Boxed in a bath with T&G yesterday. Fitted the side panel & was measuring
for the end panel when I saw this
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l2...s/earth002.jpg

An earth wire screwed into the wall.

Whilst boxing in the side I noticed earth bonding cables connected to the
bath feed pipes, but didn't pay much attention to them. What would be the
purpose of an earth cable fixed to a brick wall?

As an aside, I often see the copper feeds to sinks, basins etc earth bonded,
with flexibles connecting to the taps. Would this earth the taps?


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257

The message
from "The Medway Handyman" contains
these words:

Boxed in a bath with T&G yesterday. Fitted the side panel & was measuring
for the end panel when I saw this
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l2...s/earth002.jpg

An earth wire screwed into the wall.

Whilst boxing in the side I noticed earth bonding cables connected to the
bath feed pipes, but didn't pay much attention to them. What would be the
purpose of an earth cable fixed to a brick wall?

Show?

When I was thinking about changing my 3 way fuse box many years ago I
followed an earth wire heading downwards and found it terminated wrapped
round a rusty nail pushed into a joint in the stonework. So I obtained a
4 foot copper earth rod and hammered it into the ground (the floor was
up for replacement at the time).

It wasn't until some time later that I found that there was also an
earth running straight through the wall to the meter box and I am still
not sure whether the earth rod is necessary (or even counter
productive).

--
Roger Chapman

Roger wrote:

Boxed in a bath with T&G yesterday. Fitted the side panel & was measuring
for the end panel when I saw this
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l2...s/earth002.jpg

An earth wire screwed into the wall.

Whilst boxing in the side I noticed earth bonding cables connected to the
bath feed pipes, but didn't pay much attention to them. What would be the
purpose of an earth cable fixed to a brick wall?

Show?

When I was thinking about changing my 3 way fuse box many years ago I
followed an earth wire heading downwards and found it terminated
wrapped round a rusty nail pushed into a joint in the stonework.

It's just a primitive belief in earth magic. Almost a hundred years ago,
people were doing much the same by "earthing" their wireless sets to the
nearest aspidistra pot.


--
Ian White

The Medway Handyman wrote:
Boxed in a bath with T&G yesterday. Fitted the side panel & was measuring
for the end panel when I saw this
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l2...s/earth002.jpg

An earth wire screwed into the wall.

Whilst boxing in the side I noticed earth bonding cables connected to the
bath feed pipes, but didn't pay much attention to them. What would be the
purpose of an earth cable fixed to a brick wall?

Is it definitely just screwed to the wall - ie, any chance that it's
connecting to some wire or other buried in the wall?

When did bonding regs originally start? Not that long ago AFAIK, and
interesting that this one is obviously a modern cable.

Clutching at straws, but could it originally have been a just wiring
point for multiple bonding wires to connect to?

David

Lobster wrote:
The Medway Handyman wrote:
Boxed in a bath with T&G yesterday. Fitted the side panel & was
measuring for the end panel when I saw this
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l2...s/earth002.jpg

An earth wire screwed into the wall.

Whilst boxing in the side I noticed earth bonding cables connected
to the bath feed pipes, but didn't pay much attention to them. What
would be the purpose of an earth cable fixed to a brick wall?

Is it definitely just screwed to the wall - ie, any chance that it's
connecting to some wire or other buried in the wall?

Could have been, but no sign of any making good & the house is Victorian.

When did bonding regs originally start? Not that long ago AFAIK, and
interesting that this one is obviously a modern cable.

Clutching at straws, but could it originally have been a just wiring
point for multiple bonding wires to connect to?

I suppose it could, but the bath, basin & toilet feed pipes are at the other
end of the bathroom.

Weird innit?


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257

The Medway Handyman wrote:
Lobster wrote:
The Medway Handyman wrote:

Boxed in a bath with T&G yesterday. Fitted the side panel & was
measuring for the end panel when I saw this
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l2...s/earth002.jpg

An earth wire screwed into the wall.

Whilst boxing in the side I noticed earth bonding cables connected
to the bath feed pipes, but didn't pay much attention to them. What
would be the purpose of an earth cable fixed to a brick wall?

Is it definitely just screwed to the wall - ie, any chance that it's
connecting to some wire or other buried in the wall?

Could have been, but no sign of any making good & the house is Victorian.

When did bonding regs originally start? Not that long ago AFAIK, and
interesting that this one is obviously a modern cable.

Clutching at straws, but could it originally have been a just wiring
point for multiple bonding wires to connect to?

I suppose it could, but the bath, basin & toilet feed pipes are at the other
end of the bathroom.

Weird innit?

The wall's green, the right colour for earth - surely thats
enough?
I don't suppose its an earth wall? Someone really didn't know what
they were doing.

Equipotential bonding is not meant to connect to earth, its meant
to create an equipotential zone, meaning that whether things are
eartherd or not (and normally something is), whatever happens to
the metalwork it will all be at the same voltage.

In terms of safety benefit per cost it might save one or 2 lives per
century, making it not much more use than earthing the aspidistra
plant, but 16th requires it on new installs. I gather the 17th will
cease to.


NT

The Medway Handyman wrote:
Lobster wrote:
The Medway Handyman wrote:

Boxed in a bath with T&G yesterday. Fitted the side panel & was
measuring for the end panel when I saw this
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l2...s/earth002.jpg

An earth wire screwed into the wall.

Looks good for a wiki gallery, ok to put it up there?


NT

In terms of safety benefit per cost it might save one or 2 lives per
century, making it not much more use than earthing the aspidistra plant,

No, you've got it all wrong! The soil in the aspidistra pot *is* the
earth connection, because it's always like totally connected with the
Mother Planet. House bricks are deeply aware of this too.


--
Ian White

"The Medway Handyman" wrote in message
m...



As an aside, I often see the copper feeds to sinks, basins etc earth
bonded, with flexibles connecting to the taps. Would this earth the taps?

The "earthing" of the taps is irrelevant. If the copper pipe work that
supplies the flexis is correctly bonded then the taps will be fine. There is
no way the taps can become live.

Adam

The Medway Handyman wrote:

What would be the purpose of an earth cable fixed to a brick wall?

Your guess is as good as mine, unless it's connected to any structural
metalwork buried in the wall (unlikely in this case I'd have thought).
Whatever its purpose, the connection isn't compliant with wiring regs
since it's not labelled with the essential words "safety electrical
connection - do not remove".

As an aside, I often see the copper feeds to sinks, basins etc earth bonded,
with flexibles connecting to the taps. Would this earth the taps?

1) Terminology: don't talk about "earth bonding" it just confuses the
distinction between earthing and (equipotential) bonding:

- earthing is about connecting the metalwork of electrical equipment to
earth. It reduces shock risk by reducing the /duration/ of dangerous
touch voltage resulting from a fault, by blowing a fuse or tripping an
MCB or RCD within a prescribed time;

- bonding is a more passive measure to reduce the /magnitude/ of touch
voltage arising between both electrical (exposed-) and non-electrical
(extraneous-) conductive-parts, or any combination thereof.

2) Taps don't need to be earthed or bonded, only the metal pipework
leading to them if it's able to import a voltage from outside the
location. In a bath/shower room you need to bond incoming metal
pipework and all electrical circuit earths. Short copper tails in a
primarily-plastic plumbing installation don't need to be bonded, and nor
do basins and sinks that aren't in a bath/shower room.

When boxing-in under baths, basins etc. remember that the bonding
connections are supposed to remain accessible for electrical inspection
and testing (unless soldered).

The 17th ed. regs (BS 7671:2008) do remove the the requirement for
supplementary bonding in bathrooms, _but_only_ if all circuits feeding
loads in the bathroom, including lighting, have 30 mA protection _and_
the installation's main bonding is present and correct. It is not a
licence to remove or ignore the supplementary bonding in existing
installations.

--
Andy

wrote:
The Medway Handyman wrote:
Lobster wrote:
The Medway Handyman wrote:

Boxed in a bath with T&G yesterday. Fitted the side panel & was
measuring for the end panel when I saw this
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l2...s/earth002.jpg

An earth wire screwed into the wall.

Looks good for a wiki gallery, ok to put it up there?

Please do. I've got other stuff if you want it.


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257

Ian White wrote:

In terms of safety benefit per cost it might save one or 2 lives per
century, making it not much more use than earthing the aspidistra plant,

No, you've got it all wrong! The soil in the aspidistra pot *is* the
earth connection, because it's always like totally connected with the
Mother Planet. House bricks are deeply aware of this too.

Well thats true of course - but being disconnected form mother
earth makes it feel out of balance, so it needs earthing to avoid
falling over and dying. Nothing to do with need for sun & water,
those are just foolish old ideas.

I wonder what the capacitance to earth is for a pith ball the size of
an aspidistra, and thus whether it might have made any diference
on medium wave. Fraid I'm a bit rusty on pith ball capacitor
formulae.

I guess on a dc mains set the plant may have been positively
charged, thu attracting more dust and any nutrients in it too


NT

Andy Wade wrote:

When boxing-in under baths, basins etc. remember that the bonding
connections are supposed to remain accessible for electrical inspection
and testing (unless soldered).

But if the connections are soldered and not accessible, how would any
electrical inspector *know* that they are soldered and therefore don't
need to be accessible...?

David

Lobster wrote:
The Medway Handyman wrote:
Boxed in a bath with T&G yesterday. Fitted the side panel & was
measuring for the end panel when I saw this
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l2...s/earth002.jpg

An earth wire screwed into the wall.

Whilst boxing in the side I noticed earth bonding cables connected to
the bath feed pipes, but didn't pay much attention to them. What
would be the purpose of an earth cable fixed to a brick wall?

Is it definitely just screwed to the wall - ie, any chance that it's
connecting to some wire or other buried in the wall?

When did bonding regs originally start? Not that long ago AFAIK, and
interesting that this one is obviously a modern cable.

Just following this up - what I was getting at was that the plaster on
that wall looks as old as Methusalah, and probably predates the
regualtory requirement for bonding, no?

David

"Lobster" wrote in message
...
Andy Wade wrote:

When boxing-in under baths, basins etc. remember that the bonding
connections are supposed to remain accessible for electrical inspection
and testing (unless soldered).

But if the connections are soldered and not accessible, how would any
electrical inspector *know* that they are soldered and therefore don't
need to be accessible...?


He/She would not know unless they had the original installation certificate
or ripped up the floor for a look.

Adam