I am pretty sure I remember that one particular edition of Machinery's
handbook had a part called "the war supplement" or something like that in
it.
Last weekend we were talking about deep hole drilling and I seem to
remember that, in that issue, IBM was the source for deep hole drilling
expertise, for field rifle barrels, etc. ----I think!!!
One guy said that he'd really like to get a copy of the edition, so I went
down stairs to find mine and could not.
I must have given it away. What a dumb thing to do. I only kept a couple
of later editions.

My questions:
1. Am I off my rocker?
2. If "no" to question 1, what edition was that "war supplement" in? I am
pretty sure it had to be the 11th, 12th or 13th. I need to know so I can
tell the guy accurately which one to shop for.

I have spent a fair amount of time searching for this info on the net.
You'd have thought it would be any easy search-------


Pete Stanaitis
----------------

On 9/9/2013 8:21 AM, Pete S wrote:
I am pretty sure I remember that one particular edition of Machinery's
handbook had a part called "the war supplement" or something like that
in it.
Last weekend we were talking about deep hole drilling and I seem to
remember that, in that issue, IBM was the source for deep hole drilling
expertise, for field rifle barrels, etc. ----I think!!!
One guy said that he'd really like to get a copy of the edition, so I
went down stairs to find mine and could not.
I must have given it away. What a dumb thing to do. I only kept a couple
of later editions.

My questions:
1. Am I off my rocker?
2. If "no" to question 1, what edition was that "war supplement" in? I
am pretty sure it had to be the 11th, 12th or 13th. I need to know so I
can tell the guy accurately which one to shop for.

I have spent a fair amount of time searching for this info on the net.
You'd have thought it would be any easy search-------


Pete Stanaitis
----------------

Not Machinery's Handbook, but a confirming link...

Drilled Barrels for .30 carbines

http://www.bavarianm1carbines.com/barrels.html

On Mon, 9 Sep 2013 08:21:11 -0500, "Pete S"
wrote:

I am pretty sure I remember that one particular edition of Machinery's
handbook had a part called "the war supplement" or something like that in
it.
Last weekend we were talking about deep hole drilling and I seem to
remember that, in that issue, IBM was the source for deep hole drilling
expertise, for field rifle barrels, etc. ----I think!!!
One guy said that he'd really like to get a copy of the edition, so I went
down stairs to find mine and could not.
I must have given it away. What a dumb thing to do. I only kept a couple
of later editions.

My questions:
1. Am I off my rocker?
2. If "no" to question 1, what edition was that "war supplement" in? I am
pretty sure it had to be the 11th, 12th or 13th. I need to know so I can
tell the guy accurately which one to shop for.

I have spent a fair amount of time searching for this info on the net.
You'd have thought it would be any easy search-------


Pete Stanaitis
----------------

Deep hole drilling, particularly barrel drilling was done many years
before WW II and the basic technique didn't change much over the years
so likely IBM was not an innovator in the craft. However, IBM did make
a lot of WW II firearms, I believe that they were prominent among the
M1/2 carbine makers. The Wiki mentions " Sperry and Norden bombsights,
Browning Automatic Rifle and the M1 Carbine, and engine parts".
--
Cheers,

John B.

Thanks for the input so far, guys.
What I am really after, though, is the edition that contains the "war
supplement", if there was one. I think Machinery's handbook didn't really
get started as a complete book until about 1914, so I think the "war" I am
referencing was WWII. It's not so much to discover who "innovated" deep
hole drilling, but who was considered knowledgeable enough to write the
chapter on it, since most people these days think of IBM as a
computer/software company.
I worked for 3M company for a long time, in the Microfilm Products
division. We had a great appreciation for the Hollerith mechanisms that
IBM developed for punching, reading, sorting and handling 80 column tab
cards. We designed and built many machines to insert 35mm film chips,
expose and develop the chips. copy the chips, magnify and print them to
paper, etc. We had to modify the IBM machines to handle the tab cards that
had the "film chip" inserted into them, so they'd read, punch, etc.,
without damaging the image (engineering drawings, mostly) on the chip.

Pete Stanaitis
----------------

"John B." wrote in message
...
On Mon, 9 Sep 2013 08:21:11 -0500, "Pete S"
wrote:
Deep hole drilling, particularly barrel drilling was done many years
before WW II and the basic technique didn't change much over the years
so likely IBM was not an innovator in the craft. However, IBM did make
a lot of WW II firearms, I believe that they were prominent among the
M1/2 carbine makers. The Wiki mentions " Sperry and Norden bombsights,
Browning Automatic Rifle and the M1 Carbine, and engine parts".
--
Cheers,

John B.

On Tue, 10 Sep 2013 09:03:05 -0500, "Pete S"
wrote:

Thanks for the input so far, guys.
What I am really after, though, is the edition that contains the "war
supplement", if there was one.

Your most likely source is the Library of Congress:

http://catalog.loc.gov/cgi-bin/Pwebr...CNT=100&HIST=1

(or)

http://tinyurl.com/oh85qhn

Do you just want to know who wrote it, or do you want to know the
history of gundrilling? _American Machinist_ (which dates back to
1877) is your most likely source for that.

The current publisher (Penton) won't have a clue, but I do. g I
don't know for sure where the old copies are but I know two possible
sources, one only going back to 1928 but the other going all the way
back.

They're a bugger to track down. The Library of Congress may have a
complete set.

--
Ed Huntress

I think Machinery's handbook didn't really
get started as a complete book until about 1914, so I think the "war" I am
referencing was WWII. It's not so much to discover who "innovated" deep
hole drilling, but who was considered knowledgeable enough to write the
chapter on it, since most people these days think of IBM as a
computer/software company.
I worked for 3M company for a long time, in the Microfilm Products
division. We had a great appreciation for the Hollerith mechanisms that
IBM developed for punching, reading, sorting and handling 80 column tab
cards. We designed and built many machines to insert 35mm film chips,
expose and develop the chips. copy the chips, magnify and print them to
paper, etc. We had to modify the IBM machines to handle the tab cards that
had the "film chip" inserted into them, so they'd read, punch, etc.,
without damaging the image (engineering drawings, mostly) on the chip.

Pete Stanaitis
----------------

"John B." wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 9 Sep 2013 08:21:11 -0500, "Pete S"
wrote:
Deep hole drilling, particularly barrel drilling was done many years
before WW II and the basic technique didn't change much over the years
so likely IBM was not an innovator in the craft. However, IBM did make
a lot of WW II firearms, I believe that they were prominent among the
M1/2 carbine makers. The Wiki mentions " Sperry and Norden bombsights,
Browning Automatic Rifle and the M1 Carbine, and engine parts".
--
Cheers,

John B.

On Tue, 10 Sep 2013 09:03:05 -0500
"Pete S" wrote:

Thanks for the input so far, guys.
What I am really after, though, is the edition that contains the "war
supplement", if there was one. I think Machinery's handbook didn't really
get started as a complete book until about 1914, so I think the "war" I am
referencing was WWII. It's not so much to discover who "innovated" deep
hole drilling, but who was considered knowledgeable enough to write the
chapter on it, since most people these days think of IBM as a
computer/software company.
snip

Thought you probably found this already but maybe not...

http://new.industrialpress.com/resources/history

They are still around, even have a 1914 replica to sell:

http://new.industrialpress.com/machi...n-replica.html

You could always try sending them an email with your question:

http://new.industrialpress.com/contact

Might even get an answer

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

On Tue, 10 Sep 2013 09:03:05 -0500, "Pete S"
wrote:

Thanks for the input so far, guys.
What I am really after, though, is the edition that contains the "war
supplement", if there was one. I think Machinery's handbook didn't really
get started as a complete book until about 1914, so I think the "war" I am
referencing was WWII. It's not so much to discover who "innovated" deep
hole drilling, but who was considered knowledgeable enough to write the
chapter on it, since most people these days think of IBM as a
computer/software company.

I think it was between '43 and '45, Pete. (1943 seems to ring a bell)
Googling now...Yes, wartime supplement in '43.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_H._Colvin


I worked for 3M company for a long time, in the Microfilm Products
division. We had a great appreciation for the Hollerith mechanisms that
IBM developed for punching, reading, sorting and handling 80 column tab
cards. We designed and built many machines to insert 35mm film chips,
expose and develop the chips. copy the chips, magnify and print them to
paper, etc. We had to modify the IBM machines to handle the tab cards that
had the "film chip" inserted into them, so they'd read, punch, etc.,
without damaging the image (engineering drawings, mostly) on the chip.

Pete Stanaitis
----------------

"John B." wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 9 Sep 2013 08:21:11 -0500, "Pete S"
wrote:
Deep hole drilling, particularly barrel drilling was done many years
before WW II and the basic technique didn't change much over the years
so likely IBM was not an innovator in the craft. However, IBM did make
a lot of WW II firearms, I believe that they were prominent among the
M1/2 carbine makers. The Wiki mentions " Sperry and Norden bombsights,
Browning Automatic Rifle and the M1 Carbine, and engine parts".
--
Cheers,

John B.

--
[Television is] the triumph of machine over people.
-- Fred Allen

To: machining history buffs:
Well, I was wrong and sorta right!
The key to getting the info was to search "wartime data supplement" (adding
the word "data" to my previous search).
This wartime data supplement was added to the American Machinists' Handbook
in the 1945 8th edition, not in Machinery's Handbook. There's about 154
additional pages of info there.

Pete Stanaitis
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Original request-----------------------------------------------
"Pete S" wrote in message
.. .
I am pretty sure I remember that one particular edition of Machinery's
handbook had a part called "the war supplement" or something like that in
it.
Last weekend we were talking about deep hole drilling and I seem to
remember that, in that issue, IBM was the source for deep hole drilling
expertise, for field rifle barrels, etc. ----I think!!!
One guy said that he'd really like to get a copy of the edition, so I
went down stairs to find mine and could not.
I must have given it away. What a dumb thing to do. I only kept a couple
of later editions.

My questions:
1. Am I off my rocker?
2. If "no" to question 1, what edition was that "war supplement" in? I
am pretty sure it had to be the 11th, 12th or 13th. I need to know so I
can tell the guy accurately which one to shop for.

I have spent a fair amount of time searching for this info on the net.
You'd have thought it would be any easy search-------


Pete Stanaitis
----------------

On Tuesday, October 1, 2013 8:19:12 AM UTC-6, Pete S wrote:
To: machining history buffs: Well, I was wrong and sorta right! The key to getting the info was to search "wartime data supplement" (adding the word "data" to my previous search). This wartime data supplement was added to the American Machinists' Handbook in the 1945 8th edition, not in Machinery's Handbook. There's about 154 additional pages of info there. Pete Stanaitis

But did you find a copy of that edition? Inquiring minds want to know...

There were a lot of books put out during the war that had machining kinks in them, uses for machine tools that weren't meant to do the operation that they were modified to do, critical operations done on cobbled-together jigs.. Kind of gave an idea of how desperate those days really were.

Stan

On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 12:08:35 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

On Tuesday, October 1, 2013 8:19:12 AM UTC-6, Pete S wrote:
To: machining history buffs: Well, I was wrong and sorta right! The key to getting the info was to search "wartime data supplement" (adding the word "data" to my previous search). This wartime data supplement was added to the American Machinists' Handbook in the 1945 8th edition, not in Machinery's Handbook. There's about 154 additional pages of info there. Pete Stanaitis

But did you find a copy of that edition? Inquiring minds want to know...

There were a lot of books put out during the war that had machining kinks in them, uses for machine tools that weren't meant to do the operation that they were modified to do, critical operations done on cobbled-together jigs. Kind of gave an idea of how desperate those days really were.

Stan

American Machinists' Handbook vs. Machinery's Handbook?????????????
---

Gerry :-)}
London,Canada

replying to Pete S , massauto wrote:
spaco wrote:

I am pretty sure I remember that one particular edition of Machinery's
handbook had a part called "the war supplement" or something like that in
it.


I believe the 8th edition of the American Machinists' Handbook contained
the Wartime Data Supplement.

The independent Wartime Data Supplement was published in 1944 by Fred H.
Colvin and Frank A. Stanley - McGraw-Hill Book Co.

My copy is available on Amazon.

Ron




--
posted from
http://www.polytechforum.com/metalwo...on-583668-.htm
using PolytechForum's Web, RSS and Social Media Interface to
rec.crafts.metalworking and other engineering groups

On Monday, September 9, 2013 at 6:21:11 AM UTC-7, Pete S wrote:
I am pretty sure I remember that one particular edition of Machinery's
handbook had a part called "the war supplement" or something like that in
it.

I have 11th edition here, fourth printing, 1943; it hasn't any 'war supplement'
chapter or section. There is a 'wartime address' listed for the Great Britain
office of the publisher, however.
Probably, 11th edition had later printings into which a supplement may have
been bound.
The US entered the war late 1942, the 1943 edition probably was written earlier.

On Tue, 24 Feb 2015 11:16:01 -0800 (PST), whit3rd
wrote:

On Monday, September 9, 2013 at 6:21:11 AM UTC-7, Pete S wrote:
I am pretty sure I remember that one particular edition of Machinery's
handbook had a part called "the war supplement" or something like that in
it.

I have 11th edition here, fourth printing, 1943; it hasn't any 'war supplement'
chapter or section. There is a 'wartime address' listed for the Great Britain
office of the publisher, however.
Probably, 11th edition had later printings into which a supplement may have
been bound.
The US entered the war late 1942, the 1943 edition probably was written earlier.

Right. The war supplement was written in 1944. You can read it he

http://catalog.hathitrust.org/Record/005751882

--
Ed Huntress
(former associate editor of American Machinist)

"whit3rd" wrote in message
...
On Monday, September 9, 2013 at 6:21:11 AM UTC-7, Pete S wrote:
I am pretty sure I remember that one particular edition of
Machinery's
handbook had a part called "the war supplement" or something like
that in
it.

I have 11th edition here, fourth printing, 1943; it hasn't any 'war
supplement'
chapter or section. There is a 'wartime address' listed for the
Great Britain
office of the publisher, however.
Probably, 11th edition had later printings into which a supplement
may have
been bound.
The US entered the war late 1942, the 1943 edition probably was
written earlier.

Late 1941, specifically December 7th.

By late 1942 we were pushing the Japanese back. I just finished
reading this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_N...of_Guadalcanal

There's no War Supplement in my 1941 Marks' Handbook.
-jsw

On Tue, 24 Feb 2015 14:33:25 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"whit3rd" wrote in message
...
On Monday, September 9, 2013 at 6:21:11 AM UTC-7, Pete S wrote:
I am pretty sure I remember that one particular edition of
Machinery's
handbook had a part called "the war supplement" or something like
that in
it.

I have 11th edition here, fourth printing, 1943; it hasn't any 'war
supplement'
chapter or section. There is a 'wartime address' listed for the
Great Britain
office of the publisher, however.
Probably, 11th edition had later printings into which a supplement
may have
been bound.
The US entered the war late 1942, the 1943 edition probably was
written earlier.

Late 1941, specifically December 7th.

By late 1942 we were pushing the Japanese back. I just finished
reading this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_N...of_Guadalcanal

My dad fought in that one (1st Div., 11th Marines), particularly the
Battle of the Tenaru River (actually, it was the Ilu River). He had
some horrific stories about it.

--
Ed Huntress

On Tue, 24 Feb 2015 14:33:25 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"whit3rd" wrote in message
...
On Monday, September 9, 2013 at 6:21:11 AM UTC-7, Pete S wrote:
I am pretty sure I remember that one particular edition of
Machinery's
handbook had a part called "the war supplement" or something like
that in
it.

I have 11th edition here, fourth printing, 1943; it hasn't any 'war
supplement'
chapter or section. There is a 'wartime address' listed for the
Great Britain
office of the publisher, however.
Probably, 11th edition had later printings into which a supplement
may have
been bound.
The US entered the war late 1942, the 1943 edition probably was
written earlier.

Late 1941, specifically December 7th.

By late 1942 we were pushing the Japanese back. I just finished
reading this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_N...of_Guadalcanal

There's no War Supplement in my 1941 Marks' Handbook.
-jsw


Dad joined the USAAC in San Antonio, July 1941.

http://bookstore.xlibris.com/Product...ld-War-II.aspx

We celebrated his 95th birthday with him Dec 22 this last year. He's
still with us.

Pete Keillor

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 24 Feb 2015 14:33:25 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:
.............

My dad fought in that one (1st Div., 11th Marines), particularly the
Battle of the Tenaru River (actually, it was the Ilu River). He had
some horrific stories about it.

--
Ed Huntress

Jungle warfare was no better for the Japanese:
http://wwarii.com/blog/archives/deat...mps-of-ramree/

On Tue, 24 Feb 2015 14:33:25 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"whit3rd" wrote in message
...
On Monday, September 9, 2013 at 6:21:11 AM UTC-7, Pete S wrote:
I am pretty sure I remember that one particular edition of
Machinery's
handbook had a part called "the war supplement" or something like
that in
it.

I have 11th edition here, fourth printing, 1943; it hasn't any 'war
supplement'
chapter or section. There is a 'wartime address' listed for the
Great Britain
office of the publisher, however.
Probably, 11th edition had later printings into which a supplement
may have
been bound.
The US entered the war late 1942, the 1943 edition probably was
written earlier.

Late 1941, specifically December 7th.

By late 1942 we were pushing the Japanese back. I just finished
reading this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_N...of_Guadalcanal

There's no War Supplement in my 1941 Marks' Handbook.

If you haven't yet, read W.E.B. Griffin's series, The Corps. I learned
a lot, even though it was fiction. Also extremely good is the
Presidential Agent series. Outstanding books!

--
A sound mind in a sound body is a short but full description
of a happy state in this world.
-- John Locke

On Tue, 24 Feb 2015 16:29:20 -0600, Pete Keillor
wrote:

On Tue, 24 Feb 2015 14:33:25 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"whit3rd" wrote in message
...
On Monday, September 9, 2013 at 6:21:11 AM UTC-7, Pete S wrote:
I am pretty sure I remember that one particular edition of
Machinery's
handbook had a part called "the war supplement" or something like
that in
it.

I have 11th edition here, fourth printing, 1943; it hasn't any 'war
supplement'
chapter or section. There is a 'wartime address' listed for the
Great Britain
office of the publisher, however.
Probably, 11th edition had later printings into which a supplement
may have
been bound.
The US entered the war late 1942, the 1943 edition probably was
written earlier.

Late 1941, specifically December 7th.

By late 1942 we were pushing the Japanese back. I just finished
reading this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_N...of_Guadalcanal

There's no War Supplement in my 1941 Marks' Handbook.
-jsw


Dad joined the USAAC in San Antonio, July 1941.

My dad graduated with the class of '41G. I wonder if Pete Sr. and Lou
Jr. ever met...


http://bookstore.xlibris.com/Product...ld-War-II.aspx

We celebrated his 95th birthday with him Dec 22 this last year. He's
still with us.

Congrats! Mine died of CHF at 86, one of the youngest in our
long-lived family. Most have hung on until their late 90s. Mom just
turned 90. It's great. (Papa, Dad's dad, was nearly arrested riding
his trike down the I-5 freeway one day. He was 93 at the time and
thought it would be quicker than going 3 or 4 blocks the busy side
streets. He did, however, ride on the shoulder, not in a freeway
lane, but the CHP officer escorted him home and gave his new wife a
tongue lashing. We got a big kick out of that one.)

--
A sound mind in a sound body is a short but full description
of a happy state in this world.
-- John Locke