with the gas feed running up the outside of the house.

is it legal ?

situation:

sime halstead running c/h and has been for a while with no problems
but the dhw supply is way below par. dhw is currently supplied by an
immersion heater in the bathroom. sime halstead currently in ground
flor utility room at the back of the house.

plan:

strip out immersion and cold water tank and install smallest, cheapest
combi boiler in a newly built cupboard to feed bathroom hot water and
kitchen which is situated directly below the bathroom.

are there any legal issues with running a gas pipe up the outside of a
house or siting a combi in a cupboard in a bathroom ?

many thanks for any advice


RT

"R Taylor" wrote in message
...
with the gas feed running up the outside of the house.

is it legal ?

Yes, as long as it is metal pipe and protected from corrosions and damage
(cars backing into it, etc)

situation:

sime halstead running c/h and has been for a while with no problems
but the dhw supply is way below par. dhw is currently supplied by an
immersion heater in the bathroom. sime halstead currently in ground
flor utility room at the back of the house.

plan:

strip out immersion and cold water tank and install smallest, cheapest
combi boiler in a newly built cupboard to feed bathroom hot water and
kitchen which is situated directly below the bathroom.

A small combi will give poor flowrates. Small combi's are great for
showers. If you do mainly showers and the odd bath, then a small combi is
fine.

are there any legal issues with running a gas pipe up the outside of a
house

see above.

or siting a combi in a cupboard in a bathroom ?

No problem, as long as any electrical switches, or equipment is not
reachable by wet hands.

"R Taylor" wrote in message
news

"R Taylor" wrote in message
...
with the gas feed running up the outside of the house.

is it legal ?

situation:

sime halstead running c/h and has been for a while with no problems
but the dhw supply is way below par. dhw is currently supplied by an
immersion heater in the bathroom. sime halstead currently in ground
flor utility room at the back of the house.

plan:

strip out immersion and cold water tank and install smallest, cheapest
combi boiler in a newly built cupboard to feed bathroom hot water and
kitchen which is situated directly below the bathroom.

are there any legal issues with running a gas pipe up the outside of a
house or siting a combi in a cupboard in a bathroom ?

many thanks for any advice


RT

my bad, pre coffee post.

we're actually hoping to fit a multipoint water heater, not a combi.

http://inspiredheating.co.uk/acatalo...itony_IIT.html

thanks for any advice

Great for showers and slow baths occasionally. If you want high flowrates
then a high flowrate combi is the way. Or buy two multipoints and couple
them up (still saves space), but you may be exceeding your gas supply then.

"R Taylor" wrote in message ...
with the gas feed running up the outside of the house.

is it legal ?

situation:

sime halstead running c/h and has been for a while with no problems
but the dhw supply is way below par. dhw is currently supplied by an
immersion heater in the bathroom. sime halstead currently in ground
flor utility room at the back of the house.

plan:

strip out immersion and cold water tank and install smallest, cheapest
combi boiler in a newly built cupboard to feed bathroom hot water and
kitchen which is situated directly below the bathroom.

are there any legal issues with running a gas pipe up the outside of a
house or siting a combi in a cupboard in a bathroom ?

many thanks for any advice


RT



my bad, pre coffee post.

we're actually hoping to fit a multipoint water heater, not a combi.

http://inspiredheating.co.uk/acatalo...itony_IIT.html

thanks for any advice

are there any legal issues with running a gas pipe up the outside of a
house or siting a combi in a cupboard in a bathroom ?

No. That's fine. Ensure it is fanned flue and requires no cabinet
ventilation. There are plenty available within those restrictions. You must
run the entire central heating system off an RCD.

Christian.

R Taylor wrote:

with the gas feed running up the outside of the house.

is it legal ?

Yes - quite a common solution these days...


sime halstead running c/h and has been for a while with no problems
but the dhw supply is way below par. dhw is currently supplied by an

When you say DHW is "way below par" what do you mean? Poor flow rate?
not hot enough?

plan:

strip out immersion and cold water tank and install smallest, cheapest
combi boiler in a newly built cupboard to feed bathroom hot water and
kitchen which is situated directly below the bathroom.

The only observation I would make is that the "smallest cheapest" combi
(or multipoint) is also likely to offer poor hot water performance by
design.



--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

according to future brother in law the poor heat from the DHW side of our
'crap' combi
should'nt be a problem for a few reasons: we're having a shower fitted, we
have a
dishwasher and we're selling the house when this load of work is finished
"so, do you
really care ? " :-)

That's the way to go. If you're selling the house, you'd never make your
money back installing a decent hot water system when it is so cheap to
install a combi!

Christian.

Thanks for the replies, both.

after a quick search of the groups (duh) I'd sort of got to the bottom of the problem.

the DHW flow rate is fine but the chap I got the boiler off said that the temperature
was lame and wouldn't fill a bath (?he's a plumber?) anyways, in the past I've found
that to fill a bath off a crappy combi all you had to do is only turn the tap on so far
(water runs slower through boiler=higher temp) and wait an age for the bath to fill.

Thankfully, I've just had a phonecall from 'long time ago fallen out with' future brother
in law who's an ace plumber and who's agreed to do all the plumbing & gas jobs we
need doing and he can start the job in just 4 weeks.

according to future brother in law the poor heat from the DHW side of our 'crap' combi
should'nt be a problem for a few reasons: we're having a shower fitted, we have a
dishwasher and we're selling the house when this load of work is finished "so, do you
really care ? " :-)

turned out nice, again



RT

Is there a regulation that says it needs to be on an RCD ? I can see that
it would make sense, but as it's hardwired and in a cupboard, is it
actually a requirement now?

I'd have to check, but you might get away with it if the cabinet requires
tools (i.e. a screwdriver) to remove the door. However, I'm not 100% certain
on this point.

Christian.

On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 12:09:53 +0100, "Christian McArdle" wrote:

are there any legal issues with running a gas pipe up the outside of a
house or siting a combi in a cupboard in a bathroom ?

No. That's fine. Ensure it is fanned flue and requires no cabinet
ventilation. There are plenty available within those restrictions. You must
run the entire central heating system off an RCD.

Is there a regulation that says it needs to be on an RCD ? I can see that it would make sense, but
as it's hardwired and in a cupboard, is it actually a requirement now?
I've never seen it done, nor an RCD on an electric immersion heater in similar circumstances.

On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 14:53:37 +0100, "Christian McArdle"
wrote:

Is there a regulation that says it needs to be on an RCD ? I can see that
it would make sense, but as it's hardwired and in a cupboard, is it
actually a requirement now?

I'd have to check, but you might get away with it if the cabinet requires
tools (i.e. a screwdriver) to remove the door. However, I'm not 100% certain
on this point.

Christian.


Zone 1 relates to the space above and below but not in the bath.
There is a reference to the space under the bath being in Zone 1 if
tools are not required to open it. 601-02-01

601-09-02 talks about fixed current using equipment. Apart from
shower pumps and water heaters, it allows other equipment that can
only be used reasonably in that zone to be fitted under the bath if a
30mA RCD is used, This would not apply here, since you would not
fit a combi under the bath, I think.

The argument that would apply here would be to make the cupboard
outside zones ( 3m from bath) by requiring a tool to unlock it, but I
can't see a specific rule permitting it.

However, according to 601-09-03, a fixed current using water heater
may be installed even in zone 2 (next to bath) if it is suitable for
installation in that area. I am dubious that a combi boiler would
be suitably rated with the appropriate IPX4 coding.


..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 15:48:26 +0100, Andy Hall wrote:

On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 14:53:37 +0100, "Christian McArdle"
wrote:

Is there a regulation that says it needs to be on an RCD ? I can see that
it would make sense, but as it's hardwired and in a cupboard, is it
actually a requirement now?

I'd have to check, but you might get away with it if the cabinet requires
tools (i.e. a screwdriver) to remove the door. However, I'm not 100% certain
on this point.

Christian.


Zone 1 relates to the space above and below but not in the bath.
There is a reference to the space under the bath being in Zone 1 if
tools are not required to open it. 601-02-01

601-09-02 talks about fixed current using equipment. Apart from
shower pumps and water heaters, it allows other equipment that can
only be used reasonably in that zone to be fitted under the bath if a
30mA RCD is used, This would not apply here, since you would not
fit a combi under the bath, I think.

The argument that would apply here would be to make the cupboard
outside zones ( 3m from bath) by requiring a tool to unlock it, but I
can't see a specific rule permitting it.

However, according to 601-09-03, a fixed current using water heater
may be installed even in zone 2 (next to bath) if it is suitable for
installation in that area. I am dubious that a combi boiler would
be suitably rated with the appropriate IPX4 coding.


.andy


To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

So it's probably quicker to fit an RCD than wade through the regulations.... fair enough!

On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 16:07:15 GMT, Mike Harrison
wrote:



Zone 1 relates to the space above and below but not in the bath.
There is a reference to the space under the bath being in Zone 1 if
tools are not required to open it. 601-02-01

601-09-02 talks about fixed current using equipment. Apart from
shower pumps and water heaters, it allows other equipment that can
only be used reasonably in that zone to be fitted under the bath if a
30mA RCD is used, This would not apply here, since you would not
fit a combi under the bath, I think.

The argument that would apply here would be to make the cupboard
outside zones ( 3m from bath) by requiring a tool to unlock it, but I
can't see a specific rule permitting it.

However, according to 601-09-03, a fixed current using water heater
may be installed even in zone 2 (next to bath) if it is suitable for
installation in that area. I am dubious that a combi boiler would
be suitably rated with the appropriate IPX4 coding.


.andy


To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

So it's probably quicker to fit an RCD than wade through the regulations.... fair enough!



Be careful. RCD does not automatically let you off the hook on other
regulations.


..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

In article ,
Andy Hall wrote:
This would not apply here, since you would not fit a combi under the
bath, I think.

Might make a better job of heating the water that way. ;-)

--
*Yes, I am an agent of Satan, but my duties are largely ceremonial

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
In article ,
Andy Hall wrote:
This would not apply here, since you would not fit a combi under the
bath, I think.

Might make a better job of heating the water that way. ;-)

You could also use a non-condensing boiler, with the exhaust going
through the bath, which would be very efficient.
There is the small matter that you wouldn't need a second bath.

"Christian McArdle" wrote in message
et...
are there any legal issues with running a gas pipe up the outside of a
house or siting a combi in a cupboard in a bathroom ?

No. That's fine. Ensure it is fanned flue and requires no cabinet
ventilation. There are plenty available within those restrictions. You
must
run the entire central heating system off an RCD.

Christian.

Surveyors for house purchasers appear to frown on any kind of gas appliance
in a bathroom.
This has been an issue in 2 properties I've been involved with.

On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 22:26:29 +0100, BillV wrote:


"Christian McArdle" wrote in message
et...
are there any legal issues with running a gas pipe up the outside of a
house or siting a combi in a cupboard in a bathroom ?

No. That's fine. Ensure it is fanned flue and requires no cabinet
ventilation. There are plenty available within those restrictions. You
must
run the entire central heating system off an RCD.

Christian.

Surveyors for house purchasers appear to frown on any kind of gas appliance
in a bathroom.
This has been an issue in 2 properties I've been involved with.

This is probably becasue they have heard rightly that some gas applainces
can't be fitted in bathrooms. Since they don't/can't know which these
might be they simply mention the fact as a possible problem.


--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html

"Ed Sirett" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 22:26:29 +0100, BillV wrote:


"Christian McArdle" wrote in message
et...
are there any legal issues with running a gas pipe up the outside of
a
house or siting a combi in a cupboard in a bathroom ?

No. That's fine. Ensure it is fanned flue and requires no cabinet
ventilation. There are plenty available within those restrictions. You
must
run the entire central heating system off an RCD.

Christian.

Surveyors for house purchasers appear to frown on any kind of gas
appliance
in a bathroom.
This has been an issue in 2 properties I've been involved with.

This is probably becasue they have heard rightly that some gas applainces
can't be fitted in bathrooms. Since they don't/can't know which these
might be they simply mention the fact as a possible problem.

The appliances were in fact quite ok in my opinion but the negative comments
of the surveyors tended to put buyers off or they use it as a reason to beat
the price down.

On Wed, 21 Jul 2004 11:23:45 +0100, BillV wrote:


"Ed Sirett" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 22:26:29 +0100, BillV wrote:


"Christian McArdle" wrote in message
et...
are there any legal issues with running a gas pipe up the outside of
a
house or siting a combi in a cupboard in a bathroom ?

No. That's fine. Ensure it is fanned flue and requires no cabinet
ventilation. There are plenty available within those restrictions. You
must
run the entire central heating system off an RCD.

Christian.

Surveyors for house purchasers appear to frown on any kind of gas
appliance
in a bathroom.
This has been an issue in 2 properties I've been involved with.

This is probably becasue they have heard rightly that some gas applainces
can't be fitted in bathrooms. Since they don't/can't know which these
might be they simply mention the fact as a possible problem.

The appliances were in fact quite ok in my opinion but the negative comments
of the surveyors tended to put buyers off or they use it as a reason to beat
the price down.

Given the thousands that might be lost thus. It might be better to get an
inspection report from a registered installer.


--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html

In article .uk,
Ed Sirett wrote:
This is probably becasue they have heard rightly that some gas applainces
can't be fitted in bathrooms. Since they don't/can't know which these
might be they simply mention the fact as a possible problem.

Which appliances and for what reason, Ed? Seems to me the sensible place
since it's the one room in the house that's rarely too warm. Assuming you
have the space, of course.

--
*Middle age is when it takes longer to rest than to get tired.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Wed, 21 Jul 2004 18:14:37 +0100, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article .uk,
Ed Sirett wrote:
This is probably becasue they have heard rightly that some gas applainces
can't be fitted in bathrooms. Since they don't/can't know which these
might be they simply mention the fact as a possible problem.

Which appliances and for what reason, Ed? Seems to me the sensible place
since it's the one room in the house that's rarely too warm. Assuming you
have the space, of course.

There is an absolute prohibition on all open flued appliances. In practice
this is no prohibition at all since the only open flued appliances anyone
is likely to fit will be gas fires.

The wiring regs have much more impact on the matter in practice.

Ed.
--