I recently had 'replacement' Windows (PVCu) and a front door fitted by
a FENSA registered company. The windows were fine but the front door
leaks like a sieve as is does not completely mate with the seals
either outer or inner. The simple reason is the door is slightly
'warped

Obviously I am in 'dispute' with the supplier to replace the door and
that is another story!

What I am particularly interested in is the 'self certification'
aspect. If I understand the response to a question to FENSA on this
issue, FENSA are only interested in the 'design' aspect, that is that
the replacement parts meet Part L of the Building Code (I think that
is right). From their response, FENSA apparently couldn't care less
if the components are fitted correctly to ensure they are air tight.

The local Building Inspectors tell me they thought FENSA self
certification also covered installation, that is the installed product
is air tight and meets the intent of the code.

Anyone with any insight on this?

Referring to the installation, the 'fitters' simply installed the door
and windows. There was no check by anyone to ensure the parts sealed
when closed, no 'Quality Control' and on the basis the door was warped
before installation no or ineffective Quality Assurance. It seems to
me this FENSA self certification scheme is little short of a marketing
scam.

What particularly annoys me is how many other installations are
similarly defective? I checked the seals but how many do this? Not
many I suspect.

"Edward W. Thompson" wrote in message
...
I recently had 'replacement' Windows (PVCu) and a front door fitted by
a FENSA registered company. The windows were fine but the front door
leaks like a sieve as is does not completely mate with the seals
either outer or inner. The simple reason is the door is slightly
'warped

Obviously I am in 'dispute' with the supplier to replace the door and
that is another story!

What I am particularly interested in is the 'self certification'
aspect. If I understand the response to a question to FENSA on this
issue, FENSA are only interested in the 'design' aspect, that is that
the replacement parts meet Part L of the Building Code (I think that
is right). From their response, FENSA apparently couldn't care less
if the components are fitted correctly to ensure they are air tight.

The local Building Inspectors tell me they thought FENSA self
certification also covered installation, that is the installed product
is air tight and meets the intent of the code.

Anyone with any insight on this?

Referring to the installation, the 'fitters' simply installed the door
and windows. There was no check by anyone to ensure the parts sealed
when closed, no 'Quality Control' and on the basis the door was warped
before installation no or ineffective Quality Assurance. It seems to
me this FENSA self certification scheme is little short of a marketing
scam.

What particularly annoys me is how many other installations are
similarly defective? I checked the seals but how many do this? Not
many I suspect.

Have a look at http://www.fensa.org.uk/

Edward W. Thompson wrote:
I recently had 'replacement' Windows (PVCu) and a front door fitted by
a FENSA registered company. The windows were fine but the front door
leaks like a sieve as is does not completely mate with the seals
either outer or inner. The simple reason is the door is slightly
'warped

I don't think pvc doors "warp" but, if the frame was distorted during
installation, it would look that way

On Sat, 18 Mar 2006 13:16:29 GMT, Stuart Noble
wrote:

Edward W. Thompson wrote:
I recently had 'replacement' Windows (PVCu) and a front door fitted by
a FENSA registered company. The windows were fine but the front door
leaks like a sieve as is does not completely mate with the seals
either outer or inner. The simple reason is the door is slightly
'warped

I don't think pvc doors "warp" but, if the frame was distorted during
installation, it would look that way

Let me put it another way, when a straight edge is put up against the
door, the door is bowed. I thought warp means bent out of shape,
perhaps I am wrong :-)!

With respect to the FENSA web site, it tells you precisely nothing.
It certainly does not indicate, as far as I can see, what 'self
certification' means and how Companies given FENSA registration are
controlled for compliance, whatever compliance really means.

Edward W. Thompson wrote:

Let me put it another way, when a straight edge is put up against the
door, the door is bowed. I thought warp means bent out of shape,
perhaps I am wrong :-)!

Well, if you're going to get technical...:-)
Unusual for pvc to warp though.


With respect to the FENSA web site, it tells you precisely nothing.
It certainly does not indicate, as far as I can see, what 'self
certification' means and how Companies given FENSA registration are
controlled for compliance, whatever compliance really means.

Sounds like another self-interest group

"Edward W. Thompson" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 18 Mar 2006 13:16:29 GMT, Stuart Noble
wrote:

Edward W. Thompson wrote:
I recently had 'replacement' Windows (PVCu) and a front door fitted by
a FENSA registered company. The windows were fine but the front door
leaks like a sieve as is does not completely mate with the seals
either outer or inner. The simple reason is the door is slightly
'warped

I don't think pvc doors "warp" but, if the frame was distorted during
installation, it would look that way

I think 'warping' is what something does to itself. 'Bending' is what
someone else does to it. A wooden door may warp in damp weather, while a
plastic door may bend if forced into an opening the wrong shape. The
dictionary definitions mention wood a lot. Anyway - we know what you mean,
so the technical definition is moot ;-)

-- JJ

"Stuart Noble" wrote in message
news
Edward W. Thompson wrote:

Let me put it another way, when a straight edge is put up against the
door, the door is bowed. I thought warp means bent out of shape,
perhaps I am wrong :-)!

Well, if you're going to get technical...:-)
Unusual for pvc to warp though.


With respect to the FENSA web site, it tells you precisely nothing.
It certainly does not indicate, as far as I can see, what 'self
certification' means and how Companies given FENSA registration are
controlled for compliance, whatever compliance really means.

Sounds like another self-interest group

I took a look at that site too, trying to find out about DIY certification.
All it mentions is a few paragraphs that try to scare you out of getting
involved, by mentioning how you will have to bear the costs, and get the
planners involved, etc. Talking to a colleague, it cost him £60 and a cup of
tea for the inspector to look at the windows he put in, so it is really no
big deal getting a certificate.

-- JJ