I am currently installing new light fittings through out my house (not
rewiring)and have had no problems.

Yesterday I have removed the hallway light to replace it with a new
downlight (non transformer type) only to discover that instead of the
standard 2 groups of wires (+ & - ) this existing fitting has also got
an extra wire into another terminal on the block identified as loop ?.
The problem is that my new fittings only have positions for a positive
and negitive and no extra terminal for a loop ?


Is there a way I can use this fitting or will I have to purchase a
different type ?


I have also discovered that all fittings in this half of the house
(bedrooms ,bathroom) have the same issue. Being a Mechanic and not a
"Cone head"" I'm not sure why half the house is one way and the other
half the other. If this becomes to hard I will just hire an electrician

next time he's available (I live in a country town).


Thanks in advance.

"Cherry" wrote:

I am currently installing new light fittings through out my house (not
rewiring)and have had no problems.

Yesterday I have removed the hallway light to replace it with a new
downlight (non transformer type) only to discover that instead of the
standard 2 groups of wires (+ & - ) this existing fitting has also got
an extra wire into another terminal on the block identified as loop ?.
The problem is that my new fittings only have positions for a positive
and negitive and no extra terminal for a loop ?

The two groups of wires should be called "Live (L)" and "Neutral (N)"
rather than "+" and "-" .

"Loop" is used to carry the live feed to other lights on the same
circuit and I would also expect you to have at least two wires going
into the terminal.

There is also presumably a separate earth terminal (bare wires -
sleeved with green/yellow). If not then you may have issues that go
beyond new light fittings.

Is there a way I can use this fitting or will I have to purchase a
different type ?

Yes you can use this fitting.

The correct way to deal with the wiring is to replace the ceiling rose
(the bit on the ceiling) with a junction box above the ceiling, so
that you just have one cable to connect your new light fitting to.

There are diagrams of how to do this on the web, and no doubt a link
will be along in a minute.

I have also discovered that all fittings in this half of the house
(bedrooms ,bathroom) have the same issue. Being a Mechanic and not a
"Cone head"" I'm not sure why half the house is one way and the other
half the other.

A mix of "Loop-in" ceiling roses and other types is quite normal.

If this becomes to hard I will just hire an electrician

It can be costly call an electrician a "cone head", even here in
Derbyshire. :-)

next time he's available (I live in a country town).

In Australia judging by your email address. :-)

John
--
John White,
Electrical Contractor

On 23 May 2006 04:03:28 -0700 someone who may be "Cherry"
wrote this:-

Yesterday I have removed the hallway light to replace it with a new
downlight (non transformer type) only to discover that instead of the
standard 2 groups of wires (+ & - ) this existing fitting has also got
an extra wire into another terminal on the block identified as loop ?.

Bearing in mind that I know almost nothing about wiring in
Australia, but assume it has similarities with the UK.

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=wiring+light gives an awful
lot of information about how such things are wired, including
pictures and drawings. A picture is worth a thousand words.

The light is wired using the loop-in system, which is described in
the links from the above search.

The problem is that my new fittings only have positions for a positive
and negitive and no extra terminal for a loop ?

Are these positions inside the fitting? If they are then it is
probably best to replace the existing ceiling rose with a four
terminal junction box and run a short bit of cable to the new
fitting. The short bit of cable should be heat resisting in some
circumstances.



--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

The message . com
from "Cherry" contains these words:

Yesterday I have removed the hallway light to replace it with a new
downlight (non transformer type) only to discover that instead of the
standard 2 groups of wires (+ & - ) this existing fitting has also got
an extra wire into another terminal on the block identified as loop ?.
The problem is that my new fittings only have positions for a positive
and negitive and no extra terminal for a loop ?

Using the loop-in system there are effectively 3 terminals (probably
plus earth) on the ceiling rose, live, switched live and neutral and the
3 incoming pairs (mains, switch, light) are each wired across 2 out of
the 3. If you on have 2 terminals you have to find some other way of
getting the live to the live on the lamp which has to be supplied by the
switched live if you don't want in on permanently. IMO the easiest way
to do this is to transfer the existing wires to a 4 post junction box
concealed in the ceiling void (or even use the existing ceiling rose)
and feed the switched live and neutral to the new fitting.

--
Roger Chapman

The message . com
from "Cherry" contains these words:

All together now......

What's black and frazzled and hangs from an Aussie ceiling?



Why Conehead BTW?

In Military Aviation Engine & Airframe technicians (mechanics) are know
as Blackhanders for obvious reasons. The rest , Radio, Instrument and
Electrical are known as either Whitehanders (*******s never get dirty)
or Coneheads as it takes an alien to figure out that stuff !! These
days the terminoligy is slowly creeping into the other trades. It is
not an insult, just rival banter among tradies. Blackhanders are proud
that they look like they work for aliving and coneheads are pround not
to need a shower before going to the pub after work.

Also thanks everyone for the advise and ideas. I will check it out over
the weekend.