Ok, i've googled to no avail, so i'm stopping by in here.

I have a Riello 40 fired boiler, but it's going into constant lockout.
It's had a couple of emergency 20L oil drums thrown into the tank, and
the oil has been bled through to within about 1ft of the boiler.

It's not exactly 'flowing' as the tank is still quite low, can the
Rello lift the oil itself via the pump, or do I need to prime it right
to the pump ? How ? I can't see any bleed valves or any way to get the
oil further.

Is it self priming ?

I've replaced the gate valve on the tank, and there's a flow of oil
coming out of the filter, so the oil level is definitely above the
outlet (!)

There is also a device which I take to be an oil flow cutoff valve
(it's connected to a capillary tube) and is in line with the oil feed
with a label 'push buttton hard to reset', but I can't see a button to
press on it :/

Any advice appreciated before I get a man in.

Cheers,

Paul.

wrote in message
...
Ok, i've googled to no avail, so i'm stopping by in here.

I have a Riello 40 fired boiler, but it's going into constant lockout.
It's had a couple of emergency 20L oil drums thrown into the tank, and
the oil has been bled through to within about 1ft of the boiler.

i know bugger all about oil boilers really, except owning an eberspacher
diesel fueled heater in my motorhome, similar way of working i guess, just a
much smaller scale.

It's not exactly 'flowing' as the tank is still quite low, can the
Rello lift the oil itself via the pump, or do I need to prime it right
to the pump ? How ? I can't see any bleed valves or any way to get the
oil further.

i would deffo prime it right to the pump, most pumps do sod all when they
are pumping air, as the air just compresses so wont move along easily,

i'd run the pump and crack open the outlet fitting, the oil should then be
able to flow to the pump, when it's coming out the cracked open fitting with
minimal air, close the fitting, and it'll be able to pump the oil to the
burner.

There is also a device which I take to be an oil flow cutoff valve
(it's connected to a capillary tube) and is in line with the oil feed
with a label 'push buttton hard to reset', but I can't see a button to
press on it :/

That'll be the fire valve, i'd imagine the button you need to press only
pops up when it's been activated by the boiler overheating, or any other
reason it gets too hot to think theres a risk the oil will be feeding an out
of controll fire.

On 19 Aug, 01:09, wrote:
Ok, i've googled to no avail, so i'm stopping by in here.

I have a Riello 40 fired boiler, but it's going into constant lockout.
It's had a couple of emergency 20L oil drums thrown into the tank, and
the oil has been bled through to within about 1ft of the boiler.

It's not exactly 'flowing' as the tank is still quite low, can the
Rello lift the oil itself via the pump, or do I need to prime it right
to the pump ? How ? I can't see any bleed valves or any way to get the
oil further.

Is it self priming *?

I've replaced the gate valve on the tank, and there's a flow of oil
coming out of the filter, so the oil level is definitely above the
outlet (!)

There is also a device which I take to be an oil flow cutoff valve
(it's connected to a capillary tube) and is in line with the oil feed
with a label 'push buttton hard to reset', but I can't see a button to
press on it :/

Any advice appreciated before I get a man in.

Cheers,

Paul.

I have a Riello 40. I have run the tank right down to empty on
several times in the 20 odd years I've had it and the pump has quite
happily coped with that when the tank was refilled - it does have a 10
ft lift. Having said that I was warned by the service engineer that
the pump does rely on the oil for lubrication and running it dry can
knacker it.

I do remember when commissioned the guy couldn't get it to work and
found in due course that a coupling was leaking air into the system.

Do I take it you don't have the handbook which has a Fault Finding
Chart? When you say 'lockout' what actually do you mean ? Is the
burner firing and then cutting out or is it just not firing ?

Rob

On Aug 19, 8:25*am, robgraham wrote:
On 19 Aug, 01:09, wrote:



Ok, i've googled to no avail, so i'm stopping by in here.

I have a Riello 40 fired boiler, but it's going into constant lockout.
It's had a couple of emergency 20L oil drums thrown into the tank, and
the oil has been bled through to within about 1ft of the boiler.

It's not exactly 'flowing' as the tank is still quite low, can the
Rello lift the oil itself via the pump, or do I need to prime it right
to the pump ? How ? I can't see any bleed valves or any way to get the
oil further.

Is it self priming *?

I've replaced the gate valve on the tank, and there's a flow of oil
coming out of the filter, so the oil level is definitely above the
outlet (!)

There is also a device which I take to be an oil flow cutoff valve
(it's connected to a capillary tube) and is in line with the oil feed
with a label 'push buttton hard to reset', but I can't see a button to
press on it :/

Any advice appreciated before I get a man in.

Cheers,

Paul.

I have a Riello 40. *I have run the tank right down to empty on
several times in the 20 odd years I've had it and the pump has quite
happily coped with that when the tank was refilled - it does have a 10
ft lift. *Having said that I was warned by the service engineer that
the pump does rely on the oil for lubrication and running it dry can
knacker it.

I do remember when commissioned the guy couldn't get it to work and
found in due course that a coupling was leaking air into the system.

Do I take it you don't have the handbook which has a Fault Finding
Chart? *

Nope, no handbook, no manuals, nada.

When you say 'lockout' what actually do you mean ? *Is the
burner firing and then cutting out or is it just not firing *?

It fires, and the boiler fuel pump runs, but there's no oil appearing
at the inlet to the pump, which led me to believe it wasn't self
priming. then the big red light comes on and the boiler pump motor
shuts off.

There's 4 ports on the oil pump, 2 on the side and 2 on the bottom,
one f which is an inlet. I'll see if I can get the pump better
primed.

Thanks for the warning about the pump lubrication. I did see some
warnings about overuse of the reset button can damage the boiler, and
it now dawns on me why ...

Paul.

On 19 Aug, 01:09, wrote:
Ok, i've googled to no avail, so i'm stopping by in here.

I have a Riello 40 fired boiler, but it's going into constant lockout.
It's had a couple of emergency 20L oil drums thrown into the tank, and
the oil has been bled through to within about 1ft of the boiler.

It's not exactly 'flowing' as the tank is still quite low, can the
Rello lift the oil itself via the pump, or do I need to prime it right
to the pump ? How ? I can't see any bleed valves or any way to get the
oil further.

Yes you do need to bleed it right to the pump
On the pump facing you are two screws, one with a drak finish and a
slot for a screwdriver - DO NOT TOUCH THIS ONE or you will have to
pay someone to set up the combustion again!
Below it is a hexagon headed one which is a plug in a port on the
pump. Remove or slacken this one and as long as the oil supply is
higher than the pump air will be displaced from this port and oil will
arrive. Provide a shallow tray to catch the spillage and ensure the
plug is properly replaced and seals (when running this port will show
the burner atomising pressure between 100 and 150 psi)


Is it self priming *?

Not normally, furthermore the time-out is very short on the Riello
control so repeated resets may not succeed in drawing fuel through
before you have damaged the pump by running it dry.


I've replaced the gate valve on the tank, and there's a flow of oil
coming out of the filter, so the oil level is definitely above the
outlet (!)

There is also a device which I take to be an oil flow cutoff valve
(it's connected to a capillary tube) and is in line with the oil feed
with a label 'push buttton hard to reset', but I can't see a button to
press on it :/

There are a few makes of capillary firestop valve about. The commonest
has a small button under the brass body.
Unless the sensor has been subject to excessive heat it should not
have tripped closed


Any advice appreciated before I get a man in.

Riello pumps are getting on for a hundred quid so if you have damaged
it you are looking at an expensive running out of fuel session


Cheers,

Paul.

On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 03:53:26 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

It fires, and the boiler fuel pump runs, but there's no oil appearing
at the inlet to the pump, which led me to believe it wasn't self
priming. then the big red light comes on and the boiler pump motor
shuts off.

Slight contradiction there. If it has no oil how can it "fire"? An oil
burner goes through a start up sequence.

1) Power is applied, motor starts and pump runs for a few seconds.
2) The ignitor is activated.
3) If the boiler lights (fires) the flame detector switches off the
ignitor and the boiler continues to run.
4) If the boiler doesn't light after a few seconds of ignitor it shuts
down and "locks out".

If when the boiler is running the flame detector detects lack of flame you
jump to 2)

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 19 Aug, 13:17, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 03:53:26 -0700 (PDT), wrote:
It fires, and the boiler fuel pump runs, but there's no oil appearing
at the inlet to the pump, which led me to believe it wasn't self
priming. then the big red light comes on and the boiler pump motor
shuts off.

Slight contradiction there. If it has no oil how can it "fire"? An oil
burner goes through a start up sequence.

1) Power is applied, motor starts and pump runs for a few seconds.
2) The ignitor is activated.
3) If the boiler lights (fires) the flame detector switches off the
ignitor and the boiler continues to run.
4) If the boiler doesn't light after a few seconds of ignitor it shuts
down and "locks out".

If when the boiler is running the flame detector detects lack of flame you
jump to 2)

--
Cheers
Dave.

indeed - assuming it fires and then quits - as Dave summarises, I
suggest checking filters as probly bunged or partially up with "bottom
of tank" crud - rust, dirt, water etc.
Given a few minutes/hours enough will seep through for an attempted
start, only to fail when the oil pump cannot keep it coming at the
required rate.

Had this exact scenario on ours last year - Riello 40 too - there was
a hidden filter under leaves by tank!! choked to the max with rust
etc.

ope it elps
Jim

wrote in message
...
On Aug 19, 8:25 am, robgraham wrote:
On 19 Aug, 01:09, wrote:



Ok, i've googled to no avail, so i'm stopping by in here.

I have a Riello 40 fired boiler, but it's going into constant lockout.
It's had a couple of emergency 20L oil drums thrown into the tank, and
the oil has been bled through to within about 1ft of the boiler.

It's not exactly 'flowing' as the tank is still quite low, can the
Rello lift the oil itself via the pump, or do I need to prime it right
to the pump ? How ? I can't see any bleed valves or any way to get the
oil further.

Is it self priming ?

I've replaced the gate valve on the tank, and there's a flow of oil
coming out of the filter, so the oil level is definitely above the
outlet (!)

There is also a device which I take to be an oil flow cutoff valve
(it's connected to a capillary tube) and is in line with the oil feed
with a label 'push buttton hard to reset', but I can't see a button to
press on it :/

Any advice appreciated before I get a man in.

Cheers,

Paul.

I have a Riello 40. I have run the tank right down to empty on
several times in the 20 odd years I've had it and the pump has quite
happily coped with that when the tank was refilled - it does have a 10
ft lift. Having said that I was warned by the service engineer that
the pump does rely on the oil for lubrication and running it dry can
knacker it.

I do remember when commissioned the guy couldn't get it to work and
found in due course that a coupling was leaking air into the system.

Do I take it you don't have the handbook which has a Fault Finding
Chart?

Nope, no handbook, no manuals, nada.

When you say 'lockout' what actually do you mean ? Is the
burner firing and then cutting out or is it just not firing ?

It fires, and the boiler fuel pump runs, but there's no oil appearing
at the inlet to the pump, which led me to believe it wasn't self
priming. then the big red light comes on and the boiler pump motor
shuts off.

There's 4 ports on the oil pump, 2 on the side and 2 on the bottom,
one f which is an inlet. I'll see if I can get the pump better
primed.

Thanks for the warning about the pump lubrication. I did see some
warnings about overuse of the reset button can damage the boiler, and
it now dawns on me why ...

Paul.

If it fires for a second or two before cutting out it could well be a sooted
up photo cell.
Release the control box fixing screw and pull of the control box. the photo
cell is connected to this. If the cell is dirty then it cannot detect a
flame and quickly shuts the boiler down. A wipe over with a rag is normally
sufficient to clean up the "eye".

On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 19:57:28 +0100, Heliotrope Smith wrote:

If it fires for a second or two before cutting out it could well be a
sooted up photo cell.

A possibilty but we need to know what the OP actually means by "it fires".
I reading:

It fires, and the boiler fuel pump runs, but there's no oil appearing
at the inlet to the pump, which led me to believe it wasn't self
priming. then the big red light comes on and the boiler pump motor
shuts off.

To mean that no ignition takes place within the alloted fan & pump time
plus ignitor on time. Thus the boiler locks out (big red light comes on).

Rather than it does ignite but the flame isn't detected thus causing a
lock out.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Aug 19, 12:48 pm, cynic wrote:
On 19 Aug, 01:09, wrote:

Ok, i've googled to no avail, so i'm stopping by in here.

I have a Riello 40 fired boiler, but it's going into constant lockout.
It's had a couple of emergency 20L oil drums thrown into the tank, and
the oil has been bled through to within about 1ft of the boiler..

Riello pumps are getting on for a hundred quid so if you have damaged
it you are looking at an expensive running out of fuel session

Thanks, you're full of good news

I don't think it's goosed, I asked for advice before going much
further.

P.

On Aug 19, 10:26 pm, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 19:57:28 +0100, Heliotrope Smith wrote:
If it fires for a second or two before cutting out it could well be a
sooted up photo cell.

A possibilty but we need to know what the OP actually means by "it fires".
I reading:

It fires, and the boiler fuel pump runs, but there's no oil appearing
at the inlet to the pump, which led me to believe it wasn't self
priming. then the big red light comes on and the boiler pump motor
shuts off.

To mean that no ignition takes place within the alloted fan & pump time
plus ignitor on time. Thus the boiler locks out (big red light comes on).

Rather than it does ignite but the flame isn't detected thus causing a
lock out.

No, my bad, bad terminology.

Fires as in fires up the motor. I think the pump is dry, so it's fuel
starvation.

Time to get the oil into the pump. Back in a bit

P.

On Aug 19, 11:45 pm, wrote:
On Aug 19, 10:26 pm, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:



On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 19:57:28 +0100, Heliotrope Smith wrote:
If it fires for a second or two before cutting out it could well be a
sooted up photo cell.

A possibilty but we need to know what the OP actually means by "it fires".
I reading:

It fires, and the boiler fuel pump runs, but there's no oil appearing
at the inlet to the pump, which led me to believe it wasn't self
priming. then the big red light comes on and the boiler pump motor
shuts off.

To mean that no ignition takes place within the alloted fan & pump time
plus ignitor on time. Thus the boiler locks out (big red light comes on).

Rather than it does ignite but the flame isn't detected thus causing a
lock out.

No, my bad, bad terminology.

Fires as in fires up the motor. I think the pump is dry, so it's fuel
starvation.

Time to get the oil into the pump. Back in a bit

Can't get the oil to the pump, so it's time for a partial fill rather
than faffing with the emergency drums to get the oil level up to the
input of the pump.

I was trying to get away with as little fuel as possible, as the short
term plan is to relocate (and actually replace) the tank.

More on the DIY practicality of that in another post. Let's get the
boiler going 1st

P.

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember saying
something like:

I was trying to get away with as little fuel as possible, as the short
term plan is to relocate (and actually replace) the tank.

Easy enough with a pump and as many 205L drums as necessary.

More on the DIY practicality of that in another post. Let's get the
boiler going 1st

If there's no blockage and the fuel pipe doesn't have a rise/hump/kink
in it, it should flow. Are you sure the outlet from the tank is at least
100mm above the burner?
--
Dave
GS850x2 XS650 SE6a

"It's a moron working with power tools.
How much more suspenseful can you get?"
- House

On Aug 20, 10:08 pm, Grimly Curmudgeon
wrote:
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember saying
something like:

I was trying to get away with as little fuel as possible, as the short
term plan is to relocate (and actually replace) the tank.

Easy enough with a pump and as many 205L drums as necessary.

More on the DIY practicality of that in another post. Let's get the
boiler going 1st

If there's no blockage and the fuel pipe doesn't have a rise/hump/kink
in it, it should flow. Are you sure the outlet from the tank is at least
100mm above the burner?

Nope, there's no fall in the pipe at all, it's pretty flat. There's a
nice man in a tanker turning up tomorrow, so we'll know then ..

P.

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember saying
something like:

Nope, there's no fall in the pipe at all, it's pretty flat. There's a
nice man in a tanker turning up tomorrow, so we'll know then ..

There's your problem. While the tank's empty, can you raise it up by
100mm?
--
Dave
GS850x2 XS650 SE6a

"It's a moron working with power tools.
How much more suspenseful can you get?"
- House