The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but just to
remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html



--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but just to
remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html



--
Cheers,

John.


I heard about an accident a few years ago where a guy was sitting down using
a circular saw in his garage and managed to go through both of his legs.

His wife was in another room and had thought that he'd been using a hose
pipe (due to the sound), not realising it was actually his arteries. He bled
to death quite quickly.

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but just to
remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html

Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a ladder is
a prime candidate for a Darwin award.

Colin Bignell

Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a ladder
is
a prime candidate for a Darwin award.

Yes. I don't think that would comply with health and safety legislation.

Christian.

"nightjar .uk.com" wrote in message
Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a ladder
is a prime candidate for a Darwin award.

My thoughts entirely.

Dave

"nightjar" nightjar@ insert my surname here.uk.com wrote:

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but just to
remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html

Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a ladder is
a prime candidate for a Darwin award.

Anyone who does anything requiring the use of both arms while standing
on a ladder is pushing their luck in my opinion.

--
Chris Green

wrote:
"nightjar" nightjar@ insert my surname here.uk.com wrote:

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but
just to remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html

Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a
ladder is a prime candidate for a Darwin award.

Anyone who does anything requiring the use of both arms while standing
on a ladder is pushing their luck in my opinion.

So whats the difference between using a circular saw and a drill whilst
standing on a ladder?
I have been on jobs where I have had no alternative but to use a circular
saw.

So whats the difference between using a circular saw and a drill whilst
standing on a ladder?

Well, both should not be done. However, there is more potential for problems
with the circular saw. A good drill will have a rotor brake that stops it
dead when dropped. Even spinning it is likely to cause fewer injuries than
an out of control circular saw. However, there is potential for both tools
to snag, throwing you off the ladder to your death or serious injury.

I have been on jobs where I have had no alternative but to use a circular
saw.

But you probably had an alternative to the ladder. According to HSE, a
ladder is not a "work platform". However, there are alternatives that are.

Christian.

ben wrote:
wrote:
"nightjar" nightjar@ insert my surname here.uk.com wrote:

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but
just to remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html

Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a
ladder is a prime candidate for a Darwin award.

Anyone who does anything requiring the use of both arms while standing
on a ladder is pushing their luck in my opinion.

So whats the difference between using a circular saw and a drill whilst
standing on a ladder?

Not a lot, except that it's generally possible to do light drilling
jobs with only one hand holding the drill.

I have been on jobs where I have had no alternative but to use a circular
saw.

Then you need to find an alternative to the ladder!

--
Chris Green

wrote:
Not a lot, except that it's generally possible to do light drilling
jobs with only one hand holding the drill.

One of my criteria for choosing a drill is that it has a side handle but
is light enough for 1-handed use (obviously doesn't apply to SDS though!)

--
Spamtrap in use
To email replace 127.0.0.1 with blueyonder dot co dot uk

"ben" wrote in message
. uk...
....
So whats the difference between using a circular saw and a drill whilst
standing on a ladder?

The circular saw is a potentially more dangerous tool and it needs two hands
to use it.

I have been on jobs where I have had no alternative but to use a circular
saw.

In that case, you should not be on a ladder. It is not a stable or safe
working platform. There are step ladders that are designed with a work
platform at the top, although H&S inspectors are not really happy with those
either. The right solution is scaffolding with proper safety rails, a cherry
picker, one of the work platforms designed for use with a fork lift truck or
similar.

Colin Bignell

On 29 Jul 2005 08:56:15 GMT, wrote:

"nightjar" nightjar@ insert my surname here.uk.com wrote:

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but just to
remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html

Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a ladder is
a prime candidate for a Darwin award.

Anyone who does anything requiring the use of both arms while standing
on a ladder is pushing their luck in my opinion.

I'm a trapeze artist (who still has a lot of DIY to do in real life
:-) and I'm perfectly happy hanging by my toes from a 1" thick metal
bar 25 foot above the ground - i.e. a trapeze.

I *hate* ladders though - I've been using them for years for rigging
trapezes, and given the choice I wouldn't use them. Usually I attach
myself to something solid with a harness once I'm at the top of a
ladder. Wobbly, sharp, bendy, shiny horrible things, the lot of them.

Charlie

Charlie wrote:
I'm a trapeze artist

Does any group have a wider range of expertise than this, really?

Owain

In message , Charlie
writes
On 29 Jul 2005 08:56:15 GMT, wrote:

"nightjar" nightjar@ insert my surname here.uk.com wrote:

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but just to
remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html

Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a
ladder is
a prime candidate for a Darwin award.

Anyone who does anything requiring the use of both arms while standing
on a ladder is pushing their luck in my opinion.

I'm a trapeze artist (who still has a lot of DIY to do in real life
:-) and I'm perfectly happy hanging by my toes from a 1" thick metal
bar 25 foot above the ground - i.e. a trapeze.

I *hate* ladders though - I've been using them for years for rigging
trapezes, and given the choice I wouldn't use them. Usually I attach
myself to something solid with a harness once I'm at the top of a
ladder. Wobbly, sharp, bendy, shiny horrible things, the lot of them.

Can you juggle chain saws like Archaos used to ?

--
geoff

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 19:59:27 GMT, raden wrote:


Can you juggle chain saws like Archaos used to ?

Nope. Cos it's stupid.

Seriously though, someone at Archaos used to do this - but apparently
he didn't take the usual route (replace the cutting chain with a
motorbike chain, use a clutch so the chain stops quickly if it touches
something) - he used a normal chainsaw.

And eventually cut his leg off.

The thing to remember about circus tricks is that no matter how
dangerous they look, the artists are usually *very* careful to reduce
the risk to themselves as much as possible.

Charlie

"nightjar .uk.com" nightjar@insert my surname here wrote in message
...

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but just to
remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html

Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a ladder
is a prime candidate for a Darwin award.



It worrying that some circular saws can lock the switch on, so if you have
to drop it because of a graceful fall off the ladder, it doesn't stop the
motor itself.


rusty

"Rusty"
It worrying that some circular saws can lock the switch on, so if you have
to drop it because of a graceful fall off the ladder, it doesn't stop the
motor itself.
For some time, circular saws have been required to have switches that do not
*lock on*.

"Toolmaker" wrote in message
...
"Rusty"
It worrying that some circular saws can lock the switch on, so if you
have to drop it because of a graceful fall off the ladder, it doesn't
stop the motor itself.
For some time, circular saws have been required to have switches that do
not *lock on*.

Right, that must be why I got my nice Black and Decker at half price from a
shed.

For some time, circular saws have been required to have switches that do
not
*lock on*.

Are you sure that is true? Mine has a lock on and it isn't that old.

I regard it as safer, as it gives you an extra hand which gives you extra
control, which is a considerable safety benefit.

Christian.

"Toolmaker" wrote:

"Rusty"
It worrying that some circular saws can lock the switch on, so if you have
to drop it because of a graceful fall off the ladder, it doesn't stop the
motor itself.
For some time, circular saws have been required to have switches that do not
*lock on*.

In fact on more modern ones its more effective than that in preventing
accidental turn on. They still have what looks like a lock button on
the side but you need to press this to get the main switch to depress
- that's the way my Makita works and its a damn sight safer than the
way my old one could be accidentally powered or locked on.

--

Rusty wrote:
"nightjar .uk.com" nightjar@insert my surname here wrote in
message ...

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but
just to remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html

Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a
ladder is a prime candidate for a Darwin award.



It worrying that some circular saws can lock the switch on, so if you
have to drop it because of a graceful fall off the ladder, it doesn't
stop the motor itself.


rusty

A blade guard is paramount on cirular saws, and I would never buy one
without this.

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 10:50:51 GMT, "ben" wrote:

Rusty wrote:
"nightjar .uk.com" nightjar@insert my surname here wrote in
message ...

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but
just to remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html

Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a
ladder is a prime candidate for a Darwin award.



It worrying that some circular saws can lock the switch on, so if you
have to drop it because of a graceful fall off the ladder, it doesn't
stop the motor itself.


rusty

A blade guard is paramount on cirular saws, and I would never buy one
without this.

All the replys Mention circular saws Whe I read it it read as Angle
Grinder

still Gruesome

Lenny

In message , Lenny Brown
writes
On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 10:50:51 GMT, "ben" wrote:

Rusty wrote:
"nightjar .uk.com" nightjar@insert my surname here wrote in
message ...

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but
just to remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html

Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a
ladder is a prime candidate for a Darwin award.



It worrying that some circular saws can lock the switch on, so if you
have to drop it because of a graceful fall off the ladder, it doesn't
stop the motor itself.


rusty

A blade guard is paramount on cirular saws, and I would never buy one
without this.

All the replys Mention circular saws Whe I read it it read as Angle
Grinder

UKRM is that way -------------------------------
--
geoff

You'll never stop the blade spinning immediately, even if the power
does go off.

It's technically possible to stop the blade almost immediately with a
brake. But the momentum of the spinning blade has to go somewhere and
for a handheld saw that would simply jerk it out of your hands.

I don't believe Ben's statement "I have been on jobs where I have had
no alternative but to use a circular saw ". Using a circular saw
because that's all you brought with you is not a safe condition, or a
valid condition to claim "no alternative". Even if you wanted to use a
powered saw, a reciprocating saw (jigsaw or sabre saw) is much safer
than a hand-held circular and all its reaction forces.

I work on timber-framing projects with untrained apprentices running
around. No-one goes up onto a frame with a circular saw, nor do they
ever need to.

wrote:
You'll never stop the blade spinning immediately, even if the power
does go off.

It's technically possible to stop the blade almost immediately with a
brake. But the momentum of the spinning blade has to go somewhere and
for a handheld saw that would simply jerk it out of your hands.

I don't believe Ben's statement "I have been on jobs where I have had
no alternative but to use a circular saw ". Using a circular saw
because that's all you brought with you is not a safe condition, or a
valid condition to claim "no alternative". Even if you wanted to use a
powered saw, a reciprocating saw (jigsaw or sabre saw) is much safer
than a hand-held circular and all its reaction forces.

I work on timber-framing projects with untrained apprentices running
around. No-one goes up onto a frame with a circular saw, nor do they
ever need to.

You sound as if your building the things? but have you ever had the
opportunity to actully work on large beams in situ? i.e house renovation.

There are two conditions where I just don't use circular saws:

- Old timber or pallets, with the risk of nails etc. in it. If I do
cut this (and I do) then it's checked with a metal detector, then it
goes through the cabinet saw with the chipped blade on it. The saw is
also powerful enough to saw nails cleanly in half rather than jamming,
although thuis is hard on the blade.

- Off the ground, or anywhere where I can't control the reaction or
gyroscopic forces of the saw. That's what big reciprocating saws are
for.

What's this hypothetical situation where there's no alternative but a
circular saw up a ladder ?

On 29 Jul 2005 04:06:22 -0700, wrote:

You'll never stop the blade spinning immediately, even if the power
does go off.

It's technically possible to stop the blade almost immediately with a
brake. But the momentum of the spinning blade has to go somewhere and
for a handheld saw that would simply jerk it out of your hands.


I have a Hitachi circular saw with electric braking. The blade spins
down pretty fast when the trigger is released but not so fast as to
create too much of an unwanted force.

Nevertheless, it gets treated with great respect.




--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

In article ,
Andy Hall writes:
I have a Hitachi circular saw with electric braking. The blade spins
down pretty fast when the trigger is released but not so fast as to
create too much of an unwanted force.

My lawn mower used to do that, but the breaking stopped working
after about 5 years.

--
Andrew Gabriel

Rusty wrote:
"nightjar .uk.com" nightjar@insert my surname here wrote in message
...

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...

The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but just to
remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html

Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a ladder
is a prime candidate for a Darwin award.




It worrying that some circular saws can lock the switch on, so if you have
to drop it because of a graceful fall off the ladder, it doesn't stop the
motor itself.


rusty




Also one wonders why the blade guard did not self close?

Alex.

AlexW wrote:

Also one wonders why the blade guard did not self close?

That was the question that sprang to my mind... either it was a dodgy
saw, or he was just very unlucky to catch the angle of fall in such a
way as to operate the guard correctly.

IIUC he was on a small step ladder rather than a leant ladder as such...
still a dangerous proposition though.

It also gives no details of the size of saw... a small cordless 4" saw
that can be used single handed is somewhat different from trying to use
a full size 7" or even 10" saw in that circumstance.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

It probably had a go, just not quickly enough. It needs to close
entirely before hitting the body part, otherwise you'll hold it open -
as indeed it's designed to do.

It's also very common for users to wedge the guards back, or remove
them. One of the reasons I like my Skil Legend is that it has a very
convenient thumb lift for the guard, avoiding all need to do this.

In article , "Rusty" rusty@
666.fsnet.co.uk says...

"nightjar .uk.com" nightjar@insert my surname here wrote in message
...

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but just to
remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html

Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a ladder
is a prime candidate for a Darwin award.



It worrying that some circular saws can lock the switch on, so if you have
to drop it because of a graceful fall off the ladder, it doesn't stop the
motor itself.

Which are they? That sounds like a recipe for disaster.

In article ,
"Rusty" writes:

It worrying that some circular saws can lock the switch on, so if you have
to drop it because of a graceful fall off the ladder, it doesn't stop the
motor itself.

I just referred back and the story has been updated.
Besides being more gruesome now than I recall when I
first read it, it implies he wasn't using the saw at
the time, but was climbing down the ladder.

URL has changed:
http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ws/NEWS21.html

--
Andrew Gabriel

I just referred back and the story has been updated.
Besides being more gruesome now than I recall when I
first read it, it implies he wasn't using the saw at
the time, but was climbing down the ladder.

Indeed. It seems like a genuine unfortunate accident, as even with a proper
work platform, you'll probably have to climb up and down a ladder with your
tools.

However one must assume that the circular saw had a defective blade guard
and I'm amazed just what damage a stationary circ blade can do.

Christian.

"Christian McArdle" wrote in message
. net...
I just referred back and the story has been updated.
Besides being more gruesome now than I recall when I
first read it, it implies he wasn't using the saw at
the time, but was climbing down the ladder.

Indeed. It seems like a genuine unfortunate accident, as even with a
proper
work platform, you'll probably have to climb up and down a ladder with
your
tools.

You don't need to move them while they are still powered though.

Colin Bignell

"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
I just referred back and the story has been updated.
Besides being more gruesome now than I recall when I
first read it, it implies he wasn't using the saw at
the time, but was climbing down the ladder.

But what on earth had he been doing? I would never attempt to use a
circular saw on anything that wasn't clamped to a bench.

Dave

But what on earth had he been doing? I would never attempt to use a
circular saw on anything that wasn't clamped to a bench.

Perhaps he was climbing down a ladder from a bench or more likely tressles
perched atop the school roof. A terrible tragedy.

Henry

On 29 Jul 2005 14:45:58 GMT, (Andrew
Gabriel) wrote:

In article ,
"Rusty" writes:

It worrying that some circular saws can lock the switch on, so if you have
to drop it because of a graceful fall off the ladder, it doesn't stop the
motor itself.

I just referred back and the story has been updated.
Besides being more gruesome now than I recall when I
first read it, it implies he wasn't using the saw at
the time, but was climbing down the ladder.

URL has changed:
http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ws/NEWS21.html



Is it possible that it had something to do with his being from Rainham
as the article implies?

At least the priest was there and that appears to be the only saving
grace.



--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

nightjar nightjar@ wrote:
"John Rumm" wrote in message
...

The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but just to
remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html


Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a ladder is
a prime candidate for a Darwin award.

Colin Bignell



Everyone does something daft occasionally, even intentionally. Most of
us get away with it though.

Spare a thought for him and his family eh...

Alex.

"AlexW" wrote in message
...
nightjar nightjar@ wrote:
"John Rumm" wrote in message
...

The sort of incident you might expect when using a chainsaw, but just to
remind you of what can go wrong with a circular saw:

http://www.thisisessex.co.uk/essex/s...ews/NEWS5.html


Anyone who gets killed by using a circular saw while standing on a ladder
is a prime candidate for a Darwin award.

Colin Bignell

Everyone does something daft occasionally, even intentionally.

Many people do daft things. Those who have the right mental attitude to
safety do not. One of the biggest challenges to anyone responsible for
industrial safety is instilling that attitude into people.

Most of us get away with it though.

That demonstrates that you don't have the right mental attitude to safety.

Spare a thought for him and his family eh...

If he has a family, that disqualifies him from the Darwin award.

Colin Bignell