the box to the fused 4 way
trailing socket please?

All the best ..

T i m

"David Hansen" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 01 Sep 2008 17:10:00 GMT someone who may be "ARWadworth"
wrote this:-

Carefully cut/file/drill the faceplate at the point you wish to bring the
cable out and you should not have to worry too much about the profile.

How is the flex emerging from the faceplate to be clamped?

A good point. One that I missed.

There is a proper cord outlet that would take up the 3rd module instead of
the blank. I cannot find my MK catalogue for love nor money and cannot guve
a cat no.

Adam

On Mon, 01 Sep 2008 19:17:22 GMT, "ARWadworth"
wrote:


"David Hansen" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 01 Sep 2008 17:10:00 GMT someone who may be "ARWadworth"
wrote this:-

Carefully cut/file/drill the faceplate at the point you wish to bring the
cable out and you should not have to worry too much about the profile.

How is the flex emerging from the faceplate to be clamped?

A good point. One that I missed.

There is a proper cord outlet that would take up the 3rd module instead of
the blank.

I cannot find my MK catalogue for love nor money

http://www.mkelectric.co.uk/PDF/tech..._PLUS_prod.pdf

and cannot guve
a cat no.

K4886 WHI ?

But, as we thought, I think this brings the cable out at 90 deg to the
plate (so will intrude into the room) .. :-(

Mind you, it will be easier to put a bit of a bend in some flex than
to squash a plug top! ;-)

All the best ...

T i m

T i m wrote:
On Mon, 1 Sep 2008 16:55:52 +0100, "Bob Mannix"
wrote:


I know exactly what he is looking for

phew ;-)

but I can't see the advantage in using
a switched FCU over an extension lead. In either case the switch
will be inaccessible. Even with an unswitched FCU the fuse will be
inaccesible. This being the case, why not just use the extension
lead?

Ah, ok, I'll try to explain better. The space between the unit and the
existing double 13A socket is too small to even allow a std 13A
plug-top to be plugged in.

Perfect excuse to buy a Fein Multimaster or Bosch PMF180. Cut a rectangle
out of the back of the unit so a plugtop will fit.

Does the job & you get a new power tool...


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

On Mon, 01 Sep 2008 21:22:42 GMT, "The Medway Handyman"
wrote:


Perfect excuse to buy a Fein Multimaster or Bosch PMF180. Cut a rectangle
out of the back of the unit so a plugtop will fit.

Does the job & you get a new power tool...

;-)

I have a similar tool (but not as flash) but if I cut away sufficient
to allow a plug to pass the unit wall collapse.

All the best ..

T i m

In article ,
T i m wrote:
Ah, ok, I'll try to explain better. The space between the unit and the
existing double 13A socket is too small to even allow a std 13A
plug-top to be plugged in. So I was hoping to 'temporarily' remove the
double socket and fit some form of cable outlet and then a trailing
socket (4 way will do). I don't really want or need a fuse or switch
there but thought I might have to have one (and / or should have one
to protect the flex) and why I mentioned having a higher rating fuse
in this socket than in the trailing lead (so the lead in the fuse
would blow before the one in the plate ... hopefully). If I had to I
could pull the unit out (to change a fuse etc).

Wicks do a FCU with bottom flex exit.

--
*The older you get, the better you realize you were.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 00:29:28 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
T i m wrote:
Ah, ok, I'll try to explain better. The space between the unit and the
existing double 13A socket is too small to even allow a std 13A
plug-top to be plugged in. So I was hoping to 'temporarily' remove the
double socket and fit some form of cable outlet and then a trailing
socket (4 way will do). I don't really want or need a fuse or switch
there but thought I might have to have one (and / or should have one
to protect the flex) and why I mentioned having a higher rating fuse
in this socket than in the trailing lead (so the lead in the fuse
would blow before the one in the plate ... hopefully). If I had to I
could pull the unit out (to change a fuse etc).

Wicks do a FCU with bottom flex exit.

Hmm, that'll be a single though won't it Dave?

I'll have a look inside this double and see how easy it might be to
fit a twin box (as suggested previously).

All the best ..

T i m

On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 00:35:53 +0100, Owain
wrote:

T i m wrote:
I currently have a double 13A socket that is going to be temporarily
lost behind a unit in the lounge and would like to replace that with a
suitable (switched / fused) faceplate running ~1m to a 4 way gang that
I can then plug light / portable stuff into (mobile phone chargers,
network kit and the like). Ideally the faceplate would have bottom
rather than front cable entry to keep the profile as low as possible.

You could use a double blanking plate, cut a recess at the bottom to
take a surface cable and run that along the wall as an unfused spur to a
location convenient for a FCU and 4-way strip.

Ok ...

A fused 4-way strip could
in theory be connected without a FCU but all the ones I've seen have
mfr's instrructions that say that an external 13A fuse is essential, so
that would be non-compliant if you didn't have that.

Ok, and not a real issue. I *can* get the unit out to service a fuse
and would like to keep it on in reasonable (practical) spec.

The cable would have to be clipped or otherwise fastened.

It could well only be a very short run thought Owain, from the wall
nearly directly to the 4 way?

Ordinary
junction boxes etc do not have cable clamps and they are not regarded as
unsafe.

Ok ..

Provided the cable is sufficiently well fastened to the wall
surface (and nailing clips into wooden plugs would probably be better
than nailing the pins into plaster) it should be sfae enough for
domestic use, given it'll be behind furniture so small children etc
shouldn't be able to tug it.

Exactly. I would prefer a proper FCU for the fuse, the dp isolation
and the cable clamp and will go for that if practically feasible (and
I've been given a few good ideas now). ;-)

It is not "best" practice. One point to watch is that the cable is not
chafed by the edge of the metal flush back box.

Understood. If I did such I would always protect by suitable edging /
grommets etc.

All the best ..

T i m

In article ,
T i m wrote:
Ah, ok, I'll try to explain better. The space between the unit and the
existing double 13A socket is too small to even allow a std 13A
plug-top to be plugged in. So I was hoping to 'temporarily' remove the
double socket and fit some form of cable outlet and then a trailing
socket (4 way will do). I don't really want or need a fuse or switch
there but thought I might have to have one (and / or should have one
to protect the flex) and why I mentioned having a higher rating fuse
in this socket than in the trailing lead (so the lead in the fuse
would blow before the one in the plate ... hopefully). If I had to I
could pull the unit out (to change a fuse etc).

Wicks do a FCU with bottom flex exit.

Hmm, that'll be a single though won't it Dave?

I'll have a look inside this double and see how easy it might be to
fit a twin box (as suggested previously).

No need - as it's temporary and covered by the furniture simply fix to one
side of the existing box. You could cut down a one gang blank plate and
make some form of strap between the two if you want a higher strenght
fixing combined with a safety cover. Then it will be easier to
reinstate the two gang socket.

All the best ..

--
*Why don't you ever see the headline "Psychic Wins Lottery"?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 09:35:56 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:


Wicks do a FCU with bottom flex exit.

Hmm, that'll be a single though won't it Dave?

I'll have a look inside this double and see how easy it might be to
fit a twin box (as suggested previously).

No need - as it's temporary and covered by the furniture simply fix to one
side of the existing box. You could cut down a one gang blank plate and
make some form of strap between the two if you want a higher strenght
fixing combined with a safety cover. Then it will be easier to
reinstate the two gang socket.

Ah, a 'thinking outside the box' solution. ;-)

I guess that as long as the single plate is reasonably stable and the
hole filled up then not much can go wrong eh (not pretty but safe
enough, electrically etc). Especially behind a unit. ;-)

All the best and thanks Dave.

T i m

In article ,
T i m wrote:
No need - as it's temporary and covered by the furniture simply fix to one
side of the existing box. You could cut down a one gang blank plate and
make some form of strap between the two if you want a higher strenght
fixing combined with a safety cover. Then it will be easier to
reinstate the two gang socket.

Ah, a 'thinking outside the box' solution. ;-)

I guess that as long as the single plate is reasonably stable and the
hole filled up then not much can go wrong eh (not pretty but safe
enough, electrically etc). Especially behind a unit. ;-)

Plates tend to sit on the wall so a one gang in a two gang box will be
supported on three sides. Of course the majority of the strength in these
things is in the outside rib which you'd need to remove on one side to fit
the smaller box - but if concerned about strength use a metal one.

However, if you use a plastic plate and cut it accurately, araldite a
steel strip on the back to provide a fixing for the second screw (perhaps
a self tapper) you'll end up with a neat safe and secure result.

--
*I have a degree in liberal arts -- do you want fries with that

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 01:05:18 +0100, Owain
wrote:

Owain wrote:
You could use a double blanking plate, cut a recess at the bottom to
take a surface cable and run that along the wall as an unfused spur to a
location convenient for a FCU and 4-way strip.

That would have to be 2.5mm minimum or whatever your ring circuit is
wired in.

Good point / noted.

All the best ..

T i m

On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 11:18:46 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
T i m wrote:
No need - as it's temporary and covered by the furniture simply fix to one
side of the existing box. You could cut down a one gang blank plate and
make some form of strap between the two if you want a higher strenght
fixing combined with a safety cover. Then it will be easier to
reinstate the two gang socket.

Ah, a 'thinking outside the box' solution. ;-)

I guess that as long as the single plate is reasonably stable and the
hole filled up then not much can go wrong eh (not pretty but safe
enough, electrically etc). Especially behind a unit. ;-)

Plates tend to sit on the wall so a one gang in a two gang box will be
supported on three sides.

Agreed.

Of course the majority of the strength in these
things is in the outside rib which you'd need to remove on one side to fit
the smaller box - but if concerned about strength use a metal one.

But this is only the blanking plate yes?

However, if you use a plastic plate and cut it accurately, araldite a
steel strip on the back to provide a fixing for the second screw (perhaps
a self tapper) you'll end up with a neat safe and secure result.

I was thinking about that and considered bending a bit of 10mm x 2mm
strip to form a offset square 'C' section, the long side screwed to
the back of the box with two self tappers and the short leg under the
floating mounting plate hole on the FCU (tapped to 4BA or whatever
those box screws are). I could even drill another hole in the trimmed
blanking plate and fit a suitable spacer underneath and another tapped
hole in my bracket. ;-)

All the best ..

T i m

On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 11:18:46 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:


Plates tend to sit on the wall so a one gang in a two gang box will be
supported on three sides. Of course the majority of the strength in these
things is in the outside rib which you'd need to remove on one side to fit
the smaller box - but if concerned about strength use a metal one.

However, if you use a plastic plate and cut it accurately, araldite a
steel strip on the back to provide a fixing for the second screw (perhaps
a self tapper) you'll end up with a neat safe and secure result.

Well, I got the FCU, a couple of blanking plates, a short length of
16A flex and the multiway and upon inspection found (and something I
had in the back of my mind) that the metal back boxes also had the 2
lugs on the long sides top and bottom. The meant I could fit the FCU
sideways (not ideal but fully functional and brought the cable out
perfectly) and retained with two screws and a blanking plate suitably
trimmed fitted using two screws over the remaining space. ;-)

All in all took ten minutes, is pretty safe and easily reversible! ;-)

Thanks to all who replied, it all helped.

Al the best ..

T i m

"T i m" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 02 Sep 2008 11:18:46 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:


Plates tend to sit on the wall so a one gang in a two gang box will be
supported on three sides. Of course the majority of the strength in these
things is in the outside rib which you'd need to remove on one side to fit
the smaller box - but if concerned about strength use a metal one.

However, if you use a plastic plate and cut it accurately, araldite a
steel strip on the back to provide a fixing for the second screw (perhaps
a self tapper) you'll end up with a neat safe and secure result.

Well, I got the FCU, a couple of blanking plates, a short length of
16A flex and the multiway and upon inspection found (and something I
had in the back of my mind) that the metal back boxes also had the 2
lugs on the long sides top and bottom. The meant I could fit the FCU
sideways (not ideal but fully functional and brought the cable out
perfectly) and retained with two screws and a blanking plate suitably
trimmed fitted using two screws over the remaining space. ;-)

All in all took ten minutes, is pretty safe and easily reversible! ;-)

Thanks to all who replied, it all helped.

Al the best ..

T i m

You lucky sod.

Adam

On Thu, 04 Sep 2008 00:33:43 GMT, "ARWadworth"
wrote:


All in all took ten minutes, is pretty safe and easily reversible! ;-)

Thanks to all who replied, it all helped.

Al the best ..

T i m

You lucky sod.

Tell me about it Adam!

Or maybe it was foresight when I fitted the back boxes all those years
ago (not)! ;-)

All the best ..

T i m