I've just noticed that Argos are selling a Worx Sonic Crafter ( item
711/2472 ) - which is a oscillating cutter like the Fein Multimaster
and Bosch pmf 180.

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

There is no other info available yet - not even on the Worx website

dg

On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....

--
John Stumbles

Pessimists are never disappointed

John Stumbles wrote:

On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....


Well, the Worx has the considerable 'advantage' of the 'excellent'
after-sales service and support, and it doesn't cost any more than the
Bosch ...

That's another 'Fein' mess you've gotten me into. ;-)

http://www.patfullerton.com/lh/movies/finemess.html

"John Stumbles" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....

--
John Stumbles

Pessimists are never disappointed

Nope! it not a tough one...the worx is (alledgedlly)250w,wereas the Bosch is
180w.

dg wrote:
I've just noticed that Argos are selling a Worx Sonic Crafter ( item
711/2472 ) - which is a oscillating cutter like the Fein Multimaster
and Bosch pmf 180.

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

There is no other info available yet - not even on the Worx website

dg

That price might well be to establish a 'was' price for subsequent
advertising purposes.

--
Rod

Hypothyroidism is a seriously debilitating condition with an insidious
onset.
Although common it frequently goes undiagnosed.
www.thyromind.info www.thyroiduk.org www.altsupportthyroid.org

On 2008-07-28 10:03:14 +0100, John Stumbles said:

On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....

This sounds like the Swedish chemists shop sketch.

Neither. Buy the proper Fein one.

On 2008-07-28 10:03:14 +0100, John Stumbles said:

On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....

This sounds like the Swedish chemists shop sketch.

Neither. Buy the proper Fein one.

On 2008-07-28 13:17:21 +0100, "George" said:


"John Stumbles" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....

--
John Stumbles

Pessimists are never disappointed

Nope! it not a tough one...the worx is (alledgedlly)250w,wereas the Bosch is
180w.

Allegedly being the operative word. Input power is no indicator of
mechanical output. In the case of reputable manufacturers such as Fein
and even Bosch, the motors are efficient and a high proportion of
electrical input becomes mechanical output. The low end
manufacturers have a habit of using inefficient motors. This has
several effects:

- They can claim a "higher power" than the tools with which they are
attempting to compete, thus taking in the unwary who think that more
electrical input means a more powerful tool

- The excess input is turned into heat, reducing the reliability of the
tool and making it less comfortable to use.

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-28 10:03:14 +0100, John Stumbles
said:

On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....

This sounds like the Swedish chemists shop sketch.

Neither. Buy the proper Fein one.



Ah - two replies in unison from Mr Hall. :-)

--
Rod

Hypothyroidism is a seriously debilitating condition with an insidious
onset.
Although common it frequently goes undiagnosed.
www.thyromind.info www.thyroiduk.org www.altsupportthyroid.org

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-28 10:03:14 +0100, John Stumbles
said:
On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....

This sounds like the Swedish chemists shop sketch.

Neither. Buy the proper Fein one.

Nothing wrong with the Bosch, works a treat. Easy to get blades as well.


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

On 2008-07-31 17:41:13 +0100, "The Medway Handyman"
said:

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-28 10:03:14 +0100, John Stumbles
said:
On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....

This sounds like the Swedish chemists shop sketch.

Neither. Buy the proper Fein one.

Nothing wrong with the Bosch, works a treat. Easy to get blades as well.

The same breadth of range?

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-31 17:41:13 +0100, "The Medway Handyman"
said:

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-28 10:03:14 +0100, John Stumbles
said:
On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....

This sounds like the Swedish chemists shop sketch.

Neither. Buy the proper Fein one.

Nothing wrong with the Bosch, works a treat. Easy to get blades as
well.

The same breadth of range?

No, but all I need & half the price.


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:4891ee48@qaanaaq...
On 2008-07-31 17:41:13 +0100, "The Medway Handyman"
said:

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-28 10:03:14 +0100, John Stumbles
said:
On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....

This sounds like the Swedish chemists shop sketch.

Neither. Buy the proper Fein one.

Nothing wrong with the Bosch, works a treat. Easy to get blades as well.

The same breadth of range?

Just cut one up with an angle grinder and get an even bigger range.

On 2008-07-31 20:32:00 +0100, "The Medway Handyman"
said:

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-31 17:41:13 +0100, "The Medway Handyman"
said:

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-28 10:03:14 +0100, John Stumbles
said:
On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it is
priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....

This sounds like the Swedish chemists shop sketch.

Neither. Buy the proper Fein one.

Nothing wrong with the Bosch, works a treat. Easy to get blades as
well.

The same breadth of range?

No, but all I need & half the price.

Ah but not all that all the customers need. If the solution doesn't
do the wanted job, the price is irrelevant

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-31 20:32:00 +0100, "The Medway Handyman"
said:

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-31 17:41:13 +0100, "The Medway Handyman"
said:

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-28 10:03:14 +0100, John Stumbles
said:
On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it
is priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....

This sounds like the Swedish chemists shop sketch.

Neither. Buy the proper Fein one.

Nothing wrong with the Bosch, works a treat. Easy to get blades as
well.

The same breadth of range?

No, but all I need & half the price.

Ah but not all that all the customers need. If the solution doesn't
do the wanted job, the price is irrelevant

Doesn't work that way. You invent something like the Fein to do one or two
jobs well, then you start to invent attachments to make it even more
versatile.

Started off with the DIY drill. Very soon you had jigsaw attachments,
circular saw attachments etc. All hopeless.

Same with pressure washers. Started with the machine, then came
sandblasters, drain cleaners etc. All useless.

So with Fein you have blades to remove boy scouts from horses hooves. With
Bosch you have blsdes that plunge cut or flush cut - pretty much what the
tool was designed for in the first place.


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

On 2008-08-01 00:39:32 +0100, "The Medway Handyman"
said:

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-31 20:32:00 +0100, "The Medway Handyman"
said:

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-31 17:41:13 +0100, "The Medway Handyman"
said:

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-28 10:03:14 +0100, John Stumbles
said:
On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it
is priced the same as the Bosch too

So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....

This sounds like the Swedish chemists shop sketch.

Neither. Buy the proper Fein one.

Nothing wrong with the Bosch, works a treat. Easy to get blades as
well.

The same breadth of range?

No, but all I need & half the price.

Ah but not all that all the customers need. If the solution doesn't
do the wanted job, the price is irrelevant

Doesn't work that way. You invent something like the Fein to do one or two
jobs well, then you start to invent attachments to make it even more
versatile.

Started off with the DIY drill. Very soon you had jigsaw attachments,
circular saw attachments etc. All hopeless.

Same with pressure washers. Started with the machine, then came
sandblasters, drain cleaners etc. All useless.

So with Fein you have blades to remove boy scouts from horses hooves. With
Bosch you have blsdes that plunge cut or flush cut - pretty much what the
tool was designed for in the first place.

Except that the analogy doesn't apply here. Fein's only chocolate
teapot accessory is the concrete vibrator. The rest work well IME

The Medway Handyman wrote:
Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-31 20:32:00 +0100, "The Medway Handyman"
said:

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-31 17:41:13 +0100, "The Medway Handyman"
said:

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-07-28 10:03:14 +0100, John Stumbles
said:
On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:55:17 -0700, dg wrote:

The tool fitting seems the same as the Bosch one, and oddly it
is priced the same as the Bosch too
So, should one buy the Bosch or the Worx. Hmmm, tough one ....
This sounds like the Swedish chemists shop sketch.

Neither. Buy the proper Fein one.
Nothing wrong with the Bosch, works a treat. Easy to get blades as
well.
The same breadth of range?
No, but all I need & half the price.
Ah but not all that all the customers need. If the solution doesn't
do the wanted job, the price is irrelevant

Doesn't work that way. You invent something like the Fein to do one or two
jobs well, then you start to invent attachments to make it even more
versatile.

Started off with the DIY drill. Very soon you had jigsaw attachments,
circular saw attachments etc. All hopeless.

Same with pressure washers. Started with the machine, then came
sandblasters, drain cleaners etc. All useless.

So with Fein you have blades to remove boy scouts from horses hooves. With
Bosch you have blsdes that plunge cut or flush cut - pretty much what the
tool was designed for in the first place.



I wonder how either would work for removing putty from window frames.
Spent an hour doing that yesterday with the usual implements, but a nice
neat cut should allow you to knock out the glass and putty together
without damage to the frame.

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:48924104@qaanaaq...

Ah but not all that all the customers need. If the solution doesn't
do the wanted job, the price is irrelevant


Also if it does what is needed the (cheap) price is irrelevant.

On 2008-08-01 13:07:32 +0100, stuart noble said:

I wonder how either would work for removing putty from window frames.
Spent an hour doing that yesterday with the usual implements, but a
nice neat cut should allow you to knock out the glass and putty
together without damage to the frame.

I have done that very operation in the past.

On 2008-08-01 13:11:47 +0100, "dennis@home"
said:



"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:48924104@qaanaaq...

Ah but not all that all the customers need. If the solution doesn't
do the wanted job, the price is irrelevant


Also if it does what is needed the (cheap) price is irrelevant.

Unless it falls apart.

Leaving that aside, the Fein has a lot of functionality in terms of
working with tiles, metal, plastic, sanding and detail sanding.

It is far mor cost effective to buy one good tool to do these things
well, than a collection of mediochre ones that each only cover part of
the application area.

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-08-01 13:07:32 +0100, stuart noble
said:

I wonder how either would work for removing putty from window frames.
Spent an hour doing that yesterday with the usual implements, but a
nice neat cut should allow you to knock out the glass and putty
together without damage to the frame.

I have done that very operation in the past.

How does the cutter cope with rock hard putty, semi-hard putty, sprigs,
and possibly glass? I wouldn't want to wreck one blade per window.

On 2008-08-01 14:08:32 +0100, stuart noble said:

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-08-01 13:07:32 +0100, stuart noble said:

I wonder how either would work for removing putty from window frames.
Spent an hour doing that yesterday with the usual implements, but a
nice neat cut should allow you to knock out the glass and putty
together without damage to the frame.

I have done that very operation in the past.

How does the cutter cope with rock hard putty, semi-hard putty, sprigs,
and possibly glass? I wouldn't want to wreck one blade per window.

IIRC, I mainly used the carbide blade

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2008-08-01 13:11:47 +0100, "dennis@home"
said:



"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:48924104@qaanaaq...

Ah but not all that all the customers need. If the solution doesn't
do the wanted job, the price is irrelevant


Also if it does what is needed the (cheap) price is irrelevant.

Unless it falls apart.

Leaving that aside, the Fein has a lot of functionality in terms of
working with tiles, metal, plastic, sanding and detail sanding.

It is far mor cost effective to buy one good tool to do these things
well, than a collection of mediochre ones that each only cover part of
the application area.


On the other hand, in certain parts of Northern Ireland, it might be
better to go with the Bosch, or Worx, or anything else... :-)

--
Rod

Hypothyroidism is a seriously debilitating condition with an insidious
onset.
Although common it frequently goes undiagnosed.
www.thyromind.info www.thyroiduk.org www.altsupportthyroid.org

In article ,
The Medway Handyman wrote:
Ah but not all that all the customers need. If the solution doesn't
do the wanted job, the price is irrelevant

Doesn't work that way. You invent something like the Fein to do one or
two jobs well, then you start to invent attachments to make it even
more versatile.

Which ones?

Started off with the DIY drill. Very soon you had jigsaw attachments,
circular saw attachments etc. All hopeless.

Well, they were really the only DIY option at the time due to cost - and
did sort of work.

Same with pressure washers. Started with the machine, then came
sandblasters, drain cleaners etc. All useless.

So with Fein you have blades to remove boy scouts from horses hooves.
With Bosch you have blsdes that plunge cut or flush cut - pretty much
what the tool was designed for in the first place.

As a detail sander it's miles better than my 'proper' Bosch one - let
alone the cutting functions. I'd guess because the vibrator has no lost
motion.

--
*When a clock is hungry it goes back four seconds*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 1 Aug, 14:50, Rod wrote:

On the other hand, in certain parts of Northern Ireland, it might be
better to go with the Bosch, or Worx, or anything else... :-)

Nowt wrong with being a Feinian!

Bet these little lathes don't sell too well though
http://www.taigtools.com/

Andy Dingley wrote:
On 1 Aug, 14:50, Rod wrote:

On the other hand, in certain parts of Northern Ireland, it might be
better to go with the Bosch, or Worx, or anything else... :-)

Nowt wrong with being a Feinian!

Bet these little lathes don't sell too well though
http://www.taigtools.com/

Hmmm, not exactly brilliant marketing. :-)

--
Rod

Hypothyroidism is a seriously debilitating condition with an insidious
onset.
Although common it frequently goes undiagnosed.
www.thyromind.info www.thyroiduk.org www.altsupportthyroid.org

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:48930248@qaanaaq...
On 2008-08-01 13:11:47 +0100, "dennis@home"
said:



"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:48924104@qaanaaq...

Ah but not all that all the customers need. If the solution doesn't do
the wanted job, the price is irrelevant


Also if it does what is needed the (cheap) price is irrelevant.

Unless it falls apart.

Irrelevant if it does what's needed.


Leaving that aside, the Fein has a lot of functionality in terms of
working with tiles, metal, plastic, sanding and detail sanding.

So what, I have other tools that will do those things, probably better than
some universal wonder tool.


It is far mor cost effective to buy one good tool to do these things well,
than a collection of mediochre ones that each only cover part of the
application area.

Really?
Maybe you should buy better tools so you don't suffer from poor tool
experiences.

In article ,
dennis@home wrote:
Leaving that aside, the Fein has a lot of functionality in terms of
working with tiles, metal, plastic, sanding and detail sanding.

So what, I have other tools that will do those things, probably better
than some universal wonder tool.

It's really more like a decent drill - where you change bits according to
what you're drilling.

It does work very well, and is beautifully made. You should try one before
criticising.

--
*Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 2008-08-01 19:57:33 +0100, "dennis@home"
said:



"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:48930248@qaanaaq...
On 2008-08-01 13:11:47 +0100, "dennis@home"
said:



"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:48924104@qaanaaq...

Ah but not all that all the customers need. If the solution doesn't
do the wanted job, the price is irrelevant


Also if it does what is needed the (cheap) price is irrelevant.

Unless it falls apart.

Irrelevant if it does what's needed.

How does that work if it has fallen apart?




Leaving that aside, the Fein has a lot of functionality in terms of
working with tiles, metal, plastic, sanding and detail sanding.

So what, I have other tools that will do those things, probably better
than some universal wonder tool.

Possibly. However, you will have spent more money on them if they are
reasonable ones and will have four or five when one will do a
multiplicity of tasks very well.




It is far mor cost effective to buy one good tool to do these things
well, than a collection of mediochre ones that each only cover part of
the application area.

Really?
Maybe you should buy better tools so you don't suffer from poor tool
experiences.

I do.

"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:489301c3@qaanaaq...
On 2008-08-01 13:07:32 +0100, stuart noble
said:

I wonder how either would work for removing putty from window frames.
Spent an hour doing that yesterday with the usual implements, but a nice
neat cut should allow you to knock out the glass and putty together
without damage to the frame.

I have done that very operation in the past.


Its easy with a router and a jig.
Clean rebates too.

On Fri, 1 Aug 2008 20:21:23 +0100, Andy Hall
wrote:

On 2008-08-01 19:57:33 +0100, "dennis@home"
said:


So what, I have other tools that will do those things, probably better
than some universal wonder tool.

Possibly. However, you will have spent more money on them if they are
reasonable ones and will have four or five when one will do a
multiplicity of tasks very well.

But if Dennis already has these other tools, is he expected to buy a
replacement just to supplant them?

--
Frank Erskine

On 2008-08-01 20:45:57 +0100, Frank Erskine
said:

On Fri, 1 Aug 2008 20:21:23 +0100, Andy Hall
wrote:

On 2008-08-01 19:57:33 +0100, "dennis@home"
said:


So what, I have other tools that will do those things, probably better
than some universal wonder tool.

Possibly. However, you will have spent more money on them if they are
reasonable ones and will have four or five when one will do a
multiplicity of tasks very well.

But if Dennis already has these other tools, is he expected to buy a
replacement just to supplant them?

That's up to him.

Personally I didn't have some of the capabilities of the Multimaster in
other tools and did need them for several projects, so it was an easy
decision to make.

I might have done the same if I had had crappy versions of some tools,
but I didn't.

dennis@home wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message news:489301c3@qaanaaq...
On 2008-08-01 13:07:32 +0100, stuart noble
said:

I wonder how either would work for removing putty from window frames.
Spent an hour doing that yesterday with the usual implements, but a
nice neat cut should allow you to knock out the glass and putty
together without damage to the frame.

I have done that very operation in the past.


Its easy with a router and a jig.
Clean rebates too.

Making and securing the jig might well take longer than doing it the
normal way

On Fri, 01 Aug 2008 15:03:45 +0100, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

*When a clock is hungry it goes back four seconds*

groan :-)

--
John Stumbles

Press any key to continue or any other key to exit