Missed a couple of minutes of tonight's Gloucester lawyers prog. So I went
to the GD website and was astonished to see even the supplier of
"Tolietries (small bathroom)" (sic) credited. This suggests that the people
who appear can scrounge all sorts of stuff 'for the publicity'.

No big surprise but it set me wondering. Assuming that they get some sort
of appearance/co-operation fee from GD - how much can you make, all in, by
being filmed?

--
Rod

In article ,
Rod writes:
Missed a couple of minutes of tonight's Gloucester lawyers prog. So I went
to the GD website and was astonished to see even the supplier of
"Tolietries (small bathroom)" (sic) credited. This suggests that the people
who appear can scrounge all sorts of stuff 'for the publicity'.

No big surprise but it set me wondering. Assuming that they get some sort
of appearance/co-operation fee from GD - how much can you make, all in, by
being filmed?

I doubt they get any fee from GD. They might get a discount on
some of the fixtures and fittings in exchange for a mention on
C4's website.

--
Andrew Gabriel

In message ,
Rod wrote:

Missed a couple of minutes of tonight's Gloucester lawyers prog. So I went
to the GD website and was astonished to see even the supplier of
"Tolietries (small bathroom)" (sic) credited. This suggests that the people
who appear can scrounge all sorts of stuff 'for the publicity'.

No big surprise but it set me wondering. Assuming that they get some sort
of appearance/co-operation fee from GD - how much can you make, all in, by
being filmed?


Dunno, but when my sis and bro' in law contacted Property Ladder, there
was no fee from the programme makers involved; though they did promise a
bottle and a copy of the programme on tape. I suspect that with the
proliferation of this sort of programme most suppliers wouldn't do
anything too special. If I had the chance of working on a building while
being filmed, I wouldn't offer any special deals because if you get on
camera at all, it's for two or three seconds, they usually say something
like "and the bill for the electrics is twice as high as expected" and
even if your logo is emblazoned across all available area of your shirt,
it's rarely seen for long enough or clear enough to make an impact.

Mentions on the website are ok, but I can't see it's going to make much
of an advertising impact unless you are perhaps a national supplier of
some hard-to-get niche product, in which case you can charge what you
like anyway because people are willing to pay.

Note adapted subject line: have you any idea how many "Grand Designs"
threads Google has archived over the years?

Hwyl!

M.

--
Martin Angove: http://www.tridwr.demon.co.uk/
Two free issues: http://www.livtech.co.uk/ Living With Technology
.... Hire teenagers while they still know everything.

Martin Angove wrote in
:

Note adapted subject line: have you any idea how many "Grand Designs"
threads Google has archived over the years?

Yes - I know but although I mentioned it, I really wasn't commenting just
on tonight's edition.

It is also amazing how many times the featured people just manage to do
something extra at the end of filming - something that they had earlier
deemed too expensive. Examples include doing the landscaping or getting new
furniture.

--
Rod

Martin Angove wrote:

Note adapted subject line: have you any idea how many "Grand Designs"
threads Google has archived over the years?

Follow on question...
what the hell have they re-mortgaged it for?
All that hidden I.T. work and lighting etc etc couldn't have come cheap.
Considering they were stuffing chillis into bottles to earn a few quid
and doing very little (evident) work themselves !

On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 22:47:22 GMT, GymRatZ
wrote:

Martin Angove wrote:

Note adapted subject line: have you any idea how many "Grand Designs"
threads Google has archived over the years?

Follow on question...
what the hell have they re-mortgaged it for?
All that hidden I.T. work and lighting etc etc couldn't have come cheap.
Considering they were stuffing chillis into bottles to earn a few quid
and doing very little (evident) work themselves !

Well the restoration budget started at £65,000, then went to £120,000
then finished up about £300,000 ...Must have damn good jobs I say and
they also cashed in their pensions to help out .
Stuart






Shift THELEVER to reply.

In article ,=20
says...
On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 22:47:22 GMT, GymRatZ
wrote:
=20
Martin Angove wrote:

Note adapted subject line: have you any idea how many "Grand Designs"
threads Google has archived over the years?

Follow on question...
what the hell have they re-mortgaged it for?
All that hidden I.T. work and lighting etc etc couldn't have come cheap.=
=20
Considering they were stuffing chillis into bottles to earn a few quid=
=20
and doing very little (evident) work themselves !
=20
Well the restoration budget started at =C2=A365,000, then went to =C2=A31=
20,000
then finished up about =C2=A3300,000 ...Must have damn good jobs I say a=
nd
they also cashed in their pensions to help out .
Stuart=20
=20


I got a feeling da-da or mummsy where around somewhere with deep deep=20
pockets
--=20
Paul Mc Cann

Paul Mc Cann wrote:

I got a feeling da-da or mummsy where around somewhere with deep deep
pockets

LOL.
I kept seeing what looked like a jar of "ashes" in the fireplace and
wondered if it was a late grand-parent that contributed substantially to
the costs upon their departure.

In message ,
GymRatZ wrote:

Martin Angove wrote:

Note adapted subject line: have you any idea how many "Grand Designs"
threads Google has archived over the years?

Follow on question...
what the hell have they re-mortgaged it for?
All that hidden I.T. work and lighting etc etc couldn't have come cheap.
Considering they were stuffing chillis into bottles to earn a few quid
and doing very little (evident) work themselves !


My thoughts exactly. It would surely have saved a five figure sum easily
to have put in the cabling, but left off buying the kit for a year or
two? Having said that, I suppose they probably thought "in for a
penny..." because if they are already mortgaged (or whatever) beyond the
hilt, a couple more quid on the repayments isn't going to make much
difference, but getting the money together for the kit later on might be
difficult with such a large existing commitment.

Hwyl!

M.

--
Martin Angove: http://www.tridwr.demon.co.uk/
Two free issues: http://www.livtech.co.uk/ Living With Technology
.... Please think when you drink....

In message ,
Martin Angove wrote:

In message ,
Rod wrote:

Missed a couple of minutes of tonight's Gloucester lawyers prog. So I went
to the GD website and was astonished to see even the supplier of
"Tolietries (small bathroom)" (sic) credited. This suggests that the people
who appear can scrounge all sorts of stuff 'for the publicity'.

No big surprise but it set me wondering. Assuming that they get some sort
of appearance/co-operation fee from GD - how much can you make, all in, by
being filmed?


Dunno, but when my sis and bro' in law contacted Property Ladder, there
was no fee from the programme makers involved; though they did promise a
bottle and a copy of the programme on tape. I suspect that with the
proliferation of this sort of programme most suppliers wouldn't do
anything too special. If I had the chance of working on a building while
being filmed, I wouldn't offer any special deals because if you get on
camera at all, it's for two or three seconds, they usually say something
like "and the bill for the electrics is twice as high as expected" and
even if your logo is emblazoned across all available area of your shirt,
it's rarely seen for long enough or clear enough to make an impact.


Just realised that the obvious exceptions to this were both Grand
Designs programmes: the one about the Huff Haus which spent the whole
programme talking about these fantastic Germans and their brilliant
system (but Huff have a huge waiting list, so they hardly need to offer
incentives for extra publicity), and the one about that girl with the
funny name (Melody?) and her bloke who built an "experimental" half
oak-framed house. Not so many mentions, but not difficult to work out
that said girl's daddy runs Border Oak who designed and built the house
and so there would have been *loads* of freebies available, not only for
family reasons, but also because of the mentions in the programme and
the articles in the magazines (it was definitely in Homebuilding and
Renovating, and I *think* I saw it in Self Build & Design too).

On the other side of the argument, I saw a DIY SOS last night; it was at
completely the other end of the scale; "here are Bill and Ben" (or
whatever their names were). "They are hand crafting this lovely oak
kitchen..." but not a mention of the supplier's name. Probably on the
website, though I haven't checked.

Hwyl!

M.

--
Martin Angove: http://www.tridwr.demon.co.uk/
Two free issues: http://www.livtech.co.uk/ Living With Technology
.... Blessed are the Greeks

Martin Angove wrote:
In message ,
Rod wrote:

snip question about GD

Dunno, but when my sis and bro' in law contacted Property Ladder,
there
was no fee from the programme makers involved;

Did they have to fill in a questionaire, which I imagine goes something
like this:

1) Are you an arrogant pair of freaks, who can agree on nothing?
2) Do you commit to ignoring all advice when given by a professional?
3) Do you consider your own 'research' (asking two of your freakish
friends and glancing in one estate agents window) to be far superior to
say 15 years experience in the building trade?
4) Are you colour blind?
5) Will you commit to buying a second property wihtout a survey half
way through renovating your first, despite it being a royal **** up on
which you will make no money?
6) Are you 'living the dream'?
7) Will you put your property on the market based on your own
(ludicrously high) estimates rather than listening to the guest estate
agents, who will over value the place anyway because they want lots of
commision?

Answered yes to all questions? We'll be in touch.

Answer no to any and it's bad luck I'm afraid, you're far to likely to
actually do something sensible which makes for terrifically dull
television.

Although answer our bonus question with a 'yes' and you can go on Grand
Designs:

Bonus Question: When you have exhausted all forms of savings,
investments, credit and indeed all fiscal avenues open to you 3/4 of
the way through your build are you able to 'dig a little deeper' or
'look really hard' and magiaclly find another =A350,000?


Of course despite this I still watch the flippin programs...
--=20
Steve F

On the other side of the argument, I saw a DIY SOS last night; it was at
completely the other end of the scale; "here are Bill and Ben" (or
whatever their names were). "They are hand crafting this lovely oak
kitchen..." but not a mention of the supplier's name. Probably on the
website, though I haven't checked.

Hwyl!

M.

--
Martin Angove: http://www.tridwr.demon.co.uk/
Two free issues: http://www.livtech.co.uk/ Living With Technology
... Blessed are the Greeks
They had there company name on the back of there overalls and on their van
in the last shot.

Trevor Smith

In article ,
Martin Angove writes:
In message ,
GymRatZ wrote:
Follow on question...
what the hell have they re-mortgaged it for?
All that hidden I.T. work and lighting etc etc couldn't have come cheap.
Considering they were stuffing chillis into bottles to earn a few quid
and doing very little (evident) work themselves !

My thoughts exactly. It would surely have saved a five figure sum easily
to have put in the cabling, but left off buying the kit for a year or

Also, it adds nothing to the value of a house. Indeed complex
home automation often subtracts value because it scares buyers
off, sadly.

--
Andrew Gabriel

Also, it adds nothing to the value of a house. Indeed complex
home automation often subtracts value because it scares buyers
off, sadly.


Agreed, but they had "fallen in love with the space and would live here
forever".
Umtil they split up, that is. He would then have to take his boys toys
to a rented garret.

Bruce

I got a feeling da-da or mummsy where around somewhere with deep deep=20
pockets
Paul Mc Cann

No - there was something really speciall about those chillies in oil.

But let's not worry about where the money came from. The important
lesson is that one should not destroy historic fabric, one should
never use Portland cement and that lime and oak are the best building
materials.

Check out the website and see a credit for the PR company who blagged
the home cinema system - although the word they used was 'sourced'.

"Martin Angove" wrote in message
My thoughts exactly. It would surely have saved a five figure sum easily
to have put in the cabling,

Although the guy did explain it, I can't believe there wasn't a simpler way
of doing all that cabling with some sort of multiplexing. I think the new
Airbus A380 has a lower cable density than thay house.

Martin Angove wrote:
... If I had the chance of working on a building while
being filmed, I wouldn't offer any special deals because if you get on
camera at all, it's for two or three seconds, they usually say something
like "and the bill for the electrics is twice as high as expected" and
even if your logo is emblazoned across all available area of your shirt,
it's rarely seen for long enough or clear enough to make an impact.

However the value possibly lies not in the advertising on GD itself,
which as you say is negligible, but in the press release you send to
your local papers "Local tradesman featured on telly programme", etc.

Owain

Biff wrote:

I got a feeling da-da or mummsy where around somewhere with deep deep=20
pockets
Paul Mc Cann


No - there was something really speciall about those chillies in oil.

But let's not worry about where the money came from. The important
lesson is that one should not destroy historic fabric, one should
never use Portland cement and that lime and oak are the best building
materials.

Indeed. So superlative are they that aircraft use them almost
exclusively ;-)

On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 00:44:45 +0100, Stuart
wrote:

Well the restoration budget started at £65,000, then went to £120,000
then finished up about £300,000

That was the bit I couldn't understand. One glance at it must have told
anyone it would cost more than 65k. You must be looking at pretty well
that (or more?) just for the kitchen extension, with glass link, and
fitted kitchen, surely?
--
On-line canal route planner: http://www.canalplan.org.uk

(Waterways World site of the month, April 2001)

Why is everyone obsessed with the money but no-one mentions lime, oak
and hand-made glass.

In message ,
(Biff) wrote:

Why is everyone obsessed with the money but no-one mentions lime, oak
and hand-made glass.

Possibly because money was (or appeared to be) the big conjouring
trick in this episode. From the first five minutes it was obvious to
anyone with half a brain that £65k or £70k or whatever wasn't going to
be anywhere near enough money, especially given

a: need to replace like-with-like (your lime, oak, glass and
due to the listed building status)

b: stated aim to install large amounts of high-tech gadgetry

c: design for new kitchen in oak with glass wall and roof

d: they obviously bought it more through heart than head ("we
just fell in love with it").

I for one was incredibly jealous of the whole concept. I would love to
have £750k (or whatever the final total was) to play with and do
something like this. I too would probably have pulled out all the
stops to use appropriate and sympathetic replacements where necessary,
but given a mere £70k at the outset I think I would probably have
known that it wasn't going to be enough.

I suppose that *if* the house had been structurally sound, and *if*
none of the timbers had needed replacing then £70k would have looked a
little more realistic, but you only needed two facts to be able to
guess that this wasn't the case: the house was several hundred years
old, and had had no work done on it within living memory.

Was that what you meant?

Hwyl!

M.

--
Martin Angove: http://www.tridwr.demon.co.uk/
Two free issues: http://www.livtech.co.uk/ Living With Technology
.... Dessert? I'll take a piece of cherry pi.

Martin Angove wrote in
:

I suppose that *if* the house had been structurally sound, and *if*
none of the timbers had needed replacing then £70k would have looked a
little more realistic, but you only needed two facts to be able to
guess that this wasn't the case: the house was several hundred years
old, and had had no work done on it within living memory.

Good answer, Martin.

There have been many GD programs where money has not been splashed around
(classics being the Welsh hillside and the wooden house in the woods). But
did you really feel that these Gloucester lawyers would have appeared at
all for nothing? (Remember, lawyers simply don't appear for nothing.)

Over the years I have seen several GD houses in various places (GD's own
website and magazine as well as other 'style' publications). I reckon that
the total exposure achievable is quite significant.

I totally agree with Martin that 70k was a joke in the circumstances. That
the extra money was found was not a surprise. But from where? Their
resources? Or payments of various sorts, possibly including knock-down
prices on some items?

OK, so lime and wood are classics. It is nice to seem them being used. But
I am damned sure that the house is riddled with copper, plastic,
plasterboard, etc. It is no purist's dream house.

--
Rod

I suppose that *if* the house had been structurally sound, and *if*
none of the timbers had needed replacing then £70k would have looked a
little more realistic, but you only needed two facts to be able to
guess that this wasn't the case: the house was several hundred years
old, and had had no work done on it within living memory.

I totally agree with Martin that 70k was a joke in the circumstances. That
the extra money was found was not a surprise. But from where? Their
resources? Or payments of various sorts, possibly including knock-down
prices on some items?

OK, so lime and wood are classics. It is nice to seem them being used. But
I am damned sure that the house is riddled with copper, plastic,
plasterboard, etc. It is no purist's dream house.

Well I thought he had a twinkle in his eye and tongue firmly pressed
in cheek when he mentioned the &70k, but their personal finances are
their affair and we shouldn't be interested.
The point of the programme was about how to make a historic house
function in the 21st century with minimal damage to historic fabric.
Kevin McCloud has been quietly pushing the case for lime over cement
and gypsum for many years and this house was a great showcase for
appropriate building materials and techniques. Sure the electrics use
copper and plastic - this is a house to be lived in with all mod cons
not a 16th century museum piece but I doubt if any plasterboard or
Ordinary Portland cement was used on the site.

Rod wrote in message .4...
I suppose that *if* the house had been structurally sound, and *if*
none of the timbers had needed replacing then £70k would have looked a
little more realistic,

Still no banana. The fitted kitchen alone would have run to 20k plus
probably that much for the extension and a few grand for the glass
link. That leaded glass window would have been in the thousands,
probabably 10k for heating and electrics on a 'normal' house. The
initial budget was woefully inadequate but seemed to basically be a
joke - as was the chilli bottle stuffing. "We're £120,000 short so i'm
going to raise £100 selling chilli's in oil." I rather suspect that
all of the two lawyers "working on it themselves" was just for the
cameras and they actually did next to nothing.

Either they started with far more than they said (and the initial
figure was for 'dramatic effect') or there was an advance on
inheritance from some very rich parents.


There have been many GD programs where money has not been splashed around
(classics being the Welsh hillside and the wooden house in the woods). But
did you really feel that these Gloucester lawyers would have appeared at
all for nothing?

I don't quite understand that either. I know that there are kickbacks
on fixtures and fittings (it's not just GD but newspaper and magazine
features in the future) and I can see that architects have a lot to
gain from their designs being featured but i think a lot of it must
just be showing off. People generally come across well on GD compared
to most reality TV.

"Mike" wrote in message ...
"Martin Angove" wrote in message
Although the guy did explain it, I can't believe there wasn't a simpler way
of doing all that cabling with some sort of multiplexing.

Indeed - Surely they should be fitting a full CAT5 structured cabling
system running everyting over IP. Far more flexible and upgradable.

In message ,
(Biff) wrote:


Sure the electrics use
copper and plastic - this is a house to be lived in with all mod cons
not a 16th century museum piece but I doubt if any plasterboard or
Ordinary Portland cement was used on the site.

They sure were - most of the partitioning in the attic was bog
standard plasterboard (it was specifically mentioned at least twice)
and skimmed, no doubt, with bog standard plaster. Apart from the one
end of the attic, I don't think they even managed to use Oak
floorboards. I got the impression that the partition they moved
(living room) was also built as a normal stud-plasterboard wall, but I
can't recall that being mentioned quite so specifically. Lastly, the
extension (inner leaf at least) was built using standard blocks and
cement as far as I could tell.

Hwyl!

M.

--
Martin Angove: http://www.tridwr.demon.co.uk/
Two free issues: http://www.livtech.co.uk/ Living With Technology
.... DOS is just an operating system that runs Windows 3.1

In message ,
(Anthony James) wrote:

"Mike" wrote in message
...
"Martin Angove" wrote in message
Although the guy did explain it, I can't believe there wasn't a simpler way
of doing all that cabling with some sort of multiplexing.


I just wish to point out that, although I agree with the above
statement, it wasn't actually me wot said it; it was the
aforementioned "Mike".

Indeed - Surely they should be fitting a full CAT5 structured cabling
system running everyting over IP. Far more flexible and upgradable.

Have you tried running distributed TV over IP?

Hwyl!

M.

--
Martin Angove: http://www.tridwr.demon.co.uk/
Two free issues: http://www.livtech.co.uk/ Living With Technology
.... 1024x768x16M - sounds like one *mean* woman!

In message ,
(Anthony James) wrote:

Rod wrote in message
.4...
I suppose that *if* the house had been structurally sound, and *if*
none of the timbers had needed replacing then £70k would have looked a
little more realistic,


Come on, you've misquoted again. That bit above *was* me this time!

[snip cos I have nothing sensible to add at this stage]

Hwyl!

M.

--
Martin Angove: http://www.tridwr.demon.co.uk/
Two free issues: http://www.livtech.co.uk/ Living With Technology
.... Hold on - wait, maybe the answer's looking for you.

"Rod" wrote in message
. 4...

There have been many GD programs where money has not been splashed around
(classics being the Welsh hillside and the wooden house in the woods). But
did you really feel that these Gloucester lawyers would have appeared at
all for nothing? (Remember, lawyers simply don't appear for nothing.)

One of the researchers for GD has contributed to the www.periodproperty
forum in the past and confirmed they don't pay for appearances. I wonder if
these pair intend to set up some form of project management company - with
law qualifications as well they could offer a turnkey solution.

"Martin Angove" wrote in message
...
"Mike" wrote in message
...
Although the guy did explain it, I can't believe there wasn't a simpler
way
of doing all that cabling with some sort of multiplexing.


I just wish to point out that, although I agree with the above
statement, it wasn't actually me wot said it; it was the
aforementioned "Mike".

Indeed - Surely they should be fitting a full CAT5 structured cabling
system running everyting over IP. Far more flexible and upgradable.

Have you tried running distributed TV over IP?

I have running over ADSL as well. Needs care with buffering and run-on but
quite achieveable.

All seat TVs on the new A380 also use IP, albeit using a special switch
which does implement priority routing unlike certain Ciscos :-)

"Mike" wrote:


"Rod" wrote in message
.4...

There have been many GD programs where money has not been splashed around
(classics being the Welsh hillside and the wooden house in the woods). But
did you really feel that these Gloucester lawyers would have appeared at
all for nothing? (Remember, lawyers simply don't appear for nothing.)

One of the researchers for GD has contributed to the www.periodproperty
forum in the past and confirmed they don't pay for appearances. I wonder if
these pair intend to set up some form of project management company - with
law qualifications as well they could offer a turnkey solution.

turnkey solution?

turkey solution more like



--

"Cynical Git" wrote in message
...
"Mike" wrote:


"Rod" wrote in message
.4...

There have been many GD programs where money has not been splashed
around
(classics being the Welsh hillside and the wooden house in the woods).
But
did you really feel that these Gloucester lawyers would have appeared
at
all for nothing? (Remember, lawyers simply don't appear for nothing.)

One of the researchers for GD has contributed to the www.periodproperty
forum in the past and confirmed they don't pay for appearances. I wonder
if
these pair intend to set up some form of project management company -
with
law qualifications as well they could offer a turnkey solution.

turnkey solution?

turkey solution more like

Quite possibly :-)

But apparently that pair of gays (not the Scottish ones on Ch5) from Beeny
show a few series back make a very good living this way now.



--

Martin Angove wrote in message ...
I'll get the quoting right this time.

Have you tried running distributed TV over IP?

I've had a very brief attempt with a Nebula DigiTV server. Whilst I
didnt get it working other people have done. That's a £100 TV card on
a low spec PC.

However, live TV is very last century. The only time live tv becomes
important is for Sport. What I actually do is stream programmes to a
second location from my Tivo and it works perfectly well though it's a
little clunky because it's using 3rd party hacks. Alternatively i can
grab files from the Tivo and play them locally rather than streaming.
With US Series 2 Tivo this stuff isn't a problem and transfer speeds
are much quicker.

A Windows Media Centre PC will do this with 'media centre extenders'
as remote clients. I dont think you can buy them in the UK yet but an
X-Box will do it.

I've also seen a large scale TV over IP multicasting install that is
working very well. -

Hwyl!
???