I'm tearing out my hair at the mo, because both of our showers have
developed leaks, both in the same place AFAICS - at the bottom corner
of the door. Given that the same cowboy (ahem) fitted both doors
(which are different brand and design) it does suggest a bit of
operator error. It's not at all obvious exactly where the water's
getting out, just that it's wet immediately below the corner and
nowhere else.

Both doors stipulated that they should be sealed with silicone at the
outside edge only, and that it was important *not* to seal them inside.
I felt very uncomfortable with this arrangment - it just *looks* wrong
when when you're in the shower! - but presumably the idea is that any
water which gets between the doorframe or base and the wall/tray runs
out into the tray, rather than either out onto the floor, or worse,
getting trapped behind the silicone.

I've already refitted one of these doors before, about 2 years ago (the
other was new a few months back). Any suggestions as to how to
proceed? (other than 'rip the doors out and do it again', because I'm
sure there's more to the problem than that)

--
Thanks
David

"Lobster" wrote in message
ups.com...
I'm tearing out my hair at the mo, because both of our showers have
developed leaks, both in the same place AFAICS - at the bottom corner
of the door. Given that the same cowboy (ahem) fitted both doors
(which are different brand and design) it does suggest a bit of
operator error. It's not at all obvious exactly where the water's
getting out, just that it's wet immediately below the corner and
nowhere else.

Both doors stipulated that they should be sealed with silicone at the
outside edge only, and that it was important *not* to seal them inside.
I felt very uncomfortable with this arrangment - it just *looks* wrong
when when you're in the shower! - but presumably the idea is that any
water which gets between the doorframe or base and the wall/tray runs
out into the tray, rather than either out onto the floor, or worse,
getting trapped behind the silicone.

I've already refitted one of these doors before, about 2 years ago (the
other was new a few months back). Any suggestions as to how to
proceed? (other than 'rip the doors out and do it again', because I'm
sure there's more to the problem than that)

Thanks
David

What type of doors are they? Are they hinged directly off a wall rail
support? Do they make up a complete cubicle? Is the silicone sealant
spread right down the outside of the support rail, including along the
little bit at the very bottom? Is the seal strip along the bottom fully in
place? Sometimes the seal strip can move along the runner it sits in, and
this creates a small opening at the end that allows water to pass.

It's always a good idea to squirt sealant along the back of the support,
right down the middle and over the screw holes, before you offer the rail to
the wall and fix it. This gives the rail a seal to stop water getting right
the way through, but it leaves the edges open to allow any condensation that
may dribble down off the wall to escape unhindered. It's never a good idea
to seal both inside and outside edges, which would only help to trap water
in the gap that's left between them. A puddle of water between the wall and
the support rail isn't going to do any of them any good.

BigWallop wrote:
"Lobster" wrote in message
ups.com...

I'm tearing out my hair at the mo, because both of our showers have
developed leaks...

What type of doors are they? Are they hinged directly off a wall rail
support? Do they make up a complete cubicle? Is the silicone sealant
spread right down the outside of the support rail, including along the
little bit at the very bottom? Is the seal strip along the bottom fully in
place? Sometimes the seal strip can move along the runner it sits in, and
this creates a small opening at the end that allows water to pass.

OK, to answer the queries: both doors are self-contained, ie a
rectangular frame with built-in hinges; one has two sliding doors, the
other is a bi-fold one. In both cases they fit between a tile solid
wall and a tiled stud partition (ie, the cubicle is tiled on three walls).

Yes, there's silicone right round the outside; both sides and the
bottom. Certainly the recently-fitted door doesn't have any seal strip
(just rechecked the fitting instructions which I kept, and it doesn't
mention one); and I'm pretty sure that the older door was the same.
Certainly can't *see* any sealing strip.

It's always a good idea to squirt sealant along the back of the support,
right down the middle and over the screw holes, before you offer the rail to
the wall and fix it. This gives the rail a seal to stop water getting right
the way through, but it leaves the edges open to allow any condensation that
may dribble down off the wall to escape unhindered. It's never a good idea
to seal both inside and outside edges, which would only help to trap water
in the gap that's left between them. A puddle of water between the wall and
the support rail isn't going to do any of them any good.

Yes, that's exactly what I did, and then sealed the outer face of the
door only.

It's obviously getting through somewhere, but I hate the idea of ripping
it all out to re-do it, especially as I fitted it really carefully, and
as far as I could tell, effectively - ie, I don't know how I could do it
any differently next time.

--
Thanks
David

"Lobster" wrote in message
...
BigWallop wrote:
"Lobster" wrote in message
ups.com...

snipped
in the gap that's left between them. A puddle of water between the wall
and
the support rail isn't going to do any of them any good.

Yes, that's exactly what I did, and then sealed the outer face of the
door only.

It's obviously getting through somewhere, but I hate the idea of ripping
it all out to re-do it, especially as I fitted it really carefully, and
as far as I could tell, effectively - ie, I don't know how I could do it
any differently next time.

Thanks
David

And do you think water could actually be getting over the top of the screen
when you're showering? Or could steam be condensing on something above or
around the screen, then dripping down to look like it comes from the screen
itself? Where the door unit fits inside the support rail, does this has a
good seal around the edges. Gaps between the support rail and where the
door unit slips inside the U shape can be a good way for water to find an
escape route.

A good test to see exactly where a leak is forming, is to sprinkle talcum
powder all over the screen and surrounds before using the shower. A light
dusting is enough to expose where water has been running from, and might
show that clear water is running from somewhere that you wouldn't expect.

I hate not being able to actually see such jobs. Very frustrating indeed.
:-)

"Lobster" wrote in message
...
BigWallop wrote:
"Lobster" wrote in message
ups.com...

snipped

Yes, there's silicone right round the outside; both sides and the
bottom. Certainly the recently-fitted door doesn't have any seal strip
(just rechecked the fitting instructions which I kept, and it doesn't
mention one); and I'm pretty sure that the older door was the same.
Certainly can't *see* any sealing strip.

Thanks
David

The seal strip I mean is along the bottom of the moving part of the doors.
Sorry about my wording, it didn't read like what I meant it to. :-)

The bottom of the door should have some sort of sealing strip along it. It
fits between the door and the edge of the bath or tray. These stop any
water that bounces off the edges of the tray, from running under the doors.
Sometimes these can slide along away from the ends, and is sometimes enough
to create a gap that the water finds to escape through.

BigWallop wrote:

And do you think water could actually be getting over the top of the screen
when you're showering? Or could steam be condensing on something above or
around the screen, then dripping down to look like it comes from the screen
itself? Where the door unit fits inside the support rail, does this has a
good seal around the edges. Gaps between the support rail and where the
door unit slips inside the U shape can be a good way for water to find an
escape route.

Well, it's running water for sure, not condensation. One of the two
leaks came to light earlier this week when I was in there; SWMBO came
running upstairs shrieking about the flood. There was water running out
of a light fitting - one of thoise with an inverted glass bowl as a
shade, which had filled with about a pint or so of water and was
overflowing. When I took it down to empty, I found a vast number of
tide marks at different levels all around the inside of the bowl - one
for each time the shower's been used - telling me that this leaking has
been going on undetected for weeks, if not months, and presumably until
now the heat from the light has been enough to evaporate off surplus
water in between showers, until now, when we are barely using the light
as it's midsummer. Ouch.

A good test to see exactly where a leak is forming, is to sprinkle talcum
powder all over the screen and surrounds before using the shower. A light
dusting is enough to expose where water has been running from, and might
show that clear water is running from somewhere that you wouldn't expect.

Nice idea - will give that one a go!

Thanks
David

"Lobster" wrote in message
...
BigWallop wrote:

And do you think water could actually be getting over the top of the
screen
when you're showering? Or could steam be condensing on something above
or
around the screen, then dripping down to look like it comes from the
screen
itself? Where the door unit fits inside the support rail, does this has
a
good seal around the edges. Gaps between the support rail and where the
door unit slips inside the U shape can be a good way for water to find
an
escape route.

Well, it's running water for sure, not condensation. One of the two
leaks came to light earlier this week when I was in there; SWMBO came
running upstairs shrieking about the flood. There was water running out
of a light fitting - one of thoise with an inverted glass bowl as a
shade, which had filled with about a pint or so of water and was
overflowing. When I took it down to empty, I found a vast number of
tide marks at different levels all around the inside of the bowl - one
for each time the shower's been used - telling me that this leaking has
been going on undetected for weeks, if not months, and presumably until
now the heat from the light has been enough to evaporate off surplus
water in between showers, until now, when we are barely using the light
as it's midsummer. Ouch.

A good test to see exactly where a leak is forming, is to sprinkle
talcum
powder all over the screen and surrounds before using the shower. A
light
dusting is enough to expose where water has been running from, and might
show that clear water is running from somewhere that you wouldn't
expect.

Nice idea - will give that one a go!

Thanks
David

WOW!!! It's enough water to flow through the ceiling in the time it takes
for one shower? Are you sure it's the door area that's leaking? This
sounds more like a leak in the seal around the tray and wall joint, or on
the waste outlet pipework. The drips that flow from the door seals would
only be enough to wet the floor, not flow through the ceiling into the room
below. You'd have to point the head of the shower at the shower door, and
leave the shower doors fully open for that amount of water to get out.

It's not your door screen that's leaking mate, it's the waste outlet under
the tray. For damn sure.

BigWallop wrote:
"Lobster" wrote in message
...

Well, it's running water for sure, not condensation. One of the two
leaks came to light earlier this week when I was in there; SWMBO came
running upstairs shrieking about the flood. There was water running out
of a light fitting - one of thoise with an inverted glass bowl as a
shade, which had filled with about a pint or so of water and was
overflowing. When I took it down to empty, I found a vast number of
tide marks at different levels all around the inside of the bowl - one
for each time the shower's been used - telling me that this leaking has
been going on undetected for weeks, if not months, and presumably until
now the heat from the light has been enough to evaporate off surplus
water in between showers, until now, when we are barely using the light
as it's midsummer. Ouch.

WOW!!! It's enough water to flow through the ceiling in the time it takes
for one shower? Are you sure it's the door area that's leaking? This
sounds more like a leak in the seal around the tray and wall joint, or on
the waste outlet pipework. The drips that flow from the door seals would
only be enough to wet the floor, not flow through the ceiling into the room
below. You'd have to point the head of the shower at the shower door, and
leave the shower doors fully open for that amount of water to get out.

It's not your door screen that's leaking mate, it's the waste outlet under
the tray. For damn sure.

Really don't think so. I can get my hand to the outlet and it's bone
dry, and the (inaccessible) pipework goes in the other direction, away
from the wet area. Point is, it's evidently been leaking very slowly
over a long period, presumably not allowing the damp between the ceiling
and floor to dry out, so that it builds up and emerges through the
ceiling? The other day when it emerged it happened at the end of a the
second (longish) shower in a row.

If it IS a pipework issue then that would really be a mess - the tray
was installed by a pro (ha-ha) without any thought given to any future
maintenance/access issues (at least the other shower I installed
recently myself - less serious leak - is reasonably easy to get at).

David

On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 07:11:30 GMT, Lobster
wrote:

Really don't think so. I can get my hand to the outlet and it's bone
dry, and the (inaccessible) pipework goes in the other direction, away
from the wet area. Point is, it's evidently been leaking very slowly
over a long period, presumably not allowing the damp between the ceiling
and floor to dry out, so that it builds up and emerges through the
ceiling? The other day when it emerged it happened at the end of a the
second (longish) shower in a row.

If it IS a pipework issue then that would really be a mess - the tray
was installed by a pro (ha-ha) without any thought given to any future
maintenance/access issues (at least the other shower I installed
recently myself - less serious leak - is reasonably easy to get at).


Hi,

Is it sealed on the outside right to the corners and across to the
tiles, maybe water is going down the edges and out through a gap.

Try looking underneath while SOH is having a shower, it could be there
are gaps that are only visible when the shower tray is under load.

Also sealing it temporarily with duct tape and playing the shower on
it, will tell whether the problem is where you think it is.

cheers,
Pete.

Try looking underneath while SOH is having a shower,

If I tried that I'd get a slap!

Mungo (already in "Friday" mood... :-)

Probably not applicable, Lobster, , but throw it in the mix: we
discovered our shower was leaking round the door area recently - big wet
patch on the floor, had been hidden for weeks/months by the carpet.

I eventually twigged that the plastic sealing strip which runs along the
bottom of the door *frame*, inside the shower, had been clipped on
upside down. (These strips clip into a channel, and are easily removable
presumably for cleaning.) As a result instead of diverting the water
down into the tray, it was funnelling it into the corner of the frame,
where the silicone sealant had eventually given up the struggle.

My wife said that she thought that that was the way the blokie had
installed the strip when the shower was put in - *years* ago! I
couldn't really believe this: it's so obvious (once I'd looked at it
critically) that it was upside down. Yet I myself had clipped it on
upside down more than once, having cleaned it, because "that's the way
I'd found it".

I'm impressed with "pints into the kitchen light fitting". That sounds
more than a sealant leakage to me!

John

In article . com,
Lobster wrote:
I've already refitted one of these doors before, about 2 years ago (the
other was new a few months back). Any suggestions as to how to
proceed? (other than 'rip the doors out and do it again', because I'm
sure there's more to the problem than that)

I simply gave up and fitted a shower curtain which just runs across the
door.

--
*Change is inevitable ... except from vending machines *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

wrote in message
ups.com...
Try looking underneath while SOH is having a shower,

If I tried that I'd get a slap!

Mungo (already in "Friday" mood... :-)

It's POETS DAY Mungo.

If only I could (**** Off Early Tomorrow's Saturday). Just finished a
week
working in Dublin and the only direct flight home leaves at 20:50
tonight.
Ho hum - time to plan out all the weekend jobs that need done before
the
new condensing boiler arrives on Monday...

Have a nice weekend folks.

Mungo :-)

wrote in message
oups.com...
If only I could (**** Off Early Tomorrow's Saturday). Just finished a
week
working in Dublin and the only direct flight home leaves at 20:50
tonight.
Ho hum - time to plan out all the weekend jobs that need done before
the
new condensing boiler arrives on Monday...

Have a nice weekend folks.

Mungo :-)

Same back at ya' Mungo. Good luck with the boiler system.

replying to Lobster, Algy Lambert wrote:
Spread lip balm (Vaseline in the UK) around the outside of where the leak is,
particularly the bottom where the door hinge is. Top up as necessary. Works
a treat for me.

--
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